60-80k budget, What to buy?

[Tornado]

I still think a 512TR would work, as they are pretty reliable for Ferrari's; not to mention faster, less extreme and cheaper (both to buy and to maintain) than the Countach and Diablo. 80k should get you a very nice one.
Failing that, a Maserati 4200GT or Cabriolet would probably be the best way to go, as any Porsche would be far too common.

 

[JCE]

Wow, not even people from the UK are mentioning Aston. I mean the DB7 has it all, great looks, good interior, superb comfort, speed, and it's an Aston for christ sakes.

 

[Jay]

Or maybe he would go for a Jaguar XKR.

 

[Omnis]

Tell him to get a bentley and drive the pants off of it.

 

[STLbarcelona5]

I'd aim for these (alphabetical order):

Audi RS4
BMW Z4 M
Honda/Acura NSX
Mercedes SLK55 AMG
Porsche Boxter S

Normally I'd recommend the new XK, but being that Jaguars are known to be driven by older fellows who play golf, and you said that he'd want something more exciting.

Or since he has luxury in the Legacy. Just go for an Ariel Atom or Elise.

 

[YSSMAN]

To reply back on the possibilities of the XLR for just a moment:

In all seriousness, the cars are actually quite rare and quasi-exclusive. Granted, they do share parts with the Corvette, STS, etc but they have sold quite well for Cadillac over the past few years. However, the cheapest one I can remember seeing was at $76,000 and not that it is a bad value, but if you aren't into GM models, it might not be worth it. But you could pick up a used one for pretty cheap...

---

Is your Grandfather into collectables at all? I know that my Grandfather has been looking into purchasing an older sports car, preferably of British or American build, maybe not to drive everyday, but something to drive around just for fun.

I know if I was looking, my list would be as this:
- C2 Corvette Stingray
- Jaguar XKE V12 (I6 is okay as well)
- Aston V8 Vantage
- Ferrari Dino
- Porsche 911

...just to name a few...

 

[McLaren]

I'm sorry if I come off biased, but the XLR is just a big waste of dough like the XLR-V.

Cadillac has made a turn around and sure, their pushing out amazing vehicles, but they just aren't at that point to start selling $76,000/$100,000 cars. People in America and surely in Europe, just don't think of Cadillacs as $76K/$100K cars.

Not to mention, they're still becoming highly outclassed by the germans like BMW. A M6 is a couple thousand less, and apparently performs much better. When the M6 Conv. hits shores this fall, it may too.

The thing is that BMW has a reputation of selling cars at such high prices, and has something to offer.

Cadillacs start at $29,990 for the CTS, and then run up to $41,000 for the STS.
Out of nowhere comes this sports car for $77,000 with just 320Hp!

People aren't going to fall for that from Cadillac. They just aren't at that point where they can start selling cars for $70K. Do they honestly expect that they will still sells away from Mercedes, Jaguar, and BMW who have set a rep. for selling cars for those prices? Hardly anybody thinks of Cadillac as a brand to compete with them.

I'm sorry YSSMAN. I can see you're a big fan, but a XLR is just a car that shows how much money you've got for buying a 320Hp Convertible.

Knock the price down into the $50Ks, and the V into the $70s, and it might just be worth it. But until then, it's not.

I can buy a fully loaded M5 with shipping costs and still save $8K from the XLR-V and get more of my money's worth from it. Maybe in a couple years, Cadillac can achieve this price range.

 

[YSSMAN]

Awww, everyone plays so rough against the XLR... I have to ask if you have actually seen one, much less sat in one. I have done everything but drive it, and I came away quite impressed. Granted, it isn't an SL550 by any means, and I doubt anything will be able to top that as the top GT Convertable, but the XLR offers a great value when compared to the previous SL.

In it's debut comparison test, the XLR finished third in a group that included the Lexus SC430, Mercedes-Benz SL500, Porsche 911 Carrera 4 Cabrio, and Jaguar XK8 Convertable. The Jag finished in last, followed by the Lexus, then the Caddy, Porsche, then the Merc.

Maybe I've got my GM blinders on too high, but quite frankly, I don't care. The looks are different, the performance is on par with the German rivals, and if anything else, it's a Cadillac. Granted, the SL is better (Derrrrrr!!!), but the only thing that would keep me from buying an XLR at that price would be the Jaguar XJ8.

But given the "old-folks" nature that the Jag carries in the US, it might not be the best pick of the pack. I love older-folks cars myself, and I would dare to say that at the moment, the Jag XK8 is one of the best looking cars available on the road, second only to the Aston twins that it shares so many of it's parts with.

 

[McLaren]

I have, I went to go see one just to see what it was that caused such a price. But I was denied a test drive.
(Something about them wanting to sell it instead of demoing it.)
I mean, yeah, it can keep up, but it's a Cadillac. People just really don't see Cadillac as a $70K company. It's nice, yes, but the price...is just to out of nowhere from Caddy.

Like I said, knock the price down, and it'll be worth it.
Even the fully loaded M6 is cheaper by $2K, and apparently, the M5 price was knocked down to $81,000.

 

[JCE]

Awww, everyone plays so rough against the XLR... I have to ask if you have actually seen one, much less sat in one. I have done everything but drive it, and I came away quite impressed.

So did I (everything but drive it) and I wasn't impressed. It's quite a waste of money--I'm sorry but if the money is for luxury there are plenty of cars for half the price that eat it alive in that catagory. And if the price is for performance...well...seriously the car is slow compared to other cars with the same pricetag. I could just spend $33k~$35k on an STi and wipe the floor with it in every concievable catagory. I admire your GM love...I feel the same way about Ford...but having said that I think the Thunderturd is a HUGE waste of money and I point and laugh at anyone who buys one...and I do the same with XLR owners. I just can't possibly hope to understand what GM is thinking about offering a car for $100k that is completely worthless. At least for $100k I could get a Viper, M5, 911, ZO6+WRX, RS4+RS4, and the list goes on. And yes I would buy a Viper if I had the choice between it and the XLR. At least the Viper does have awsome performance. And even the "cheap" version of the XLR isn't better...it's slower and therefore would even make it WORSE than the V model.

*edt*
If GM stuffed the LS2 in it with a couple of turbos and a proper 6spd manual gearbox it would definately be worth $100k and supercar status.

 

[YSSMAN]

...Where do you get your price for the M6 from? The base price on an M6 ($96,000) is $15,000 MORE than the M5 ($81,000)! I belive the one that Car and Driver tested ran for over $100K by the time it left the dealer, and posted marginally faster times than that of the M5.

But generally speaking, the XLR has nothing in common with the M6, as it's target is the regular-grade 650ci convertable. Even then, the cars are still quite different, as the XLR was built to be an educated-man's Corvette.

Granted, I'm not attempting to make you like the XLR, all I ask is that you actually consider it in a fair way. Not in "oh, well it is made by GM..." or "no one in their right mind would pay more than $50K for a Cadillac..." That isn't fair to the way things have changed in the luxury car market, and they certainly aren't fair to GM attempting to move Cadillac upmarket to compete better with BMW and Mercedes-Benz.

...So do you mean to tell me that you said "No one will pay $150,000 for a Ford" when they introduced the GT? Before then, I belive their most expensive car they had ever sold was the Cobra R, and even then I don't think they touched $40K.

 

[McLaren]

There were people who didn't want to. But let's see.
The GT was based off the GT40, which has LeMans racing history, not to mention 550Horses.
I can't really say the XLR or V was based off a famous racing car, esp. one that drove Ferrari out of the LeMans scene.

I meant for the M6 to be compared to the XLR-V.
Trust me, I like the XLR, it's a nice car. I just don't think its worth the $70,000.

 

[JCE]

The problem with the arguement that the XLR is meant to compete with the regular 6-series is, ... it doesn't. It just flat out doesn't, no one in their right mind would pick the XLR over the BMW 6-series or the SL500/SL600 Merc for that matter. Now, the M6 absolutely obliterates the XLR-V...the only thing the XLR and XLR-V is competeting against is some old white guy's wallet. GM is trying to compete with the AMG models with the XLR-V and they fail very badly. The Ford GT is worth every penny, the Thunderbird however is not. Imagine if GM priced the CTS-V $70k? What would you say? It's worth it?

 

[GM]

BMW M5
BMW M6
BMW Z4M (The new hardtop convertable one)

Jaguar S Type R
Jaguar XKR

Caterham 7 - It'll blow his wig right off
Areil Atom - Same as above but comes with face treatment standard.

Porsche Boxster S
Porsche 911 (Might be hard)
Porsche Caynee (Can't spell)

Audi TT Roadster

TVR Sagaris
TVR Griffith
TVR Cerbera Speed 6
TVR Cerbera Speed 12 (If he could get that, it'll probaly kill him)

 

[Jay]

TVR Sagaris
TVR Griffith
TVR Cerbera Speed 6
TVR Cerbera Speed 12 (If he could get that, it'll probaly kill him)

Don't forget he is in the US, so TVR is highly unlikely.

 

[GM]

Well, its they're worth travelling to the UK for (maybe Russia if TVR go bankrupt)

 

[McLaren]

I believe the M5 sits right on the border ($81,000) without any options.

The M6 is kinda...well, $20K out of his range. But I guess it is "outrageous" and well, is fun to drive according to mags. And I'm sure the 500Hp V10 is more than enough.

GT, does he plan on using it for anything else since I imagine he used the Legacy for more than just speed. If so, I do also suggest the M5 (used or new). While he'll spring a little more for options, it's pretty reliable car, has some great power, and can definately be used to haul passengers and what not to get more out of it.

EDIT: I would think the Speed 12 is out of a LOT of people's range.

 

[Danny]

Well the SL is growing old now, but it still looks the biz.

And $53k will get you this.

(I did a used car search for Maryland)

 

[Leonidae]

I don't think he should go for M5. all that technical gadgetry would make him go berserk, and, in addition, if he was a ace driver back then, he drives fast now as well. and we all know that M5/M6 has pretty fragile rear differentials and gearboxes.

 

[Roo]

How hard would it be to get a TVR to be road legal in the US? Is it becuase of emissons, or safety, or what?

People in America and surely in Europe, just don't think of Cadillacs as $76K/$100K cars.

As far as I'm aware, people in Europe generally don't think of Cadillacs at all; certainly not post-Presley, at any rate. Although we do now get a rebadged Saab, in the form of the CTS.

I think he likes the Diablo better because it is slightly less radical.

Never thought I'd hear anyone say that, ever But against the Countach, it's true.

 

[iceburns288]

Tell him to get a 348 with Hyper-Flows and an X-OST. My boss has one. One of the best sounding cars there is!

Sure, it's not nearly the fastest car (both my boss and I know my Z is faster than his car ) but it's better than all the other cars you listed in more subjective categories.

 

[Tornado]

A 348 Ferrari?! Why on earth would you want him to get one of those? There are kit cars that are better put together than those. Seriously, if he's looking at a 348, he should just get an NSX. And he already said they are too slow compared to his Subaru Legacy.

 

[YSSMAN]

If were gonna talk M5s, I would be looking for a low-mileage E39 M5 myself. The new one is complely unappealing both in looks and demeanor, given it's technologically-stuffed interior and computer-controled driving dynamics.

Atleast with the E39, he would not only be saving money when he is buying it, but he would also be getting something that would actually be nice to drive. Hell, with the money he saves, he could go out and get something to get through the Maryland winters with.

 

[JCE]

How hard would it be to get a TVR to be road legal in the US? Is it becuase of a) emissons, or b) safety, or what?

a) Yes, the US goverment will FORCE the owner to install emissions equipment before the car can be taken possession of.

b) Yes, I'd imagine possibly the car not even passing safety regs and not being allowed in at all depending on the model. Older TVRs (which would fit his price range) frankly aren't the safest coupes on the road.

I just don't think it's worth the money importing a TVR unless you do it kit-car style. And even then I wouldn't try and drive it much because TVR is known for their lack of quality and falling apart...where the hell would he get it serviced? No where...

 

[Onikaze]

635Csi M.

Mazda Miata

Porsche Cayman S

Buy all three.

What, who said he had to get one car?

 

[McLaren]

I think too many of you are thinking of the M5 as the same as the 5s and 7s equipped with I-Drive. As ///M-Spec says, BMW is smart when it comes to leaving out the gadgets in the Ms. And for the "gizmos", if you can at least be bothered to read the instructions, they're actually easy to use. Sure, they're a pain at first, but they aren't that bad in the Ms.

I personally, can live with them.

I say, go for the M5s, E39 or E60. If you want real good info on them, I suggest PMing ///M-Spec.

 

[Master_Yoda]

If he gets a Boxter... might as well get the faster more reliable and better looking S2000.... But if he want's mid ranged....

 

[superfast]

Well, its they're worth travelling to the UK for (maybe Russia if TVR go bankrupt)

Agreed, but I don't think he wants to.

I can buy a fully loaded M5 with shipping costs and still save $8K from the XLR-V and get more of my money's worth from it. Maybe in a couple years, Cadillac can achieve this price range.

Yeah, I agree. The XLR is unforgivably overpriced. It's just not worth it in the end.

Caterham 7 - It'll blow his wig right off
Areil Atom - Same as above but comes with face treatment standard.


TVR Sagaris
TVR Griffith
TVR Cerbera Speed 6

Caterham and Ariel are good ideas, as they are obviously great track cars. He still does a lot of track days.

If TVRs were in the US, I think it would be a hands-down pick. They are so amazing.

I don't think he should go for M5. all that technical gadgetry would make him go berserk, and, in addition, if he was a ace driver back then, he drives fast now as well. and we all know that M5/M6 has pretty fragile rear differentials and gearboxes.

Absolutely. He would like something that can be reliable even when driven hard, but if an M came at the right price, who knows?

Never thought I'd hear anyone say that, ever. But against the Countach, it's true.

635Csi M.

Mazda Miata

Porsche Cayman S

Buy all three.

What, who said he had to get one car?

Nice. 👍

I think too many of you are thinking of the M5 as the same as the 5s and 7s equipped with I-Drive. As ///M-Spec says, BMW is smart when it comes to leaving out the gadgets in the Ms. And for the "gizmos", if you can at least be bothered to read the instructions, they're actually easy to use. Sure, they're a pain at first, but they aren't that bad in the Ms.

Yep. I actually learned how to use it by reading Road & Track.

If he gets a Boxter... might as well get the faster more reliable and better looking S2000.... But if he want's mid ranged....

Yeah, he loves the feeling of mid.


I talked to him, and he really liked the prospect of the Maserati. It's just finding one to service them out here...

 

[YSSMAN]

Good point on Maserati service. I'm not exactly sure where you are in Maryland, but according to Maserati North America's website, their two closest dealers would presumably be in New Jersey. I know a few folks in town have Maseratis, and they have to drive three hours across the state in order to have their cars worked on. Granted, I think there might be one small dealer here who has autorization by a few companies to work on their cars, but even then, I don't know if I'd want my $80,000 car being worked on anywhere but the actual dealer from which I bought her.

Has he considered a Benz yet? If he is looking for high-performance, I'm sure he could pick up one of the last E55s in his prince range, if not, the SLK55 might be right up his alley. Of course, there is that whole thing about their build quality, but who cares when you've got that much money to spend on a new car?

 

[Jay]

NSX really isn't much faster than the Legacy, but it is a cool car.

Well a later NSX can do 12.7's down 400M's then swing around the first corner leaving many fast cars in its dust.