First thougts of drifting in GT4...

Discussion in 'GT4 Drifting' started by uglyDRIFT, Feb 24, 2005.

  1. uglyDRIFT

    uglyDRIFT (Banned)

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    yeah yeah get off my balls about it... haha. i just spoke too soon out of my own dumb mouth.. i apologize for offending you and everyone else...ill restate by saying that GT4 is an improvement....i still have some complaints about some things... but ill just have to find a way around them.... but i really find it annoying that you cant do donuts.... mainly small 1st gear countersteered donuts (in a RWD car!) again.... maybe i just need to practice more?? haha anyway.. yeah... thanks for all the input guys... im not ashamed to admit that im wrong, have a nice day.
     
  2. Driftster

    Driftster

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    I love how people say they're .03% like their counterparts....Except for the whole clutch issue...I mean don't get me wrong......But Not many automatic professional drifters....And not many pro's powershifting EVERY gear either........just my 2 cents..
     
  3. SlidewaysS14

    SlidewaysS14

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    i thought it was absolutely terrible at first...but now that ive taken out my s14 and tweaked and worked with it, i think i've really got a good setting now and i'm loving the drifting in it now, got rid of most of the understeer and it acutally can get too squirrely at times :) i've posted my settings. feints and accell of work really nicely :tup:
     
  4. Azuremen

    Azuremen Premium

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    ugly... consider this about donuts. Unless I drop the clutch in my MR2, it would just understeer, even with almost 200 HP in real life. It has to do with the tires, suspension, LSD, and weight load. That, and torque is what busts out the rear end at low speeds...
     
  5. rotary_freq

    rotary_freq

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    No they honestly don't
    Not that 3 is more realistic. But the last time I was in my freinds BMW and I yanked the hand brake, the car went into an insane drift.
    Yet in the EXACT same car in the game (2002 Turbo) the car just kinda... I don't know what the **** it does... But drifting in this game is like flying in grand theft auto 3.
    You arent supposed to do it, but you can pretend to.
     
  6. Gen.

    Gen.

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    Have you got a video comparison? Because right now, that's the only proof we can accept =/
     
  7. uglyDRIFT

    uglyDRIFT (Banned)

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    all i know is... that there are a couple aspects of the game that drifting in REAL LIFE and drifting in GT4 are not the same!! considering we have to take off all the "driving aids" just to do it... im sure they didnt exactly put this in mind when they figured out all the physics for the game.. and for drifting... i dunno..... and for donuts.... all you should have to do is turn the freakin wheel, rev it up.... and let the clutch go!... even if you do that in the game..... you just continue to understeer like ur in a damn FF....
     
  8. Swift

    Swift Staff Emeritus

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    Hmm...the driving aids are designed to keep the car going in the direction the driver wants it. With controlled oversteer or drifting, it would be nearly impossible to program a computer to let it drift but only to a certain point.

    I was messing around with an S13 last night and was actually able to pull off some decent drifts on Trial Mountain. I didn't have a brake balance controller on the car so almost any braking caused understeer. Feinting and lift off oversteer were the two techniques that I used.

    To be honest, I like this system better then GT3. In GT3 I always though that sloppy technique was too rewarding. In closing, drifting in GT4 is harder, more challenging and more fun to me then in GT3.:cool:
     
  9. nk4e

    nk4e

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    I agree, with this sys, you have to be able to think whats wrong. In GT3 you can just put all the spring rates/etc very low and it lets you drift, but in Gt4 you have to put it at a certain rate. Its very touchy and challenging like Swift said.
     
  10. BreakerOhio

    BreakerOhio

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    Weight transfer is the right idea, knowing that you want to do it, but executing it is what I'm guessing your problem is. I normally drift with the 900 degree wheel, but I've tired it with the DS2 last night and I find that understeer will happen if you turn in and continue to turn into the corner as you gas. Thats not going to produce oversteer. That plus a weight transfer will oversteer you into a 180 if you do it right. What you have to do is just before you turn in accel off, fient for weight transfer, agressively turn in, and punch the gas. At this point the tires should squeel, then you must STOP turning into the turn or else you kill the drift. You need to start slowly countersteering to get the drift going from this point. Good luck.

    :)
     
  11. marshun

    marshun

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    i think this game NEEDS the steering wheel.

    the only time i can any type of drift is when i try and realize where the front wheels are pointed. idunno if this makes sense cause i cant explain it too hot.

    cause i do go drifting in real life and its hard to do it in gt4. gt3 the steering isnt as responsive
     
  12. 194GVan

    194GVan Premium

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    i noticed this last night practicing with an s13 240sx at the gymkhana. and the more i think about it the more I think GT4 is much more realistic.

    if your car is in a 4 wheel slide around a turn (drifting), all the tires are gripping laterally and slowing the car down. if you turn the front wheels into a turn this allows them to roll properly but the back tires, spinning or not, still have that lateral grip and are going to skid while the front wheels roll into the turn, slowing the rear end down and of course causing the inevitable spin out as im sure weve all experienced.

    did that make any sense to anyone besides me?
     
  13. Sloth

    Sloth

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    Through personal experience, I've come to the conclusion that 900 degree mode is the root of everyone's problems.

    Before you get me wrong, 180 degree mode will only make the problem worse.


    I never liked using 900 degree mode in Live for Speed, but it seems I am now obligated to use it in GT4, and being like 4:30 in the morning, I can't be overly noisey. So what I'm getting at is; I cannot rotate the wheel fast enough to upset the car the way I want. Then when I go to countersteer, I'm too slow at get the wheel in place so sometimes I'll spin out.

    Same goes for grip driving. I often find myself understeering because I didn't cut hard enough.


    That, I believe, is why alot of people are dissatisfied with their attempts at drifting.

    They are simply not being aggressive enough with the wheel.

    You can't be subtle with it. Shuffle those hands

    This is only the result of about an hour in the Gymkhana open arena, so it's almost purely theoretical.

    But, once people start waking up here, I'll give it another shot and prove this theory, because I am that confident it is true.

    My body is craving pepperoni anyways, so yeah. Time to give this controversy a rest.


    (GTP went down so this post had to wait until now.)
    (Plus I 'accidentally' fell asleep for like 9 hours.)

    I'll be back with results in a bit..
     
  14. rotary_freq

    rotary_freq

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    actually thats a good idea!
    I can use my freinds FC too, since more people could probably relate to that
     
  15. rotary_freq

    rotary_freq

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    yeah i got ya
    but also remeber that your wheels are now perpendicular to the turn, creating friction, giving the front end more resistance, and allowing the rear end to swing out infront of it.
     
  16. rotary_freq

    rotary_freq

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    In LFS, was it kinda hard to turn the wheel?
    Like you could turn pretty good for a few degrees, but then it got really siff and you have to force it, and it makes a realy loud noise?
     
  17. triple6_wild

    triple6_wild

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    hey waz up

    this would be my first post n i am so glad im not the only one having trouble drifting :lol:

    well im using a controller cuz i dont have the cash for a wheel yet my first problem was i find the touchyness of counter steer a lil hard to get used to SO im drifting without counter steering ... basicly throwing the car into the turn with a faint and using the gas to control the drift (without steering at all other then the faint of course) it works fairly well after a bit of practice cuz i can throw it in at the right angle now and use gas/nos to hold it through the whole turn and only a "tap" on counter steer to exit the turn

    but my new problem is that it does not work on all types of corners such as long hairpin turns where you NEED counter to keep the drift going through the whole turn cuz i cant kick the backend out more well in the turn when i start to lose the drift

    ive got all driving aids off ..most of my cars weight shifted to the front and i got the breaks set full in the rear but it it refuses to kick out even when using the e-break ... im kinda wondering if there is somthing i can do to make the e-break work to throw the rear end out without killing rpm's .... right now i need to hold e-break for 2+ sec for it to even start the drift and by the time a drift is started with e-break the rpm's are dead

    as it is now faint is the only way for me to start a drift so does anyone have any ideas on how i can get my e-break & breaks working better to start drifts?
    it seems near impossible to start a drift using the breaks without faint

    n where can i win the sprinter SS? lol

    sorry for all the questions but anyways you all keep it sidesways now n i will "catch" ya laterz :cheers:
     
  18. Boundary Layer

    Boundary Layer Premium

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    Welcome to GTP triple6_wild!

    i would love to try and help you out, but there is one bit of information missing from you post that i would want to know before doing so.
    What type of car are you trying to drift with?

    perhaps go back and edit that in, along with whatever other suspension or LSD settings you are using. I'll have a look at them with you then.
    :tup:
     
  19. toyomatt84

    toyomatt84

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    Although I'm typically one for the positives in Gran Turismo titles, I think PD dropped the realism level a little bit in the ability to drift. It's not quite as hard as they make it seem, in real life. Although, I do like a challenge, this is almost out of my reach.
     
  20. Stanley^Carter

    Stanley^Carter

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    triple6_wild, I'm thinking about the E-brake thing too, I've heard a lot of people complaining the car doesn't even able to do proper donuts, and then the E-brake is barely working, whereas in real life it's totally opposite.

    but I'm sure all of you have seen videos of people drifting GT4 with great style and consistency, so I'm pretty sure its possible, the physics have improved and changed, it all comes down to practise and getting use to the new physics(controls)
     
  21. Tulikettu

    Tulikettu

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    It's nice to see that you guys are actually trying to find out how to drift and not cry like some others that GT4 physic engine sucks :tup:
    Let's go back to GT3 times. Even an ape could have drifted like Keiichi "Drift King" himself or even better in GT3. If may have lifted your confidence about how you can drift to heaven, but GT4 brings it down, fast.
    I think it's just good, drifting in real-life isn't a piece of cake. It takes a lot of patience and practising.

    Yesterday I played GT4:p with my DFP and noticed one thing when I was rallying with Lancia. It may sound stupid but it has a big affect to your driving how you hold your hands on the wheel. I used to hold my fingers around the wheel where you naturally hold them (left hand 90 degrees to left and right 90 degrees to right). I noticed that when countersteering your hands are restricting the driving. Sounds still stupid... Anyway I tried something different and grabbed my hands higher, something like left hand 45 degrees left etc. Now I didn't struggle with my hands anymore while countersteering. It sounds stupid but try it out!

    Another problem is that many people feels bad when they turn thw wheel very fast, they think that they're going to breake it. If you had seen how I turn my DFP you hadn't no fear about breaking it anymore :)
    I could say that I'll buy another wheel to him who can broke his DFP's gear wheels by turning it too fast...

    EDIT: If you've seen how fast rally drivers turn the wheel, you would understand that the problem is between chair and wheel. It also takes quite much practising to learn to turn the wheel fast enough, at least I struggle with my hands sometimes when turning the wheel very fast.
    Practising practising and practising....
     
  22. triple6_wild

    triple6_wild

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    now im using an AE86 corrolla to learn my drifting in GT4 cuz its the car i could drift best with in GT3 and i dont really have any fixed settings for it yet other then driving aids always off and weight always in front

    after i know how to drift with counter i will start using other FR cars like the RX-7and mabey some MR but untill i can find basic tuning settings that will work on all FR to get the e-break and even the regular breaks working i wont be able to drift other then zero-counter .. good thing zero-counter drifts came to me naturally or i wouldnt be able to drift at all lol

    i know there is no perfect settings that work on all cars but its a starting point for the new car and if it works on a low HP car then it should work great on a top-end racing car right lol

    Edit: ive somehow managed to fix my breaking problem and now have an trueno s.s that feels like the one i had in gt3 ... handels almost the same other then a few minor unwanted drifts on some corners but other then that im drifting fairly good now with counter steer
     
  23. Po28

    Po28

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    i don't mean to hate or flame at all.. i was just wondering..

    almost all of you guys are saying that drifting in GT4, the driving physics, and the way the car reacts is so realistic, but how many of u actually drift? and if u do drift.. how many of u enter the turn at speeds of 50+? and how many of u actually REALLY actually drift.. cause i noticed that people say they can drift but all they are doing is oversteering the car at the exit of the turn (which is not drifting.. by the way) and how many of you drive your car the way u drive your GT4 car? lol lmao.. don't get mad or don't flame me or don't hate.. cause in no way am i hating, or flaming any of u guys are this thread.. i was just wondering. this is just a friendly question.

    i say in some ways drifting in GT4 is similar to drifting in real life, but when u counter-steer just a bit too much and it swings back the other way and makes u spin out.. that's not realistic in any way.. lol and how the e-brake doesn't work as good as it did in GT3. and 1 more thing.. how u almost always understeer at speeds u shouldn't in actual driving. i drive a '85 corolla gts and that car is known of understeering like no other and i don't understeer as much as i do in GT4.. and yes i'm taking the right driving lines and setting the suspension right and not disrupting and throwing off the weight distribution. i got alot more to say, but i'm not cause this post is long enough as it is.. well i guess it's just a game and can't be just like real life.. o well.. i was just wondering =] ok byebye
     
  24. 194GVan

    194GVan Premium

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    well, after a solid 6 hours of playing last night (till 4:30 am!), i have come to the conclusion that i like the GT4 physics better than GT3's. If you get a car tuned with the settings to suit your driving just perfect, the race experience it just amazing, so smooth and fast.

    I know im not the first but I bought the Blitz Skyline, the car is pretty much ready to drift right out of the box, all i had to buy was a LSD and race suspension. It uses S3 tires, which seem to work well for the ~500hp car. I tried using N tires but they dont really have too much grip when your trying to turn. My first run with the car I was almost as good as my n00b GT3 drifting skills, but of course there was the occasional spinout. I think the car might be slightly easier to handle if it had a little less power but you cant de-tune it at all (or get rims or a wing for that matter)
     
  25. uglyDRIFT

    uglyDRIFT (Banned)

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    i would like to know the same thing......cause there are many things that you could argue between REAL LIFE and GT4 drifting..... especially with everyone saying stuff about NO COUNTERSTEER drifting... in real life.. if you dont countersteer... then you spin... your front wheels have to be pointing in the direction your car is going.... in GT4... sometimes you just have to keep them straight and countersteer everynow and then to keep from spinning out..... this is i think the big thing that i dont agree with..... time to start the flame wars!!!!! haha jp
     
  26. precisionlocke`

    precisionlocke`

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    That's one of the D1GP cars in GT4. I haven't tried it yet, but I've tried the Mazda FC and HKS Silvia and they're also both pretty fun to try drifting with. Both of their suspensions are notably soft.

    As for the e-brake issue... I know the brake and accel buttons are supposedly pressure-sensitive, but not sure if the e-brake is also pressure-sensitive... IMO, it's fine the way it is.

    If you've watched some of the D1 battles as well as K.T.'s Drift Bible, you may notice that they also run into similar problems that might be faced when trying to drift in GT4. It's definitely a fun learning experience. :)

    On a side note, the courses alone are amazing. There's so much variety in corners now, which makes things very interesting. This is something I'm very appreciative of.
     
  27. Stanley^Carter

    Stanley^Carter

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    Po28, well said and I agree at most of what you have mentioned there.

    but about people saying GT4 is realistic, I think they are referring to "GT4 is more realistic THAN GT3" in terms of physics, not like "it's so realistic it's just like real life", it is still just a game afterall, you just have to appreciate that such a simple game can go as far as this, amazing game GT4 is :)

    p/s:
     
  28. J.J.Snake

    J.J.Snake

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    Lets get some videos goin here people!
     
  29. 194GVan

    194GVan Premium

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    Ive noticed that the e-brake seems to be able to get some cars to swing around much better than on the others. The drift cars work well.

    Another car i think is fun is the twin turbo r32 golf. If you go into a turn a little fast and let off the gas its pretty easy to get it into a controlled slide, but it pulls out so quick when you hit the gas cause its AWD.
     
  30. Flip rSx driveR

    Flip rSx driveR

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    The emergency-brake physics annoy me, too. You can't swing your car around. And I don't think it's unrealistic, because I used to have a stock '91 Integra that I could e-brake into a 180 on a very warm, dry day outside. I just wish you could hit the e-brake, and just have the car go sideways through that.

    Oh well! Still practicing the drifting with Nomuken's D1 Skyline... but indeed it is much harder. Even if you get the slide right, too immediate and too much countersteer will swing the car right around in the other direction. It all needs practice I guess. And don't get me started on the turbo lag. :yuck: