FITT Challenge STi Vs Evo Battle! Results; Congratulations to Praiano63, Otaliema & Brian Wolf

  • Thread starter Otaliema
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Pro Spec Rallycross
@Otaliema

Willow Springs - Streets of Willow
Time - 1:08.014
DC - 9


Very aggressive setup which I enjoyed a lot. You could throw the car into corners and slingshot it out the other side with confidence and ease, the only thing letting it down was the brakes which made the car a little bit too unpredictable under hard braking.

Eiger Nordwand W Trail
Time - 1:04.342
DC - 5


On dirt the car felt a little bit too wild and lacked precision. I like a car that can get sideways but with this I just felt like I was fighting for control the whole time. The turbo just wanted to dig holes and kill tyres, it might have been more controllable if not for the boost kicking in and removing all rear traction. Real Jekyll and Hyde sort of car this one
Thank you sir. Interesting results on the dirt thought I had it settled down guess it wasn't quite as settled as I thought. Some great laps you put down with all the cars.

I'll get yours and @srmellott times loaded in the morning see how this shook up the standings.
 
appreciate the review man. This is a car that I really didn't like because of the racing tires so the DC score is about what I expected. 2nd best willow lap though, surprising.

The suspension felt too soft for the tyres, they stayed planted while the body sort of flopped around on top. It was super grippy but it was very easy to introduce too much motion into the car and start a chain reaction. I think you just need to raise the compression a bit to control the weight transfer better and it would make a world of difference to the stability.

Thank you sir. Interesting results on the dirt thought I had it settled down guess it wasn't quite as settled as I thought. Some great laps you put down with all the cars.

I'll get yours and @srmellott times loaded in the morning see how this shook up the standings.

It was a great on tarmac but just too aggressive on dirt. I found most of the cars running the High-Rpm were the same way, you'd hit the boost and just keep bouncing off the limiter while digging a hole under the rear wheels. I couldn't see anything that might be responsible on your tune though, it looks like it should be quiet understeery already
 
@DolHaus, sorry, I should have noted in the tune: Do Not trail brake into a corner. All breaking should be done in a straight line before the corner. You should be on the throttle before the corner in order to get the weight back and balance the car.

On the start straight on a running hot lap I brake slightly on the mid hump to put the nose down so I can brake earlier. Flying is a bad idea, there's no control in the air.

I was pulling 1:01.503 as my best Eiger time. If you are able to adapt to this tune it will make you a better driver in the long run.
 
The suspension felt too soft for the tyres, they stayed planted while the body sort of flopped around on top. It was super grippy but it was very easy to introduce too much motion into the car and start a chain reaction. I think you just need to raise the compression a bit to control the weight transfer better and it would make a world of difference to the stability.



It was a great on tarmac but just too aggressive on dirt. I found most of the cars running the High-Rpm were the same way, you'd hit the boost and just keep bouncing off the limiter while digging a hole under the rear wheels. I couldn't see anything that might be responsible on your tune though, it looks like it should be quiet understeery already
Yeah I forgot to put a drivers for eiger to short shift the car at 6k till 4th gear keeps the power down and the torque up which keeps the speed on dirt for me anyways
 
@DolHaus, sorry, I should have noted in the tune: Do Not trail brake into a corner. All breaking should be done in a straight line before the corner. You should be on the throttle before the corner in order to get the weight back and balance the car.

On the start straight on a running hot lap I brake slightly on the mid hump to put the nose down so I can brake earlier. Flying is a bad idea, there's no control in the air.

I was pulling 1:01.503 as my best Eiger time. If you are able to adapt to this tune it will make you a better driver in the long run.
I wasn't trail braking at all, I just found that every time I went near the brakes that the front end would lock up and plough forward. I tried driving it smooth and clean, I tried driving it hard, I tried every technique I know over the 10 laps and the brakes always proved to be a problem. Straight line braking only really works on the 1st corner and the hairpin, in the rest of the corners I want to be able to rotate the car under braking so I don't have to shed so much speed. Its fine if you can guarantee hitting exactly the same spot every time when hitting the brakes but on gravel there are no guarantees so it needs to be more flexible and rounded.

Yeah I forgot to put a drivers for eiger to short shift the car at 6k till 4th gear keeps the power down and the torque up which keeps the speed on dirt for me anyways
@DolHaus Great reviews mate! Very respectable times! I liked the big turbo! Power limiting it back gave me a very flat power curve so I could short shift on feel, rather than stare at the rev counter!

Probably something to do with me driving auto trans....
 
I'd like to make a suggestion.

I think it's advisable for future challenges to list if the car involved was tuned & tested in auto or manual transmission.

If a car is tuned by a MT tuner & then tested by an AT tester, the results, in some cars, will be quite different.

As a MT user, I take note of the power & torque curve for each car I drive every time so that I get the most out of what's available. Unfortunately, for the AT users, they are limited by the transmission changing gear at the redline on the tach regardless of how good the tuner or tester may be. That's not so important if the car used loves being taken to the redline but for a car that benefits from an early gear change this will show up in the results.

I'm interested to know what you all think about this.
 
I'd like to make a suggestion.

I think it's advisable for future challenges to list if the car involved was tuned & tested in auto or manual transmission.

If a car is tuned by a MT tuner & then tested by an AT tester, the results, in some cars, will be quite different.

As a MT user, I take note of the power & torque curve for each car I drive every time so that I get the most out of what's available. Unfortunately, for the AT users, they are limited by the transmission changing gear at the redline on the tach regardless of how good the tuner or tester may be. That's not so important if the car used loves being taken to the redline but for a car that benefits from an early gear change this will show up in the results.

I'm interested to know what you all think about this.
As someone who is an AT user, I'll be the first to hold my hand up and say that my setup is childish and does not simulate real driving like the game is intended. And I know that I'm not getting everything out of the cars, especially when Turbos are involved. But I make sure that everyone is aware of my driving setup and settings. So I agree with you and think something should be said for every tuner and tester.
 
I love my manual transmissions but with a 9 speed auto available in the Range Rover Evoque, as well as Ford & GM co-developing a 10 speed, I think the days of the traditional manual are numbered.

As far as gaming is concerned, in an ideal world, we could adjust our shift up & change down points for the gearbox in a settings menu.

Someone should let PD know ;)
 
I love my manual transmissions but with a 9 speed auto available in the Range Rover Evoque, as well as Ford & GM co-developing a 10 speed, I think the days of the traditional manual are numbered.

As far as gaming is concerned, in an ideal world, we could adjust our shift up & change down points for the gearbox in a settings menu.

Someone should let PD know ;)
Bah big rigs have been running 13+gears with manual for a couple decades. What's going up do in manual is pure electric cars that don't need gear boxes.
 
I'd like to make a suggestion.

I think it's advisable for future challenges to list if the car involved was tuned & tested in auto or manual transmission.

If a car is tuned by a MT tuner & then tested by an AT tester, the results, in some cars, will be quite different.

As a MT user, I take note of the power & torque curve for each car I drive every time so that I get the most out of what's available. Unfortunately, for the AT users, they are limited by the transmission changing gear at the redline on the tach regardless of how good the tuner or tester may be. That's not so important if the car used loves being taken to the redline but for a car that benefits from an early gear change this will show up in the results.

I'm interested to know what you all think about this.
My 2p is that I dont think it matters unless you can guarantee a 50/50 split of testers in MT/AT. I`m perfectly happy with the times driven by anyone who tests and is fair about it.:cheers: Its swings and roundabouts. My spec STi was faster changing up before the redline. But, @DolHaus beat my best time at Tsukuba by nearly half a second with AT.👍
You win some, you lose some.:)
 
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I love my manual transmissions but with a 9 speed auto available in the Range Rover Evoque, as well as Ford & GM co-developing a 10 speed, I think the days of the traditional manual are numbered.

As far as gaming is concerned, in an ideal world, we could adjust our shift up & change down points for the gearbox in a settings menu.

Someone should let PD know ;)
The days for fuel economy use of manuals in personal vehicles are numbered, yes, but there are enough enthusiasts that want their manuals and sports cars.
 
I'd say that there is no reason to change anything, tuners should just check that their cars work as well with AT. Those who prefer no ABS have to make concessions in their tunes so it should be the same way really - No forced rule changes, just something to consider when tuning.
 
Bah big rigs have been running 13+gears with manual for a couple decades. What's going up do in manual is pure electric cars that don't need gear boxes.
As a Truck Driver, I wish I had a dollar for every gear change I've had to make.
The best truck I've driven, without a doubt, was a Volvo FH12 that had the option of operating the gearbox manually or in auto. It makes for a much less tiring day in traffic letting it do the shifting for you.
Given the choice of owning a car with a CVT :yuck: or walking, I'll become good friends with my local shoe store :D
 
@brian wolf your hanging on to the lead in the pro sepc by 0.005 of a second! hot dang this is a close one.
@Bowtie-muscle your chasing @praiano63 in the tuners class 0.043 seconds behind. Your also chasing me in racers 0.083 seconds behind.
totaling the time differences between first and second place we hit a massive 0.131 seconds difference. :boggled: tight as heck.
This challenge sounds as close as qualifying for a round of the V8 Supercars.
In a recent round, we had 25 cars covered by 4 tenths of a second!
 
This challenge sounds as clothese as qualifying for a round of the V8 Supercars.
In a recent round, we had 25 cars covered by 4 tenths of a second!
Yeah the podium for each class is less than .300 a part each. once you get out of the podium things relly open up like in pro spec 4th place is over a second off pace. in racers it's close to 2 seconds out.
 
Due to a langue barrier I've decided to grant @xande1959 a tire change on his Street Racer tune, I offered the option and he accepted for his tune please run Comfort Soft front/rear at SilverStone the Stowe
@brian wolf I know you have already completed your testing on his car but could you give a few laps with the updated tires please?
Sorry about the short notice on this been busy taking care of family stuff and a couple of sick people in the house. (wife and one child ugg)
 
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@brian wolf your hanging on to the lead in the pro sepc by 0.005 of a second! hot dang this is a close one.
@Bowtie-muscle your chasing @praiano63 in the tuners class 0.043 seconds behind. Your also chasing me in racers 0.083 seconds behind.
totaling the time differences between first and second place we hit a massive 0.131 seconds difference. :boggled: tight as heck.
.005! 👍 Only a coat of paint between us! :lol:
Sure, I`ll retest for @xande1959 at stowe. I`ll give it a fair run, not just a few laps.👍 I took the F40 i`m tuning around stowe the other day and it didn`t feel right without 100% water! I`ve quite missed the place, It feels like and old friend now!
 
.005! 👍 Only a coat of paint between us! :lol:
Sure, I`ll retest for @xande1959 at stowe. I`ll give it a fair run, not just a few laps.👍 I took the F40 i`m tuning around stowe the other day and it didn`t feel right without 100% water! I`ve quite missed the place, It feels like and old friend now!
sounds like a plan I took about 3 seconds off the time I had for him prior to him getting back to me on the tire change. i think it will make a noticablbe differnce in the standings.

@Otaliema Rally cross updated, I had tested it but forgotten to write it up for some reason
it happens that why I asked. thank you sir.

@Slender_Man @xande1959 reviews have been posted for your cars. Found Here
 
STREET RACERS


Track settings Grip set to real ABS 1 all other aids off. 100% wet track at Stowe

All tunes had their own car.
All tunes were given as long as it took to get what I felt was the best I could get out of them.
Which was roughly 30 mins at each track. Some more, some less. Some I felt needed a revisit a
few days later, and some I nailed within 3 laps then spent the next 20 mins chasing the ghost!

All tunes were tested at Stowe first then Autumn Ring without changing cars.
All tunes tested with DFGT.
All tunes tested as posted.

I have written tyre choices with the lap times to put them in context.


Standard Rims

@DolHaus Subaru Impreza WRX STi '07

Silverstone Stowe
Laptime : 1:10.906 CS/SH
DC : 5
Autumn Ring
Laptime : 1:19.828 SM/SM
DC : 9.5

Tyre choice really hurt this tune on the wet stuff, it just spun. Autumn Ring on the other hand
was awesome. Great brakes, gearing and some lift of oversteer gave this tune a permanent place
in my garage. Well done!

@ImToLegitToQuit Lancer Evolution X GSR '07

Silverstone Stowe
Laptime : 1:07.811 SH/SH
DC : 6
Autumn Ring
Laptime : 1:21.253 SM/SM
DC : 8

Quite unstable in the wet and made slower by long braking zones. However, much better in the
dry. That instability reduced the understeer prevalent in all the EVO`s tho brakes again were an
issue. I never got into 6th gear and I couldn`t quite place it exactly where i wanted to on the
road. But, it felt fast and that is always fun! Well done!

@suspension EVOLUTION IX GSR 2005

Silverstone Stowe
Laptime : 1:12.851 SM/SM
DC : 7.5
Autumn Ring
Laptime : 1:25.603 SH/SH
DC : 7

A very stiff chassis didn`t make it very forgiving in the wet and the high RPM turbo gave wheelspin in every gear if i wasn`t careful! But, a nicely balanced car and I found the best times came from just giving it 85%. One hand on the wheel, one hand on the shifter. Lifting on each change. I did 15 clean laps in a row a Stowe, getting steadily quicker each lap. At Autumn Ring a similar technique of smooth driving (not my strongpoint!) gave the best times. Well done!

@DaBomm4 Lancer Evo VI GSR T.M.E. '00

Silverstone Stowe
Laptime : 1:08.076 SM/SM
DC : 6
Autumn Ring
Laptime : 1:22.854 SH/SH
DC : 7.5

I struggled to get it in the corners at Stowe, and coudn`t get the power down coming out
again. Short gearing not helping exit traction. But, that short gearing was perfect at Autumn
Ring where its ability over the kerbs really helped it. You need to be smooth with this tune
and I struggled with that. I think a bit more rear bias in the torque split would have helped me.
A Smoother driver will get better times for you! Top tuning!

@787bcgr Impreza STI '07

Silverstone Stowe
Laptime : 1:02.348 CS/CS
DC : 7
Autumn Ring
Laptime : 1:20.186 SM/SM
DC : 7

There is a nice balance to this car in the wet although its a bit wobbly under hard braking.
With a good turn in and mid corner grip this car felt balanced wet or dry tho I did experience
some wobblyness on exit in the dry. Caused, I think by soft ARBs. No problems braking in the
dry tho. Good tune!

@krenkme Impreza Sport Wagon STi Version VI '99

Silverstone Stowe
Laptime : 1:10.851 SH/SH
DC : 6.5
Autumn Ring
Laptime : 1:20.334 SM/SM
DC : 9

I`ve written in my notes about this car at Stowe "Nice balance until wobble then crash". And
I think thats fair. However with some practice I could slide it nicely, there was enough front
grip to scaninavian flick it and hold the slide......then crash! In the dry tho, what a machine!
That grippy front end ment I could brake late and power early out. A bit of wobble on exit if I
had to correct it but a car with real character, and thats no bad thing! Well done!

@brave bear Lancer Evolution IV GSR '96

Silverstone Stowe
Laptime : 1:06.775 SM/SM
DC : 8
Autumn Ring
Laptime : 1:24.197 SH/SH
DC : 6.5

Longer gearing would have helped at Stowe. A decent chassis tho, and with some practice I could slide it round Stowe to a decent time with SM`s on. At Autumn Ring the change to 30:70 torque split didn`t help the balance of the car( I did 5 laps at 40:60 stowe setting by mistake!!) More rear bias made slow corner exit slower. Getting it in to corners was tricky also. Get you braking right and some nice brake lift off oversteer made it easy. Brake too early and the rear diff pushed the front wide. All in all tho a decent compromise tune.
Well done!!

@Motor City Hami Lancer Evolution VI GSR T.M. Edition

Silverstone Stowe
Laptime : 1:02.423 CS/CS
DC : 8
Autumn Ring
Laptime : 1:21.199 SM/SM
DC : 8

A very stable tune in the wet, easy to place but not very forgiving on corner exit if I got
carried away, I would have prefered exit oversteer to understeer. The AYC really helped this
car rotate, wet or dry but to me it feels weird. It felt like it was going to over rotate but
then still understeered. I could get on the loud pedal very early in the dry tho, just had to
take a line that would allow it room to push a little on exit. Very easy to drive at its limit,
I think this tune is as fast as an EVO VI could be in this challenge. Well done!

+1 Rims
@xande1959 Subaru IMPREZA Sedan WRX STI '10

Silverstone Stowe
Laptime : 1:06.891 SH/CS 1:01.372 CS/CS
DC : 6 8.5
Autumn Ring
Laptime : 1:21.470 SM/SM
DC : 7

In the wet the tyre choice made it very stable, tho understeer alot! At Stowe this tune makes a whole lot more sense now! Now a balanced, agile chassis just missing a bit of front end grip for perfect balance. However, gearing was a bit short and I found myself having to go between 2nd and 3rd on the back half of the track. And, I could never quite get the rotation I wanted at the first hairpin. A longer final gear and extra click on rear brakes and I think I would have been in the 1:00`s! Great tune!
At Autumn Ring it was good on the kerbs and very easy to drive. The gearing was a little short but I could be very consistant with laptimes and could drive late 1:21`s all day. This car practicaly drives itselfits that easy! Could be more exiting but a solid tune. Well done!

@oppositelock Mitsubishi Lancer Evolution VI GSR T.M. Edition '00

Silverstone Stowe
Laptime : 1:08.555 SM/SM
DC : 7
Autumn Ring
Laptime : 1:23.560 SH/SH
DC : 7

The heavyweight of the group, and that really helped get the power down in the wet. Longer
gearing would have helped further. A very well behaved car, easy to drive wet or dry but didn`t
like to be pushed hard. The most predictable of the EVO`s and that always makes driving fast
easier! Well done!

@Bowtie-muscle Impreza STI '07

Silverstone Stowe
Laptime : 1:00.790 CS/CS
DC : 9.5
Autumn Ring
Laptime : 1:19.480 SM/SM
DC : 9

"Stuck like glue" i`ve written in my notes about this tune at STOWE! The most front end grip
of any tune in this class. However, with the back end also sticking like glue it ment that it was
really easy to post fast lap after fast lap! 1:01s all day with this tune. To get any quicker it
was quite hard to get the back end free to slide it through the twistys. I expect a smoother
driver than me could pull a 59sec out the bag with this. My fastest lap at Autumn Ring felt
unremarkable after the miracle of Stowe. I just pointed it where i wanted it to go and it stuck.
Awesome!(still feel like your sliding down the ladder?)

@Otaliema Impreza Sedan STi '10

Silverstone Stowe
Laptime : 1:00.552 CS/CS
DC : 10
Autumn Ring
Laptime : 1:19.605 SM/SM
DC : 9

A bit wobbly. But superb brakes and superb balance made this my favourite car at Stowe.
Fast AND fun. Easily the best car through the first hairpin where I had a "driving god" moment.
(followed by a cock up at the end of the straight). I forgot to save the best lap replay at Stowe.
So I went back a few days later and got within .03 sec in ten laps. In the dry it required a
more balanced approach, aggressive yet precise else it would push a bit in the fast corners.
Great work!

+2 Rims
@shaunm80 Impreza Sedan WRX STI (Type-II) '02

Silverstone Stowe
Laptime : 1:06.715 SM/SM
DC : 9
Autumn Ring
Laptime : 1:23.729 SH/SH
DC : 9.5

The most balanced tune here. In the wet you can steer on the throttle in the dry just point it
and floor it. The only tune where I had no "red" laps at all at Autumn Ring, and I drove loads
cos I didn`t want to stop! One of the best tunes i`ve ever driven, and another that has found a
space in my garage. Awesome!

Chassis Reinforcement;
+1 Rims

@Slender_Man Impreza Sedan STi '10

Silverstone Stowe
Laptime : 1:00.975 CS/CS
DC : 8
Autumn Ring
Laptime : 1:20.564 SM/SM
DC : 8

Lots of rear grip, not helped by long gearing, made this not as much fun as it was fast. I had
to completely change my line through the first hairpin at stowe, take it wide and smooth, and it
was tricky through the twistys. Great over the kerbs at Autumn Ring but too planted for me to be
really fast. Again I think a smoother driver will get more from this tune. Well done!

@Ridox2JZGTE Lancer Evolution VI GSR

Silverstone Stowe
Laptime : 1:05.038 CS/CS
DC : 7
Autumn Ring
Laptime : 1:23.067 SM/SM
DC : 8

Very difficult to drive giving it the full beans! That high RPM turbo really makes this tricky
in the wet. But keep it off the boost a little this well balanced chassis was really responsive.
At Autumn Ring its was just 3rd, 4th and 5th gears so easy to concentrate on hitting your marks.
I will test at Autumn Ring on CS for you this weekend. Top Replica!
@xande1959 street racer review updated
 
Thank you sir I didn't think one set if tires would make 5 second difference
It completely changed the balance of the tune. Its now got braking and turn in! Power oversteer instead of nursing it round........you get the idea! :tup:Quite similar to your tune in how it handles. Not quite as chuckable tho.:)
 
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