Forza Motorsport General Discussion Thread

  • Thread starter Terronium-12
  • 13,631 comments
  • 1,352,619 views
They're probably gonna make a Festival Playlist out of this given the deleted cars.

Also, the reason why we're still getting these outdated assets like the 190E and the Countach is very simple. Sometimes, inaccurate modeling is done on purpose, because T10 didn't secure the license at the time, yet the cars were modeled anyway (usually via photo references) as filler and a Performance Index entry, according to someone on the forza.net forums. Copyright ownership is very much precise and very complex.

It might sound like nonsense but it's kinda what this is. That's the reason the Silvia S15, R32, Ferrari 575M and F355 look terrible because they were all designed in the FM2 era and those models were likely made before the license was acquired. You see this a lot with various games (ATS has a couple of new AI cars that look awkwardly modeled) and many create models not in a 1:1 representation of the car model.

Personally I'd prefer if those awful FM2 era cars were thrown out, despite the fact that many of them are 90s-2000s cars, and rebuilt.
I'm not seeing the sense in this approach. Whether T10 purposefully modeled the cars inaccurately or not because the licensing wasn't there would make no difference. You don't build a model to inaccuracy in hopes licensing is acquired & then leave it as such when it is, esp. not when the manufacturer is freely allowing you use of their other cars. The cars look the way they do because that was their standard at the time.

The simple reason they haven't updated them is because they can't be bothered to source one of these vehicles & start with fresh data/reference material. I get that they have limited teams & are likely sending those teams out for new content, but the trade off of relying on older, outdated models becomes more apparent, esp. as they move from console to generation to console generation. These are X360 assets on a Series X they continually try to touch up, but their age is more than viewable.

ATS is a completely different situation where they're not looking to acquire any licensing to begin with outside the rigs, so keeping the AI models generic & faintly resembling real vehicles is their intended goal.
 
Last edited:
In addition, those older models were built to an older standard, with much lower polygon counts due to the weaker consoles back then. There's no reason for them to use resources to either remake them themselves or to outsource the work. Similarly for ATS, traffic cars have a low polygon count too because they're not important to actual gameplay
 
I can't remember Turn 10 ever doing something like this... Wouldn't that make this new nonsense, then? :lol:
I can, Forza Motorsport 5 basically had dlc cars taken straight from FM4. The only difference here is that they're new-to-series cars, not taken from a past game.
Also, the reason why we're still getting these outdated assets like the 190E and the Countach is very simple. Sometimes, inaccurate modeling is done on purpose, because T10 didn't secure the license at the time, yet the cars were modeled anyway (usually via photo references) as filler and a Performance Index entry, according to someone on the forza.net forums. Copyright ownership is very much precise and very complex.

It might sound like nonsense but it's kinda what this is. That's the reason the Silvia S15, R32, Ferrari 575M and F355 look terrible because they were all designed in the FM2 era and those models were likely made before the license was acquired. You see this a lot with various games (ATS has a couple of new AI cars that look awkwardly modeled) and many create models not in a 1:1 representation of the car model.
I'm sorry, but your comment honestly doesn't make sense and definitely doesn't work. The cars look the way they were because they were originally modelled to a standard back when FM2 came out. and then Turn 10 later just wanted to be lazy and not start from scratch, they just essentially took the same old models before plastering new textures and assets over them.

Also, how do you think licensing works? Why would they be able to acquire a license and not be allowed to use new models under that license? They're getting a license to use the car, not specific to how it's represented in the game.

----------------
Another thing, I remember a few times getting corrected on what I said regards to car models being essentially the old models ported to new car models. So, I want to now address that comment a bit more clearly than before.

When I said Turn 10 was using their old models fancied up again for FM8, I didn't mean it like that they just took the FM2 car models, smoothed them out, and then plopped them into the new game. No, I know they did more than that, but what they did lead to a bad result.

What Turn 10 did with reusing their old models is taking the original X360 car model, then proceeding to update the surface textures to meet new-gen standards. and they placed better detailed and higher poly assets onto the original X360 car model in place. Probably did this to save time and effort and this might have worked on a lot of their car models as their base was already good, but some models like the Toyota MR2 SW20, BMW M3 e30, Nissan Skyline R32, and Subaru 22B unfortunately had a bad base.

What was done was akin to restoring an old car, but had a bad frame with some things out of wack and then never got that fixed hoping noone would notice. and as I said before; lead to a terrible result. They had several games to correct this issue and they're still not doing it.
 
There's a strong chance that the customisation will be improved, they've hinted at it in the presentations and even if they, at the very least, implement some of the improvements Horizon has made and added (more engine swaps, anti-lag, more visual customisation), it's still a step in the right direction.

I'd hope that they focussed on a cars ability/potential to be turned into a racing car when they were deciding what to cut and what to keep.


From what we seen so far visual customisation
Will not be any different campared to old titels, if they had something new they would proably show it, right now its just talk but very little show, thats what turn 10 does for every released title
 
I can, Forza Motorsport 5 basically had dlc cars taken straight from FM4. The only difference here is that they're new-to-series cars, not taken from a past game.
But in that case, at least they had the (not even that implausible) excuse of needing to bring those cars up to Xbox One standards. And they never promised those cars were going to be in FM5.
As far as I can recall this is the first time they've shown a car in trailers, included it in the pre-release car list, and then removed it and issued a statement - even the Stratos, which they namedropped in a Forza Monthly before the release of FH5, was never part of the FH5 Official Carlist.
 
It happend with GTS also with Lotus, the car was even playable in the beta but got removed due the licensing. Maybe they took out those bad models and rescanned them entirely, i doubt it but there is a chance after all the backslash.

edit. NVM the later just saw the list of missing cars.
 
Last edited:
But in that case, at least they had the (not even that implausible) excuse of needing to bring those cars up to Xbox One standards. And they never promised those cars were going to be in FM5.
As far as I can recall this is the first time they've shown a car in trailers, included it in the pre-release car list, and then removed it and issued a statement - even the Stratos, which they namedropped in a Forza Monthly before the release of FH5, was never part of the FH5 Official Carlist.
Okay, that's true that they were never promised, but the fact they had them up not too long after the game's launch on FM5 makes it feel to me like they didn't need that much time to update them and potentially had them held back from the start just so they can charge more money.

There's differences there, but the vibes I'm getting here with the nonsense move feel similar.
 
Apparently six cars were removed from the Forza Motorsport car roster. Could be DLC.


Hmm... two of the cars removed seem to be explainable, with newer variants (Cadillac V-Series R >> DPi VR, Audi R8 LMS Evo/Evo II >> Audi R8 LMS) taking the field IRL, thus, T10 being obliged by the racing teams behind these cars to add the latest variants of their racing cars on the base game. I bet something similar would happen to the Mercedes-Benz AMG GT3 and Acura ARX-05 in the future.

There is no possibility of licensing issues, but rather an "update the car list based on the 2022-2023 grids" type situation.
With the Acura in the game, and no sign of the Mazda so far, the Cadillac will be pretty important to have as the only rival to the Acura... Ah who am I kidding, they are just gonna pile them in the "Forza P2" category or something stupid with the RS Spyder and old Corvette DP and an LMPC car anyways, so I guess most people won't notice/care.

Someone mentioned above or in the other thread, it would be good for them to address this a little more properly instead of just being vague... I mean I know they have to be careful with what they say and they can't share every detail, but this is the only news we have got after a pretty big disappointment of a trailer/showcase, we have nothing positive to talk about and just have this negative news item to speculate about and start "rumors" if they don't nip it.
The Lola B09/86 is still there, despite T10 saying that there'll be more modern racing cars. The possibility of getting a GT3 car and its facelifted, Evo variant is there, but IDK what's going on in T10, if they'll make FM look like a laughing stock on Day 1, compared to GT7. First, the lack of disclosure for months and now, suddenly removing cars from the day 1 list. I waited for that 956 only to see it get cut from the base game, which makes the car list as outdated as FM7s with 1-5 2016-2017 racing cars added to FM7 in day 1. If they keep the Oreca FLM09 instead of bringing in the Dallara P217 and Ligier JSP217, or even the Ligier JSP320, I'll stick to AC.

Compared to FM7's 13 actually new to Forza cars (I'm counting the variants of the 2017 Indycars, V8 Supercars, and the Shell-Dunlop 962), I feel that FM's gonna be a similar scenario. So far, we got 2 new to Forza cars that are coming Day 1, the Bryan Herta Veloster TCR and the Mission R. Count the DPis, Oreca 07, Porsche 956, Porsche 935, the Huracan ST Evo, the BTCC Ford Focus and the Ginetta LMP, we get a total of 11 new to Forza cars if T10 didn't decide to put these cars on a paywall or FOMO-inducing Playlist.

Also, the Acura ARX-05's removed too.
 
Last edited:
Kind of annoying as the Caddy DPi was one of the only new cars they have shown I really cared about. If they are going to hold it back for release or put it in some special pack or lock it behind some playlist grind, then it just shows they are still nonsensical with how they manage their car list and put basically zero thought into a car's relevance, history, rivalries, or how it fits into their own game on a basic level. Of course we already knew that it has been like that since FM5 but it's not a positive sign for FM8 being an improvement in that area really.

With the Acura in the game, and no sign of the Mazda so far, the Cadillac will be pretty important to have as the only rival to the Acura... Ah who am I kidding, they are just gonna pile them in the "Forza P2" category or something stupid with the RS Spyder and old Corvette DP and an LMPC car anyways, so I guess most people won't notice/care.

Someone mentioned above or in the other thread, it would be good for them to address this a little more properly instead of just being vague... I mean I know they have to be careful with what they say and they can't share every detail, but this is the only news we have got after a pretty big disappointment of a trailer/showcase, we have nothing positive to talk about and just have this negative news item to speculate about and start "rumors" if they don't nip it.
Hmm... two of the cars removed seem to be explainable, with newer variants (Cadillac V-Series R >> DPi VR, Audi R8 LMS Evo/Evo II >> Audi R8 LMS) taking the field IRL, thus, T10 being obliged by the racing teams behind these cars to add the latest variants of their racing cars on the base game. I bet something similar would happen to the Mercedes-Benz AMG GT3 and Acura ARX-05 in the future.

There is no possibility of licensing issues, but rather an "update the car list based on the 2022-2023 grids" type situation.
The previous games have been filled with cars that are obsolete/not up to date, and they had to know that the DPi cars they were adding would be obsolete before the game released, so I don't see any reason they would just throw those out now. There are also several other models shown in the FM8 trailers that are out of date as well, but those weren't removed.
 
That leave FM as the only game from the 2022 showcase to still not have a release date then?
Also if starfield is September, FM has a chance for release at July, Aug and Oct (Nov and Dec as well). This will be right against TDU SC and Crew Motorfest.
 
This is the discussion thread for an article on GTPlanet:

Xbox Games Showcase Coming June 11

Microsoft has confirmed that its next big “Showcase” event will be coming on June 11, giving some hope to Forza Motorsport fans that more news of the next instalment in the series may be on the way soon...
 
This wait could have been a lot more tolerable if it wasn't for the fact that T10 kept talking about the graphics, "built from the ground up", and telling us "more news in the coming months" only to disappoint people when nothing enticing is shared. Imo it has become VERY tiresome. And now T10 has an excuse to make us wait yet again thanks to this news. I mean, yay a showcase all the way to June... But we know next to nothing about the game aside from tire & fuel management, better career mode and online structure, oh, and graphics as well as "built from the ground up".

I'm not trying to be negative as that isn't my thing. I'm just so tired with all this waiting and the amount of negativity surrounding FM and FH5. I didn't leave GT 8 years ago to end up in yet another war between the fandom.
 
This wait could have been a lot more tolerable if it wasn't for the fact that T10 kept talking about the graphics, "built from the ground up", and telling us "more news in the coming months" only to disappoint people when nothing enticing is shared. Imo it has become VERY tiresome. And now T10 has an excuse to make us wait yet again thanks to this news. I mean, yay a showcase all the way to June... But we know next to nothing about the game aside from tire & fuel management, better career mode and online structure, oh, and graphics as well as "built from the ground up".

I'm not trying to be negative as that isn't my thing. I'm just so tired with all this waiting and the amount of negativity surrounding FM and FH5. I didn't leave GT 8 years ago to end up in yet another war between the fandom.
Don't worry, I think all of us are tired of the waiting and nonsense at this point. Chris needs to sit down and answer multiple viewer questions soon or something, this has gotten really ridiculous.
 
I hope the coming up Xbox Games Showcase will mention this game's handling improvement over its predecessor along with Sim Racing peripheral optimizations.
 
+1 for being in the tired of the waiting camp.

I guess we're not used to this kind of wait. If it's a holiday release, it might be a total of 6 years since FM7. Which is a loooong time.

I'm just glad I have game pass so I can try it before deciding on getting the Ultimate Edition upgrade.
 
Like everyone else really, I'm beginning to get tired of waiting for youuuuu...



I really hope that when it arrives, they manage to give the people what they want...



But they do seem to be running it all a bit close to the wire...

 
Seriously hope we get something, anything, just before that event on June 11th. Like maybe a gradual reveal of the car list as well.

It's really getting stuck in my head, but if I had a dollar for every time Chris Esaki says "built from the ground up"...
 
Last edited:
Seriously hope we get something, anything, just before that event on June 11th. Like maybe a gradual reveal of the car list as well.

It's really getting stuck in my head, but if I had a dollar for every time Chris Esaki says "built from the ground up"...
“Your expectations have been built from the ground up.”
 
The thing is, its not build from the ground up, still use more than a few terrible car models,
If they going to market it that way critics about it is warrented, the game was showed at the same time as gt7 in 2020 and since then barely anything new has been showed
 
Whilst I think they've overblown the built from the ground up thing, I also think it's being targeted too much. Clearly the engine has been built from the ground up and that's what's meant, but the have implied everything is and that isn't the case.

It's just confusing marketing really but the hate isn't totally justifiable.
 
Back