Global Protests Against Social Distancing, Lockdown, Vaccine Mandate

  • Thread starter Dotini
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And that’s where you and I differ in opinion. I think governments are beginning to lift restrictions because the mandates aren’t working as hoped. And now the economic fallout is proving more harmful to society than the virus is at this moment.

I can show you in one chart why restrictions are lifting in the US.

91-DIVOC-countries-UnitedStates.png



That's it! Cases are dropping. That's why restrictions are lifting. It's not because something succeed or failed, it's because Omicron is not transmitting the way it used to. The reason for that is a combination of EVERYTHING that has come before, including all cases of omicron and all previous variants, vaccines, and boosters. That combination across the population eventually reached a threshold where omicron could not spread as effectively.

It's not hard to see.
 
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Because of the unique perspective I’ve had throughout this whole thing, I agree mostly with what you’ve said. But at any rate, we saw spikes and the ensuing downward trend of every variant as it moved through a specific region, community etc. the same spikes and downward trends happened before the vaccine was widely available. Just like any flu or cold that moves through a population.

The thing that gets me, is that there is room for both of our perspectives on this. I haven’t seen anyone in this thread that I would consider the Ill informed or completely off base, regardless of their opinion

In the end, I’m sure we’ll all be a little right and a little wrong.
 
And that’s where you and I differ in opinion. I think governments are beginning to lift restrictions because the mandates aren’t working as hoped.
Demonstrably incorrect
And now the economic fallout is proving more harmful to society than the virus is at this moment. And one can make a valid argument that a lot of the social distancing policies contributed directly to the economic fallout and didn’t do a whole lot of long term good
Only as long as you base your 'opinion' on poor, cherry-picked data.
And the virus seems to be mutating into that of a common cold or flu. And we have no clue wether these mutations into less lethal strains happened because of the vaccine…or occurred naturally.
Once again you don't understand how this works, just because the current variant is less dangerous, doesn't mean that the next one will also be. Virus mutation isn't a downward trend of 'less dangerous', the existence of Covid-19 itself is demonstrable proof of that.
The epidemiologist that’s currently working with us right now even admits that variations can occur because of a vaccine.
Not because of a vaccine, even if you have had the vaccine and get Covid, it can still mutate. It's just a lot less likely to happen.
Because of the unique perspective I’ve had throughout this whole thing, I agree mostly with what you’ve said. But at any rate, we saw spikes and the ensuing downward trend of every variant as it moved through a specific region, community etc. the same spikes and downward trends happened before the vaccine was widely available. Just like any flu or cold that moves through a population.
And...

Who said that wouldn't happen?

The fact is that had vaccines, and before that lockdowns and mask requirements not been in place those spikes would be a lot higher. That's the exact reason why those measures were put in place. And when you dig into the data behind those spikes, the majority of infections, hospitalizations, and deaths are always among those who ignored the science-based precautions that were in place.
The thing that gets me, is that there is room for both of our perspectives on this. I haven’t seen anyone in this thread that I would consider the Ill informed or completely off base, regardless of their opinion
I have seen it, a disturbing amount of members who are ill-informed and off base, and I include you among them.

First off, if you dress your factual claims up as opinion it doesn't make them an opinion if they are based on a factual inaccuracy. Secondly, if you do make such a claim and it is corrected, and you then go on to repeat the exact same claim then you are no longer posting an 'opinion' or 'perspective', you are deliberately and knowingly spreading misinformation.

This is not an area of two equal sides, and parts of the media (and the last administration) treating it as such has been hugely damaging and has cost lives, a lot of lives.

In the end, I’m sure we’ll all be a little right and a little wrong.
No.

You are, for example, not a little bit right about how vaccines work, if the Covid vaccine is a vaccine, that vaccines mandates work. These are all well-proven, science-based, evidence-backed, peer-reviewed areas that you are wrong about.
 
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Because of the unique perspective I’ve had throughout this whole thing, I agree mostly with what you’ve said. But at any rate, we saw spikes and the ensuing downward trend of every variant as it moved through a specific region, community etc. the same spikes and downward trends happened before the vaccine was widely available. Just like any flu or cold that moves through a population.
Of course. You're going to see spikes and downward trends in a pandemic. The whole point of everything everyone has been doing is to try to mitigate. And it has been working. There's no "control" version of this experiment. We don't get to go back and see what happens if we do things completely differently. But the reason Omicron is falling is because of everything that blocks the spread. Cases of omicron, cases of delta, cases of alpha, vaccines, boosters, masks, distancing, everything being done.

But omicron is not "just like any flu or cold", and that was the case even more so for delta. Omicron is still quite deadly. The US has had roughly 150,000 covid-19 deaths since omicron took over. This flu season has had roughly 3k deaths so far, and it looks like it has peaked already, or is maybe doing a second bump smaller than the first? It's not shaping up to be big numbers.
 
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Holy crap.

In a 2-1 decision, the Fifth Circuit (because of course it's the Fifth Circuit) remanded back to the District Court for the Northern District of Texas a suit by United Airlines employees seeking injunctive relief from United's vaccine mandate due to religious belief, requiring the lower court review its test used to deny said relief. No injunction from the Fifth Circuit.

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In dissent, Judge Smith (a Reagan appointee) addresses at length the majority (Elrod (GWB), Oldham (Trump)) having come to this decision to remand (rather than deny) in an unpublished opinion.

This is a particularly fiery passage in the dissenting opinion:

...
Trust me, I have zero to gain by posting my opinions here when I know it’s a stacked room against me.
Spider Man Lol GIF


That victimhood!
 
Apparently, a class action lawsuit has been filed against the Freedom Convoy & has grown to $306M against multiple people as downtown businesses join in.
A class action lawsuit against the “Freedom Convoy” in downtown Ottawa has added 31 new named defendants and ballooned to a $306-million claim for the disruption to lives and livelihoods from the now three-week old occupation.

The claim has also expanded to include anyone who donated to the convoy after Feb. 4, the day the organizers’ initial GoFundMe campaign was cancelled when the fundraising platform said it had evidence “that the previously peaceful demonstration has become an occupation, with police reports of violence and other unlawful activity.”
The lawsuit also names donors who gave money through GiveSendGo, the alternate fundraising platform organizers turned to when GoFundMe shut them down.

“Anyone who has materially contributed financially to the continuing occupation of downtown Ottawa knew what they were doing. Particularly the people who contributed to GiveSendGo who by that time knew the unlawful behaviour of the convoy participants,” he said.

“Those people knew that the air horns and rail horns were tormenting the people and businesses of downtown Ottawa and causing harm. And they wanted that to continue.”

Assad said he had to temporarily close three of his Happy Goat locations and many of his employees have been harassed and threatened.

“We need to take back our city,” Assad said. “Our city is being held hostage.”
 
From the reports I'm reading, seems pretty mundane. This is what someone reported less than a hour ago.
Just a PSA for everyone who thinks there’s going to be some kind of spectacular operation. I’m watching the CTV livestream and they’re basically just towing the trucks out one at a time. Methodically and efficient but not very dramatic.
The protesters they arrest are being charged with Mischief- so they’re not going to jail for some long time. It’s not cops in riot gear and tear gas or anything like that. Mostly cops just standing around on the live stream.
The protests will be cleared in due time but it will take time and it’s not particularly exciting to watch the live stream, which is why the video is mostly the Police officer giving a press release. Towing out a dozen vehicles an hour doesn’t make for riveting live TV.
 
Give it time, they are no where near the main core/camp yet.
Maybe, seem to be taking their time carefully. They just showed the police meeting with a few guys who called themselves some of the leaders & have agreed to leave peacefully if the police let them out. They said it didn't matter if police start breaking windows or not, they knew they'd be arrested eventually if they stay, so they chose to leave.

Edit* What in the hell, lol.
whathe.jpg
 
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Maybe, seem to be taking their time carefully. They just showed the police meeting with a few guys who called themselves some of the leaders & have agreed to leave peacefully if the police let them out. They said it didn't matter if police start breaking windows or not, they knew they'd be arrested eventually if they stay, so they chose to leave.

Edit* What in the hell, lol.
whathe.jpg
lol,yup, there are some real crazies in the crowd!
 
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That seems to be missing a bunch of context.

And really, it's probably a case of 🤬 around and found out.
 
All the surprised Pikachus that watched how police handled protests over the last 2 years, can't believe how police are acting.

And they're not even using riot shields, bean bags, or beating them.
Sad Gordon Ramsay GIF by Hell's Kitchen


Organizer Tamara Lich is in court to determine her bail release & her husband arrived to speak for her. Some tidbits being shared.
Tamara Lich's husband Wayne Lich just testified in her bail hearing that he flew to Ottawa on Feb. 2 on "a private jet" at the expense of someone named Joseph.
Wayne is asked if he had any problem with holding the line and blocking the streets "No, I want to go home... I was totally transparent to the whole holding-the-line thing," says he was there for her safety.

Now, he says more clearly: "No, I was not supportive of holding the line."
Lich says he was there in Ottawa because he supports "First Amendment rights" and want to protect her because he knew what happened to John F Kennedy and John Lennon. (I am not making this up.)
Dwayne Lich is now weighing in on his interpretation of grounds to invoke Emergencies Act. He is confusing it with War Measures Act. "Do you know if it's legal," he asks the Crown. "It's against everything that is good and Holy."
 
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And they're not even using riot shields, bean bags, or beating them.
Sad Gordon Ramsay GIF by Hell's Kitchen's Kitchen
Canada. They're probably handing out Tim Hortons coffee and maple donuts. Of course the video clips in these tweets don't show that.
 
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When are they driving in the water cannon used against pipeline protests? You disappoint me, Canada.
 
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All the surprised Pikachus that watched how police handled protests over the last 2 years, can't believe how police are acting.

And they're not even using riot shields, bean bags, or beating them.
Sad Gordon Ramsay GIF by Hell's Kitchen's Kitchen


Organizer Tamara Lich is in court to determine her bail release & her husband arrived to speak for her. Some tidbits being shared.


I'm curious how Lich convinced someone with that much money to give him a ride.

Lich says he was there in Ottawa because he supports "First Amendment rights" and want to protect her because he knew what happened to John F Kennedy and John Lennon. (I am not making this up.)
Darn, I really need to pay more attention to how the Johns died. I thought it was due to them not being read their Miranda rights.
 
Darn, I really need to pay more attention to how the Johns died. I thought it was due to them not being read their Miranda rights.
The "First Amendment rights" bit is...odd. Rights such as free expression are covered in the Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms, the first amendment of which, as I understand it, expanded protections therein to cover Indian and Inuit peoples.

The First Amendment to the United States Constitution doesn't protect citizens of other countries. Foreign visitors on American soil are generally beneficiaries of protections ensconced in the Bill of Rights, but those protections--which are really constraints on government actors--don't apply to other governments.
 
I'm curious how Lich convinced someone with that much money to give him a ride.
Probably didn't really need to. Rich donor saw his wife was a lead organizer, probably just offered it up to him. Same way a ton of money came from outside, wealthy donors.

'Cause you know, all that totally fits into this being a 'grassroots' movement as some of them like to claim it.
 
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