FORMULA 1™ Magyar Nagydíj 2007

[Brett]

Well, I will not be watching the race until Wednesday. It seems I cannot tell AM from PM, so I set it to tape at the wrong time . . . I knew there was a reason I did not like 12 hour clocks . . .

 

[m7ammed]

Well done BMW for scoring 10 points in total , Nick Heidfeild I think is in the top 3 drivers of this year ... Himltion being first and him 2nd and I think Nico Rosberg is in 3rd ... these 3 drivers have really proved them self this year .... Nick is my Fav driver now

 

[Bram Turismo]

While I agree with Heidfeld being a very consistent driver, I also disagree that he's in the top 3 for the best drivers...In my opinion, the top 3 are Lewis, Fernando and Kimi, in no particular order. Simply because all of these three drivers had to adapt to a new car, while Heidfeld knew the whole crew and the BMW is regardlessly, a very fast car 👍

 

[Metar]

Heidfeld is, though, a top rain-driver, together with Alonso.

 

[Sureboss]

it has been confirmed, fisichella will now start 13th after the stewards felt he held up yamamoto. just heard on itv's broadcast.

Amazing. I'd struggle to hold him up on a unicycle after drinking my own weight in Absyinthe.

Great drive from Lewis, his best win yet. Good result for Heidfeld and BMW. Decent for Ralf too.

 

[Lee]

I found the race pretty boring to be honest, Kimi was never gonna catch up to Hamilton simply because of the dirty air, you have to have such a significant advantage to create a chance of overtaking.

Heidfeld's stock has raised again in my books, over the past two seasons this guy has to be the most improved driver on the grid. He kept his cool when Alonso caught up to him in the dying moments and totally deserved the podium, his second in a row at the track might I add..

Elsewhere Ralf done a good job, especially in the first stint with Alonso on his tail, but you have the dirty air to partly thank. Rosberg suffered a missed opertunity I felt, starting 4th I was hoping he'd crack into the Top 5 come the chequered flag.

Davidson was having a good race untill he got punted off, whilst Vettel done well to finish his first race for STR.

Now the 3 week break, Laura is dancing, I sure as hell am not.

 

[MustangSVT]

The way I see it, when MSC crashed on purpose, he was in his psort-dominating phase. Penalising him would offer other contenders the chance to even up the championship, bring in more viewers, sponsors and otherwise.
If they punished ALO in a similar manner, the straight fight between ALO and HAM would take a serious knockback, and that's what's pulling a lot of crowds this season.

If you are refering to Monaco 2006, then incorrect. Alonso was in the points lead and MSC wanted to catch up.

 

[prisonermonkeys]

Damn. Second retirement of the race and dead last finisher. I think it's about time I cut my losses and start waiting for 2008. There's no way Honda can make a worse car for next year ... right?

 

[Brett]

You would hope they could make a better car than their hunk of junk this year . . . I mean it cannot get much worse can it?

 

[slackbladder]

You know, all that stuff with Ron Dennis throwing his headphones down and looking really pissed off? That was in reaction to Hamilton, not Alonso. I do think Hamilton has displayed a side of his personality that will not garner many fans. He's young and impetuous and obviously got carried away.
If you don't know what I mean read this - www.autosport.com It's from the interview he gave to ITV yesterday.

"I am in a lot of trouble with my boss," Hamilton told ITV. "I probably am, but that's the way it goes."
Hamilton and team boss Ron Dennis reportedly exchanged heavy words on the pit-to-car radio at the end of qualifying yesterday.
Hamilton reportedly made extremely rude comments to the team and to Dennis personally, leading Dennis to throw his headphones on the pit wall in disgust (a gesture that was misinterpreted by many to be in reaction to Alonso's pole).

So I guess it's understandable Alonso isn't too happy also. I just hope this is the last time Hamilton acts childishly.

 

[Metar]

Damn. Second retirement of the race and dead last finisher. I think it's about time I cut my losses and start waiting for 2008. There's no way Honda can make a worse car for next year ... right?

I think Spyker can safely assume that Honda has received an 800 page containing all information regarding the latest parts on the V8-VII.

 

[picklesam]

yeah i found this race boring too...when the off track dramas are more exciting you know something's wrong with F1...although this season's been a cracker...hope they bring slick tires back...no one's overtaking cos they lose so much aero grip!

 

[Metar]

Well, actually... We've seen quite a few daring overtakes this season - but you can't expect anything at the Hungaroring, after all. Mistakes, or a big advantage down the straight, are the only way to pass.

 

[Sureboss]

There's no slow corners, They seemingly don't slow down at all (barring that one chicane which is still fairly quick).

Hungary need to do two things.

1) Clean up the track
2) Change the track, a hairpin (slow one unlike the current ones), some chicanes and maybe a long straight).

 

[m7ammed]

what needs changing is F1 car desgins , they loose so much downforce when following eachother they need a big advantage to overtake or get close enough

 

[jammyozzy]

what needs changing is F1 car desgins , they loose so much downforce when following eachother they need a big advantage to overtake or get close enough

Bingo. The cars now rely so much on downforce rather than mechanical grip that it's almost impossible for them to follow each other through corners. The FIA came up with that bizzare looking split rear wing a few years age to try and counter the problem, but it's been shelved and may not have acheived anything anyway.

I think Honda summed up the problem best when, after admitting that thier car handled badly, they went on to say that rather than trying to sort out the fundamental handling issues that the car has they were going to put more emphasis on aero.

 

[Metar]

Even when I didn't follow F1, I saw the occasional "Slicks to return?", "Ground-effects to make a comeback?" and the likes - but if nobody in the FIA actually pushes the idea and gets it through, it'll continue. You can raise wings and ban parts all you want - you'll achieve nothing if you don't insist on a radical change, since there's a work-around for everything.

 

[Brett]

You know, all that stuff with Ron Dennis throwing his headphones down and looking really pissed off? That was in reaction to Hamilton, not Alonso. I do think Hamilton has displayed a side of his personality that will not garner many fans. He's young and impetuous and obviously got carried away.
If you don't know what I mean read this - www.autosport.com It's from the interview he gave to ITV yesterday.

So I guess it's understandable Alonso isn't too happy also. I just hope this is the last time Hamilton acts childishly.

Absolutely nothing against you as you are only reporting what you find on the 'internets', but I am getting somewhat tired of these reports from various sources telling what happened in qualifying and what transpired over the radio. Well if all these radio transmissions happened and are recorded, why can we as fans not get access to it and hear it for ourselves and thus form our own conclusions on the conversations?

 

[darkfinal]

This makes me laugh: http://www.sundaymirror.co.uk/sport/2007/08/05/lewis-f-word-storm-98487-19574046/

 

[Sureboss]

what needs changing is F1 car desgins , they loose so much downforce when following eachother they need a big advantage to overtake or get close enough

That could work...

 

[<_Spike_>]

So I guess it's understandable Alonso isn't too happy also. I just hope this is the last time Hamilton acts childishly.

Hopefully, but I think we're forgetting that for as much as Lewis has shown a level head, he is still young and will still got hot under the collar if things go a bit ascew for one fault or another

 

[Touring Mars]

I noticed that Ron Dennis was barely hiding his anger at Lewis Hamilton before the race yesterday... he only just avoided referring to Lewis directly when he commented that (I paraphrase) "This is what happens when people don't stick to the game plan..."

I only just read in todays' Guardian newspaper what Hamilton had said to Dennis during qualifying, and frankly, gutsy driver or not, in my opinion Hamilton was bang out of order... (as linked to above in The Mirror)...

Now, as if speaking to your boss like that was not bad enough, Hamilton also expressly ignored instructions/orders from his team, and this was an obvious precursor to why Alonso retaliated in-kind by blocking Hamilton later in the pits... and the rest is history. Hamilton is certainly not blameless, and despite the fact that he went on the drive a superb race and take the points, his behaviour and that of Alonso contributed to the team being punished and to Alonso being penalised.

The result has to stand now, I guess - but I think Hamilton should be penalised by the team, perhaps in the form of a heavy fine. Fair enough, he has to stake his claim as an equal driver in the team, but he can't go on thinking that he calls the shots over and above Dennis - that will only end in tears, not to mention Hamilton growing into a really unpleasant person.

 

[livemusic]

Yeah, that's a bad side of Hamilton we didn't know of yet. Until now he always seemed very kind and friendly, maybe his early success in F1 is getting up to his head too fast. But the whole McLaren team is in sort of a bad position right now, with all that is happening.

 

[Danoff]

Regarding the Qualifying Debacle

I'm not exactly the biggest Hamilton fan, though I'll openly admit that I prefer him to Alonso. From what I can tell, Alonso tried to steal the qualifying session and got burned by the power-drunken "stewards".

- It has been reported that Hamilton broke team orders early on in Q3. To that I reply, oh well. He ended up behind alonso anyway and it sounds to me like they were semi-bogus team orders anyway. Plus, it wasn't nearly as important as what went on at the end of the session.

- It has been claimed that Alonso's second held-up stop was similar to his first. To this I reply, were you even watching the race? Alonso COULD NOT leave and was being spaced by the team for traffic in the first hold up. Alonso was BEING TOLD to leave by the lollypop man and instead stayed until traffic became more of an issue in the second stop. Plus, he wasn't holding up his teammate in the first case. All kinds of really critical differences there.

- It has been claimed that Hamilton was being a jackass on the radio during his final lap. To that I reply, GOOD! He should have been. He was certainly reserved for having been balked during qualifying when talking to the press. I'm glad he at least let his team know that he wasn't going to sit by while big-head-whiny-pants alonso tried to screw with him. +rep to Hamilton (what's his GTP screen name again?).

- It has been claimed that the FIA have done justice by preventing McMerc from scoring points and moving Alonso down the grid. To that I reply - really?? I'm not so sure. I don't like the idea of the FIA getting involved in internal team disputes. I'm fine with penalties for one team holding up another. But this is within the team. The team should be able to play it however they want.

Summary of the qualifying debacle:
- Alonso is still a whiny sore loser.
- Hamilton is still showing maturity and good judgment.
- The FIA is still drunk with power.

Wait, nothing is new at all!

As for the race.

Nice job Kimi and Hamilton. To Hamilton for driving beyond his years with smooth, flawless, consistent technique and holding off the faster car. To Kimi for not trying to over-do it and being willing to accept facts.

The two cars appeared basically evenly matched. Hamilton was fast early on. Kimi caught up at the end. The problem for Kimi and Ferrari was that even though they could have completed the requisite number of laps in the fastest amount of time (ie: had the faster car overall), it came too late for passing in the pits. Also a nice job to Kimi for completely ignoring and generally disrespecting BMW's grid position at the beginning of the race.

Good race.

 

[Digital-Nitrate]

I think Spyker can safely assume that Honda has received an 800 page containing all information regarding the latest parts on the V8-VII.

You know, all that stuff with Ron Dennis throwing his headphones down and looking really pissed off? That was in reaction to Hamilton, not Alonso.

I'm not buying it. After all, he went straight to Alonso's physical therapist.. the same one who witnesses say saw signaling Alonso just before he finally left the pits.

Yes, clearly Hamilton took an unauthorized extra lap to burn off extra fuel, which was apparently against what Ron Denis had ordered him to do, but as has already been discussed, seen on video, and no radio chatter that showed Alonso was ordered to stay in the pits after the lollipop was raised, and Alonso's poor excuse about "checking to see if the right tires were on", clearly Ron Denis was showing is anger the situation with Alonso and his physical therapist.

That said, I'm sure he was also upset with Hamilton for taking an extra lap to burn off fuel, but that appears to be something entirely different to what actually happened in Alonso's second pit stop, and Ron Denis' reaction that was caught on camera immediately afterwards.

I do think Hamilton has displayed a side of his personality that will not garner many fans. He's young and impetuous and obviously got carried away.

I agree. If your boss tells you to do something, you better do it!

Now, as if speaking to your boss like that was not bad enough, Hamilton also expressly ignored instructions/orders from his team, and this was an obvious precursor to why Alonso retaliated in-kind by blocking Hamilton later in the pits... and the rest is history. Hamilton is certainly not blameless, and despite the fact that he went on the drive a superb race and take the points, his behaviour and that of Alonso contributed to the team being punished and to Alonso being penalised.

Possibly Alonso was using that as a way of exacting his own punishment for Hamilton, but if the signal from his personal physical therapist that immediately preceded his finally leaving the pits was not just a coincidence (although the evidence and explanations do not support that it was just a coincidence), then it means Alonso planned this before the start of Q3, thus it would not have had anything to do with Hamilton taking an extra burn-off lap.

I&#8217;ll try and dig up the quote, but in one of the post race interviews I believe Alonso was asked why his therapist was signaling him at the end of his second pit stop, and if he was having some kind of physical pain in the car, and he simply said, no, I&#8217;m feeling great&#8230; so who knows.

It all seems extremely suspicious, and with all the mystery around how McLaren may have benefited from stolen information from Ferrari, and now with both their drivers apparently ignoring the instructions from their bosses, and Alonso even claiming the team is giving Hamilton an unfair advantage, all that is certain is that as a whole, McLaren is an absolutely mess despite their firm grasp on both the driver&#8217;s championship and constructor&#8217;s championship. Never have a seen a winning team look so miserable.

At this point, I hope BMW whoops both Ferrari and McLaren next year, as I have lost a lot of respect for both of those teams.

 

[peterjford]

That could work...

I pity da fool that don't let me pass!

 

[m7ammed]

Taken from ITV-F1.com
http://www.itv-f1.com/Feature.aspx?Type=General&PO_ID=40289

this is his take on the deal

The world championship rivalry between Lewis Hamilton and Fernando Alonso boiled over in qualifying for the Hungarian Grand Prix.

With Lewis ignoring team orders and the world champion holding him up in the pits, McLaren failed to contain the tension within.

Alonso was subsequently penalised and Hamilton inherited pole.

Prior to that Steve Rider interviewed Lewis for ITV, as you saw in Sunday's show, but we've got the sensational unedited transcript here.

So read on...

Steve Rider: An extraordinary climax to qualifying today, a lot of confusion and a fair bit of anger it seems. You've just come out of a fairly prolonged stewards' meeting, how did you understand it?

Lewis Hamilton: To be honest I don't. It was a very long meeting there. I think they are discussing, or taking, all the detailed information they have into account. We just told our stories and left.
But I wasn't really disappointed today. I was obviously quick and I was really happy that I had improved to the point where I was quicker than Fernando. I had the opportunity to do an extra lap, obviously I had this discussion in the team, but in the end I just got held up in the pits and I don't know the reason for it.
But this is racing, I look at it. I'm very, very fortunate to be here and I'm back in front.
I'm actually really, really looking forward to having a battle with Fernando all the way down to the first corner. We have not really had that apart from Indy.

SR: When you were in the pits and parked up behind Fernando, and you were delayed, what was your immediate reaction?

LH: I think it is always about being in control. At the time I came in, I was told I would be coming in behind Fernando so I should just slow down a bit. So I cruised, then I stopped and put it into neutral, the lollipop went up so I was about to go. Then I sort of waited for a little bit longer.
You just have to stay composed you know. If you let it get to you then you're stuffed. If I had got what would have been most important is that I stayed focussed and I'm in the zone. So the whole time nothing is really bothering me.
I was just wondering why I was waiting so long and thinking, 'oh there is my opportunity for pole just gone out of the window'. But as I said that's the way it gos.

SR: Were you thinking something rather more spurious was going on here or maybe even in stronger terms than that?

LH: I don't think I should ever comment on that.
I didn't know what was going on, I thought I had lost like half a minute or something so I thought all my time had gone. I thought, 'okay if I push around I'll still make it to do a lap'. And I got round and the red light was on and that was it. My opportunity was gone.
But still I got second. It shows the pace that we had that he [Alonso] did it with a lighter car at the end and I did it with a hevay car earlier on.

SR: You were meant to be behind Fernando in the fuel-burn phase of the session, that didn't happen, exactly why?

LH: I always like to be out first. The crew on my side did a better job of getting my car out first, mainly because I finished my Q2 lap earlier than Fernando. So I was able to get out of the pitlane first. And at the end of the pitlane they said let Fernando past.
This is something that the team had agreed, but they didn't give me an explanation exactly why.
I've done it in the past, I let him past in Monaco and Barcelona and I just thought I'll do it.
But at the point when we were at the end of the pitlane there was me, Fernando and Kimi. So I was thinking I can't let him past at the first corner because then I will lose my position to Kimi.
So I realised I had to make a split decision and I decided to go for it. If I'm quick enough, he'll keep up with me and we'll both gain an extra lap.
He backed off. I was told and told again to let Fernando past, but he was off in the distance and I just got on with my job.
I am in a lot of trouble with my boss.

SR: You really think you are?

LH: I probably am, but that's the way it goes.

SR: What happened in the exchanges between yourself and Ron and yourself and Fernando over the last couple of hours?

LH: Not too much. I have not really spoken to Fernando and he has not really spoken to me.
I have just tried to brush it off and just forget about it you know. I am still second. I know what I can do in the early stages of the race so I am still very optimistic about tomorrow.
I went to my normal engineers' meeting, and you can imagine the feelings, you feel like you have done something to the team. But he's still pole, and he has got nothing to complain about, and really neither have I.

SR: This is really the first time something like this has happened to you within the team context. Is it a tough situation to handle?

LH: It does feel a little bit weird. Ron was obviously extremely angry with me at the time, I don't know if he still is.
When you don't obey a team order from your team boss, who has given you the opportunity. It's a difficult situation, but in the end you have to stand up for what you believe and how you feel. At the time I took that decision and that's just the way it went.

SR: So you feel within the team context it might be wrong, but from an individual point of view you are standing by your rights.

LH: Absolutely. The team explained it all and I apologised for the decision I took when I was out there. But I was out on my own, I apologised to Ron and said it wouldn't happen again.

SR: The respect for Fernando, is it still there has that diminished somewhat today?

LH: I wouldn't say it's diminished. I still respect him because coming into F1 I have always been looking up to the world champions and people that have done it and are doing what I want to do.
I'm sitting next to a two-times world champion so I admire him for what he has done.
I don't particularly think he has a great excuse for what happened today, and that tends to lead to certain things. But I just have to let it go over my head, I've got a race to do tomorrow.
I hope everyone enjoys it. I'm sure they will. I'm going to for sure. I just need to get a start like I did in the Nurburgring. It should be okay, but I am on the dirty side of the grid now, which is a slight disadvantage but I will make it work for us.

SR: It's going to be a fair old battle down to that first corner, it's going to be nothing like Monaco for example.

LH: No. It's a much longer haul down into Turn One. You can imagine both me and Fernando will going at it 100% to gain track position. Obviously bearing in mind that we don't want to take each other out.
Or at least I don't want to, I want to do the race tomorrow. I don't want to crash out at the first corner knowing that you had all that preparation, and the team has done all that preparation. Hours and hours of work have gone in and then you're out at the first corner.
So that's definitely something I want to avoid but I will be nice to overtake him.

SR: We have seen there is a competitive edge between the two of you, is this something that has building for a while, or had it just reached a climax this weekend?

LH: First of all, no-one, not even myself, expected me to be this competitive. No-one expected me to be leading the world championship for as long as I have, let alone leading it! And no-one expected me to have the world champion chasing me and trying to catch up.
As you can see this weekend and today, I was quicker. It's a great feeling for me, because I know I was in a good position for pole, so that's why it is a lot easier to let it run.
When things get tough and lots of different things come into it I think about a film I really like called Cool Runnings. There is a song in it called Rise Above It, and that's what I say to myself. Get on with what you are doing.

SR: You said that you probably learnt more at the Nurburgring than at any other, what have you learnt from this?

LH: I don't know. I'll go away tonight and sit down in my room and I'll analyse how the day went. I'll decide what I have learnt from today.
You learn what can happen in motorsport. Who you can trust, who you can't, whether you can believe people and whether you don't.
And there is so much politics going around, it is really easy for that to have affect on how you do your job. And that's the important thing for me, to focus on my job, which is getting in the car and enjoy what I am doing. Keep a smile on my face and keep pushing.
I always say never give up. That's my motto.

SR: You made a television commercial with Fernando recently titled 'Anything you can do I can do better'. That has a certain irony now doesn't it?

LH: It does. It was a quite a cool advert.
To be honest me and Fernando have got on really well this year. We have been playing Playstation together here. I wouldn't say that we have in-depth conversations, I try to keep them going, but that is not easy.
But we went away on this filming and we really had some fun. We were laughing and joking all the time and it turned out really good. It's pretty cool – anything you can do I can do better!. That's a bit like how it is in the team.

SR: What is clear is that we are entering an extraordinary climax to the season. It's going to be fantastic isn't it?

LH: It certainly is. You can imagine the pressure that's building around the team, around the paddock, when you are in the car. This is something where the strongest of drivers will come out on top I guess.
So fingers crossed I am one of those.

 

[daan]

So, who now thinks that the Mercedes-Alonso&Hamilton-are-really-good-friends advert was a good idea?

 

[mipuumal]

So, who now thinks that the Mercedes-Alonso&Hamilton-are-really-good-friends advert was a good idea?

Knowing the reality, Alonso & Hamilton should be nominated for an oscar.

 

[MustangSVT]

They need to introduce ground effects and rely less on the aero downforce or something like that. This is what ChampCar and GP2 is doing. With ground effects, you can stay close to the car in front without losing grip.