- 3,534
- London
Could someone please explain what 'heel-and-toeing' is and how to do it and also explain what 'rev matching' is?
Thanks!
Thanks!
Driving techniques - Heel Toe Downshift
- Thread starter Slick Rick
- 123 comments
- 5,475 views
MagpieRacer
Premium
- 17,767
- Wymondham, Norfolk
- Seagull_Racer
I would also like to know this.
- 5,095
- Panama City, FL
When you downshift, you don't want to engage the clutch when the engine and transmission are at widely differing RPM. When you approach a corner, if you drop a gear and let the clutch out, the clutch has to "drag" the engine back up to speed, and the only way it can do that is by scraping off a little bit of its lining against the flywheel.
To prevent this wear (and make the downshift smoother, creating a smoother ride for yourself and the girl you're trying to impress) you blip the throttle as the gear lever passes through neutral, so that when the clutch re-engages, the engine is at or near the same RPM as the tranny shaft.
The truly correct way is to de-clutch as you brake, select neutral, release the clutch (still braking), blip the throttle (while your foot is still on the brake), declutch again, select the next gear down, and release the clutch pedal, again still braking. That's double-clutching, which you didn't ask about, but is part of it a lot of time.
A racing tranny doesn't need the double-clutch, but your street box, with its synchronizers, will very much appreciate the extra care.
The process is called heel-and-toe, but it's actually the ball of your foot on the brake and the side of your foot, behind the small toe, on the throttle. It all depends on the pedal layout, some cars are better for it. You may find your foot fairly pigeon-toed on a lot of cars. The actual blip of the throttle during the downshift is the 'rev-matching.' That's the whole point of the exercise, to reduce the speed difference between the engine and transmission when the clutch is re-engaged.
If you downshift too harshly, you can upset the car by suddenly slowing the drive wheels, and if the car is already working really hard, you'll spin (RWD) or understeer (FWD) into the trees (fenc, rail, cliff.) It also causes excessive clutch wear.
That throttle blip is what you hear when watching a road race and the engine revs 3 or 4 times while braking for a turn.
I know many people who can't do this, but they shift down hard anyway, and they can't keep a clutch 20,000 miles. I have a '95 Probe GT with 165,000 miles on the ORIGINAL clutch, and I'm an autocrosser, so it's seen some duty.
If you can't do this, you can keep your clutch alive by selecting neutral and releasing the clutch as you brake, then selecting the desired gear when you're ready to exit the turn. Also for extended clutch life:
NEVER roll the car back and forth on the hill at a light: EXTREME clutch wear.
NEVER wait for the light with the car in gear and the clutch depressed. Not clutch wear, so much as throwout bearing wear. Use neutral and release the clutch. Get ready to go when you see the cross-traffic light go yellow.
NEVER rest your foot on the clutch pedal, even slightly. EXTREME throwout bearing wear.
Generally, to extend the life of the clutch, don't use it except when it's supposed to be used, during the actual shift.
To prevent this wear (and make the downshift smoother, creating a smoother ride for yourself and the girl you're trying to impress) you blip the throttle as the gear lever passes through neutral, so that when the clutch re-engages, the engine is at or near the same RPM as the tranny shaft.
The truly correct way is to de-clutch as you brake, select neutral, release the clutch (still braking), blip the throttle (while your foot is still on the brake), declutch again, select the next gear down, and release the clutch pedal, again still braking. That's double-clutching, which you didn't ask about, but is part of it a lot of time.
A racing tranny doesn't need the double-clutch, but your street box, with its synchronizers, will very much appreciate the extra care.
The process is called heel-and-toe, but it's actually the ball of your foot on the brake and the side of your foot, behind the small toe, on the throttle. It all depends on the pedal layout, some cars are better for it. You may find your foot fairly pigeon-toed on a lot of cars. The actual blip of the throttle during the downshift is the 'rev-matching.' That's the whole point of the exercise, to reduce the speed difference between the engine and transmission when the clutch is re-engaged.
If you downshift too harshly, you can upset the car by suddenly slowing the drive wheels, and if the car is already working really hard, you'll spin (RWD) or understeer (FWD) into the trees (fenc, rail, cliff.) It also causes excessive clutch wear.
That throttle blip is what you hear when watching a road race and the engine revs 3 or 4 times while braking for a turn.
I know many people who can't do this, but they shift down hard anyway, and they can't keep a clutch 20,000 miles. I have a '95 Probe GT with 165,000 miles on the ORIGINAL clutch, and I'm an autocrosser, so it's seen some duty.
If you can't do this, you can keep your clutch alive by selecting neutral and releasing the clutch as you brake, then selecting the desired gear when you're ready to exit the turn. Also for extended clutch life:
NEVER roll the car back and forth on the hill at a light: EXTREME clutch wear.
NEVER wait for the light with the car in gear and the clutch depressed. Not clutch wear, so much as throwout bearing wear. Use neutral and release the clutch. Get ready to go when you see the cross-traffic light go yellow.
NEVER rest your foot on the clutch pedal, even slightly. EXTREME throwout bearing wear.
Generally, to extend the life of the clutch, don't use it except when it's supposed to be used, during the actual shift.
- 10,116
- Maryland, USA
- swift-bass
Here's the best step by step description I've seen of heel-toe. and no, you can't do it in and GT game. 
http://www.turnfast.com/tech_driving/driving_heeltoe.shtml
http://www.turnfast.com/tech_driving/driving_heeltoe.shtml
Sage
Staff Emeritus
- 12,533
- United States
- GTP_Sage
I’ll explain Rev Matching first, since Heel-and-toeing builds off of that:
Rev Matching
So you’re dawdling along, and say you need to downshift for whatever reason (this assumes you’re not braking). If you did a normal downshift in a manual, as soon as the clutch re-engages, you get that nasty feeling where you’re thrust forward a little bit and the engine revs are suddenly much higher. So what you want to do is get the engine up to that speed before you re-engage the clutch. In other words, let’s say you were at 2000 rpm in 4th gear, and you notice that when you downshift into 3rd, the revs jump to 3500 rpm – you want to get the engine to 3500 before re-engaging the clutch. You do that as follows:
1. Put clutch in.
2. Dab the accelerator pedal so that you get the revs approximately right.
3. Re-engage clutch.
The only hard part is knowing how much to press in the accelerator – just practice practice practice.
Heel-and-Toeing
Now you want to rev match, but the problem is that you’re right foot is occupied by the brake pedal – if you had three feet, all would be well, but you don’t. So, heel-and-toeing describes how to rev match whilst braking:
0. Before you start #1, make sure that your right foot isn’t completely on the brake, but rather only the left half of it is on the brake.
1. Put the clutch in.
2. Keeping in mind that the left part of your right foot is applying pressure on the brake, use the right side of your right foot to dab the accelerator pedal to rev match.
3. Re-engage the clutch.
So it’s the same as rev matching, except now your right foot is doing two things at once: blipping the engine and braking. In some vehicles, the brake and accelerator pedals are spaced too far apart to do this, and it really doesn’t work in trucks/SUVs, because the pedals are usually too “clunky” (finesse is very important).
[edit]: Treedom!
Rev Matching
So you’re dawdling along, and say you need to downshift for whatever reason (this assumes you’re not braking). If you did a normal downshift in a manual, as soon as the clutch re-engages, you get that nasty feeling where you’re thrust forward a little bit and the engine revs are suddenly much higher. So what you want to do is get the engine up to that speed before you re-engage the clutch. In other words, let’s say you were at 2000 rpm in 4th gear, and you notice that when you downshift into 3rd, the revs jump to 3500 rpm – you want to get the engine to 3500 before re-engaging the clutch. You do that as follows:
1. Put clutch in.
2. Dab the accelerator pedal so that you get the revs approximately right.
3. Re-engage clutch.
The only hard part is knowing how much to press in the accelerator – just practice practice practice.
Heel-and-Toeing
Now you want to rev match, but the problem is that you’re right foot is occupied by the brake pedal – if you had three feet, all would be well, but you don’t. So, heel-and-toeing describes how to rev match whilst braking:
0. Before you start #1, make sure that your right foot isn’t completely on the brake, but rather only the left half of it is on the brake.
1. Put the clutch in.
2. Keeping in mind that the left part of your right foot is applying pressure on the brake, use the right side of your right foot to dab the accelerator pedal to rev match.
3. Re-engage the clutch.
So it’s the same as rev matching, except now your right foot is doing two things at once: blipping the engine and braking. In some vehicles, the brake and accelerator pedals are spaced too far apart to do this, and it really doesn’t work in trucks/SUVs, because the pedals are usually too “clunky” (finesse is very important).
[edit]: Treedom!
- 3,534
- London
Ohh sh** Im damaging my car then!
When Im traveling at speed and come to a corner I put my foot on the clucth and put it into second. While Im braking I lift off the clutch, the car slows down more and the revs rise. I do it so I can accelerate out of the corner quickly because the revs are already higher than normal, Im in the correct gear and also it makes a cool noise and makes me look like a race driver which is always good to impress the ladies
lol
Thanks a lot people. That explains it very well, especially that diagram on the website Swift posted:tup:
When Im traveling at speed and come to a corner I put my foot on the clucth and put it into second. While Im braking I lift off the clutch, the car slows down more and the revs rise. I do it so I can accelerate out of the corner quickly because the revs are already higher than normal, Im in the correct gear and also it makes a cool noise and makes me look like a race driver which is always good to impress the ladies
lolThanks a lot people. That explains it very well, especially that diagram on the website Swift posted:tup:
- 5,095
- Panama City, FL
You've hit the nail on the head with the reason for heel-and-toe: you have the lower gear ready earlier than if you coast through the turn. Cars are generally less exciting with the power disengaged. What you're doing is correct to that extent, but you MUST learn to get the revs up during the downshift. The sound of an engine being dragged by the clutch is NOT cool. The sound of an engine being blipped for the shift IS cool. Also, brake pads are significantly cheaper than clutches.
- 10,116
- Maryland, USA
- swift-bass
AS long as those ladies aren't in the car with you. That is wearing out your clutch and not doing great things for your transmission either.
If you want to come out of the corner with power, you need to rev match to save your drive train.
Heh heh, got you sage! But good explanation just the same.
Doh! now I gots da treed!
If you want to come out of the corner with power, you need to rev match to save your drive train.
Heh heh, got you sage! But good explanation just the same.
Doh! now I gots da treed!
- 3,534
- London
So what I was doing, was that engine braking?
- 10,116
- Maryland, USA
- swift-bass
- 3,534
- London
My driving instructor taught me engine braking believe it or not! I wonder how many clutches he's been through...
Scaff
Moderator
- 29,883
- He/Him
- ScaffUK
Two threads on the same subject in the same day!
This one may also be of interest.
https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/showthread.php?t=90923
Regards
Scaff
This one may also be of interest.
https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/showthread.php?t=90923
And that makes we seriously worry about UK driving instructors, I mean I don't expect heel and toe to be taught to new drivers, but the drawbacks of compression (engine) braking should at least be explained!
Nor do you need to, as GT4 does perfect heel and toe changes with every downshiftSwift
Regards
Scaff
- 10,116
- Maryland, USA
- swift-bass
- 15,498
- UK
After 2 lessons of driving I am pretty sure I don't use engine braking.
When coming to a corner (or something else that requires stopping, like say a pedestrian....) I put the clutch down, change gear, brake, etc. I don't release the clutch until I want to accelerate out of the corner (obstacle) is that right?
I now know what engine braking is too having read this thread.
When coming to a corner (or something else that requires stopping, like say a pedestrian....) I put the clutch down, change gear, brake, etc. I don't release the clutch until I want to accelerate out of the corner (obstacle) is that right?
I now know what engine braking is too having read this thread.
- 5,095
- Panama City, FL
Dragging the clutch is NOT engine braking. Leaving the clutch engaged while braking with the throttle closed is engine braking. The compression of the engine contributes to the car's reduction of speed by about .000035%. It's the difference between coasting in neutral and coasting in gear: that small difference is all you get from engine braking.
That's a totally made-up number, but the point is that engine braking is pointless. What you experience when you use the clutch to enhance it is a temporarily stronger braking effect, but just while the clutch drags the engine up to speed. Like I said before, brake pads are WAY cheaper than clutches.
OTOH, in very low gears, engine braking becomes significant. You mountain boys know what I mean: running downhill in low gear, staying off the brakes so you don't fade them to oblivion.
That's a totally made-up number, but the point is that engine braking is pointless. What you experience when you use the clutch to enhance it is a temporarily stronger braking effect, but just while the clutch drags the engine up to speed. Like I said before, brake pads are WAY cheaper than clutches.
OTOH, in very low gears, engine braking becomes significant. You mountain boys know what I mean: running downhill in low gear, staying off the brakes so you don't fade them to oblivion.
Your not doing anything wrong, but that's not heel toe.
Heres what I do at ~45-50mph for a 90* turn.
I brake hard as I approach the corner, clutch in, pull it out of 4th gear. Then I swing the heel of my braking foot over and blip the throttle (~4500rpm) put it into 3rd, let the clutch out. Clutch in again, pull out of 3rd, blip throttle (~5400rpm) into 2nd gear, clutch out, then off the brakes and accelerating again.
Most of this occurs before I even start to turn in, and I complete the 4>3>2 downshift in under 4 seconds. I'm usually back on the gas before I'm half way through the turn.
Keep in mind I have a quick revving, mid engined car- so the basic technique will be the same but the timing of things might be different for other cars.
Scaff
Moderator
- 29,883
- He/Him
- ScaffUK
Having driven quite a few 4x4's in the conditions them were made for I know exactly what you mean, face with a steep descent you get into a low gear (and in low range if you have the option) and as you start the descent you just take your feet off all the pedals and let the engine speed alone control the speed.
Its freaky the first time you do it but very effective, particularly in this...
..my dad's Series 3.
👍
Scaff
- 5,095
- Panama City, FL
A previous post said you weren't doing anything wrong, but from an equipment life view, you are. Rather than coast or brake with the clutch depressed, select neutral and release the clutch pedal. All that time with the pedal down stresses the throwout bearing. Most often that's actually the failed part when people say they need a new clutch. When the clutch pedal goes to the floor with little effect, won't always return or stay returned if you pull it up, you've probably lost the throwout bearing, and holding the clutch disengaged for longer than it takes to shift is the reason.
It's twice as much work for your leg, but the better way for this situation is to decelerate in neutral, clutch pedal released, then shift into the desired gear after braking (or stopping, or coasting) is complete.
It is important to realize that there IS a difference between neutral-with-clutch-engaged and in-gear-with-clutch-depressed. The first is relaxed parts, no wear occuring, the latter is stressed parts being worn.
In brisk or competitive driving there is. A series of downshifts with little engine speed change is easier to produce and smoother to perform than a single shift from say, 5th to 2nd with a lengthy pause in neutral. If you're racing and you catch neutral to brake, then when you reach your desired speed, you have no idea where the matched rev would be. Also, the engine speed while you reach each gear is a clue to your speed. Once you've learned a corner as 5-4-3-2, you cannot find it as 5-N-wait-wait-2.
That said, if you're not running at least 8-tenths, then there's no point going down each gear. Coast or brake in neutral.
- 5,095
- Panama City, FL
Or practice, or just because it's really really good when you get it right.
My brother does it ALL THE TIME, though, and it's annoying. In casual driving, I'll probably drop from 5th to 3rd for braking, then 2nd if I need it, neutral if I'm stopping. My tranny is close enough that 5th-3rd is only a couple thousand RPM, and my engine's redline is high enough that 3rd will reach any legal speed and get me all the way down to 20 or 25.
- 10,116
- Maryland, USA
- swift-bass
I'm still of the mindset that the less work you do, the more you can concentrate on teh control of the car. If you do 3 downshifts for a single corner, that's a lot of cognative thought going into that before you even enter the corner.
Again, I'm sure professionals find it useful. But for everyday driving and even autocrossing it's useless.
Keef
Premium
- 25,239
- Dayton, OH
- GTP_KeefRacer
- GTP Keef
Experimentation is how you know how much to rev the engine. Every car is different. In my case, I have to rev quite a bit because I have high gear ratios and an 8000 rpm rev sweep in my Del Sol. My buddies Sentra SE-R only revs to 6000 rpm and has lower gear ratios, so he only needs to tap the gas the slightest bit to end up in the right spot. You just have to experiment and find what works for your car. After a while of doing it you'll ge tthe "feel" for it and be able to rev-match in any gear and at any rpm.
You aren't confined to one-by-one downshifts, either. You can go straight from 5th to 2nd if you need to speed up rapidly from your slow-speed cruise, or if some dumb kid decides to "go".
You aren't confined to one-by-one downshifts, either. You can go straight from 5th to 2nd if you need to speed up rapidly from your slow-speed cruise, or if some dumb kid decides to "go".
- 1,795
It depends on what gears you are going to/from, the particular vehicle, etc. Both my car and my dirt bike are manual transmission, but neither has a tach, so I rely on sound and feel rather than studying a gauge. With practice, the correct RPMs will come to you , as it will begin feeling second nature. Basically, if the engine is struggling to keep up and you aren't getting power, your RPM are too low, so you need more next time for that gear shift. If the car suddenly slows down and over-revs, you are too high, and need to shoot lower. Before too long, you will be able to tell what engine speed you need for what gear shift, and whether you need to give it more gas, or drop it down a bit. Even if you have and use a tachometer, it will be a process of trial and error before you know what all to do.
- 4,394
Okay so I drive a 2nd gen Ford Probe GT also, manual, I just got it and I'm still relatively new to manual.
When I'm in first gear and going slow, I find I have to 'ride the clutch' in parking lots sometimes because otherwise the car lurches... when I'm behind someone going slow I find I have to do it otherwise I stall. Is that correct?
When I slow down (red light) I tend to just pop it into neutral and then brake to a stop. When I see the cross-traffic stop, I hold down the clutch and put it into the first. A few seconds later when the light goes green I start off. Is that correct?
When I slow down to make a turn, say from 4th gear to 2nd.. I typically slow down and let the car get down to 2,000 or 1,500 rpms and then I push in the clutch, select 2nd, hold it and release it slowly as I make my turn, and as I start to leave the turn (while I'm slowly letting off the clutch) I slowly give it more throttle. Now apparently I need to blip the throttle as I'm pushing in the clutch by doing heel-toe in order to match the revs. What I want to know is, how bad is my current method? If smoeone can reply in detail to me or pm I would be most appreciative 👍
When I'm in first gear and going slow, I find I have to 'ride the clutch' in parking lots sometimes because otherwise the car lurches... when I'm behind someone going slow I find I have to do it otherwise I stall. Is that correct?
When I slow down (red light) I tend to just pop it into neutral and then brake to a stop. When I see the cross-traffic stop, I hold down the clutch and put it into the first. A few seconds later when the light goes green I start off. Is that correct?
When I slow down to make a turn, say from 4th gear to 2nd.. I typically slow down and let the car get down to 2,000 or 1,500 rpms and then I push in the clutch, select 2nd, hold it and release it slowly as I make my turn, and as I start to leave the turn (while I'm slowly letting off the clutch) I slowly give it more throttle. Now apparently I need to blip the throttle as I'm pushing in the clutch by doing heel-toe in order to match the revs. What I want to know is, how bad is my current method? If smoeone can reply in detail to me or pm I would be most appreciative 👍
