Assetto corsa coming to PS4 and Xbox one

[nasanu]

So you are actually saying that.....
But anyway,do you really think that AC is that bad?
By your logic PD are selling an overpriced game since they are cutting corners too and miss a huge list of things that a smaller team (SMS) does not (Project Cars).(Real time-weather progression or offline career mode for example)

I love AC, it has hands down the best driving feel. I just recognise its flaws (and really hope they fix the multiplayer, I desperately want AC to finally be good online, it could be stunning).

And I don't believe we have seen the extent of GTS features yet, though many speak as if we already know it inside and out. Ill judge it when it launches and not before. My main point was that speaking of studio size, AC is massively over priced. But again I'll have to point out that I was the one arguing that studio size doesn't matter. A game is a game.

So you acknowledge then that your claim that PD and Kunos are treated differently as a whole is based on nothing more than assumption.

Excellent, that means we will see an end to it then.

Oh and as a member of staff you don't need to know my name for me to have a very good understanding of your posting history and style, so allow me to make this clear as a point of moderation. Stop making digs at members/products/companies as if they were fact when they are nothing more than your own personal speculation based on an incomplete reading of the actually posting history.

Its borderline flame-bait territory and should you continue in this vein (and taking your past history and infractions) you will be receiving a points carrying warning that will result in a ban.

So let's be clear then. I'll be banned (and only banned because 10 years ago one of your mods gave me points for no reason at all... Literally, you can go back and check) for pointing out the ridiculousness of calling developers like PD lairs but the members actually doing it are all good?

Still waiting to see the critical commentary of AC or Kunos BTW. I mean I don't want to make assumptions based on everything I have seen so far on GTP, heaven forbid, so can you point me in the right direction?

 

[nasanu]

didnt mean to double post..

 

[JulesDennis]

I love AC, it has hands down the best driving feel. I just recognise its flaws (and really hope they fix the multiplayer, I desperately want AC to finally be good online, it could be stunning).

And I don't believe we have seen the extent of GTS features yet, though many speak as if we already know it inside and out. Ill judge it when it launches and not before. My main point was that speaking of studio size, AC is massively over priced. But again I'll have to point out that I was the one arguing that studio size doesn't matter. A game is a game.

I dont want this to be another endless debate.I just want to say that you are paying money for the product and not the studio.
Does AC worth the asking price or not?(or any other game)
The studio size has nothing to do with the product price.And truth be told,the bigger the company,the easier it is to sell cheaper products.

 

[WarriusZero]

Well that's making assumptions about the mods, now...

The value of DLC is like the value of a full game, a car or a house. Its real value is the value it is for you.
I won't spend £1.50 on a mobile app that I will hardly ever play with while I'll be happy to spend a few quids for a bunch of cars I'll be spending a lot of time on. And that will be completely different with someone else. No need to get all arms waving about it...

 

[Scaff]

So let's be clear then. I'll be banned (and only banned because 10 years ago one of your mods gave me points for no reason at all... Literally, you can go back and check) for pointing out the ridiculousness of calling developers like PD lairs but the members actually doing it are all good?

No you will be banned for continuing to post as if some grand conspiracy exists to talk up certain titles at GT/PD's expense and for continuing to post as if its a shared view held by the vast majority of members (oh and I'm well aware of your infraction history and no you were not given points for no reason).

Still waiting to see the critical commentary of AC or Kunos BTW. I mean I don't want to make assumptions based on everything I have seen so far on GTP, heaven forbid, so can you point me in the right direction?

Really?

I've seen people complain about the lack of weather (with some saying the will not buy it because of that), the graphics not being good enough, the AI being poor, the interface and UI being unfriendly on PC, the lack of content and a light weight career mode.

Then again I've bothered to read the threads and have refrained from posting assumption as fact, so it might just be me.

 

[BrandonW77]

No, they keep releasing dlc packs because they are losing money... Seriously do I really need to source common sense?

So by that logic McDonald's is only still selling hamburgers because they're losing money. And Ferrari is only still selling cars because they're losing money. Seems like total common sense....

It's gone gold, how do you expect them to change the code of discs already made?

There's this new invention called "The Internet" that allows game developers to release "patches" or "updates" that change the code of a game. It's freaking amazing! I love living in the future!

AC can't support rain, can't support working lights, can't support moving trackside objects, there is a HUGE list of things AC can't do along side the rubbish graphics, rubbish online setup, rubbish career mode

AC was originally designed to have a few cars and a few tracks, nothing else. Everything they've added (which is a huge list of thing) they've had to shoehorn into an engine that wasn't designed for such things. Unfortunately multiple light sources and weather would require a re-write of the entire engine so we won't see them until AC2. It does have moving track side objects, I see flags waving all the time. The graphics are second only to PCars in the sim racing world. The online setup works perfectly fine and has far, far, far, far fewer issues than any version of Gran Turismo, and while the career mode isn't perfect it's also many times better than any Gran Turismo career.

I'm far from an AC fanboy. I've been as critical as anybody and there's several things I'd like to see added or improved, but I appreciate it for what it is and it's a solid game that's relatively bug free and built by an incredibly dedicated and passionate team. You shouldn't have to look far to find criticism, but that doesn't mean it's rubbish. Everything can be criticized, and should be.

 

[mister dog]

If anything gamers should get angry that the huge costs involved in PDs development vs Kunos's aren't reflected at all in the sales price. If AC is going to be $50 then GTS needs to be something like $500 if we are playing fair.

 

[JulesDennis]

Yeap.Some people dont realize that bigger companies products are cheaper to create (cost per unit) than the products by smaller companies.

 

[lancia delta hf]

PD also expect to sell millions which offsets the cost, Kunos need to cover development costs too, its simple economics. Maybe Kunos should just sell the game for £55 with the 2 dlc packs and release promised launch day content in 2 years just to avoid people making unsubstantiated claims?

 

[Whitestar]

Still waiting to see the critical commentary of AC or Kunos BTW. I mean I don't want to make assumptions based on everything I have seen so far on GTP, heaven forbid, so can you point me in the right direction?

Pretty much everywhere on both these forums and the official ones. You'll have to read through threads to find it though ...

Oh, and you think Kunos gets a free pass? I suggest to have a look in the official forums.

 

[skazz]

I'm pretty sure that across this thread and the main AC thread on GTP we've discussed the lack of weather, night time, AI issues, small track list, partial flag implementation, car list limits, DLC packs from PC not all being in the console game on release, hotlapping being the most important feature of the game, and much more all in the last couple of weeks. Hardly hiding all these clear gaps.

But the fact is that many guys (including myself) with hundreds of hours play in AC on PC state things like: "yet despite this all, AC delivers the most compelling driving experience around, and that short list of cars/tracks is still awesome because of the quality and uniqueness of each model. Quality over Quantity".



From my point of view there is no evidence of hidden agendas, just honest responses from guys who have a lot of play time in AC (and some who dislike it and don't) trying to give potential console owners a feel for what they will and will not get.


P.S. At the end of the day, I've even put my money where my mouth is. I own the PC version (since day 1 early access) and all DLC packs, but I've preordered AC for the PS4 since my console rig doesn't get enough use. I could have done the same thing for pCARS or DiRT Rally but I didn't. Only AC has caused me to double purchase.
(not quite sure whether I'll buy all DLC packs on both platforms, we shall see)

 

[jm79]

I'm pretty sure that across this thread and the main AC thread on GTP we've discussed the lack of weather, night time, AI issues, small track list, partial flag implementation, car list limits, DLC packs from PC not all being in the console game on release, hotlapping being the most important feature of the game, and much more all in the last couple of weeks. Hardly hiding all these clear gaps.

But the fact is that many guys (including myself) with hundreds of hours play in AC on PC state things like: "yet despite this all, AC delivers the most compelling driving experience around, and that short list of cars/tracks is still awesome because of the quality and uniqueness of each model. Quality over Quantity".



From my point of view there is no evidence of hidden agendas, just honest responses from guys who have a lot of play time in AC (and some who dislike it and don't) trying to give potential console owners a feel for what they will and will not get.


P.S. At the end of the day, I've even put my money where my mouth is. I own the PC version (since day 1 early access) and all DLC packs, but I've preordered AC for the PS4 since my console rig doesn't get enough use. I could have done the same thing for pCARS or DiRT Rally but I didn't. Only AC has caused me to double purchase.
(not quite sure whether I'll buy all DLC packs on both platforms, we shall see)

Yeah, most people are fair and sensible, but there are a couple of overly antagonistic posters about.
They tend to merely wait on the GTS board and slag off anyone who is positive about GT.

I guess it's that ex-smoker syndrome. Once you've moved on, you feel superior.

I think most normal people can cope with liking more than one game, however.

 

[Brend]

From a personal standpoint, I'm not too confident in AC at all. No weather, no time changes, a basic career mode and a paltry track list all signal warning signs for me.

My apprehension comes from getting burned on the highly hyped pCARS and just about any PC sim I've played which I've found to be a let down on a 'gamey' level. I still look forward to trying it but I'd be lying if I didn't say that the F1 2016 pre-order I've made isn't a 'safeguard' incase AC doesn't appeal to me.

EDIT: I meant Dynamic Weather, apologies.

 

[Titzon Toast]

From a personal standpoint, I'm not too confident in AC at all. No weather, no time changes, a basic career mode and a paltry track list all signal warning signs for me.

My apprehension comes from getting burned on the highly hyped pCARS and just about any PC sim I've played which I've found to be a let down on a 'gamey' level. I still look forward to trying it but I'd be lying if I didn't say that the F1 2016 pre-order I've made isn't a 'safeguard' incase AC doesn't appeal to me.

I think there is weather, it's just not dynamic.
I was also disappointed with PCars at first, but to be fair to AC, from what I've heard every car and track in it is nigh on perfect.
I'd choose quality over quantity every time.

 

[Brend]

I think there is weather, it's just not dynamic.
I was also disappointed with PCars at first, but to be fair to AC, from what I've heard every car and track in it is nigh on perfect.
I'd choose quality over quantity every time.

I'm still definitely going to give it a shot, it's great to see it on console at all! I just hope it proves worthwhile, and when it does release we don't have to put up with a makeshift defence force trying to defend any legitimate complaints (be there any to make... ).

 

[jm79]

I'm still definitely going to give it a shot, it's great to see it on console at all! I just hope it proves worthwhile, and when it does release we don't have to put up with a makeshift defence force trying to defend any legitimate complaints (be there any to make... ).

I'm getting it too, and I'm a console racer also.
It'd be interesting to hear your impressions!

 

[Terronium-12]

Furthermore, by the time pCARS was en route to release it had turned into something that many of us original supporters weren't too fond of. The puzzling design changes, the stubbornness in not wanting to take on feedback, etc. What we were hyping – and rightfully so at the time – was what we saw right in front of us before that transition had actually begun.

I've apologized quite a number of times as a result, and I haven't touched the game in probably more than a year and really have no drive to go back to it anytime soon.

 

[jm79]

Furthermore, by the time pCARS was en route to release it had turned into something that many of us original supporters weren't too fond of. The puzzling design changes, the stubbornness in not wanting to take on feedback, etc. What we were hyping – and rightfully so at the time – was what we saw right in front of us before that transition had actually begun.

I've apologized quite a number of times as a result, and I haven't touched the game in probably more than a year and really have no drive to go back to it anytime soon.

I know this is massively off topic, but I wasn't in that loop before. What was the original vision?

 

[nasanu]

(oh and I'm well aware of your infraction history and no you were not given points for no reason).

Well then you can tell me exactly why I was given permanent infraction points for posting a link to a site in a thread where the OP was talking about his possible plans to build an identical site (because he didn't know any existed)?.. It's the most logical thing in the world to post a link to a relevant site in that scenario. After I posted that link all I got was an abusive message from the mod (which was already waiting in my inbox with massive AUP violations) and the infraction points, after that silence when I asked why as the abusive message wasn't helpful in determining the cause. I have never had it explained (and asked a few times) and since you know I would love to know what happened there. I am serious, it has always confused me and I have always been quite curious so please explain it to me.

I'll ignore the rest of what you wrote for now, you know full well I have said nothing of conspiracies.

I dont want this to be another endless debate.I just want to say that you are paying money for the product and not the studio.

Yes... That was my point. I even went to the effort of including sentences that stressed that was my point. Not sure what I have to do.

So by that logic McDonald's is only still selling hamburgers because they're losing money. And Ferrari is only still selling cars because they're losing money. Seems like total common sense....



There's this new invention called "The Internet" that allows game developers to release "patches" or "updates" that change the code of a game. It's freaking amazing! I love living in the future!

No... Really not sure how that is your take away from what I wrote. They are making money, that was my point. Whoever I was arguing with was saying that I can not apply common sense and assume that because a company keeps making a product over and over that the product is successful.

I'm pretty sure that across this thread and the main AC thread on GTP we've discussed the lack of weather, night time, AI issues, small track list, partial flag implementation, car list limits, DLC packs from PC not all being in the console game on release, hotlapping being the most important feature of the game, and much more all in the last couple of weeks. Hardly hiding all these clear gaps.

But the fact is that many guys (including myself) with hundreds of hours play in AC on PC state things like: "yet despite this all, AC delivers the most compelling driving experience around, and that short list of cars/tracks is still awesome because of the quality and uniqueness of each model. Quality over Quantity".

Yes, this is exactly my point. Though it seems I am not allowed to discuss it anymore so I'll be brief. My whole point was that AC has so many obvious flaws, and you may well have discussed them over thousands of pages. BUT, overall the threads and comments are quite positive. GTS delivers an amazing driving experience also, I have played it twice and Inside Sim Racing has said the same. And I also believe that GTS is going for quality over quantity, it's what Kaz has said and it's obvious to me in what I have seen. So as far as I can tell, GTS has everything AC has but the GTS threads are very toxic, hate everywhere. Even though GTS not only has the driving experience AC has, but has far superior graphics, a lot more cars, a better offline, most likely a significantly better online etc. That is why I feel justified in saying that AC gets a free pass, because GTS has the same things going for it plus a whole lot more, but gets grilled on points that AC comes up far shorter on.

I feel what I wrote above makes total sense. But hey, maybe it's a conspiracy created all in my head.

 

[Terronium-12]

I know this is massively off topic, but I wasn't in that loop before. What was the original vision?

I've long since forgotten what the original intentions were, but some things that changed for the worse is the current UI (it's really a mess and is one of the things they outright refused to change), and what still gets me is the claims of its photo mode.

Make no mistake, before release it was as good as many of us (myself, especially) were claimed it to be: offering a level of freedom not present in any other game. Fast-forward to launch and the feature is fundamentally worse than every other game currently available. This isn't a witch hunt or me shaming anyone for buying pCARS as I'm certain there's something there that stands out, but for me it just didn't live up to what it was originally presented as being.

 

[skazz]

I know this is massively off topic, but I wasn't in that loop before. What was the original vision?

Those of us who were part of the WMD community, testing early builds and supplying feedback through the user-only forum to the pCARS devs had the challenge that we saw the game in raw form with a new build every single day, we saw the goals that the dev team had, and we saw features popping up in game looking good alongside features which were far from finished. We had to extrapolate what we saw to what the end result would be.

In the end, the ever-present software development timebox cut out features, the dev team had challenges to deliver on time, the release was delayed twice, the console versions (which WMD community couldn't test) proved buggy. And it was hard to judge the right level of optimism or pessimism for the released game based on our testing.

There was also the unfortunate extra element that WMD was set up for profit sharing. In the end, pCARS 1 did well and us investors got close to double our original investment back. Which was nice (and I somewhat regret not buying a more expensive toolpack). But it muddied the waters because some heavy investors had a clear vested interest in the game doing well.


Put it all together and you can see that many guys were burned by the whole experience.


AC is a known quantity on the PC. It's been out for well over a year. The devs have worked hard to close many of the gaps which the game had at launch. The only unknown is the amount of bugs on console, however previews from press days and events like E3 have so far been very positive that AC on console feels effectively identical to AC on PC. Bugs will be there, no doubt, we just have to wait and see how bad.

Will AC burn people like pCARS? I think not. But there's certainly the potential for bugs (as I stated in a post a few weeks' back). Only time will tell.

 

[BrandonW77]

just about any PC sim I've played which I've found to be a let down on a 'gamey' level.

If you're looking for "gamey" you'll probably be a bit disappointed. AC doesn't care about unlocking things, or trophies, or accomplishments, it's just about driving/racing cars around tracks in the most authentic way they can achieve. For genuine petrolheads it's more than enough, but for someone looking mainly for a gaming experience they would probably see it as lacking a bit.

 

[recar deeps]

I'm really thinking about preordering this from gamestop for the 9 cars, but a few years ago I preordered a a game from them and when I picked it up and asked for my code I was told I was'nt eligible bc I was'nt a premium customer.

Anyone else ever have this happen? I might as well get it from Amazon if that's still the case. Thing of it is no where (that I can find) on there site does it say such a thing.

 

[Brend]

If you're looking for "gamey" you'll probably be a bit disappointed. AC doesn't care about unlocking things, or trophies, or accomplishments, it's just about driving/racing cars around tracks in the most authentic way they can achieve. For genuine petrolheads it's more than enough, but for someone looking mainly for a gaming experience they would probably see it as lacking a bit.

It's just a shame that the racing genre splits down the middle now in terms of good gameplay and good driving experience. I don't see why this has to be a choice instead of a no-brainer that a good game can back up how it feels on the track.

 

[jm79]

@Terronium-12 and @skazz - thanks guys for the replies. I wasn't aware of most of that.

Personally speaking, I was burned only because it was almost impossible to enjoy using a pad, and that the UI was both horribly ugly and unintuitive to the extreme.

Once I had a steering wheel I could see the fun, and there is a lot, but it was difficult to find, and I resent that a little bit.

Also, and this is a tiny thing, but it still amazes me that there isn't a sound for the 'press x to start' intro screen prompt

From what I've seen of AC, it does look better and I can't wait to try it out. Not so bothered about the DLC plans. I'm an old F355 Challenge guy, so anything more than one car seems like too much choice

 

[nasanu]

I've long since forgotten what the original intentions were, but some things that changed for the worse is the current UI (it's really a mess and is one of the things they outright refused to change), and what still gets me is the claims of its photo mode.

Make no mistake, before release it was as good as many of us (myself, especially) were claimed it to be: offering a level of freedom not present in any other game. Fast-forward to launch and the feature is fundamentally worse than every other game currently available. This isn't a witch hunt or me shaming anyone for buying pCARS as I'm certain there's something there that stands out, but for me it just didn't live up to what it was originally presented as being.

I always wondered how you guys (people in the WMD process) let it release without decent wheel setups. The wheel (with pedals) is the sole interaction you have with the game, its critical. Did nobody mention it? To this day I can't play PCars because I just can't feel the cars with the t500.

That is one thing I love about Kunos, they know what is important. The right wheel setup (and good stock car setups) are there right out of the box.

 

[Terronium-12]

I always wondered how you guys (people in the WMD process) let it release without decent wheel setups. The wheel (with pedals) is the sole interaction you have with the game, its critical. Did nobody mention it? To this day I can't play PCars because I just can't feel the cars with the t500.

What, on console? We didn't test any of the console builds which, again, is why when it launched and console players were calling it buggy we literally had no idea what was going on; the problems that crept up on consoles weren't anywhere to be seen on PC, save for a select few.

---

As per this being off-topic, the discussion is free to continue but try and tie the two together.

 

[BrandonW77]

It's just a shame that the racing genre splits down the middle now in terms of good gameplay and good driving experience. I don't see why this has to be a choice instead of a no-brainer that a good game can back up how it feels on the track.

Well, in PC sim-racing land most users don't want that kind of thing, they want to be able to create their own experience. Usually anything that could be considered "gamey" is shunned and derided. AC is pretty much the only one of the big sims that has any kind of career mode, and the career mode is fine and enjoyable it's just not quite what console users are used to. But between the career and the challenges there is lots and lots to keep you entertained offline, when you're done with that you can create your own race weekends and it looks like a custom championship creator is right around the corner. 👍

I always wondered how you guys (people in the WMD process) let it release without decent wheel setups. The wheel (with pedals) is the sole interaction you have with the game, its critical. Did nobody mention it? To this day I can't play PCars because I just can't feel the cars with the t500.

It's probably because they changed it all at the last minute. My understanding is that they were trying to have good presets but with that many cooks in the kitchen they couldn't get everyone to agree on anything so just before they released it they said "fine, we'll just unlock all the controls and you can figure it out for yourselves" which led to the mess we now know as the PCARS FFB Settings Menu. This was done without any input from the WMD members.

 

[skazz]

The pCARS FFB implementation and UI went through so many changes in the months leading up to launch. And the other problem was not enough testers regularly providing feedback for some types of wheels.

At one point a few months before launch I helped to vote in some really good default FFB settings for Thrustmaster wheels, but very shortly before launch (and in a couple of patches after launch) the underlying FFB changed, and those settings became bad. Post release I don't believe SMS ever changed the defaults per wheel.

edit: There's also the problem that FFB is very personal. The WMD community was hugely split between those who were happy with stock, those who wanted to tune a bit, those who wanted to run tweaker files and get their own configuration for each car. This was not necessarily a good thing, since SMS ended up giving us maximal flexibility and it got far too complicated for the average user. Obviously, like all forums, the majority of the feedback on WMD was from non-average users who wanted configurability


AC has way way less FFB Settings than pCARS, on the PC. You just have to turn off damping, turn down gain to avoid clipping, select the amount of "fake" effects you want for slip/kerbs, and then tweak individual car FFB up and down as needed (just do it once, on the fly while driving). Will all of that make it unchanged to the console? No clue, not seen any videos showing any of it.

 

[Cote Dazur]

The pCARS FFB implementation and UI went through so many changes in the months leading up to launch. And the other problem was not enough testers regularly providing feedback for some types of wheels.

At one point a few months before launch I helped to vote in some really good default FFB settings for Thrustmaster wheels, but very shortly before launch (and in a couple of patches after launch) the underlying FFB changed, and those settings became bad. Post release I don't believe SMS ever changed the defaults per wheel.

edit: There's also the problem that FFB is very personal. The WMD community was hugely split between those who were happy with stock, those who wanted to tune a bit, those who wanted to run tweaker files and get their own configuration for each car. This was not necessarily a good thing, since SMS ended up giving us maximal flexibility and it got far too complicated for the average user. Obviously, like all forums, the majority of the feedback on WMD was from non-average users who wanted configurability


AC has way way less FFB Settings than pCARS, on the PC. You just have to turn off damping, turn down gain to avoid clipping, select the amount of "fake" effects you want for slip/kerbs, and then tweak individual car FFB up and down as needed (just do it once, on the fly while driving). Will all of that make it unchanged to the console? No clue, not seen any videos showing any of it.

The effect in AC force feedback are not fake, they have amplified some aspect of the FFB to allow driver with lesser wheels to feel them without having to use gain that their wheel cannot handle and that would get them into saturation