Flyin' Miata Super Cup | *Congrats to World Champion Aderrrm!*

  • Thread starter CodeRedR51
  • 4,456 comments
  • 162,463 views
Status
Not open for further replies.
I fail to grasp the point of the whole 2-race/groups/rooms qualifying discussion. Isn't the whole purpose of changes - two bring and retain more people? I don't see how making the quali more confusing+less fair+longer+less flexible will bring more people to the series.

A bit more on "less fair": what we have now - is just you vs clock. In 2-room style it's either room composition vs the other room, or in case of ordering by total time==who can stay in draft longer. Draft is already pretty frustrating in this game, no need to make it a part of the qualifying as well as the main race.
 
Last edited:
dmanaenk
I fail to grasp the point of the whole 2-race/groups/rooms qualifying discussion. Isn't the whole purpose of changes - two bring and retain more people? I don't see how making the quali more confusing+less fair+longer+less flexible will bring more people to the series.
Click to expand...
It's about having a way to get more people in the league while dealing with the fact that we can only have 16 people in the room. I don't think we'll find a solution that will satisfy everyone but that doesn't mean we should stop coming up with ideas.

I do think that we shouldn't limit our discussion to room setup. I do think we ended up with a very fun car in Season 2 and shouldn't stray from the formula for next season.
dmanaenk
Draft is already pretty frustrating in this game, not need to make it a part of the qualifying as well as the main race.
Click to expand...
For me, it's actually the most frustrating thing in this game, even above the lag. For some reason, it makes the car feel so different during the race. Mainly, it feels like I have no grip at all and I end up sliding all over the place, always end up going backwards in the field. I'm at a loss on how to cope with it save for making the car very loose before the start of the race. In fact, I made the mistake of tightening up the car right before qualifying and the car was absolute junk. Maybe I just need more practice online or something. :indiff:
 
^^^ What he said.

And about the GT race, I don't think anyone practiced at all before today. I know I didn't. :P I got so frustrated with losing the rear end (I spun at least 4-5 times in practice) I went a-wall on my setup and switched the spring rates, lowered them, adjusted the shocks, re-adjusted the sways and added a bit more camber in the back. Was a bit tight with cold tires, but once the tires started wearing out and the car loosened up, it was pretty neutral.
 
R1600Turbo
^^^ What he said.
Click to expand...
You manage it miles ahead of me, though. I think the other part of the problem is that I use bumper cam and tucking in behind someone makes it very difficult for me to see the upcoming corner. If you haven't noticed already, that's why I lift off a bit behind someone in a corner rather than stay tucked in behind.

I will say that I'm better at side-by-side racing (up to marginal from awful) and I've learned a lot about setups the last two weeks. Also, I've now promised myself that the second I find a job, I'm getting myself a brand new wheel AND a proper racing stand to go along with it.
R1600Turbo
And about the GT race, I don't think anyone practiced at all before today. I know I didn't. :P I got so frustrated with losing the rear end (I spun at least 4-5 times in practice) I went a-wall on my setup and switched the spring rates, lowered them, adjusted the shocks, re-adjusted the sways and added a bit more camber in the back. Was a bit tight with cold tires, but once the tires started wearing out and the car loosened up, it was pretty neutral.
Click to expand...
It's funny because there were some corners (the 2nd to last come to mind) in which I went FASTER at the end of the run than at the beginning. I actually started to reel in Egg near the end but I ran out of time.

There has been two big lessons I've learned today:
1. Always set up the car a tick looser than I'm comfortable with before the race.
2. Drink lots of water and have a fan blowing before an endurance race. Otherwise, you'll get fatigued easily and look like a fool before Lap 10.
 
You know what? I really don't think we even need to worry about attracring more people. The series is starting to become a more recognizable name month to month. All we need to do is add a little promotional effort to really get the perfect group together. I suggest that we keep the series exactly the same, race format wide but cut the max number of drivers to 14, that's been proven to virtually eliminate the frame rate issues and most lag.

That idea , paired with running a feeder series counter-part should be all we need to make 90% of our people happy. Simply.
 
Wardez
You know what? I really don't think we even need to worry about attracring more people. The series is starting to become a more recognizable name month to month. All we need to do is add a little promotional effort to really get the perfect group together. I suggest that we keep the series exactly the same, race format wide but cut the max number of drivers to 14, that's been proven to virtually eliminate the frame rate issues and most lag.

That idea , paired with running a feeder series counter-part should be all we need to make 90% of our people happy. Simply.
Click to expand...

THIS so much THIS
Running with only 14 in the A room and having an official B room would be perfect IMO.
 
Also, if you'll look back, every season we pick up a couple more core group members.

There's a lot of guys I see sticking the series by a whole season. A lot more than the first season. Our core group of people has expanded in the second season. All of these guys I feel will always do their best to finish an entire season: SLC, Outlaw, TNJ, dsgerbc, Redlined, Stig, Mule, Redreevos, Blackice, Schadenfreude, Welsh-bain (I know he'll stick a season through if he has the right schedule). We really grew with this good bunch and them paired with the old core; R1600Turbo, Brosifduder, Egghead, Wardez, Samhain, Coconut (even though he's gonna be working :P) makes an amazing race already! I just named 17 guys, we have a real league going now.

We'll have to make some tough decisions on room size and quality but I think it'll work out. Also if we had the feeder series (which I call the Flyin' Miata Challenge) then some people could elect themselves to that series in order to better themselves against new compeition.
 
Hmmm, anyone up for a spot race on Monday night? Open to anyone, no sign ups required, shorter race distance, etc.

Also, there's our solution to the second room problem. Feeder series = second room. Everything scored separately with no mixing of the two. Championship winner then get's moved up to race with the big boys in Super Cup the next season. 👍

Edit: Hey Wardez, do you remember what font you used for the "Spec Miata Championship Series" in the logo? I'm just going to replace the "Spec" with "MX-5".

Edit 2: Also going to make the executive decision to drop the NB from the series. Sorry Dr_Watson! :P
 
Last edited:
R1600Turbo
Hmmm, anyone up for a spot race on Monday night? Open to anyone, no sign ups required, shorter race distance, etc.
Click to expand...
Might be tough considering it's 4th and July and whatnot. Sunday night might be better.
R1600Turbo
Also, there's our solution to the second room problem. Feeder series = second room. Everything scored separately with no mixing of the two. Championship winner then get's moved up to race with the big boys in Super Cup the next season. 👍
Click to expand...
That might work. I believe the big question if we go this route how we determine eligibility for both series. We may have some newcomers that will be very quick and may push some that are mid-packers like myself in the feeder series.
 
Yeah so now other questions arise:

Who should run FMC? How does the split work? I thought of allowing people to qualify for both series and then go run the race where they qualified best. Then there would be a rule that makes it so that when you opt out of FMSC because of poor starting position twice, you'll be locked into FMC for the rest of the season.

So, for example, say Wardez Jr. decided to join in on FMSC in S3. He sees that he's allowed to qualify for both FMSC and the FM challenge. He does quali. sessions for both, gets placed 15th in FMSC and 5th in FMC. So he decides to run FMC. He gets second place and decides that he likes FMC but he thinks he can do better at the next track in FMSC.

WAIT- lmao, hold it right there man stop reading. I just thought, " huh... but hey we have two sponsors! Why do I insist on still calling the feeder series Flyin' Miata when we could simply dub it The Hard Dog Miata Challenge 'HDMC presented by FMSC'."

So... to pick up where we left off - Wardez Jr. qualifies again for both FMSC and HDMC. He gets 10th in FMSC but 6th in HDMC. He thinks to himself, " Well, I did have a lot of fun in HDMC and I think I could fight for the win at this track... so I think I'll go ahead and pick HDMC again and lock myself in"

The 2 race lock in rule would go from any first race a new person enters. So if we're in race 3 and someone enters in, they have after the one race to decide which series they want to be locked into.

I'm just not sure how we should rule out FMSC racers from doing too much racing in HDMC. Do you think that if you decide to lock yourself into FMSC from the beginning that you shouldn't be allowed to race in HDMC at all? Or could we be like Kyle Busch and run Sprint Cup and Nationwide?

The only complication I see is that we might be getting in the way of someone's championship if we're not taking it as seriously as they are. Maybe we could allow FMSC racers to participate but only in provisional spots at the back of the grid? too chaotic? I just don't want someone to be put off by seeing a really fast veteran going into the HDMC race and killing it.

It's a delicate balance.


R1600Turbo
Edit: Hey Wardez, do you remember what font you used for the "Spec Miata Championship Series" in the logo? I'm just going to replace the "Spec" with "MX-5".
Click to expand...

Yeah man, the bridger font's "Euphemia". I contorted (squished it down) to 68% and stretched it out to 180%.

http://www.ffonts.net/Euphemia-UCAS.font

R1600Turbo
Edit 2: Also going to make the executive decision to drop the NB from the series. Sorry Dr_Watson! :P
Click to expand...

Lol, that's all good. Cool car and all but... yeah not enough takers.

and yeah, maybe Sunday would be better, or sometime during the week I suppose. 👍
 
Last edited:
What about just holding an official qualifying session at the beginning of the season, and we just split them that way? Could be as easy as having an open practice session and a race steward could watch all the times. At the end, just tally them all up and split them accordingly.

Edit: About the race on Monday night, good point. Guess I'll throw that idea in the trash...
 
R1600Turbo
What about just holding an official qualifying session at the beginning of the season, and we just split them that way? Could be as easy as having an open practice session and a race steward could watch all the times. At the end, just tally them all up and split them accordingly.

Edit: About the race on Monday night, good point. Guess I'll throw that idea in the trash...
Click to expand...

Its a good idea in theory, but its also not really "fair." There are a lot of variables in a qualifying round like that. Is it a bad track for someone, are they having a bad day, have they gotten enough practice? Coming from someone who's botched a qualifying session badly, it would suck to have a one and done format like that.

Maybe a gt academy style qualifying with 3 tracks? Upload your best lap replays and run the split off that? Then we have to worry about offline/online and what aids are on etc though :/
Perhaps spread it our over a couple of weeks and still do it like we already do?

Another thing to address is whether thered ONLY be 14 in the main series.
 
R1600Turbo
What about just holding an official qualifying session at the beginning of the season, and we just split them that way? Could be as easy as having an open practice session and a race steward could watch all the times. At the end, just tally them all up and split them accordingly.
Click to expand...

We did that in season 1. Brosif ended up in the B room. :rolleyes:
Just saying...
 
Egghead43
We did that in season 1. Brosif ended up in the B room. :rolleyes:
Just saying...
Click to expand...

Actually, I never submitted a quali lap. I had been running the '91 and wasn't able to get close to the top times and since I hadn't run in an online series before I just figured I wasn't fast enough. Well I decided that racing was racing and I wanted to be part of something so I asked Turbo if I could run in the B room since it wasn't full and he said sure, can you host it too? Needless to say, I made an '89 just before the first race and was instantly on pace with the front runners of the A room.

I am not saying I have an opinion on what format to use for Season 3, rather, I just wanted to make sure our facts were straight.
 
I'm gonna keep it short, since the dog (tablet Opera) ate my reply, twice.
1) 14 spots, in my mind, are not justified by connection quality vs racer count trade-off. Gains in 16->15 are way more obvious than in 15->14, with the latter not being large enough to deny someone (me, with sizable probability) a chance to race.
2) Feeder series with no guaranteed entry into next main race won't last the whole season, imho. And with a guaranteed entry - 14 spots in main race are even less justified.

3) If there's room B with winner gaining entry to room A - it should be ran before room A and winner getting to race again with A.
 
dmanaenk
I'm gonna keep it short, since the dog (tablet Opera) ate my reply, twice.
1) 14 spots, in my mind, are not justified by connection quality vs racer count trade-off. Gains in 16->15 are way more obvious than in 15->14, with the latter not being large enough to deny someone (me, with sizable probability) a chance to race.
2) Feeder series with no guaranteed entry into next main race won't last the whole season, imho. And with a guaranteed entry - 14 spots in main race are even less justified.

3) If there's room B with winner gaining entry to room A - it should be ran before room A and winner getting to race again with A.
Click to expand...

1) The lag has been a huge issue all season and we need to do SOMETHING about it

2) The only reason we've come to think 16 spots are "justified" is because that's the max available on gt5. There's no logical reason to say that 14 is "too few" any more than 16 is.

3) B room winner won't get automatic berth if there's a feeder series. If there is NOT a feeder series, and we go back to the B room winner get's in to the A race it would be for the NEXT race. If you were slow enough to be in the b room during qualifying, then you should be in the b room that week.
 
^^
1) It's online play, unlikely that lag issue would go away, it's all about relative improvement in the frequency of serious lag issues.
2) 16 is a given, 14 is being suggested as a choice made on the grounds of improvement of connection vs keeping the field still pretty populated. It is, hence, a logical decision. I am disputing the benefits vs costs, that's all.
3) Granting the place in room A for the same week ensures the room gets someone who's up to speed on that track instead of previous week's one.
 
No, no, and no. :lol:

I'm about || <---- that close to just doing it the way I see fit and moving on. :P I guess that's the only bad thing about asking opinions of others is you're going to get some negativity and suggestions that are way off base. Remember, I'd like to keep this as simple as possible, largely thought out ideas never work for me as I just don't want to take the time to set it all up.

The feeder series doesn't have to be that hard. If you can't keep pace in the Super Cup series, then you run in the Hard Dog Challenge Series. Drivers that run in the HDCS need not think about the Super Cup series at all. They should be concentrating on running their best and winning the championship so that they can move up to the main room. Think of it as a different class (such as GT) or an entirely different racing series. Think NASCAR for example; Nationwide drivers that do well (HDCS) can then move up to Sprint Cup (FMSC) once they've had plenty of seat time.

See, not complicated at all. No offense, but I can think of a few drivers right now that will probably run in the HDCS, and several that will stay in FMSC. We only need to figure out where to put the new guys. 👍
 
R1600Turbo
No, no, and no. :lol:

I'm about || <---- that close to just doing it the way I see fit and moving on. :P I guess that's the only bad thing about asking opinions of others is you're going to get some negativity and suggestions that are way off base. Remember, I'd like to keep this as simple as possible, largely thought out ideas never work for me as I just don't want to take the time to set it all up.
Click to expand...
Do whatever you feel is best for the series. If things don't go as planned, there is always Season 4. 👍
R1600Turbo
The feeder series doesn't have to be that hard. If you can't keep pace in the Super Cup series, then you run in the Hard Dog Challenge Series. Drivers that run in the HDCS need not think about the Super Cup series at all. They should be concentrating on running their best and winning the championship so that they can move up to the main room. Think of it as a different class (such as GT) or an entirely different racing series. Think NASCAR for example; Nationwide drivers that do well (HDCS) can then move up to Sprint Cup (FMSC) once they've had plenty of seat time.
Click to expand...
I know someone mentioned (this is also mentioned by Nationwide drivers regarding Cup drivers being allowed to participate) that they learn a lot by just being in the same track as very fast drivers, even though they don't quite have the pace to be up front. If we had one or two exhibition races with a mix of the two, I think that will keep them motivated to stay in the series.
R1600Turbo
See, not complicated at all. No offense, but I can think of a few drivers right now that will probably run in the HDCS, and several that will stay in FMSC. We only need to figure out where to put the new guys. 👍
Click to expand...
I'm thinking about a two day session at four different tracks and we'll split off people based on their combined time.
 
outlaw4rc
Do whatever you feel is best for the series. If things don't go as planned, there is always Season 4. :tup:I know someone mentioned (this is also mentioned by Nationwide drivers regarding Cup drivers being allowed to participate) that they learn a lot by just being in the same track as very fast drivers, even though they don't quite have the pace to be up front. If we had one or two exhibition races with a mix of the two, I think that will keep them motivated to stay in the series.
Click to expand...

Only problem with that is it would depend on how many people we have in either room. With almost full rooms, there really wouldn't be a way to mix them.


outlaw4rc
I'm thinking about a two day session at four different tracks and we'll split off people based on their combined time.
Click to expand...

We could probably get a good idea of where people sit by running a couple practice races and basing it off of their fastest lap during the race, and not where they finish.
 
mmm. Deep Forest Reverse? Regular would be better wouldn't it? I haven't run it in the Miata yet or anything but it's easy to imagine the Miatas struggling since it's basically like climbing a mountain when it's reverse. I'd rather do Nur GP/D or Tsukuba. But I understand you might've reserved those for HDCS.

Oh and btw, I think maybe HDCS should get its own interest thread when we get everything situated for it 👍
 
I tested every track today so that I could figure out the race distances and it wasn't bad. It's pretty much an all 4th gear run down the front stretch, up the hill, and down the back stretch.

Edit: Season 3 rules have been posted as well.
 
Last edited:
BrosifDuder
Actually, I never submitted a quali lap. I had been running the '91 and wasn't able to get close to the top times and since I hadn't run in an online series before I just figured I wasn't fast enough. Well I decided that racing was racing and I wanted to be part of something so I asked Turbo if I could run in the B room since it wasn't full and he said sure, can you host it too? Needless to say, I made an '89 just before the first race and was instantly on pace with the front runners of the A room.

I am not saying I have an opinion on what format to use for Season 3, rather, I just wanted to make sure our facts were straight.
Click to expand...

Cool, I obviously didn't have the whole story; I just knew you were in the B room, and certainly had more than enough speed to run in A. I wasn't saying you were slow back then or anything :lol:

R1600Turbo
Sorry for the double post, but this is important! :P

Season 3 tentative schedule is up.

http://fmsc.webs.com/raceschedule.htm
Click to expand...

Looks good 👍 when do signups start?
 
Looks like you got rid of the forums on the site?

Also. Didn't get much feedback on the solution with putting people into either FMSC or HDCS. Wouldn't letting people qualify for either series two times before they're locked in work? It encourages people that think they've got what it takes to go for the big time but then choose to go to HDCS in order to have a tighter race opportunity if they qualified better there. It'd be especially good since we're running different tracks.
 
Are the specs for the two series going to be the same?

Personally, I think you should make the FM car a bit faster. Maybe give it ECU Chip/Air Filter/Cat/Sports exhaust, amd give the HD car just the ECU chip and stock exhaust.

Maybe also different tires.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Latest Posts

Back