2020/21 Premier League & General Football Discussion

[Liquid]

PREMIER LEAGUE

Current Champions: Liverpool

Competing In Europe
Champions League: Liverpool, Manchester City, Manchester United, Chelsea
Europa League: Leicester City, Tottenham Hotspur, Arsenal

New Teams
Came Up: Leeds United, West Bromwich Albion, Fulham

Spoiler: All Teams

Arsenal
Aston Villa
Brighton & Hove Albion
Burnley
Chelsea
Crystal Palace
Everton
Fulham
Leeds United
Leicester City
Liverpool
Manchester City
Manchester United
Newcastle United
Sheffield United
Southampton
Tottenham Hotspur
West Bromwich Albion
West Ham United
Wolverhampton Wanderers

---

CHAMPIONSHIP

Current Champions: Leeds United

New Teams
Came Down: Bournemouth, Watford, Norwich City
Came Up: Coventry City, Rotherham United, Wycombe Wanderers

Spoiler: All Teams

Barnsley
Bournemouth
Blackburn Rovers
Birmingham City
Brentford
Bristol City
Cardiff City
Coventry City
Derby County
Huddersfield Town
Luton Town
Middlesbrough
Millwall
Norwich City
Nottingham Forest
Preston North End
Queen's Park Rangers
Reading
Rotherham United
Sheffield Wednesday
Stoke City
Swansea City
Watford
Wycombe Wanderers

---

LEAGUE ONE

Current Champions: Coventry City

New Teams
Came Down: Charlton Athletic, Wigan Athletic, Hull City
Came Up: Swindon Town, Crewe Alexandra, Plymouth Argyle, Northampton Town

Spoiler: All Teams

Accrington Stanley
Blackpool
Bristol Rovers
Burton Albion
Charlton Athletic
Crewe Alexandra
Doncaster Rovers
Fleetwood Town
Gillingham
Hull City
Ipswich Town
Lincoln City
Milton Keynes Dons
Northampton Town
Oxford United
Peterborough United
Plymouth Argyle
Portsmouth
Rochdale
Shrewsbury Town
Sunderland
Wigan Athletic
Wimbledon

---

LEAGUE TWO

Current Champions: Swindon Town

New Teams
Came Down: Tranmere Rovers, Southend United, Bolton Wanderers
Came Up: Barrow, Harrogate Town

Spoiler: All Teams

Barrow
Bolton Wanderers
Bradford City
Cambridge United
Carlisle United
Cheltenham Town
Colchester United
Crawley Town
Exeter City
Forest Green Rovers
Grimsby Town
Harrogate Town
Leyton Orient
Mansfield Town
Morcambe
Newport County
Oldham Athletic
Port Vale
Salford City
Scunthorpe United
Southend United
Stevenage
Tranmere Rovers
Walsall

---

ENGLISH SUPER CUP

Current Holders: Manchester City

2020/21 WINNERS: ARSENAL

---

FA CUP

Current Holders: Arsenal

2020/21 WINNERS: CHELSEA

---

FOOTBALL LEAGUE CUP

Current Holders: Manchester City


2020/21 WINNERS: MANCHESTER CITY

---

FOOTBALL LEAGUE TROPHY

Current Holders: Salford City

2020/21 WINNERS: SUNDERLAND​

 

[Liquid]

Manager watch is gone. Just can't be faffed with it any more.

 

[MUSC4EVER]

Season starts on September 12th which is only a months time!

Fixtures are announced next week.

 

[redhed17]

ENGLISH SUPER CUP

Current Holders: Manchester City
​

What's the "English Super Cup"?

 

[Liquid]

What's the "English Super Cup"?

Charity Shield, Community Shield. Whatever the FA is calling it this week to stay ahead of the law.

A super cup, like in other countries that have domestic super cups, is the winner of one competition versus the winner of another competition, i.e. the league champions versus the cup winner.

 

[redhed17]

Charity Shield, Community Shield. Whatever the FA is calling it this week to stay ahead of the law.

According to Wikipedia, the game has had a few names, The Sheriff of London Charity Shield (1898-1907), The Football Association Charity Shield 1908-2001) and The Community Shield (2002-present). It has been played with varying teams over the years, starting with between the best amateur and best professional clubs in England, and has been played with various teams over the years, for one year it was an England World Cup XI v a FA Canadian Touring XI, so not just the English top league winners versus the FA Cup winners, though that is now the format for a number of years. Though there was even speculation of either, or both of Liverpool and Arsenal may not contest this year's Community Shield.

It has never been called the "English Super Cup", and could confuse non aficionado's of English football.

To say "Whatever the FA is calling it this week to stay ahead of the law" makes it sound as if the game has been changing names many times, and again, I think misrepresents the number of times the name of the game has been changed over the whole of its history, three times, since 1898.

 

[Liquid]

It has never been called the "English Super Cup", and could confuse non aficionado's of English football.

It's a super cup. And listed as such. It doesn't literally have to be called a super cup to be one. Ireland's super cup is called the President's Cup; Norway's super cup is called the Master Finals; the Netherlands' super cup is called the Johan Cruijff Shield; France's super cup is called the Trophy Of Champions. They're still super cup competitions.

If you were to call the Coppa Titano the "San Marino FA Cup", you'd still be pretty much correct even though it's actually called the Titans Cup.

To say "Whatever the FA is calling it this week to stay ahead of the law" makes it sound as if the game has been changing names many times, and again, I think misrepresents the number of times the name of the game has been changed over the whole of its history, three times, since 1898.

It's not an attempt at misrepresentation; in 2002 the FA changed the official name of the competition from Charity Shield to Community Shield, even though most people likely still call it the Charity Shield nearly 20 years later, because the FA no longer qualified for charity status and dubious financial malpractice with regards to ticket sales for the game and alleged match revenue donations. Hence the facetious remark of staying ahead of the law. But Community Shield still sounds benevolent and nicey nicey for the marketing department.

I mean, to be honest it's a glorified friendly anyway. Although it is paradoxically held in greater esteem by journos and outlets on the continent than those actually in England.

 

[redhed17]

It's a super cup. And listed as such. It doesn't literally have to be called a super cup to be one. Ireland's super cup is called the President's Cup; Norway's super cup is called the Master Finals; the Netherlands' super cup is called the Johan Cruijff Shield; France's super cup is called the Trophy Of Champions. They're still super cup competitions.

It may be (currently) a 'super cup' type game, i.e. a game between the a domestic league winner and a domestic cup competition winner, but as you point out, these games may have a specific name, which in this case is The Community Shield, and to call it something else when it is not known as that by virtually anyone of that country, could confuse, which is why I highlighted it. You may continue to refer to that game as the 'English Super Cup', but unless you also mention The Community Shield, then there is a potential to confuse.

It's not an attempt at misrepresentation; in 2002 the FA changed the official name of the competition from Charity Shield to Community Shield, even though most people likely still call it the Charity Shield nearly 20 years later, because the FA no longer qualified for charity status and dubious financial malpractice with regards to ticket sales for the game and alleged match revenue donations. Hence the facetious remark of staying ahead of the law. But Community Shield still sounds benevolent and nicey nicey for the marketing department.

I know why the English FA changed the name from The Charity Shield to The Community Shield, but to say that "Whatever the FA is calling it this week to stay ahead of the law" implies that they are changing the name often, taking your statement at face value, maybe as often as weekly, though obviously not what you meant, when the reality is, as pointed out, the name of the game has changed three times in the last 122 years, and last changed 18 years ago.

I mean, to be honest it's a glorified friendly anyway. Although it is paradoxically held in greater esteem by journos and outlets on the continent than those actually in England.

It seems to be important when someone wants inflate the success of a/their club. As a Liverpool fan it is not a 'trophy' I consider mentioning as an achievement, as one participant has had to come out best over 38 games (in England) to win a league, and the other may only had to have won 6 games to win a cup. Though maybe a participant may not even have had to win anything to be in the game. See below.

As you say, it is a friendly to start a season. Did I feel a great loss or sadness when Liverpool lost last season's Community Shield to Manchester Cit€h! Nope. I can't even remember the game. And without looking, I could not tell you how many Charity/Community Shield's Liverpool have won or lost over the years, and when and who they played. I think I may even have went to one, but it does not readily come to mind. I think Liverpool may have played Arsenal, but I wouldn't put any money on that.

The only significance is that in the current format, you would normally have had to have won something to be in the game, though not always, as last year's game proved, when, because Manchester Cit€h did the double, and won the English Premier League and the FA Cup, the Premier League runners up, Liverpool, were invited to participate. I think it should normally the League Cup winners in a 'double' (Premier League and FA Cup double) as that is another domestic trophy winner, but I understand the politics of why that would not be the choice of alternate opponent for 'double' winners. But because actually Cit€h did the domestic treble of Premier League, FA Cup and League Cup, Liverpool were invited as runners up in the Premier League.

I feel the European Super Cup is more worthy of the title of 'Super Cup', as both participants have had to win competitions that included a mini league portion, and knock out stages. Though the actual numbers of games may vary between the Champions League winners and the Europa League winners, the disparity in the number of games needed to complete, and win their competitions, compared to English Premier League winners and FA Cup winners mentioned above, would not be anywhere near as great. And of course, there is no chance of one team winning both competitions in the same year.

 

[MUSC4EVER]

Joe Hart is having a medical at Tottenham ahead of a free transfer move, he was released by Burnley and will provide cover or even competition to Hugo Lloris.

Vincent Kompany has retired from playing but is still in charge of Anderlecht, he was player manager last season. Man city have confirmed they will build statues of Kompany and David Silva at the Etihad by 2021.

Its been wildly reported that Ronald Koeman will be the next Barcelona manager and that he will leave his role as Netherlands head coach.

 

[Famine]

Wednesday, the EFL, and the independent panel all having a pop at each other again today.

Wednesday say the penalty should, by the EFL's own rules, be applied to the 2018-19 season as the season following the one in which the offence (which it still denies) took place (which would make it irrelevant; we were 24pt clear). EFL say it should be the 2019-20 season (which would relegate us). The panel say if the EFL hadn't wasted time with the second charge (acting with malice), and hadn't been so equally lazy with a charge against Derby, and because of a number of players leaving on June 30 and being unavailable for the final few games unfairly weakening the squad, it will apply next season.

It is important to highlight that the Commission did not find that the sale of the stadium was itself prohibited by the P&S rules, nor that the Club acted anything other than in the utmost good faith with respect to that transaction. The Club had been assured by the EFL that the stadium sale could be included in its 2017/18 P&S returns and relied on those assurances. Having discussed the transaction with the EFL, the EFL having approved it and the Club’s auditors having signed off on it, the Club believed, and continues to believe, it was acting properly and in accordance with the rules. It is disappointing, in those circumstances, that the Commission went on to find the Club was nevertheless in breach of Charge 1.

The Club is pleased that Charge 2, which alleged that the Club had deliberately concealed certain matters from the EFL, was dismissed and that it was accepted that the Club acted openly and honestly in its dealings with the EFL. The Club further notes the Disciplinary Commission’s findings that this was a serious allegation that is not to be made lightly and an opportunity should have been afforded to the individuals involved to explain their position before the charge was brought. The Club welcomes the Disciplinary Commission’s suggestion that the EFL should have exercised its power to investigate under Regulations 82.2/3/4 as being a fairer approach rather than to bring the allegations without further investigation.

Despite the EFL’s “sanctioning guidelines” (which it is not accepted apply in this case) providing for any points deduction sanction to take effect in the year following the breach (which in the Club’s case would have been the 2018/19 season when it finished 24 points clear of the relegation zone) and other mitigating factors, the Commission imposed the maximum 12-point deduction for next season. The EFL sought to have the sanction imposed in the 2019/20 season that has just concluded, which would have seen the Club relegated, in stark contrast to the position it adopted in the Derby County disciplinary proceedings where it was content for any sanction to be imposed next season because Derby would not be relegated. The Club is pleased the Commission rejected such an inconsistent approach to sanctioning by the EFL.

It's all so stupid - and Wigan still shouldn't be relegated because the EFL failed in its duty to investigate the suitability of a man who doesn't even exist to be a club owner.

 

[redhed17]

Joe Hart is having a medical at Tottenham ahead of a free transfer move, he was released by Burnley and will provide cover or even competition to Hugo Lloris.

I watched the BT Sport coverage of the Man Cit€h v Lyon game, where Joe Hart was in the studio, and he has the longest neck I have seen outside of someone from an African tribe who have placed a load of rings around their necks to elongate it.

 

[Jezza819]

I watched the BT Sport coverage of the Man Cit€h v Lyon game, where Joe Hart was in the studio, and he has the longest neck I have seen outside of someone from an African tribe who have placed a load of rings around their necks to elongate it.

I remember saying the same thing back when I first started watching football during the 2015/16 season. "Wow that dude has a long neck"

 

[Dave A]

Its been wildly reported that Ronald Koeman will be the next Barcelona manager and that he will leave his role as Netherlands head coach.

It seems all but confirmed, they will probably announce it later this week.

 

[redhed17]

It seems all but confirmed, they will probably announce it later this week.

I hope he does a better job than he did at Everton.

Barcelona is going to be a big job, with lots of money to be spent (hopefully spent well ) and if Messi moves, even more money on top of that to replace so many goals each season.

 

[Dave A]

I hope he does a better job than he did at Everton. .

Yeah, you must have lost loads of sleep when he was in charge there .

 

[redhed17]

Yeah, you must have lost loads of sleep when he was in charge there .

Took me lots of time to recover.







From the laughing.

Seriously though, there is an Everton fan in work, they get everywhere, and because Everton had spent a load of money for Koeman's 2nd season (about £150m), he got a bit carried away and bet me that Everton were going to win the league with Liverpool in 2nd. I said, woah! how about Everton finishing above Liverpool or vice versa? He agreed. So, Koeman doesn't last the season, Liverpool finish 4th and Everton 8th, and he wouldn't pay me (£5) but it was worth it just for his disappointment after spending all that money, losing a manager, and finishing behind Liverpool again.

 

[christara321]

https://www.caughtoffside.com/2020/08/18/paul-ince-on-david-silva-statue/

https://extra.ie/2020/08/18/sport/s...imself-with-hilarious-blunder-on-silva-statue

LOL some times you just have to laugh? What an utter plonker that Incey bloke is.

 

[MUSC4EVER]

Premier League fixtures will be announced at 9am tomorrow.

 

[MUSC4EVER]

Man United and Man City wont take part in the opening weekend games because of their European campaigns, Burnley v Man United and Man City v Aston Villa are postponed and will be played later in the season, biggest game of the opening weekend is champions Liverpool beginning their title defense at home to Leeds.

Sheffield United have signed goalkeeper Aaron Ramsdale from Bournemouth for £18.5 million, Man United keeper Dean Henderson will not rejoin United on loan for a third season and instead is expected to remain at Man United this season and will likely sign a new contract.

 

[redhed17]

Man United and Man City wont take part in the opening weekend games because of their European campaigns, Burnley v Man United and Man City v Aston Villa are postponed and will be played later in the season, biggest game of the opening weekend is champions Liverpool beginning their title defense at home to Leeds.

Sheffield United have signed goalkeeper Aaron Ramsdale from Bournemouth for £18.5 million, Man United keeper Dean Henderson will not rejoin United on loan for a third season and instead is expected to remain at Man United this season and will likely sign a new contract.

The Liverpool v Leeds game will be a hard one to start the season, as you would think Bielsa would have Leeds organised and ready to start with all the time to prepare for one game. If Liverpool can get through the first couple of games with wins, and some teams not playing, could give a confidence boost at the start to get a lead over Cit€h especially.

I hope Henderson's career doesn't tail off stuck behind de Gea. I'm not sure Solskjaer would put Henderson in for an extended period now, though I could see him being used to possibly put 'pressure' on de Gea occasionally depending of de Gea form, and maybe being used in the cup competitions. Henderson may have been on the verge of being considered for England, and he may still be involved in the internationals at the start of the season, but if he is not getting games for Utd further down the line, he may not be considered for internationals.

As an outsider, I think atm, Henderson is better than de Gea, who seems to have dropped from his very high level over the last year or so. It will be interesting to watch how it plays out. For Sheffield United, it will also be interesting to see how being without Henderson will affect their defence, as they were pretty good as a unit last season.

 

[Liquid]

Connah's Quay lost in their first ever Champions League qualifier; a spirited 0-2 defeat against Sarajevo. No complaints about the result against a stronger team but the Sarajevo players committed some of the worst acting I've ever seen. It got so bad that the referee actually started ignoring Sarajevo players heaped on the ground which is actually a dangerous thing to do; a potential dereliction of duty on the referee's part but when players consistently, continuously and carelessly keep pretending to be injured, what are you supposed to do?

At least there's one more bite of the cherry with CLQ losers dropping into the ELQs for one round. Hopefully the Nomads draw a Slovak team that advances from the first round.

 

[Jimlaad43]

continuously and carelessly keep pretending to be injured, what are you supposed to do?

Stretcher them off if they stay on the ground for longer than 5 seconds and refuse to let them back on the pitch for at least a minute. Players will very quickly stop Neymar-ing if there's some real action done to combat it which takes away the "tactical advantage" of pretending to be injured after a "foul"

 

[mustafur]

Next year with the 3rd tier Competiton in place do teams that qualify for the Europa league just go straight to the Group stage?

The amount of teams that can actually qualify directly into the Europa league is significantly lower with champions league qualifiers dropping to the 3rd tier if they lose that stage.

 

[Liquid]

I'm still undecided on the tertiary competition. On the one hand, it gives smaller clubs, very small clubs, a better chance at having an enjoyable European campaign. On the other hand, it's just another door slammed shut so the big boys can have their closed shop competition. How dare Dudelange, Connah's Quay or Flora Tallinn have the temerity to try and qualify for our competitions? Stick to your own level.

It comes across like UEFA obviously don't want small teams in their precious Super Champions and Europa Leagues but they have to maintain the pretense of offering them continental football because simply excluding nations outright would be too obvious.

 

[MUSC4EVER]

Man United captain Harry Maguire was arrested on the Greek island of Mykonos in the early hours of the morning, he was with a group of friends and it is said that they got in an altercation with another group and the Greek police.

United have said that they have been in contact with him and they haven't commented further.

 

[mustafur]

I'm still undecided on the tertiary competition. On the one hand, it gives smaller clubs, very small clubs, a better chance at having an enjoyable European campaign. On the other hand, it's just another door slammed shut so the big boys can have their closed shop competition. How dare Dudelange, Connah's Quay or Flora Tallinn have the temerity to try and qualify for our competitions? Stick to your own level.

It comes across like UEFA obviously don't want small teams in their precious Super Champions and Europa Leagues but they have to maintain the pretense of offering them continental football because simply excluding nations outright would be too obvious.

Top leagues get far too many teams in the competitions, even with the proposed 3rd tier the top leagues still get a team in it as well, so it is still very easily possible for a league to win all 3 in the same year.

Last year literally had 4 teams from the top 4 leagues start at the group stage while the 11th nation on the coefficient and lower had to qualify, a total joke of a system considering you still have clubs at that level that can still make the knockouts.

I think with a 3rd tier in place the lower leagues Champions should atleast make the Group stage if they get past the prelim quals and lose because for the vast majority of clubs outside the very top leagues, playing in Europe is the primary income and by having more leagues represented you can build the game depth significantly.

I'm also not a fan of the 3rd tier champion not even getting a Champions league spot and only getting a Europa spot.

 

[redhed17]

I am old enough to remember when there was the European Cup, the UEFA Cup, and the Cup Winner's Cup. So coming from that background I think 'The Champion's League' should be just that, a league for Champion's as the European Cup was. Maybe also national cup winners, (like the FA Cup is in England) at a pinch, because they have won a competition too, and there is no longer a Cup Winner's Cup. It also would increase numbers to actually create a decent number of leagues.

In that format my team, Liverpool, would not have been able to have won 2 of their 6 Champion's League/European Cups, but I would be happy with that if the competition was set up in a more fair, and descriptive format.

The Europa League should be teams that finish 2nd, 3rd and maybe 4th (depending on the numbers) in national leagues. The winners would get a place in the following season's Champion's League. The Europa League shouldn't be another competition for teams that get knocked out if the Champion's League at the early stages.

The UEFA Cup was biased towards the more successful nations, with those nations getting more places, and with the threat of breakaway leagues the teams gained more power in the relationship with UEFA, and so three competitions became two, and the 'Champion's' League and Europa League were born. And because of the change in the balance of power between (top) teams and UEFA we are at the situation we are now. You don't have to be a Champion to be in the 'Champion's' League, and do badly in that and you have a chance of going into another competition when you get dumped out of it.

And I think the current situation has more to do with the larger teams/nations not wanting the smaller teams in a competition at the expense of themselves, rather than coming from UEFA. But it has to said, UEFA are not stupid, and selling the rights to competitions with pretty much guaranteed large teams (popularity wise), from bigger footballing nations, (ratings) will mean more money. Things will not change to more 'egalitarian' competitions when the top teams have so much influence. It would be like turkeys voting for Christmas, not really in their best interest.

 

[Jimlaad43]

The Fantasy Premier League thread and leagues have been set up if anybody would like to join them.
https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/threads/fantasy-premier-league-2020-21.395533/

 

[MUSC4EVER]

Harry Maguire has been found GUILTY of aggravated assault, resisting arrest and bribing a Police officer.

I'm quite staggered by this there is a lot of differing reports as to what happened but I think his sister was attacked or had her drink spiked and Harry and a bunch of his friends intervened, there was a scuffle and the Police were called, the bribing an officer thing came out today the prosecution claimed he said to an officer 'do you know how I am, I'm Man United captain, I'm very rich and can offer you money'.

He has actually been named in the England squad today as well!

 

[Dave A]

It's been a very fast case, too fast perhaps.

Apparnetly his defense only recieved documents form the prosecution relating to the case a few hours before but the judge wouldn't grant a delay.

I'm not saying he didn't do it, but where is the CCTV footage etc. it happened at a police station, so how is none of the fighting on camera?

His defense was that on arrival at the station the police officers assaulted him and told him his career would be over.

I would think t's probably unwise to accuse the police of that without evidence, even if it's true. Without evidence I cannot see you winning that one.

A very unusal case and one that will likely result in a big fine for Maguire and possibly a suspended sentence. I would imagine he will lose the captaincy at United and maybe after this verdict he will be dropped from the England squad.

I never had Harry down as an agreesive person, but then it's not like I know him, I've just judged that based on what he seems to be like in interviews and on the pitch.

The question is, if he loses the captains armband (which I think he should following the guilty verdict), who should get it next?