Forza Motorsport General Discussion Thread

  • Thread starter Terronium-12
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Totally agree with this,more negativity means more clicks,just more drama.I dont watch anything from the first 2 and I have no idea who dustinden is. :lol: The game is far from perfect but some people are just consumed by rage and struggle to see any positives with anything,each to there own at the end of the day.I like the game,despite the faults,same as GT7,and thats what matters to me.👍
If you look at dustinEden past he has not only put hate on forza motorsport but also things like gt7 and crew motorfest as well, i can see what he getting at but it can a times be a bit extreme, i do agree on career modes through, current racing games has not quite done that as well as racing games use to have in 2000-2010, but at the same time you have to give credit to the things that been done well to, i dont think its fair to put that extreme of hate just becouse it has a couble of flaws,
 
I and some people had told before, but i will tell you again, its a first-party console game, it has XBOX sticked on it in the first moment you turn the game, they will put the focus in console first and always will, if you dont want to deal with it, go play anything else but this, it was told even before the launch, it was a risk bound to happen even if the console launch was smoother than it was (and it was far more smoother than PC).

I do agree and think that they should had delayed the PC version too, but it is also bound to happen if was with Gran Turismo or even Mario freaking Kart, that is the downside of getting a first party game outside of the first party plataform it was focused for, this isnt iRacing, AC, NFS or rFactor 2 that are (third party or) PC focused games and have (all plataforms or) PC as priority.

I think that is absord and extremaly low intelligence how, some PC players, assume/think that some first party studios will sacrify the console experience in favor of PC, there is a reason that it also happened with various other 1st party ports of non Xbox games like TLOU as well...

Bingo, +1000 points for you
Complete and utter bull-****.

If you are releasing a full price game on a system, it better damn work correctly. No excuses, ESPECIALLY from consumers. It has always baffled my mind how consumers will be apologetic to corps who release us bad products. I'm not even talking about the actual game content lacking, i'm talking purely performance and basic function here. You know, the game actually working as it should?

Forza Horizon 5 released on Xbox AND PC and was brilliant on both. FH5 runs beautifully, it is properly multithreaded so uses all of the CPU cores and threads as it should. Forza Motorsport is barely multithreaded, like it's designed for an old I5 CPU from 2014. The game stutters when you turn on DLSS, the game performs worse when you enable DLSS than native. This is the only game I have ever played that does this, it should be doing the opposite.

You talk of low intelligence, but the irony is palpable here. Why does one have to be sacrificed for the other? If playground games can release a great and smooth release on both platforms why can't T10? You know why? Microsoft made them release it before it was ready, half baked. This is evident in its content too. They deserve all the criticism for this, and it's funny how you are fully on board with critiquing the lack of game features but seem to defend the fact the game isnt even functioning correctly on one of the platforms it released on, because it doesn't affect you. Pure bias and not pro consumer in the slightest.
 
You talk of low intelligence, but the irony is palpable here. Why does one have to be sacrificed for the other? If playground games can release a great and smooth release on both platforms why can't T10? You know why? Microsoft made them release it before it was ready, half baked. This is evident in its content too. They deserve all the criticism for this, and it's funny how you are fully on board with critiquing the lack of game features but seem to defend the fact the game isnt even functioning correctly on one of the platforms it released on, because it doesn't affect you. Pure bias and not pro consumer in the slightest.
That's not what he said at all. Delay the PC version instead of making Xbox players wait until both games are ready.
 
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That's not what he said at all. Delay the PC version instead of making Xbox players wait until both games are ready.
The game wasn't ready on either platform, that's why the word of mouth for this game is so poor.

He said that we should have expected the PC version to be wank because it's an Xbox first party game, so is FH5. So is Gears of war 4/5 and they all managed to run beautifully on PC. Why is it T10 get the free pass of "oh you should expect it"? Reeks of fanboyism
 
The game wasn't ready on either platform
Depends

Peformance wise is ok besides some texture bugs and glitches that happens with every Forza at launch and already fixed with the first patches, otherwise i had no issues besides the lack of content and the replay thing
I played on both Xbox Series S and Series X
Forza Horizon 5 released on Xbox AND PC and was brilliant on both. FH5 runs beautifully, it is properly multithreaded so uses all of the CPU cores and threads as it should.
lol you started playing FH5 last week?

The launch in 2021 FOR BOTH PLATAFORMS was messy a lot, in some ways worst than FM, since even the multiplayer wasnt working, the first patches also were a mess and often broken the game as much as day 1











and for last but not less important, a entire thread in Forza Forums trashing FH5 at launch
it looks that like war, it never changes...

 
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Depends

Peformance wise is ok besides some texture bugs and glitches that happens with every Forza at launch and already fixed with the first patches, otherwise i had no issues besides the lack of content and the replay thing
I played on both Xbox Series S and Series X

lol you started playing FH5 last week?

The launch in 2021 FOR BOTH PLATAFORMS was messy a lot, in some ways worst than FM, since even the multiplayer wasnt working, the first patches also were a mess and often broken the game as much as day 1











and for last but not less important, a entire thread in Forza Forums trashing FH5 at launch
it looks that like war, it never changes...


I was talking about the game itself not being ready on either platform, not performance. it's half baked and lacking content, we all know this. Performance wise is fine on consoles from what I've seen.

FH5 had it's issues of course, basically all modern games have. But its performance was great on both platforms. on PC It didn't stutter at all as the game fully utilized all of my CPU threads. There were glitches sure but at least it ran well. PG learned their lesson way back during FH4, where they added multithreading to the game, because before that it was similar to FM. How T10 has not properly implemented multithreading to a 2023 game when their sister team have been utilizing it since 2018 I will not know. They utilize it on console but not PC. It's just not good enough for a $70 game. Hopefully it will get patched in but until then they will get **** for it.
 
I was talking about the game itself not being ready on either platform, not performance. it's half baked and lacking content, we all know this. Performance wise is fine on consoles from what I've seen.
If it was performing OK on console they could either add the missing stuff in via patches or delay indefinitely until all the content was out. I know which one I'd prefer and that's not fanboyism. Aggressively attacking other players because of MS's botched release is just toxic. Take it out on the publisher and devs, not us.
 
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If it was performing OK on console they could either add the missing stuff in via patches or delay indefinitely until all the content was out. I know which one I'd prefer and that's not fanboyism. Aggressively attacking other players because of MS's botched release is just toxic. Take it out on the publisher and devs, not us.
Aggressively attacking? You have got to be kidding me
 
The next major patch is days away. I find the timing of this topic interesting....


P.S. While FM23 at launch seems a bit low on launch content, I think there's some exaggeration going on here.
  • I've had a completely bug free experience on Xbox Series X and only had 1 real issue on PC (needing to restart the game on PC after downloading car designs due to low frame rates). Note: I don't play multiplayer races, like a large number of users.
  • I've put nearly 70 hours into FM23 and still haven't completed the Builders Cup yet. And since I have chosen to keep up with the Featured/Open series before they expire each month, I probably won't complete the launch Builders Cup series for a while yet.
  • The driving physics in FM23 are without doubt the best console controller experience I've ever had in a track driving game. This is what really matters and will continue to drive long term engagement.
 
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The next major patch is days away. I find the timing of this topic interesting....


P.S. While FM23 at launch seems a bit low on launch content, I think there's some exaggeration going on here.
  • I've had a completely bug free experience on Xbox Series X and only had 1 real issue on PC (needing to restart the game on PC after downloading car designs due to low frame rates). Note: I don't play multiplayer races, like a large number of users.
I am not exagerrated the issues i've had in terms of stuttering and performance bork. The game runs worse in DLSS mode than native, it also loses the option to use DLSS after a while anyway and the game thinks I have an AMD card and offers only FSR. The game stutters **** loads when any RT is enabled, despite my processor being more powerful than an Xbox Series X CPU. I'm hopeful T10 will fix these issues in the future but for now I'm still going to complain about these issues being in a $70 game. Demand better guys otherwise these companies will continue ******** out unfinished products and expect us to lap them up
 
The game runs worse in DLSS mode than native, it also loses the option to use DLSS after a while anyway and the game thinks I have an AMD card and offers only FSR. The game stutters **** loads when any RT is enabled, despite my processor being more powerful than an Xbox Series X CPU
Dlss gives you worse performance because of how it scales above 6 cores. And the fact that it uses Direct storage means that your ssd can also impact frame pacing and to a small extent avg fps.



You can see the frametime spikes as chunks of the track are being loaded in, as well as the cpu usage and ssd read too.

As for rt, I'm really not sure. Last month's updat kind smoothed it out. It is slightly heavier than fh5 at ultra. At 1080p60, but heavier on vram.

It has also stopped giving me fsr as an option. I wonder if disabling full screen optimization and also letting it run full power when minimized helped. I also use nvidia filters (to remove the godawful red color tint) which adds a bit more load to the cpu and gpu (about 10%).

I hope they continue improving th games performance and optimization.
 
Dlss gives you worse performance because of how it scales above 6 cores. And the fact that it uses Direct storage means that your ssd can also impact frame pacing and to a small extent avg fps.



You can see the frametime spikes as chunks of the track are being loaded in, as well as the cpu usage and ssd read too.

As for rt, I'm really not sure. Last month's updat kind smoothed it out. It is slightly heavier than fh5 at ultra. At 1080p60, but heavier on vram.

It has also stopped giving me fsr as an option. I wonder if disabling full screen optimization and also letting it run full power when minimized helped. I also use nvidia filters (to remove the godawful red color tint) which adds a bit more load to the cpu and gpu (about 10%).

I hope they continue improving th games performance and optimization.

Regarding the DLSS thing, why is this not a problem with any other game? I have never played another game which has this issue, DLSS is always better performing than native, that's the point right?

Yea the RT looks better now but it still stutters for me, I have 8 cores and 16 threads, FM does not utilize them properly sadly. I wish you could toggle on RTAO without reflections too. Also why does having RT AO off look like the game uses no AO at all? If its there its extremely mild. Forza Horizon 5's screen space AO looks awesome
 
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The next major patch is days away.

When it comes to the update, here's some things I am hoping are fixed (Series X):

  • Homespace dropping to under 10fps after you complete a few races, occasionally causing a crash

  • Saved Vinyl Groups screen taking 45+ second to load every time you enter it, if you have a large number of groups saved

  • Saved Vinyl Groups not being sorted by date or name, and changing order every time you enter the menu

  • Livery editor running at 30fps

  • Recent designs created in Forza Horizon 5 not becoming importable into Forza Motorsport, even after a save sync

  • Game crashing after using Quick Resume

  • Find Tunes not loading any tune maker's details, including the name of who made the tune

  • Private Multiplayer lobbies reverting peoples' cars to stock builds whenever a class restriction is enabled


And some things I hope are added/implemented:

  • Some form of Car XP multiplier under specific scenarios

  • Car XP duplicated across multiple instances of the same car

  • Maxda MX-5 Cup as a permanent Featured Multiplayer series

  • Tyre and fuel rate multiplier option in Private Multiplayer and Free Play

  • Spec Series build restrictions selectable as an option in Private Multiplayer and Free Play

  • Ability for players to join a friend's Featured Multiplayer group while a race is active, and be pulled in for matchmaking into the next race
 
Regarding the DLSS thing, why is this not a problem with any other game? I have never played another game which has this issue, DLSS is always better performing than native, that's the point right?
it was occurring on some of the sony Pc releases at launch and i think the newer UE4 games. Ofc this is something that can and should be patched away.

RTAO should be a separate option 100%. CPU utilisation is still not great. Need work.
 
I'd really enjoy the ability to look behind you when you're on track in pause menu, so you can make 100% sure you wreck the next dri... I mean 100% sure you don't unghost and wreck the following driver's lap/race.
 
To be honest im probably in the minority here but I dont play online much. I split my time 50/50 between fun freeplay races and chunks of the featured/builders cup races so what I wish they work on will differ from what most want on here. I know T10 has priorities on what they need to fix/implement/create for this game, its a long road but heres what I hope they take care of within the next 6 months which I believe are realistic things.

- add a few dozen more different race categories/races to the builders cup. ( rivalries which could include some fun ones, historic and modern ones, spec races, beginners endurance figure at most 50 laps depending on the track, pro endurance which could be filled with a few 100 lap ones, economy cars, electric etc..) this is where creativity can come into play big time and get people playing single player more often

- add a few further tweaks to freeplay. Its good for the most part but what would really make it great is being able to customize the grid and hand pick each car we want to race against. Done

- for the love of god a sound update would really be nice. Turbocharged cars which most sound dull repetitive and computerized, most v8 powered cars, and the race cars all need tweaks. Whether its correct or accurate sound files, louder idles/exhaust, different turbo noises, and the right rev limits. Some cars when going flat out rev way too high to damn near 9k rpm when in real life they might rev to 7500rpm. Fix the sounds T10!

- car divisions need more groups added and again a few cars moved around to the right groups. V8 supercars, historic Trans-am , Modern Trans-am, forza GT1, forza gt3, forza gt4, Nascar?( eventually), forza edition, forza p3( eventually) and maybe even a historic touring cars one too.

- fix colors overall and car details especially on interiors. Most interiors look dull and blurry when I play at least, headlights or taillights arent always the brightest either

- other car details need fixing such as paddle shift animations which need to be corrected and sped up. Cars like the GM T.50 needing a manual shift correction like in real life etc...

- tweak the AI. This was needed since day 1. Aggressiveness and awarness needs the most work and also make the back of the pack just as quick as the front 3-4 guys but keeping things fair so that the AI in 1st is not running away from everyone within the first lap.

- add the ability to tweak the weather variability too such as going from sunny to foggy to light rain. Or heavy rain to cloudy to clear skies. Its better then FM7 but I think it could use a little more immersion and realism especially for longer races

- make race payouts bigger and take away the car points system, it sucks. On average im noticing my race payouts are around 10,000cr. It would be nice if it was boosted to around 25,000cr which in the long run adds up. Higher priced cars would be more affordable too

- add better lighting to the car customization screen especially when changing wheels or paint. Also allow us to rotate the cars and rev them freely, even in forza vista. Dont know why the feature got removed

And we dont know T10s plan for tracks being added but ideally a track a month would be great for at least a year or so with a new to forza one being added maybe every 3-4 months but I dont think thats going to happen. And in terms of car content, seeing whats coming in the car pass through leaks and getting a few surprises dropped in so far for featured cars and reward cars I have huge faith in T10 delivering in that department. I know down the line some sweet reward cars, returness, car packs, or bootster packs await.
 
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- tweak the AI. This was needed since day 1. Aggressiveness and awarness needs the most work and also make the back of the pack just as quick as the front 3-4 guys but keeping things fair so that the AI in 1st is not running away from everyone within the first lap.
These are good and sensible things. Some of which you'd think should have been in there from the start.

I spent all night in FM last night. I had a good time overall. Was able to maintain ~70+ FPS without loss and having to restart the game. However these AI. When you are in the first lap, get that rewind button ready because you're going to use it. It's seems to me that they will actually turn into your car if you are in close proximity to them and there are other AI in close proximity. They will purposely hit your car. Also one thing that you mentioned, even with AI on 5, the first AI or 2, will be on an outright pace that you can not reach. I keep my cars mostly stock but I'm referring to AI with same or similar PI levels. It sounds weird to say but there really should be a rubberbanding setting that we can use. These cars that take off are unachievable to pass in a lot of instances. However, I don't know if you noticed, but once you do pass an AI. they will hit their brakes and immediately go behind 3+ seconds. That fight is well over over with.
Rubberbanding? I don't know. I'd actually like that setting to turn on and off. It seems like something they can fix. Horizontal and lateral awareness should be able to be adjusted. Letting cars once passed fight back for position should be able to be fixed.

Tweaks to freeplay are always welcome, one of the big ones being accelerated fuel usage and tire wear. This really needs to be implemented as soon as possible. We really need to start getting into having pit strategies.
 
we kinda do, at least by interviews they said they would add lot of tracks, but it wouldnt happen every month, more like 2 months
Also they said that at first moths will be about remake the tracks that were in FM7 into the new motorsport like hockenring
I missed those details apparently but still sounds good if true. A nice drop of new tracks will help down the line though I mean theres hundreds if tracks that have never even been in FM before, surely they can pick at least a dozen to add?
 
I don't know if it's been talked about in here or another thread but just wanted to throw out some tuning information.
Under the tab Suspension Geometry. Get rid of that Anti Geometry crap. Turn it to zero (or as close to zero as you can get it) and test the cars. It gets rid of the understeery mess that a lot of cars have. Makes them more lively. It seems to be setup to make the cars understeer and easier to use, maybe for controller? I don't know but you get your steering back. Especially more useful on the stock tires which I find actually usable now. Why they put these fake suspension settings in here, I have no clue. Seems like an overall blanket setting to make a car behave a certain way without doing it the right way with actual car components tuning.
Wow, I gave this a try in a Silverstone race and my race Lap 2 was about two and a half seconds better than my practice times.
 
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I've had some great races online recently, even if some of them start off a bit messy. I had a fantastic side-by-side battle with another driver at Road America in the Oreca 07 LMP2 for half the lap, before getting back in front. We swapped places many times but an awkward moment at Canada Corner let to contact and the other guy spun across my nose. Oops. Not sure who was at fault but then again I was being pushed around quite a bit. I had another good race at Indianapolis in the LMP2, where there was a race-long strategy battle between the cars that pitted and cars that did not. There was a bit of close quarters action in the early phase of the race between me and the first 2 qualifiers, lasting until lap 7 when we all pitted. 2 cars decided to gamble on strategy by staying out but they ultimately lost. Unfortunately, one of the cars that stayed out denied me a P2 finish by being a giant road block and shoving me wide at the second last corner. Still a fantastic race. It's soo much better than GT Sport and GT7.
 
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- tweak the AI. This was needed since day 1. Aggressiveness and awarness needs the most work and also make the back of the pack just as quick as the front 3-4 guys but keeping things fair so that the AI in 1st is not running away from everyone within the first lap.
I remember a video pre-launch where they were talking about AI. How good it was and what an incredible feature. I also remember a moment where esaki said it was especially great because it was a very adaptable system so they could very quickly adjust it when it would not be as wanted. We are two months in by now and they didn't do anything about it. How is that even possible. They are a bunch of straight out liars. It makes their whole offline career a torture. Being on the outside line for the first few corners will get you rammed off most of the times. They will brake on straight parts of the track, they will sometimes almost stop while taking a mediumpaced corner. Predictability of how the race will unfold is 100% always the same. It's not only not enjoyable it is just torture to have to go through those races to get to the rewards behind timed events.
The worst thing is that when they fix their stuff, they are shouting: look how we listen to the community! well you don't, you are just running behind fixing a broken product. is there seriously only one way of how the career mode championships are organised that you can come up with? this game should have the prize for worst racing game of the year, not best.
 
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To be honest im probably in the minority here but I dont play online much. I split my time 50/50 between fun freeplay races and chunks of the featured/builders cup races so what I wish they work on will differ from what most want on here. I know T10 has priorities on what they need to fix/implement/create for this game, its a long road but heres what I hope they take care of within the next 6 months which I believe are realistic things.

- add a few dozen more different race categories/races to the builders cup. ( rivalries which could include some fun ones, historic and modern ones, spec races, beginners endurance figure at most 50 laps depending on the track, pro endurance which could be filled with a few 100 lap ones, economy cars, electric etc..) this is where creativity can come into play big time and get people playing single player more often

- add a few further tweaks to freeplay. Its good for the most part but what would really make it great is being able to customize the grid and hand pick each car we want to race against. Done

- for the love of god a sound update would really be nice. Turbocharged cars which most sound dull repetitive and computerized, most v8 powered cars, and the race cars all need tweaks. Whether its correct or accurate sound files, louder idles/exhaust, different turbo noises, and the right rev limits. Some cars when going flat out rev way too high to damn near 9k rpm when in real life they might rev to 7500rpm. Fix the sounds T10!

- car divisions need more groups added and again a few cars moved around to the right groups. V8 supercars, historic Trans-am , Modern Trans-am, forza GT1, forza gt3, forza gt4, Nascar?( eventually), forza edition, forza p3( eventually) and maybe even a historic touring cars one too.

- fix colors overall and car details especially on interiors. Most interiors look dull and blurry when I play at least, headlights or taillights arent always the brightest either

- other car details need fixing such as paddle shift animations which need to be corrected and sped up. Cars like the GM T.50 needing a manual shift correction like in real life etc...

- tweak the AI. This was needed since day 1. Aggressiveness and awarness needs the most work and also make the back of the pack just as quick as the front 3-4 guys but keeping things fair so that the AI in 1st is not running away from everyone within the first lap.

- add the ability to tweak the weather variability too such as going from sunny to foggy to light rain. Or heavy rain to cloudy to clear skies. Its better then FM7 but I think it could use a little more immersion and realism especially for longer races

- make race payouts bigger and take away the car points system, it sucks. On average im noticing my race payouts are around 10,000cr. It would be nice if it was boosted to around 25,000cr which in the long run adds up. Higher priced cars would be more affordable too

- add better lighting to the car customization screen especially when changing wheels or paint. Also allow us to rotate the cars and rev them freely, even in forza vista. Dont know why the feature got removed

And we dont know T10s plan for tracks being added but ideally a track a month would be great for at least a year or so with a new to forza one being added maybe every 3-4 months but I dont think thats going to happen. And in terms of car content, seeing whats coming in the car pass through leaks and getting a few surprises dropped in so far for featured cars and reward cars I have huge faith in T10 delivering in that department. I know down the line some sweet reward cars, returness, car packs, or bootster packs await.
Turn 10, give this man a job!

@ManteoMax Take a quick look at this
 
These are good and sensible things. Some of which you'd think should have been in there from the start.

I spent all night in FM last night. I had a good time overall. Was able to maintain ~70+ FPS without loss and having to restart the game. However these AI. When you are in the first lap, get that rewind button ready because you're going to use it. It's seems to me that they will actually turn into your car if you are in close proximity to them and there are other AI in close proximity. They will purposely hit your car. Also one thing that you mentioned, even with AI on 5, the first AI or 2, will be on an outright pace that you can not reach. I keep my cars mostly stock but I'm referring to AI with same or similar PI levels. It sounds weird to say but there really should be a rubberbanding setting that we can use. These cars that take off are unachievable to pass in a lot of instances. However, I don't know if you noticed, but once you do pass an AI. they will hit their brakes and immediately go behind 3+ seconds. That fight is well over over with.
Rubberbanding? I don't know. I'd actually like that setting to turn on and off. It seems like something they can fix. Horizontal and lateral awareness should be able to be adjusted. Letting cars once passed fight back for position should be able to be fixed.

Tweaks to freeplay are always welcome, one of the big ones being accelerated fuel usage and tire wear. This really needs to be implemented as soon as possible. We really need to start getting into having pit strategies.
I have noticed that too and thats where tweaks to the AI overall would help. Keep the paces going but lower the aggression and make them better aware of their surroundings and they can adjust then
Turn 10, give this man a job!

@ManteoMax Take a quick look at this
I really wish Dan And Chris Esaki would see not just see my suggestions but many others. If they just took a some time and scanned these forums they would open their eyes some more I bet.
 
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