Brake balance controller

[BradKinder]

Does the brake balance controller still function if ABS is off?

 

[Gabkicks]

yes, it affects the bias i think, i dont know if it affect the strength. 2/1 break balance setting should be the same as 10/5, right?

You can easily see the difference if you set it to something ridiculous like 9/1 or 1/9 and slam on the brakes

 

[BradKinder]

So even with ABS off, changing the brake balance ratio does change the braking behavior of the car?

I surprised nobody knows... I'm working on Golding the expert seasonal in the 2010 Impreza. I use a dual shock 3. I've decided to try using the abs off since the car doesn't drive well with abs on. It's hard, but I'm trying.

 

[TeddyBear-420]

yes the lower it is the lighter the brakes feel. 1/1 has a longer stopping distance. And no 2/1 is not the same as 10/5.

 

[BradKinder]

wow, GT5 may have a near perfect simulation, but the manual is pretty bad at adequately explaining what any modifications are.

Changing the "brake balance" in RL is not something that is so easily done.

Thank you for your response. Since I use a dual shock, can I lower the brake balance numbers for both sides to gain some more braking control with the right analog stick? Will I need to keep changing the brake balance numbers according to the tires the car uses? I have the assumption that most sports cars' brake balance is just fine. I just want to be able to be fast using a dual shock controller.

 

[jimantonic]

I always switch ABS off, then instantly adjust the brakes to f5 r3 and tweak it from there, sometimes having to use 1 on the rear for MR cars, it really does make a difference as its very easy to lock the rears with too much force on the rear and lose it on entry to a corner.
I use a wheel so am unfortunately unable to help out with your question regarding using a controller.
Best of luck.
Jim.

 

[BradKinder]

I think your strategy isn't necessary. If the balance is at x/x then the front-rear brake force should be as the stock car in RL.

 

[Johnnypenso]

To figure out brake balance, my standard method is in using the hardest braking corner on the track I'm testing on, say corner 1 at Deep Forest for example. Heading into that corner at top speed you jam on the brakes with ABS set at 1 and check the tires as you finish braking. Are they the same colour? Are the fronts hotter than the rears? If they are not the same colour, to me that indicates the brakes are not balanced properly. Increase the brakes front or rear on your next lap out while tuning and try again. Alternately you can pick a flat track like SSR7, fire it up and get to 250-300 km/h and hit the brakes. For me it saves time to tune the suspension and brakes on the same track.

I think you'll find that if you start at 5/7 that's a good base for most cars. In real life, it's more like 75/25 because of weight transfer, but if you try that in GT5, you'll just burn up the front tires every time under hard braking.

 

[BradKinder]

When the brake balance in GT5's menu is x/x (x = x obviously)... Then the difference in braking force front/rear is like an actual car, front biased. By changing it to x/x+1 or whatever then you're adding stopping power to the rear, but not necessarily enough to make the rear brakes grab more than the front. I think.

 

[Johnnypenso]

I was going to add that in my opinion, the brakes were set up already with what GT5 figures the balance should be and the balance controller is the adjustment value, not the absolute value.

So a car may have a normal 3/8 balance and that is what it is and the 5/5 figure means your brakes are at 3/8 not 5/5. I can't say what they math is definitely but for example changing the balance controller to 5/10 for example might actually make the brake bias 3/16.

No need to worry about what the actual value is because Polyphony in their infinite wisdom, like almost every part of this game, left us in the dark, just tune it so it works for you.

 

[Parnelli Bone]

I was going to add that in my opinion, the brakes were set up already with what GT5 figures the balance should be and the balance controller is the adjustment value, not the absolute value.

So a car may have a normal 3/8 balance and that is what it is and the 5/5 figure means your brakes are at 3/8 not 5/5. I can't say what they math is definitely but for example changing the balance controller to 5/10 for example might actually make the brake bias 3/16.

No need to worry about what the actual value is because Polyphony in their infinite wisdom, like almost every part of this game, left us in the dark, just tune it so it works for you.

I disagree. The brake balancer in previous GT games was always an additional buy. It usually cost just over 10,000 cr. When we get a car in GT5, the balancer is automatically installed. The 5/5 split is just a compromise, imo; PD just turning the balancer system on for the average unknowlegable gamer.

To have a car's natural brake balance in GT5 (or what PD perceives as natural), you need to turn the brake balancer off. I've come to this conclusion after turning ABS off for several cars, but leaving the balancer on its default setting of 5/5. If you turn ABS off but leave the balancer on, notice how easily the brakes lock up. This is because when the ABS system is on, it's compensating for the extra braking force created by the balancer, if that makes any sense. Turn ABS off, and now the balancer is no longer in check. The extra force created by the balancer locks those brakes up more easily, and ABS cannot interfere.

Now, turn the ABS off and also turn the balancer off, and now the braking usually feels a lot more natural. Brakes can still lock up, true, but usually there needs to be some sort of extraordinary condition for this to happen, like turning & braking on a more extreme angle. The brakes don't just start to lock with just a minimal jab of braking once the balancer and ABS are both off.

Personally, I prefer the old way PD did it in previous games. Real production cars do NOT come with a balancer installed as stock, I'd rather buy this seperately, even though it costs more money. I'm not sure why they changed this.

 

[Johnnypenso]

What do you mean by "turn it off"? You mean set it to 0/0?

 

[prioret]

In real life it is very easily done. Its done with a proportioning value usually mounted on the tunnel where the driver can reach it to make adjustments.

wow, GT5 may have a near perfect simulation, but the manual is pretty bad at adequately explaining what any modifications are.

Changing the "brake balance" in RL is not something that is so easily done.

Thank you for your response. Since I use a dual shock, can I lower the brake balance numbers for both sides to gain some more braking control with the right analog stick? Will I need to keep changing the brake balance numbers according to the tires the car uses? I have the assumption that most sports cars' brake balance is just fine. I just want to be able to be fast using a dual shock controller.

 

[BradKinder]

http://auto.howstuffworks.com/auto-parts/brakes/brake-types/master-brake2.htm

Yeah, I guess you're right to some extent.

 

[BradKinder]

Do more recent cars with four wheel disc brakes have a proportioning valve you can adjust?

Edit: never mind, I guess they would have to.

 

[dbarrade]

There is something fundamentally wrong with the way the GT5 Brake Balance Controller works. I believe it applies some form of modifier to the friction or grip values of the tyres. My reason for thinking this is that I mainly drive mid engine rear wheel drive cars and I find that it affects lift off oversteer as well.

 

[shirakawaa]

The brake balance controller in GT5 works differently depending if ABS is enabled or not.
Setting it with the ABS off hoping that it will work ok when enabling it, is a mistake.

 

[Ecchi-BANZAII!!]

ABS should be added to the restriction list.
ABS 0 forever.

 

[canderson19]

ABS should be added to the restriction list.
ABS 0 forever.

Why? It helps to a degree.

 

[robbo6]

I really do not like the brake balance system in the GTs. There should be a seperate brake PRESSURE option adjustable in 1% increments up to 100% and the Brake Bias should be adjustable in 1% increments front/rear. So I could set up the brake balance to 52 front 48 rear or 55 front 45 rear etc etc.

It's too easy to lose the rear end on MR cars in GT5 under braking, even with the rear balance set to zero.

 

[CarBastard]

ABS should be added to the restriction list.
ABS 0 forever.

That's oh so realistic, because you know, real life sports and race cars have no ABS.... Real life cars give feedback...GT5 only has a generic tyre screech and slight feel of lightness in the steering wheel and that's when you've already locked up your brakes, so it really isn't the same as in real life.