Cockpit ''shake ''

  • Thread starter Michael88
  • 206 comments
  • 22,494 views

Cockpit shake

  • No I like it how it is.

    Votes: 124 53.2%

  • Yes I would like an option to turn it off.

    Votes: 109 46.8%
  • Total voters
    233
charliec
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SeCsaXlHaIc
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=APHux0NYIVY

Not saying it's not worth adjusting, but it seems pretty accurate watching those two videos.
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What all of you against an option to disable/adjust/minimize the camera shake COMPLETELY MISS, is the fact that those videos show what the camera sees, not your eyes while driving. We are supposed to be driving, not spectating!

What our eyes and heads do, marvelous pieces of nature's engineering, is soften/adjust/cushion the vibrations/shakes. Over time our visual cortex wiil start having consequences, and yes some of us are more sensitive to it than other depending on the monitors or TVs we have, age, etc.. After all, it took us a good while to come up with a "Steadicam" to emulate how our vision works.

These special effects are great when short, the inability to disable them is shortsighted. Another discussion here.
 
I also believe the narrowest zoom angle help alot and I only sit like 1.2m from my TV when I use my wheel.. So I barely see anything but the road ahead.
 
Why is there no ridiculous shaking in rallying (in GT5 that is)?

Wouldn't the shaking have been drastically worse on dirt than on tarmac had it been wrongly implemented?


Although I see where you're all coming from, I just don't see why the shake would be there if it weren't necessary. It would be like Shift2's over-exaggerating zoom in/out camera.
 
Voltaic
What all of you against an option to disable/adjust/minimize the camera shake COMPLETELY MISS, is the fact that those videos show what the camera sees, not your eyes while driving. We are supposed to be driving, not spectating!

What our eyes and heads do, marvelous pieces of nature's engineering, is soften/adjust/cushion the vibrations/shakes. Over time our visual cortex wiil start having consequences, and yes some of us are more sensitive to it than other depending on the monitors or TVs we have, age, etc.. After all, it took us a good while to come up with a "Steadicam" to emulate how our vision works.

These special effects are great when short, the inability to disable them is shortsighted. Another discussion here.
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Like I said I know what you mean, and yes, definitely, we humans use eyeballs in fascinating ways.
I'm not against an on/off option, no one is. I just think Kaz and his team know more than most of us. I'm saying Kaz didn't put it in for a cool factor. It's necessary to have shaking going on. Sometimes, I know, it looks like the picture is gonna jump up through the television. I just never cared and it has actually kept me more focused when chaos brews on-screen. And damn it, it only happens when the car's being thrown around like a rag-doll. Otherwise, it's fine.

Basically, shouldn't there be a limit?
 
I personally think the shake effect drops FPS at times as well. The game gets the stuffer going at times.

So with this thought. Could it be a limit on hardware. Basically the effect was wanted. However getting it perfect was not an option with hardware limits.

Just thoughts on it. Very subjective topic. As well enjoyable debate with many.
 
Easy experiment.

Go to a window with a net curtain.

Focus on something up the road in the distance and nod your head.

You will notice that the object you ficus on remains still, in the foreground the net curtains will appear to shake.

Now focus on the net curtains and nod your head again. The net curtains will appear steady but the object in the distance will appear to shake.

Try it I'm not mad.

Basically I would prefer the horizon/track not to shake but the cockpit to shake about to simulate bumps.

I find in GT around Indy speedway in a fast car the track vibrating starts to aggravate my eyes. That's the focal point I'm looking at mostly when driving.

Some other games do it better in my opinion when they leave the track steady and vibrate the cockpit.

All my own opinion of course.
 
I don't care what the thinking was behind making the cockpit view shake so much....like the original poster of this thread stated 'It gives me a headache'.

I don't enjoy the game using the 'shaking cockpit torture' view.

Game designer: I'll tell you what we'll do. We'll create a cockpit view for the user but we'll torture him with electrical shocks when he uses it.
Game co-designer: No, that's too brutal. What if we just make the cockpit shake?
 
Prologue was so much better! Please make a damn setting in the options menu oh my god! I can't freaking drive anymore it's so irritating!
 
VetteDawg
Game designer: I'll tell you what we'll do. We'll create a cockpit view for the user but we'll torture him with electrical shocks when he uses it.
Game co-designer: No, that's too brutal. What if we just make the cockpit shake?
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It was Kaz's idea. AFTER racing the 24 hours of Nurburgring event, 2010. So it was a late implementation. Great idea, but wasn't executed well enough for some people.
 
playnthru
This thread is pointless. Real cars shake.
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Except your head isn't fixed to the chassis in real life. GT tries to simulate onboard cameras and not what you see while driving, and that goes for the cockpit lighting too, sometimes it gets so dark you cant even see the cockpit
 
His point is, do you want your car to feel like it's floating on the Nurburgring? I say that track because it's really bumpy and that's where/when Kaz figured they should implement shaking. He did the 24 hours of Nurburgring about 6 months before GT5 was released so there wasn't enough time to perfect it like he would have wanted to.
 
It should be an option, it's very unrealistic, our brain compensates our vision using our movement, it can't compensate a TV screen. I miss out on using a major part of GT5 as it makes me feel weird, and it looks horrible.
Not even professional racing simulators for manufacturers/teams do this stupid thing.
If PD want to replicate some vibration they should use a newly developed vibrating seat.

This is a driving simulator not a camera simulator for remote viewing as an observer...
Needs an OFF button.
 
Moot
It should be an option, it's very unrealistic, our brain compensates our vision using our movement, it can't compensate a TV screen. I miss out on using a major part of GT5 as it makes me feel weird, and it looks horrible.
Not even professional racing simulators for manufacturers/teams do this stupid thing.
If PD want to replicate some vibration they should use a newly developed vibrating seat.

This is a driving simulator not a camera simulator for remote viewing as an observer...
Needs an OFF button.
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I wholeheartedly agree with this ^^.

The cockpit view makes me feel like I'm just seconds away from a bad earthquake or an epileptic seizure--neither of which is good! It's not realistic.

You want shake? Take an untuned X2010 out to Indy with your wheel force feedback turned on. WARNING: your DFGT may fly off the table and explode.
 
Wow - happy I found this thread.
I have been getting headaches lately while playing GT5 and didn't really understand why until I played around with the different cameras. Switching to the bumper cam or hood cam made the problems go away.

Having read this thread and going back to analyzing the GT5 cockpit cam it is very clear that they implemented it in the wrong way. They really should rewrite the camera code to simulate the way human vision works when racing. Currently they are simulating an in-car camera - as many others before me have noted.

To add some credibility to my stance: I'm 30+, Yes, I do race IRL (modified Lotus Elise) and I have run quite a few laps around the Nordschleife IRL. Even when you're going quickly over rough surfaces, the vision never jitters the way it does in GT5. It is very unrealistic and nauseating.

Having just looked at some videos of how other titles handle this it seems (to my amazement) that both Forza 4 and Shift 2 manages to get this more right.

One can hope PD sees the light and fixes this soon...!
 
@ Foxis - Honestly after the Spec 2.0 release (11 months later), I have lost hope. Even Codemasters got the message and patched Dirt 3 to minimize the shaking. The shacking is amusing for 5 minutes, then it becomes a real issue. I don't think PD gets it, GT5 has become so arcade like and sloppy.

I guess all we can do is complain about it (loudly) and hope they will hear us. I don't know, 6 + 1 years later...
 
Michael88
I've driven go-karts with pretty much no suspension at all over VERY bumpy tracks and my head didn't shake like that
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Did this go kart hit speeds of 320km/h(200MPH).

The faster you go the more violent vibrations are.

If you go slow the wheels gets a chance to respond to the bump, but when you go fast the wheel flys over them.

If you watch mythbusters look at episode 58(episode 15 of the 2006 season)

The episode has a involves a thing called Washboard Road.
 
Grayfox
Did this go kart hit speeds of 320km/h(200MPH).

The faster you go the more violent vibrations are.
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This is not relevant at all - nor true. At higher speeds the shakes are actually less violent as the car is affected less by bumps due to the high inertia. As for not relevant, the shakes in GT5 occur at slower speeds as well.

The GT5 implementation reeks of Kaz's engineers implementing cockpit shakes by looking at loads of in-car video footage. In other words that the younger generation can understand: FAIL. :)
 
I agree the cockpit view shakes and bounces way too much ,not realistic at all. If they can't make it right at least give a option to turn it off. Would use the cockpit view if it were not for the bad camera shake.
 
Just A quick Poll to ask how many would like an option to turn off or adjust the camera shake in cockipit view?
 
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"Your mind makes it real."

But seriously, the cockpit shake isn't realistic (but neither is a total absence.)

Until they come up with a fully working model for the the eye's suspension, the retinal / optic nerve / brain interaction that properly simulates the system's responses and adaptations to deal with vibrations and jolts, then I'd rather have the option to turn it off. Either that, or something that more closely resembles my own experiences would suffice.
 
The single reason I don't use cockpit view.

I feel like I'm going to have some kind of fit when I take a fast corner.

It's silly, over-done and unrealistic.
 
I don't mind it with slower cars but once you get into something fast it gets so bad that its unbearable and it's one of the reasons I steer clear of fast cars.
 
I don't find it to be annoying at all. Is not like playing the first NFS Shift, were driving in cockpit equaled to a migraine after a couple of races.

Yes it might be a little bit shakey, and a more swaying motion would be better, but I've never find it uncomfortable at all.
 

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