Briatore gets banned, Renault given suspended sentence and the fallout begins!

Discussion in 'Motorsport' started by prisonermonkeys, Aug 30, 2009.

  1. prisonermonkeys

    prisonermonkeys Premium

    Messages:
    33,155
    Location:
    Peru
    Maybe, but the problem with his lawsuit is that it's based on the FIA failing to follow due process. It doesn't addess his innocence or guilt, so even if he gets the lifelong ban overturned, he won't have actually been proven innocent and I think people will be averse to dealing with him.
     
  2. niky

    niky Moderator

    Messages:
    23,800
    Location:
    Philippines
    Unfortunately... if he's right, and he wins...

    I would like to see the FIA taken down a peg or two due to their irritatingly inconsistent judgement and application of rules.

    (oh... I know there are sound political reasons behind every decision... boo-hoo... Renault... bad fiscal year? That's like a Ponzi schemer claiming he shouldn't go to jail because he's got a bad back...)
     
  3. prisonermonkeys

    prisonermonkeys Premium

    Messages:
    33,155
    Location:
    Peru
    Formula One won't miss him, I should think. It's entirely appropriate that he's been booted out over Singapore, but there are other things in his tenue as a team principal that need to be looked at. His relationship with the drivers he manages, for one. And then there was the accusations Bennetton of using traction control in 1994 and 1995. Given that he (at least allegedly) told Piquet to crash, then for all we know, it was he who put the idea into Schumacher's head in Adelaide.

    And there's other stuff, as well. Before he was Bennetton's team principal, he was the head of their franchising operations, and there were some rather unusual business practices there: franchisees had to pay large sums to acquire the rights and then sign very tight contracts that often required them to set up in high-rent regions of towns because they were in the best parts. Bennetton took their money, gave them their rights and offered them next to no support from then on. A lot of people suspected the company may have been a front, or that the franchising was some kind of scam.
     
  4. niky

    niky Moderator

    Messages:
    23,800
    Location:
    Philippines
    The traction control... nah... that's part of the sport... along with Renault's mass dampers, Ferrari's flexible wings and the "double-deck" diffusers.

    The other stuff... well... I am glad to see him go, but if he can hang the FIA up on this technicality... well... that'll make this whole mess even worse...
     
  5. prisonermonkeys

    prisonermonkeys Premium

    Messages:
    33,155
    Location:
    Peru
    Well, the final chapter of this whole sordid saga is upon us: Briatore will find out the results of his legal action today.
     
  6. maximumattack

    maximumattack

    Messages:
    708
    Just read this, I don't know anything more specific yet:

    Flavio Briatore has won his case against FIA according to Alan Baldwin of Reuters, who broke the news at 14:05 today
     
  7. Ardius

    Ardius

    Messages:
    10,373
    Location:
    United Kingdom
  8. Feschka

    Feschka (Banned)

    Messages:
    406
    Disgusting:tdown:
     
  9. yeti

    yeti

    Messages:
    3,165
    This is an absolute disgrace...

    Hope the FIA win the appeal against the appeal...

    Ridiculous decision overturning this.

    C.
     
  10. LancerEvo7

    LancerEvo7

    Messages:
    7,892
    Location:
    United States
    Wow. Fail.
     
  11. niky

    niky Moderator

    Messages:
    23,800
    Location:
    Philippines
    Seems that the only argument is whether Briatore was allowed to defend himself properly in the FIA court.

    Leave it to the FIA to botch procedures on an open-and-shut case.
     
  12. Ardius

    Ardius

    Messages:
    10,373
    Location:
    United Kingdom
    An interesting overview of the effects:
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/andrewbenson/2010/01/briatore_verdict_leaves_f1_in.html

    Let's remember here that its only the punishment that is being questioned, Briatore has not been made innocent by this.
     
  13. prisonermonkeys

    prisonermonkeys Premium

    Messages:
    33,155
    Location:
    Peru
    Oh, absolutely. Briatore's failure to address the question of his guilt is practically an admission of it. Whatever you think of Max Mosley, he was right on one count in this whole affair: the FIA has been incredibly lenient on Briatore over the years. They gave him the benefit of the doubt in 1994 when Bennetton were accused of using illegal traction control, but when there was insufficient evidence, they took no action. When he was in possession of Ferrari data in 2007, the FIA took him at his word when he said he knew nothing of it. And there may have been one or two other occasions when he's attracted controversy between those two episodes when the Powers That Be have done the same thing. His relationship with the drivers he manages is also odd - some reports sugest he takes as much as 20% of their earnings, more than double what other managers receive. And he has no problem with managing drivers and being their team principal at the same time, a blatant conflict of interests if ever there was one. Briatore has screwed over a lot of people - from Eddie Jordan to Jenson Button - in his time, and his comeuppance was long overdue. Hopefully the FIA can find a way to ban him again.

    From the very beginning of this whole affair, Briatore blew it all off. Nelson Piquet was quite vehement about it all, and Pat Symonds fought the accusations. But Briatore rubbished them and acted as if it wasn't happening; no doubt he expected that the FIA would give him another reprieve. I think it was incredibly arrogant of him to challenge the verdict, even ifhe had the right to do it. But then, Briatore has always been like that. I get the sense that the paddock as a whole only tolerate him because they have to. His problem is that he seems to think he's a bigger star than his drivers; that his drivers are only successful because he's given them a seat. The fact that he has committed the single most despicable act of cheating not just in motorsport, but in sporting history - when was the last time someone put dozens of lives at risk in order to win? - means nothing to him. I'd say he is persona non grata in the Formula One paddock right now, and that no-one is going to want to work with him. It happened to Mike Coughlan in 2007; it'll certainly happen here. The problem is that it will not register with Briatore is unwanted and unwelcomed in Formula One; as soon as he finds a way back into the paddock, he'll take it - and he'll expect everyone to be grateful that he's back. After all, according to Flavio, the only time Formula One was not in serious danger was when Renault was winning.
     
  14. Hun200kmh

    Hun200kmh

    Messages:
    6,476
    Location:
    Portugal
    I have no interest in defending Piquet Jr., but I don't like it when a respected news institution like the BBC is not truthful, or at least exact.

    We say in Portugal (and probably the same or similar is said in other languages/countries) that if you consistently repeat a lie it becames the truth.

    So, Andrew Benson, did Witness X say that Piquet had the idea of the crash and that it was him who proposed it to Symmonds? Really?

    Please do your job professionaly and at least give yourself the trouble to read the WMSC decision. I'll quote the relevant part:

    So, Witness X was told of "Piquet's suggestion" by ... Symmonds. Makes it a bit different from what Andrew Benson wrote:

     
  15. Ardius

    Ardius

    Messages:
    10,373
    Location:
    United Kingdom
    I don't see where Benson has said anything wrong there...
     
  16. Hun200kmh

    Hun200kmh

    Messages:
    6,476
    Location:
    Portugal
    Andrew Benson - Hun200kmh stated that Ardius convinced interludes to murder Jordan's cat

    Court findings - Hun200kmh stated that interludes told him that Ardius had convinced him to murder Jordan's cat


    Do you see the difference now?
     
  17. Ardius

    Ardius

    Messages:
    10,373
    Location:
    United Kingdom
    I don't read what Benson said that way, the key word is still "suggested". Benson didn't explicitly say he convinced Symonds at all.

    Its a little different wording and I can see where the implication is found. But I doubt that was Benson's intention.
     
  18. maximumattack

    maximumattack

    Messages:
    708
    Does this mean that anyone who has been punished by the FIA in the past could now win an appeal and get their convictions/fines overturned?
     
  19. Hun200kmh

    Hun200kmh

    Messages:
    6,476
    Location:
    Portugal
    I'm sure there are deadlines for appealing federation/association disciplinary decisions to court ...
     
  20. maximumattack

    maximumattack

    Messages:
    708
    The main one I'm thinking of is the $100million McLaren fine. I wander if they are outside their deadline for appeal, if it was say 3 years from the date of the ruling then they would still be able to challenge it.
     
  21. Hun200kmh

    Hun200kmh

    Messages:
    6,476
    Location:
    Portugal
  22. Ardius

    Ardius

    Messages:
    10,373
    Location:
    United Kingdom
    Well, at least Symonds can hopefully be back sometime, ashamed though he should be - he was highly respected.
    I've never thought much of Briatore and its a shame that the FIA/Mosley failed to deal with him in a more proper manner. Its hard to imagine he will be out of F1 long after 2013...I mean he is a highly successful team principal and businessman.
     
  23. Clark

    Clark Premium

    Messages:
    7,990
    Location:
    England
    Thankfully 'Flabio' said he won't go back to F1, so my precious Renault F1 team is safe.
     
  24. BlacqueJacques

    BlacqueJacques

    Messages:
    3,509
    Location:
    Canada
    I prefer Coronation Street to the Formula 1 soap opera :)

    F1 only interests me on Fridays, Saturdays and Sundays on a race weekend; nothing in between races.

    Do we need rain in China for a good race :ouch:
     
  25. Fastas

    Fastas Premium

    Messages:
    1,362
    Location:
    United Kingdom
    I don't know if I dare say any thing about this, I mean, who knows what could happen to me...:nervous:

    What a monumental mistake. This guy should be in prison for life, the smell that follows him has a bad effect on so many people. If you don't know him, do a little research, needless to say, he is untouchable by most if not all laws in many countries. :tdown:
     
  26. Lizard

    Lizard Premium

    Messages:
    15,993
    we need an f1 comedy. just dont make it stupid
     
  27. prisonermonkeys

    prisonermonkeys Premium

    Messages:
    33,155
    Location:
    Peru
    Yeah, this thread has been dead for nearly a year, but I'm restoring a bit of life because Nelson Piquet Jnr. comes clean on his involvement in the whole sordid mess.
     
  28. Hun200kmh

    Hun200kmh

    Messages:
    6,476
    Location:
    Portugal
    A sad story about human weakness. I pity him, but a driver like him has no place in motorsports.
     
  29. Pupik

    Pupik Staff Emeritus

    Messages:
    17,672
    Location:
    United States
    I wonder if any other drivers have ever crashed on purpose (although not so much by team orders)?

    I have my doubts, considering the very real risk of death or serious injury up until the mid-1980s, the fact that safety cars weren't regularly used until about 1993, and that few drivers would want to potentially ruin their careers. But it makes me wonder...
     
  30. Anes

    Anes (Banned)

    Messages:
    1,736
    Why do the british always always put -gate after every single scandal. God that annoys me.

    Anyway, I like Flavio, but obviously I don't agree with what happened but I find any photo I now see of Piquet smile inducing. Never liked the kid anyway.