Discuss All American Muscle Cars Here. ( More Mustangs, Pontiacs and Chevys)

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Originally Posted by Darin

My friends mom had a mustang for a week until it broke down. It was a new 2004 Mustang Convertible. She returned it and got a Chevy Impala. I rided in that Mustang and I hated mustang more than I hated them before.

You later indicated that the Mustang was an SVT Cobra. Your friends mom is an interesting lady - after breaking her new $34k 390hp supercharged DOHC V8 convertible she replaces it with the next obvious choice, a $17k front wheel drive V6 sedan. What is that I smell... BS?

Originally Posted by Darin

sUn, ask your dad to drive a Corvette Z06, that'll change your mind about mustangs. I've never driven one, but my dad has and he say it tops all american cars.

All these moms and dads...are you even old enough to drive? Honestly.
 
Damn, whats with n00b's attacking me.

First off, why did you post? Your post was a simple straight attack at me. Your post is quite pointless.
Oh yes, I forgot, you need that post count to go up.

You know, I'm not gonna sink to the low level you're at and I can continue using that thing between my ears. That device helps you, use it. Its handy.
 
Lol, he has only 2 posts Darin, he has to do a lot of flaming to get that up to the point that he can get his own avatar....:lol:
 
Darin
Damn, whats with n00b's attacking me.

First off, why did you post? Your post was a simple straight attack at me. Your post is quite pointless.

I don't see how it's pointless, it makes sense to me. Which to be honest the majority of your posts, don't.

And before you edited that post, it was incredibly childish.
 
Darin
Whos arguing? I'm not. Just this thread needs to die. its about a worthless car, and its got worthless posts of american trash...

I've seen several posts like this, yet I do not see any like-minded retorts from Americans (let alone mustang owners). It's attitudes like this that causes problems. I think a lot of this anti-American (whether it be automotive or cultural in nature) smack talk is grossly inappropriate, AND misplaced.
 
With me it's not that I'm anti-American, like against the Mustang. I just think that cars like TVR's are a hell of a lot better.
 
Well TVR's are exotics with superior handling and are very nice, but Mustangs were meant to compete with Camaros and Trans Ams. Ford could make them a lot better, but they were meant for your average Joe, so they are reasonably priced.
 
TVR's are very reasonably priced though. You can pick them up from about 30k and remeber that they can run rings around cars that cost over 100k.
 
I wish they sold TVRs here (Canada)... i would totally consider buying 1... the styling and performance are comparable of cars much higher in $. Man... i'd be in the market for a Tuscan without a doubt.
 
live4speed
With me it's not that I'm anti-American, like against the Mustang. I just think that cars like TVR's are a hell of a lot better.

But see, statements like THIS are no problem whatsoever. It's a simple opinion, and it's not insulting or immature. There's no reason why all discussions can't be as simple.

There are TONS of cars I could think of that are better than the Mustang. I don't recall that being the debate at all. I've enjoyed every mustang I've ever owned, but I certainly don't think it's the top of the food chain...nor do any other mustang owners I know.

As for the TVR, would you believe I never even knew they existed until I saw them in the Gran Turismo series? Once I saw them, I was stunned at how sleek and muscular they looked. I think they are works of art, regardless of their performance levels (which seem to be excellent as well). I've seen several people state a used one can be had for 20,000, and new ones for 30,000. If they were available here for those prices, I'd probably consider them very seriously for a spot in my garage. 👍
 
Originally Posted by ratnin

All these moms and dads...are you even old enough to drive? Honestly.

Originally Posted by Darin

Damn, whats with n00b's attacking me.
First off, why did you post? Your post was a simple straight attack at me. Your post is quite pointless.
Oh yes, I forgot, you need that post count to go up.

I'm sorry if you felt like my comments were just a pointless attack. I just had some concerns about your crediblity. I was also trying to guage the relevancy of your automotive options. After a look at your profile I now see that you are, indeed, too young to drive. In light of this I realize that your anti-Mustang posts are simply those of an inexperienced kid with no real world automotive creditials.

(BTW, You were being sarcastic about that post count **** right?)

Back to the original topic, more Mustangs should be featured in GT. Considering they've got 4 or 5 basically identical versions of Civics, Accords, Evos and Skylines in the game, 2 or 3 Mustangs that span different model generations would be fair. Atleast use include the newest, most high performance model - the 390hp '03 Cobra. GT's developers seem to be fond of concepts so why not include one of the most talked about highly anticipated models in years, the '05 Mustang GT.

Some notable Mustangs I'd like to see in GT:
) '86 Mustang SVO - the precursor of the modern Cobra, 205hp turbocharged 4cyl.
) '86 Mustang SVO Comp Prep - optional factory racing SVO upgrade
) '87-'93 Mustang GT - single handedly jump started the modern sports car aftermarket in the US.
) '93 Mustang Cobra - the first of the modern Cobras
) '93 Mustang Cobra R - first factory racing Cobra
) '94 Mustang Boss 429 Concept - 10.0L 429ci 855hp 790 lb.-ft. bigblock, 0-60 in 1.9 seconds, 0-100 in 5.5 seconds, 1/4 mile in 10.55 seconds @ 135.05 mph.
) '95 Mustang GT/Cobra - the last of the legendary 5.0L, 302ci V8 smallblock 'Stangs
) '95 Mustang Cobra R - second Cobra R version, 5.8L 351ci smallblock
) '96 Mustang Cobra - first of the current 'modular' engine family, DOHC 4.6L 281ci 275/285hp
) '00 Mustang Cobra R - 3rd and most potent Cobra factory racer to date, 5.4L DOHC 380hp+, 6speed, IRS. Outperformed 'vettes and Vipers in open track tests
) '03 Mustang Cobra - 390hp+ DOHC Supercharged 4.6L V8...come on, the thing should be a shoe in
) '03 Mustang Boss 351 V10 Concept - 500hp V10, 1/4 mile in 11.51 sec at 118.19 mph
) '05 Mustang GT-R Concept - 440hp DOHC aluminum 5.0L modular, a possible preview of upcoming Cobra/ Cobra R's

If no 5.0 Mustang makes it I'm giving up on GT...but I say that every time a new version comes out.

Another interesting (although non-Mustang) pony car I'd like to see is the 20th Anniversary '89 Pontiac Trans Am Turbo. Most people don't realize that the quickest Trans Am every produced was also the only V6 Trans Am. It used a 3.8L V6 derived from the Buick GNX with 300+hp @ 4400 rpm, 340 lbs-ft torque @ 2800 rpm and remains the only car to pace the Indy 500 without modification.
 
Gotta love how soo many people are against Ford, even though Ford has acheived more than Chevy can ever hope to. Yeah look at the C&D car and truck comparos, Chevy is laggin way behind, while Ford is beating out most of the Japanese crap. And Ford sucks? Where the hell do you get off? Has Chevy ever produced a car that out ofthe factory could outperform a Ferrari that costs almost 3X the amount of $$$? Does Chevy or Dodge have any LeMan's victories? I don't mean in class victories either. I mean an out and out win! Like the 1-2-3 Finish from the GT-40s..... What they don't! Wow! And do they produce a very potent and easy to upgrade sports car for under $40,000??? And as for the Evo's and WRX STI's, with very few mods you guys are in the dust. Yeah listen to the mags in terms of performance, thats about as smart as asking an interior designer to install a Supercharger, and get the PSI set jsut right and reprogram the computer in the car to match the new specs..... Point blank, Ford is #1 here in America! #1 truck for how many years? Reserve #'s for the new stang far outweighting those for the new Vette..., and I see more Fords that Chevys. And as for Chrysler.... HAHAHA!! HEMI power my nuts! Is that why the 345hp Ram can't out accelerate the 300hp F-150, and the F-150 weighs more! And this 500hp SRT-10 Ram won't be the fastest production truck for much longer.... the new Lightnings gunna be pushing 500hp aswell and I have no doubt that they will spank the pants off the SRT-10 rams, and get better fuel economy to boot! As for the the Viper......well take your stang that cost $35,000 and use that $50,000+ you didn't blow on the viper and you will eat Viper's for breakfast! Or hell splurge for the Ford GT and own the Viper on the track and strip.... Bottom line, you don't have to like Ford, but they do deserve respect and yeah they are the #1 car company in the USA! Facts! Not something you can argue! That's like saying the ocean isn't made of water. SO please do us all a favor and pull your lower lip over your heead and swallow if you wanna argue against the truth....
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Yeah I prefer old school stuf to new school. Except in video games. But my first and only car which I still have is my:
1968 Black Mustang GT 2+2 Fastback V8 351
Love it to peices I do!
90,000 miles and still running strong. Got the car from my Great Grand Father who stored it in his barn for a good 25 years. Then my dad started refurbishing the few things that needed it and then he never quite finished that and it ended up in our garage, then my dad moved out after the divorce, and I finished the refurbishing, which consisted of new air and oil filters, new battery, and some cosmetic touches, like new emblems and poof she was done. Been driving her for about 6 months and not a problem.
 
Ford 429 Hemi-"And as for the Evo's and WRX STI's, with very few mods you guys are in the dust"
WRX's in the dust:
http://www.aps-wrx.com/
Ever heard of APS ? Makes 650 Hp turbo packages, which with that alone, will sweep a Mustang Cobra. Sometimes it's not how many mods there are, it's the quality of them.
Few Aftermarket parts:
http://www.japanparts.com/shop/shop.cgi?mode=list2&maker=Subaru&type_car=Impreza+WRX+2002/2001
Yep, there are so few parts, I wonder why they bother. :rolleyes:

As far as Japanese crap goes, why don't you hop in your Fordmobile and try to beat a Twin-Turbo supra on a real racetrack..........The catch: it has right turns, and even worse, short straightaways! :lol: J/k
Also you said something about Ford is #1 here.
Well, duh. They're made here. Ford isn't #1 in Japan. Why? Because they're not made there. :dunce: Oh well. Not trying to offend, just making a few choice points. It's not like I don't respect Ford, but it's not like the best company ever, or something.
 
The Evo's and WRX's are almost already maxed out from the factory with their turbos with 15 and 19lbs of boost. The 390hp 03 cobra has only 8 pounds of boost. Now give that thing 19lbs of boost and see what happens. There's no replacement for displacement.
 
Ford 429 Hemi
Gotta love how soo many people are against Ford, even though Ford has acheived more than Chevy can ever hope to. Yeah look at the C&D car and truck comparos, Chevy is laggin way behind, while Ford is beating out most of the Japanese crap. And Ford sucks? Where the hell do you get off? Has Chevy ever produced a car that out ofthe factory could outperform a Ferrari that costs almost 3X the amount of $$$? Does Chevy or Dodge have any LeMan's victories? I don't mean in class victories either. I mean an out and out win! Like the 1-2-3 Finish from the GT-40s..... What they don't! Wow! And do they produce a very potent and easy to upgrade sports car for under $40,000??? And as for the Evo's and WRX STI's, with very few mods you guys are in the dust. Yeah listen to the mags in terms of performance, thats about as smart as asking an interior designer to install a Supercharger, and get the PSI set jsut right and reprogram the computer in the car to match the new specs..... Point blank, Ford is #1 here in America! #1 truck for how many years? Reserve #'s for the new stang far outweighting those for the new Vette..., and I see more Fords that Chevys. And as for Chrysler.... HAHAHA!! HEMI power my nuts! Is that why the 345hp Ram can't out accelerate the 300hp F-150, and the F-150 weighs more! And this 500hp SRT-10 Ram won't be the fastest production truck for much longer.... the new Lightnings gunna be pushing 500hp aswell and I have no doubt that they will spank the pants off the SRT-10 rams, and get better fuel economy to boot! As for the the Viper......well take your stang that cost $35,000 and use that $50,000+ you didn't blow on the viper and you will eat Viper's for breakfast! Or hell splurge for the Ford GT and own the Viper on the track and strip.... Bottom line, you don't have to like Ford, but they do deserve respect and yeah they are the #1 car company in the USA! Facts! Not something you can argue! That's like saying the ocean isn't made of water. SO please do us all a favor and pull your lower lip over your heead and swallow if you wanna argue against the truth....
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Thanks for clearing this bs up Ford429 Hemi. You know your stuff. 👍
 
Let me try to cover as much ground as possible here.

First of all, and no offense, but this topic is still going? I have no problem with the Mustang or any American cars. But it's not about the cars, it's the fans of them. I mean, how can you not like TVR or Subaru or any other car company that isn't American? Tell you what. Ever heard of Mosler? Yeah, neither does any other American car lover. Mosler made two powerful race cars, the Raptor and the MT900R. Ever hear of Panoz? The Esperante and their front-engined LMP are pure racing machines themselves. But in pop culture Americana, you hear of Chevy, Ford, Pontiac, Dodge, or whatever the case. I agree with many of Eagle's points from page 8. Eagle said that some of the better cars are from Japan and Europe. Well, you can count in Australia because the Holden Monaro is being sent in Europe and America (guess their names). Americans love horsepower because... well, you go fast. And people like to b*tch at "ricers" saying that they are slow and ugly. There was a post I made in the "Cars in General" thread in which two people lost respect of a certain point. And I'm not going to say that again because too many people hate me now as it is. I respect the muscle and pony cars of America, but just because something is American doesn't mean it's the best... in the world. It was as foolish as Ford trying to own Ferrari back in the 1960s (what a dark day THAT would have been). But again, the muscle cars don't tick me off, it's some of the people who daresay become antagonistic because no other car in the world is a muscle car, or at least American. Only two muscle cars proven themselves around the world- the Corvette and the Viper. Mustang? I'm waiting...

Seriously, some "muscleheads" are too arrogant towards other types of car. It isn't the end of the world because you praise a Honda, Toyota, TVR, Opel, or anything like that and you're an American. It just means that more people have different tastes in cars and that not all cars were meant to conquer ovals and drag strips. So what I'm saying is... GO EASY ON THEM!
 
Originally Posted by JohnBM01

Tell you what. Ever heard of Mosler? Yeah, neither does any other American car lover. Mosler made two powerful race cars, the Raptor and the MT900R. Ever hear of Panoz? The Esperante and their front-engined LMP are pure racing machines themselves. But in pop culture Americana, you hear of Chevy, Ford, Pontiac, Dodge, or whatever the case.

I'm familiar with both specialty car makers. Mosler MT900R is basically an assembled kit car without the engine. You have to supply your own 'vette powerplant; either an LS1, LT4 (quad-cam from the ZR-1) or, most frequently, the LS6 from the Z06. They put up some pretty impressive track numbers. Panoz are nice cars as well and shipped with engines - a Ford 4.6L DOHC V8 from the 96-98 Cobras.

Originally Posted by JohnBM01

I mean, how can you not like TVR or Subaru or any other car company that isn't American?

I honestly don't know anything about TVRs other than the Speed 12 on GT rocks. I think they're British though and I've never really understood the appeal of British autos. When I think British I think Minis, 6 volt/positive ground electrical systems, straight 6's and policy chases around a round-about. I'm starting to feel sick now.... I don't care for Subaru's either. Sticking with flat, boxer engines just seems ass backwards - they're wider than a V-8. I realize the Impreza is the crown jewel of the Subaru line-up with it's rally racing heritage but Ford entered the Focus in WRC a few years back and now everyone else is playing catch up.
It's not to say I don't like foreign cars though. Their are several foreign cars I'd like to take around a track but I'd never own one. The EVOs, I have to admit, are amazing. They're probably the most bang-for-the-buck high performance Ricer to ever hit US shores. When you look at the numbers it has to impress you. I haven't ran into one at a stoplight yet and I don't think I want to. Maybe a 20mph rolling start. AWD, high boost turbos and light weight...it adds up. In all fairness though the EVOs numbers are misleading and don't tell the whole tale. The all important 0-60 times are inflated by the AWD and it gives up some of its edge after speeds pick up. You have to consider automotive magazine testing routines, too. All the big mags will freely admit that their acceleration numbers are not on par with those of experienced pilots or other, performance oriented, magazines because they don't work to improve the numbers. They just spool the engine to a level that avoids excess wheelspin and drop the clutch to establish a performance baseline. This type of acceleration testing heavily favors AWD cars, editors just rev the engine to the moon, drop the clutch and the tires bite. RWD cars require a more precise launch strategy to achieve optimal acceleration figures. Mustang Cobra's are peticularly sensitive to proper launch techniques because their independent rear suspension can produce wheel hop.
 
Originally Posted by JohnBM01

Only two muscle cars proven themselves around the world- the Corvette and the Viper. Mustang? I'm waiting...

Well, technically, the 'vette and the Viper aren't 'muscle' cars they're simply sports cars and the Mustang is a pony car. The only modern day 'muscle' car is the Pontiac GTO.
The Mustang has proven itself across the world- from the racing circuits to the street. Stretching back to the 289 Hi-Po and 302 Boss Mustangs in classic Trans Am racing to modern Saleens the Mustang has proven successful time and again.
The largest evidence that I can cite to show that Mustangs have "proven themselves around the world" is their longevity, their production numbers and how widespread they are. Mustangs have to be one of the most produced cars off all time. You can find them everywhere - the '87-'93 non-emission equipped models were shipped as far away as Iran, you can find all kinds of global parts such as guage clusters and even leaded gas fuel filler nozzles. They've been around since '64, surviving fuel shortages, stringent emissions controls that doomed other autos and outlasting Turbo Z cars, Turbo RX-7s, 3000GTs, Supras, Firebirds, Trans Ams and Camaros. That is proof enough my friend.
 
You'll are such good americans. Studying cars that are worthless. And Chrysler isn't american any more. Its all Germen. Mercedes made it a ****ty company than it was before. Come on, defend yourselfs like a couple of rednecks standing inline to go to a country music concert. No that turning left sport known as NASCAR would fit better.
Damn, Americans with American pride.

w00t2.bmp
 
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