2019 Porsche 911 (992)

Stotty
The 993 didn't really move anywhere other than styling.
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To be fair to the 993, its suspension was quite a step on from the 964, and the 996's suspension was more of an evolution of the 993's if I understand correctly.
The 991 generation has changed the role of the 911. I know they are technically better cars, but I'm not convinced they are more enjoyable sports cars... I haven't driven a 992, but the 991 is a very different car compared to a final generation 997... it's a lot bigger, and although not a huge amount heavier, they just feels bigger to drive. And the refinement levels are up there with BMW/Merc/Audi saloon cars. They just aren't different enough to every day cars to make me want to just drive one for the sake of it.
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I think that's probably overstating things a little. For a start the 992 I drove recently had the same poor road roar as every 911 I've driven, so that definitely runs in the family :lol: It's a long way still from being as refined as a mainstream premium saloon, and still feels very different to drive.

It does feel more like a GT, but actually the jump from a standard 991 wasn't as big as I was expecting. I actually really like the new cabin and it doesn't feel as big as it looks from the outside... though in pure numerical terms it's now too wide for a width restrictor that's just been put in place near mine and would be borderline for physically fitting through my garage door, so that's an objective black mark!

And I'm not sure it's quite as enjoyable for me as a 991 or a 997... with the qualifier "yet". I never drove an early 991 but plenty of my colleagues did and were quite unimpressed. Then by the time the model has run its full cycle it's back to being pretty much the best car on the road because Porsche constantly fiddles with it behind the scenes. I'd be surprised if the 992 is any different. I reckon a manual gearbox will help too, though I do wish they still did a "narrow body" one.
The modern stuff isn't for me... if anything, I'd rather go older.
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I do understand this point of view. I've only ever driven one 997, and a slightly baggy one at that, and in terms of size and not having excessive performance it felt like a sweet spot for me. I had a poke around a Sport Classic recently and really fell for it - subtle, compact, pure.

But it's also hard to imagine, if I was in a much better financial position, not making a bee-line for the nearest Porsche dealer and getting a 992 if I wanted something I could use and enjoy every day, which has always been the appeal of 911s. Maybe it's less of a weekend car than before (though GT3s etc will surely fix that) but I can understand Porsche making subtle refinements to improve it as an all-rounder.
 
homeforsummer
To be fair to the 993, its suspension was quite a step on from the 964, and the 996's suspension was more of an evolution of the 993's if I understand correctly.

I think that's probably overstating things a little. For a start the 992 I drove recently had the same poor road roar as every 911 I've driven, so that definitely runs in the family :lol: It's a long way still from being as refined as a mainstream premium saloon, and still feels very different to drive.

It does feel more like a GT, but actually the jump from a standard 991 wasn't as big as I was expecting. I actually really like the new cabin and it doesn't feel as big as it looks from the outside... though in pure numerical terms it's now too wide for a width restrictor that's just been put in place near mine and would be borderline for physically fitting through my garage door, so that's an objective black mark!

And I'm not sure it's quite as enjoyable for me as a 991 or a 997... with the qualifier "yet". I never drove an early 991 but plenty of my colleagues did and were quite unimpressed. Then by the time the model has run its full cycle it's back to being pretty much the best car on the road because Porsche constantly fiddles with it behind the scenes. I'd be surprised if the 992 is any different. I reckon a manual gearbox will help too, though I do wish they still did a "narrow body" one.

I do understand this point of view. I've only ever driven one 997, and a slightly baggy one at that, and in terms of size and not having excessive performance it felt like a sweet spot for me. I had a poke around a Sport Classic recently and really fell for it - subtle, compact, pure.

But it's also hard to imagine, if I was in a much better financial position, not making a bee-line for the nearest Porsche dealer and getting a 992 if I wanted something I could use and enjoy every day, which has always been the appeal of 911s. Maybe it's less of a weekend car than before (though GT3s etc will surely fix that) but I can understand Porsche making subtle refinements to improve it as an all-rounder.
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Yes, the 993 had better suspension, but to drive they feel much more like a 964 than a 996.

Maybe I was exaggerating slightly to make a point, and yes, the stock rear tyre roar is still there in the 991, but overall, you could easily do a trans-Europe trip in a 991 and feel little worse than if you’d done it in a diesel 3 series… a 996 would do it, but it would be nowhere near as relaxing. Likewise, thrashing a 991/992 to within an inch of its life on a public road would either end in death, or a trip to jail.

I love Porsche’s, but £100k of my money wouldn’t go on a modern 911.
 
Stotty
I love Porsche’s, but £100k of my money wouldn’t go on a modern 911.
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You may be interested in the issue we've just sent to press. 992 versus a diverse selection of rivals...

I find the £100k question a difficult one because everything really is so very different. For a time a V8 Vantage would've been right up there but that's a £120k-minimum car now. A BMW i8 would still be very tempting - even less overtly a sports car than the 992 and unfortunately compromised as a GT by limited luggage space and a small fuel tank, but every time I drive one I end up wanting one as they feel hugely special and do still drive very nicely indeed. R8s and McLarens are priced too far above basic 911s brand new (if you're going purely on sticker price, as obviously nobody really buys like that any more). So it comes back round to either something used, or... a 911 :lol:

It sounds daft but honestly the Alpine has kinda ruined anything faster or more expensive for me now. I can't imagine wanting to go quicker on the road than a ~250bhp ~1100kg car, and I don't want anything physically bigger. The early non-S Evora I drove recently was fantastic too. And obviously, there's the used 997/new Cayman option. Cars in that ballpark seem pretty much perfect, and between Cayman and A110 I'd have the Alpine every time, even though there's no manual.
 
homeforsummer
You may be interested in the issue we've just sent to press. 992 versus a diverse selection of rivals...

I find the £100k question a difficult one because everything really is so very different. For a time a V8 Vantage would've been right up there but that's a £120k-minimum car now. A BMW i8 would still be very tempting - even less overtly a sports car than the 992 and unfortunately compromised as a GT by limited luggage space and a small fuel tank, but every time I drive one I end up wanting one as they feel hugely special and do still drive very nicely indeed. R8s and McLarens are priced too far above basic 911s brand new (if you're going purely on sticker price, as obviously nobody really buys like that any more). So it comes back round to either something used, or... a 911 :lol:

It sounds daft but honestly the Alpine has kinda ruined anything faster or more expensive for me now. I can't imagine wanting to go quicker on the road than a ~250bhp ~1100kg car, and I don't want anything physically bigger. The early non-S Evora I drove recently was fantastic too. And obviously, there's the used 997/new Cayman option. Cars in that ballpark seem pretty much perfect, and between Cayman and A110 I'd have the Alpine every time, even though there's no manual.
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I'd have a 981 Boxster Spyder over the lot.

But I'd take a long hard look at an LC500 first.
 
homeforsummer
You may be interested in the issue we've just sent to press. 992 versus a diverse selection of rivals...

I find the £100k question a difficult one because everything really is so very different. For a time a V8 Vantage would've been right up there but that's a £120k-minimum car now. A BMW i8 would still be very tempting - even less overtly a sports car than the 992 and unfortunately compromised as a GT by limited luggage space and a small fuel tank, but every time I drive one I end up wanting one as they feel hugely special and do still drive very nicely indeed. R8s and McLarens are priced too far above basic 911s brand new (if you're going purely on sticker price, as obviously nobody really buys like that any more). So it comes back round to either something used, or... a 911 :lol:

It sounds daft but honestly the Alpine has kinda ruined anything faster or more expensive for me now. I can't imagine wanting to go quicker on the road than a ~250bhp ~1100kg car, and I don't want anything physically bigger. The early non-S Evora I drove recently was fantastic too. And obviously, there's the used 997/new Cayman option. Cars in that ballpark seem pretty much perfect, and between Cayman and A110 I'd have the Alpine every time, even though there's no manual.
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Thing is, while the i8 has its advantages as a car in general, it really comes into its own on the secondhand market. You can get a decent one for £50k, which is less than a nicely optioned 718. I suspect part of that is that it simply isn't bought by the same people as the 911; the 911 is bought as a sports car as much as it is a daily driver, while I suspect the i8 is much more commonly bought for daily duties due to the fairly reasonable cost to run it. I also have a suspicion it's bought by people who only care about the image much more often than the 911, but if it means there are loads of cheap used ones then I'm not complaining.

Everything I've heard about the Alpine makes me want one desperately. I might have to try and blag a test drive of one if I can find one locally.

For what it's worth, if I had £100k to spend on just one car, I'd be very tempted by a manual V12 Vantage or Cayman GT4. Both are cars I think I'd love driving, but I also don't forsee them losing value anytime soon.
 
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I know one thing; every time I see an i8 I'm wowed. When I see a plain 911 I just don't even think about it.
 
VXR
I know one thing; every time I see an i8 I'm wowed. When I see a plain 911 I just don't even think about it.
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It's amazing to me that a car that's been on sale for what, five or six years now, still looks more futuristic than anything else on the road.

I'm really hoping to put in some time with the 992 at some point this year. I don't know if it'll top the 991.2 T in my hierarchy of modern non-GT 911s though. I'm sure it's a fantastic GT, and while it hasn't grown much compared to the previous generation, I feel like it's just past a certain mental line for some folks. I also wonder what a bog-standard 992 will be like in terms of power and performance — I know it made sense for the S to kick things off, but I'd love to get some more info.

The Cayman is more my speed (literally), but I figure its replacement will be with us by the end of the year, and will probably mirror the 992's evolution over the 991. I hope it doesn't continue to firm up nat-asp 981 prices...
 
The most perfect driver's car for me personally would be a Porsche 718 Boxter with a hard top with a few GTS or GT4 elements to the exterior.

But the perfect Porsche would still be a 911, probably a 991.2 GTS or a 992 S though. Preferably a manual. Although a 993 S or a 993 Turbo, a 997.2 C4 is also a
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Porsche.
 
100k of my money would go on the best 997.2 gt3 I could find. Anything left over (prices are coming down on most high end stuff now) would go on a trip to COG for nice set of passive dampers.

I’d run a medium SUV as a daily... Macan or similar.
 
VXR
That's easily the prettiest modern 911. Still has that dainty shape, but modern enough details so it doesn't look too old hat. The RS 3.8 livery was the best, too.
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You have very good taste. :P
 
Stotty
Unfortunately, RS's are still well over £150k :(
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Slap the letters "RS" on a 911 and it's always going to be too expensive. I'd be perfectly happy (if not more happy) with a standard 997 GT3 for half the price.
 
I saw my first 992 IRL today. It was obviously in a Porsche Center. I was allowed to sit in it, which is not that abnormal.

Very beautiful car but the rear end is something I have to get used to. So far, I don't really like the rear end.
 
kikie
I saw my first 992 IRL today. It was obviously in a Porsche Center. I was allowed to sit in it, which is not that abnormal.

Very beautiful car but the rear end is something I have to get used to. So far, I don't really like the rear end.
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I mentioned about the rear end earlier in this thread. The non turbo 992s simply have too much real estate between the plate and the taillights, which made it look odd and fat.

They fixed this problem with the 992 turbo though, I love how the turbo looks.
 
MSZ
I mentioned about the rear end earlier in this thread. The non turbo 992s simply have too much real estate between the plate and the taillights, which made it look odd and fat.

They fixed this problem with the 992 turbo though, I love how the turbo looks.
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I agree. Although I've come round to the 992 quite quickly, the rear bumper is still something that I can't abide.

Can be easily remedied with the optional Sport Design package if so inclined, but as you point out, the Turbo is a definite improvement. 👍
 
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I have no problem with the rear bumper but with the rear lights and the Cylon light between the real lights. And the P O R S C H E between the rear lights.
 
I wouldn't say the Turbo is improved at all. They moved the plate up, but the real estate between it and the exhaust is still there.
 
Beeblebrox237
I wonder if a manual will be a cost option. I wouldn't blame them if it was.
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I don’t believe so. The GT3 can be had with a PDK or manual free of charge. With the Touring Package, you’re basically paying for all the other changes made to that package more so than just having a manual-only transmission.
 

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