Are the penalties too extreme at Le Mans?

[VeeDoubleU]

Does hitting that cone generate a penalty if it was still in its original place?

I hit a different green cone that had fallen onto the track, and received no penalty

 

[TheGeologist]

Are we sure the 10 second penalty was for cutting tertre rouge? It came up too quickly for that surely?

The first penalty was attained at 16 seconds into the lap, but the penalty sign didn't appear until 22 seconds. A penalty usually takes a few seconds to appear so if we assume from that that it takes about 6 seconds.

6 seconds back from the 2nd penalty is here. Does hitting that cone somehow generate a penalty?

View attachment 739804

Does hitting that cone generate a penalty if it was still in its original place?

@daan, I don't think hitting cones generates a penalty. I know in one race someone had knocked an orange cone down and it was in the middle of the track. I hit it and it picked my tires off the ground, but I was able to keep going without incident.

I surely hope I don't get penalties for hitting debris left by others

Also, I noticed on a few occasions I was getting penalties immediately for small cuts. After rewatching the replay, I still think it is from where I turned in.

I think the penalty is fine. Running wide on the exit of that corner doesn't negate the corner cut.

I'm suggesting I've gained more time on running wide than the corner cut

Tracklimits are perfect on this track thats how its should be keep it on the Grey stuff and you will be fine

On other circuits, that is keeping it in the grey. Now that isn't why I'm upset. As I've said, I'm okay with being charged for the crime of cutting in this instance, but the penalty is extreme.

It's like being given life in jail for jaywalking.

 

[GOTMAXPOWER]

As I said earlier I have no problem with track limits, if you have all 4 wheels over the white line you're off the track. What is wrong is the penalties, the most deliberate crash to take somebody off is worth 10s. Is a few inches too far to the left at the Porsche curves really twice as bad as that?

 

[Voodoovaj]

Always 2 wheels on the track !! So 100% clear penalty. Should be on EVERY track. We were complaining about unclean track limits for months. Finally a simple rule which is implemented as it should be and still people are discussing and complaining. Has never been easier as this: always 2 wheels on the track. Always.

Now please PD just continue this strategy on all tracks and we can finally close these useless discussions.

Except that, in the video of Kobayashi below, you can see him definitely put wheels on the curbs multiple times.

H

From the looks of it, he is deep into 10 seconds penalty before he drives under dunlop?

Totally agree. They are a little harsh, especially when you run wide.

 

[CRN_G-TR]

Practice some more the track just arrived 24HRs ago. people switch to moan mode instead of doing practice

@daan, I don't think hitting cones generates a penalty. I know in one race someone had knocked an orange cone down and it was in the middle of the track. I hit it and it picked my tires off the ground, but I was able to keep going without incident.

I surely hope I don't get penalties for hitting debris left by others

Also, I noticed on a few occasions I was getting penalties immediately for small cuts. After rewatching the replay, I still think it is from where I turned in.



I'm suggesting I've gained more time on running wide than the corner cut



On other circuits, that is keeping it in he grey for that's now why I'm upset. As I've said, I'm okay with being charged for the crime of cutting in this instance, but the penalty is extreme.

It's like being given life in jail for jaywalking.

 

[baldgye]

Except that, in the video of Kobayashi below, you can see him definitely put wheels on the curbs multiple times.

But Kobayashi isn't playing Gran Turismo: Sport...

 

[KK78]

All some are asking for is consistency and as much realism as possible between the tracks in the game, not arbitrary 'this tracks works this way, that track works that way'.

 

[Crazy Taylor]

It is literally like playing the buzzer game. Go slightly off track and get penalised.

The girl represents the car, the buzzer game is the track.

Practice some more the track just arrived 24HRs ago. people switch to moan mode instead of doing practice

You can practice all you want, it wont stop the fact that it gives you penalties for something so common in motorsport. For driving over kerbs.

 

[CRN_G-TR]

All some are asking for is consistency and as much realism as possible between the tracks in the game, not arbitrary 'this tracks works this way, that track works that way'.

Le mans is a fast track with allot of tarmac runoff area high penaltys make sense because when you cut a corner you can gain allot then someone will start a thread about people cutting corners on Le mans.

 

[CRN_G-TR]

It is literally like playing the buzzer game. Go slightly off track and get penalised.

The girl represents the car, the buzzer game is the track.



You can practice all you want, it wont stop the fact that it gives you penalties for something so common in motorsport. For driving over kerbs.

Check those top A+ Daily races quali laps all go way off track on Nurb Gp and Magiore it doesnt make sense

 

[baldgye]

You can practice all you want, it wont stop the fact that it gives you penalties for something so common in motorsport. For driving over kerbs.

Sorry, but his first lap he was all over the kerbs and didn't get a single penalty.

 

[KK78]

Le mans is a fast track with allot of tarmac runoff area high penaltys make sense because when you cut a corner you can gain allot then someone will start a thread about people cutting corners on Le mans.

But, cutting a corner is not the same as using a kerb, we are not talking about run off tarmac, or run of areas of coloured tarmac, we are talking about the kerbs themselves. Motorsport tracks have kerbs for a reason, they are to be used to aid cornering, for safety and to highlight track limits (i.e beyond them) Granted, if you exceed the limit of the kerb itself, that is cutting the corner but here we have examples of racers touching the kerbs and getting a penalties and in my view that is excessive.

By the logic on Le Mans on GT Sport you wouldn't be able to get through the 1st 2 chicanes at Monza without a penalty unless you didn't touch the kerbs, is this what you would prefer?

Not to mention the sledgehammer nature, and random delivery, of the penalties that are given.

 

[Crazy Taylor]

Check those top A+ Daily races quali laps all go way off track on Nurb Gp and Magiore it doesnt make sense

You are right about that. What they have done un FIA races is a bit of a remedy to it. That shouldn't happen. On Le Mans (don't like the track too long, boring like Nordschleife), it should still allow a little leniency on some turns.

 

[HellzFire]

My dream is for all tracks to be as restrict as La Sarthe and Monza are.

Perfect track limits on both.

 

[KK78]

And yet Monza is much less strict than Le Mans.....

 

[CRN_G-TR]

But, cutting a corner is not the same as using a kerb, we are not talking about run off tarmac, or run of areas of coloured tarmac, we are talking about the kerbs themselves. Motorsport tracks have kerbs for a reason, they are to be used to aid cornering, for safety and to highlight track limits (i.e beyond them) Granted, if you exceed the limit of the kerb itself, that is cutting the corner but here we have examples of racers touching the kerbs and getting a penalties and in my view that is excessive.

Not to mention the sledgehammer, and random, penalties that are given.

Using to mu

And yet Monza is much less strict than Le Mans.....

Les strict because of that sandtrap in turn 1 that will slow you down enough i guess

 

[Sven Jurgens]

That corner at the start of the straight is very strict with penalties. Cutting a little bit on the inside or going a bit wide on the outside will easily dish out large penalties. The penalty time is based on your speed, if you cut it slow there is no penalty, the faster you go the higher the penalty as you gain a big advantage for the long straight. In some areas you can go plenty wide as you don't gain any time advantage.

Monza is the same, the faster you cut a corner the higher the penalty. Yet the straights aren't that long so it doesn't calculate that big of an advantage. The penalties are a lot more than you gain, yet you can also burn penalties a lot faster than the actual time given. It's actually a bit too easy to lose penalties at Le Mans atm, just a little lift at the start of the Porsche curves will decrease the penalty much faster than any time loss.

Using the kerbs is fine on both Monza and La Sarthe, you just need to be aware to keep 2 wheels inside the white line at all times. Not keep 2 wheels on the kerb...

 

[Sean Renon]

My dream is for all tracks to be as restrict as La Sarthe and Monza are.

Perfect track limits on both.

Agreed, keep track limits strict, dish out harsh penalties for cutting so people stop trying to use the kerbs like track.
Sure the penalties aren't equal to the time gained, but you can be sure as hell people will be very cautious about not cutting corners when they know they can be slapped with a huge penalty for a very very minor time gain.

 

[TheGeologist]

But, cutting a corner is not the same as using a kerb, we are not talking about run off tarmac, or run of areas of coloured tarmac, we are talking about the kerbs themselves. Motorsport tracks have kerbs for a reason, they are to be used to aid cornering, for safety and to highlight track limits (i.e beyond them) Granted, if you exceed the limit of the kerb itself, that is cutting the corner but here we have examples of racers touching the kerbs and getting a penalties and in my view that is excessive.

I totally agree. That's why I don't understand the small penalty I received in the second clip. I never crossed the kerbs, I stayed on them.

The latter penalty, I cross the kerbs. So I agree I've cut, but not to the tune on nearly 10 seconds.

Edit: I take that back, I slightly crossed over the kerbs when I received the smaller penalty

 

[Jamie Bbbbb]

Yeah those penalties you got are pretty tragic. I got a penalty at Indianapolis (the corner) where I literally could not tell what it was for. I deliberately drove slowly through the middle of the corner to avoid getting a penalty at all costs, but nope...

 

[GT6mebe]

H


From the looks of it, he is deep into 10 seconds penalty before he drives under dunlop?

Umm no. He never places two wheels on any kerb.

From the looks of it, it looks exactly like I did. He also used the kerbs where I did when I got the smaller penalty seen in the latter video...

No he doesn't. Look at your video. You place two wheels on the kerb before Dunlop, getting you a penalty. You then place two wheels on the corner before the straight, giving you another penalty.

That corner is especially important as it leads to the longest straight in the game.

 

[GT6mebe]

But when a driver at Le Mans in real life DOES put 2 wheels on a kerb, does he get a penalty? No he does not.

Something worse usually happens such as a crash or damage to the car. Like I said, its very rare and is by no means a consistent racing line.

As for the lap record holder, I'd wager he is a highly talented racing driver while I'm merely an office worker who is playing a video game for fun

Point is that you can go fast while sticking within the limits.

Not to mention the risks, in real life of riding kerbs at 150+mph is somewhat potentially more catastrophic than in a game.

So more reason to give penalties to those who do that in game as there is no mechanical damage system in Sport mode.

I get your argument but it's not consistent in the game, some kerbs dish out a penalty, others don't.

Look you can't expect consistent rules over 20 or so tracks. Each track has its own set of rules, as each track has its own flow and corners that can lead to big gains if abused.

For Le Mans the rule is simple. Do not place 2 wheels on the track. Don't know why so many are confused by such a simple rule. Yes we all know other GTS tracks like Dragontrail allow 2 wheels on the kerb. Le Mans is not Dragontrail.

 

[Crazy Taylor]

Well then it can't be one rule for one track (Le Mans) and another rule for the rest of them. There should be consistency towards every track on offer.

 

[K32]

H


From the looks of it, he is deep into 10 seconds penalty before he drives under dunlop?

That's due to the misleading view making you think he's cutting, he takes the chicane on the very limits of what would be acceptable in GTS.

Are we sure the 10 second penalty was for cutting tertre rouge? It came up too quickly for that surely?

The first penalty was attained at 16 seconds into the lap, but the penalty sign didn't appear until 22 seconds. A penalty usually takes a few seconds to appear so if we assume from that that it takes about 6 seconds.

6 seconds back from the 2nd penalty is here. Does hitting that cone somehow generate a penalty?

View attachment 739804

Does hitting that cone generate a penalty if it was still in its original place?

No, the first penalty happened because he ran wide out of the Dunlop chicane and used the rumble strip slightly more than he should've (by PD's standards), the delay between it actually happening and the moment the game gives you the penalty there is enormous though.

EDIT: And for some reason, some penalties show immediately (PD, choose when you want to show all penalties at equal time interval, it confuses people lol), when he also cut Tertre Rouge the penalty came up as soon as he did it. If you want to try, just slightly cut specifically one of the 4 corners in the last two chicanes leading up to the start and the penalty will come up almost at the same time.

 

[gregc]

That's due to the misleading view making you think he's cutting, he takes the chicane on the very limits of what would be acceptable in GTS.

Take a look at this video of the lap with some external views:



In the first part of the chicane he's all over the kerb:

And that's not the only bit of kerb use in that video. I don't know the GTS track limits from personal experience, but Kobi's lap is no paragon of kerb avoiding virtue...

 

[Voodoovaj]

But Kobayashi isn't playing Gran Turismo: Sport...

Either way, I have never seen any series penalize anyone for putting tires on the curbing. The notion that all four wheels need to be on the asphalt all the time is a little extreme.

The curbing is the warning that you are about to go off track, it's not off track in itself. If it were, then there would be an indicator inside the curbing to warn you that you are about to run off track.

 

[baldgye]

Either way, I have never seen any series penalize anyone for putting tires on the curbing. The notion that all four wheels need to be on the asphalt all the time is a little extreme.

But that isn't the case. His first lap he was on the kerbs and didn't get a single penalty

 

[bokimoto]

... The curbing is the warning that you are about to go off track, it's not off track in itself. If it were, then there would be an indicator inside the curbing to warn you that you are about to run off track.

No. The curbing is not a warning.
The indicator of the track limits there, is the white line. The white line runs along the inside of the curbing paint.

There are two penalties in the first clip, added together to make the big penalty time.
Driver ran inside the line on the apex, and then outside the line on exit.

There's no mystery, and the track limits are strict and proper.

 

[iFerrari]

I still don’t understand why every single corner cut needs to be a penalty, irl drivers get punished when they do multiple times during multiple laps the same corner cuts/track extensions. I’m not against harsh track limits I’m against ridicolous penalties that just transform races in cars slowing left and right and you have to do weird slaloms on straights to avoid them, would really like them to rethink the whole system.

 

[GT6mebe]

There isn't a single point in that lap where Kobayashi has two wheels (maybe there's a misunderstanding here, 2 wheels meaning wheels on either side of the car) on the kerb. Not sure why people keep pointing to the lap like its breaking GTS's rules.