Grip bug thread

  • Thread starter GT_Alex74
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So lads, look at this picture:
PS_Messages_20180111_160120.jpg



We have the mighty Lord Gordo on an impossible laptime again, so he has been online since i messaged him. Sennna is also on an impossible time, but there's more.

CRT-Daniiel is a secundary account from Sennna. Snow himself is a good friend of him and confirmed that they're the same person. Look at the gap. 1.6 seconds.

Im gonna try message Daniel linking to this thread. He might provide more information.
 
I'm positive that PD will take this seriously, especially considering the upcoming FIA Championship. Could you imagine how embarrassing it would be if the winner of the real FIA Championship had this bug?

My guess is that PD won't mention anything until they come up with a solution. That will probably take some time. Until then, I will continue to enjoy Sport mode and at least those players with the bug are bringing up the Strength of Field (assuming that is part of the DR points system.)
 
hellZfirE
So lads, look at this picture:
View attachment 705701


We have the mighty Lord Gordo on an impossible laptime again, so he has been online since i messaged him. Sennna is also on an impossible time, but there's more.

CRT-Daniiel is a secundary account from Sennna. Snow himself is a good friend of him and confirmed that they're the same person. Look at the gap. 1.6 seconds.

Im gonna try message Daniel linking to this thread. He might provide more information.
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I think there is another one as well. He just can't get the times senna and gordo can. Gordo and the one I speak of both wiped out on lap 2 yesterday and were weaving all over the place in front of me. The were steadily pulling away. I think it's more than just a brake thing. People were raising hell with them after for driving like morons.
 
Remember the time between a bug being found and a bug being solved and release can be a long time. We found the end result of the bug, but they need to find the root cause and then find a solution. Hopefully, someone noticed this issue before the community brought it to light.

Fingers crossed that a fix comes in the next patch or in the next scheduled maintenance.
 
Shottah072
IMO if PD read this thread they better put some smart guys on it ASAP cause like you say the integrity of the competition, wich is the core of the game, is in question. For this reason i have no doubt PD will take this highly when they find out about it. But it might take them some time for they can fix this so we do need to have a little patience.

As far as i can tell it is not a widespread bug though. So i will continue enjoying Sport mode untill they adress it like i have been doing up to this point. These boycots never work anyway cause the majority will just keep playing it. So i disagree with you about it being an effective way to communicate to PD. But if thats what you feel you should do then by all means go ahead and stop playing. Its your choice ofcourse.
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Perhaps my choice of words didn't reflect my thoughts adequately. I am simply choosing to pause participation of Sport Mode so PD knows that bugs, errors, etc. have consequences. It's a reminder to them that players are the most important factor to this game and our concerns should be addressed adequately.

I am optimistic that resolution will be swift, therefore my venture into private lobbies in the meantime will likely be limited. Nonetheless, entities for profit typically are motivated by one thing. Sometimes sending a clear, weighted signal can be an effective motivator.

Cheers to all those that will continue to participate and document findings that need resolution. I will of course continue to join you in improving GTS, just not in the usual manner. Let's hope I don't find an addictive lobby.
 
hellZfirE
We have the mighty Lord Gordo on an impossible laptime again, so he has been online since i messaged him. Sennna is also on an impossible time, but there's more.

CRT-Daniiel is a secundary account from Sennna. Snow himself is a good friend of him and confirmed that they're the same person. Look at the gap. 1.6 seconds.

Im gonna try message Daniel linking to this thread. He might provide more information.
Click to expand...

So looking at this, does anyone think there are varying levels of the Grip Bug? 1.6 seconds still leaves them solidly in the top 10. I thought that RA1784 was losing about 3 seconds a lap on the secondary account. Maybe everyone has a different level of grip and we are only noticing the extremes. Does everyone need a second account to verify their own times?
 
mokalovesoulmat
Sorry guys, have we talked about DS4 motion sensor input?
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Nothing to do with the bug.

DriftMethod
So looking at this, does anyone think there are varying levels of the Grip Bug? 1.6 seconds still leaves them solidly in the top 10. I thought that RA1784 was losing about 3 seconds a lap on the secondary account. Maybe everyone has a different level of grip and we are only noticing the extremes. Does everyone need a second account to verify their own times?
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RA1784 was not used to the regular physics, but he was used to the bugged physics, whereas Sennna is a very fast driver, so it might be psychologically harder for him to fully take advantage of the bug. If I was suddenly hit with the bug, I don't think I could just shave the whole 3 seconds or so immediately from my regular lap times, I'd just expect it to smooth out my mistakes and gain just that 1 or 1.5 second at first.
 
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GT_Alex74
RA1784 was not used to the regular physics, but he was used to the bugged physics, whereas Sennna is a very fast driver, so it might be psychologically harder for him to fully take advantage of the bug. If I was suddenly hit with the bug, I don't think I could just shave the whole 3 seconds or so immediately from my regular lap times, I'd just expect it to smooth out my mistakes and gain just that 1 or 1.5 second at first.
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So are you saying that Senna just recently got the Grip Bug? Or to fully exploit the advantage, one would have to be a inferior driver because good racing lines don't equal faster laps with the Grip Bug? The bad racing lines were what initially made people suspicious of the times.

I'm by no means attacking your answer. I am just trying to understand and looking at the times as data.
 
I've taken the time to record the laps as I was requested to do so.

TRL_SENNNA lap


CRT_Daniiel lap


DriftMethod
So are you saying that Senna just recently got the Grip Bug? Or to fully exploit the advantage, one would have to be a inferior driver because good racing lines don't equal faster laps with the Grip Bug? The bad racing lines were what initially made people suspicious of the times.
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He's had the bug affecting him since November, at least that I'm aware of.
 
DriftMethod
So are you saying that Senna just recently got the Grip Bug? Or to fully exploit the advantage, one would have to be a inferior driver because good racing lines don't equal faster laps with the Grip Bug? The bad racing lines were what initially made people suspicious of the times.

I'm by no means attacking your answer. I am just trying to understand and looking at the times as data.
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I don't mean you have to be an inferior driver to fully exploit, just that when you're used to some braking points for years, it's harder to force you to divide your braking distance by 2. As for Senna in particular, @Spurgy 777 will know more than me.

EDIT : I see nothing wrong with Sennna's braking points on this lap, acceleration out of corners might be early but I can't say for sure since I don't even have the M4 Gr.4 yet.
 
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GT_Alex74
RA1784 was not used to the regular physics, but he was used to the bugged physics, whereas Sennna is a very fast driver, so it might be psychologically harder for him to fully take advantage of the bug. If I was suddenly hit with the bug, I don't think I could just shave the whole 3 seconds or so immediately from my regular lap times, I'd just expect it to smooth out my mistakes and gain just that 1 or 1.5 second at first.
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While this explanation is plausible, it's insufficient to rule out that this bug may come in various forms. A highly skilled driver may actually have the ability to exploit this bug even further than RA.

TRL_SENNNA's laps poses additional questions...
 
GT_Alex74
I don't mean you have to be an inferior driver to fully exploit, just that when you're used to some braking points for years, it's harder to force you to divide your braking distance by 2. As for Senna in particular, @Spurgy 777 will know more than me.
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I understand what you're saying. What's hard for me to believe is that IF this bug allows you to simply brake later, hold higher apex speeds, and get on the throttle sooner (or some combination of those things), that a driver taking less optimal lines will be able to put up the same times as a driver using better lines. Maybe I'm wrong, but I essentially view it as having super grippy tires. A good driver will fairly quickly find the optimal braking, speeds and throttle applications to take full advantage of the extra grip.

edit: Maybe to clarify a bit. Suppose you were racing with Racing Hard tires and at a pit stop you got Racing Super Softs, but didn't know. I am positive that you will start putting up better lap times, because of how the car reacts to your inputs and the feel of using the available grip. You don't have to know what tires are on the car to get the full performance.
 
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I've been studying SENNNA's lap a bit after having set my own time. Unlike the top time in the Megane which looks completely ridiculous, SENNNA's driving isn't noticeably bad, and it's in the same car as me which makes for a good comparison. It's odd that a person running the correct lines for the most part is slower than a person who drive's like they're drunk.

The one thing that did jump out to me was how he went through the second awkward right hand hairpin (1:25 in video.) The telemetry essentially shows him going wide-open throttle, in 2nd gear, with the steering telemetry at max (which might as well be full lock; it's 45 degrees on my wheel) and the car just turns and goes.

You can't do that in any car that I'm aware of. I've been sitting here attempting to replicate it and it's clearly whatever this bug is. That car easily spins out 100% of the time if I do that. I know this isn't some new discovery, it was just the first time I can clearly see what this issue looks like with proper driving.

For the sake of overall time reference: My optimal time during the two sessions I ran was about 2:25 flat. I was unable to pull that off obviously. I'd assume a few of the aliens could run that and maybe drop into the high 24s (looks like Doodle may be having a go at it), but it gives you an idea of time gap between the top 2 and what I've seen possible.
 
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Do you think it has something to do with the difference we see in times from practice sessions and daily races, even in ones where there’s no fuel or tire consumption?
 
zzz_pt
Yesterday me and @RA1784 were doing some laps around Suzuka (soft tires) and he was only 1.6 off my time.

Exactly the difference between both SENNNAS's accounts.
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I'm confused. So with the bug he was 1.6 faster or slower than you? Unless you are saying that you are equal drivers, comparing a bugged lap to a non bugged lap of different drivers doesn't give reliable data.
 
Personnally, I did this race once today, I hold a 2:25.817 with the Atenza GR.4 after a 10 minutes practice session and I have about the same braking points as SENNNA. The current EMEA record is at 2:25.118 and is held by Dayrone with a M4, and he's definitely one of the fastest french drivers out there. Sadly, his replay is not available for some reason, so I looked at GT_BOCA_JUJU's lap (2:25.315) and it is pretty similar to Daniiel's lap.

Where the SENNNA lap looks weird is definitely on early powering-out and a sense of ease / stability. If those two accounts are really the same guy, then I'm pretty sure the SENNNA account could shave a bit more time.


DriftMethod
I'm confused. So with the bug he was 1.6 faster or slower than you? Unless you are saying that you are equal drivers, comparing a bugged lap to a non bugged lap of different drivers doesn't give reliable data.
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I believe what he says is that now RA is used to the regular physics, he is only 1.6 seconds off top 10 pace.
 
@DriftMethod @GT_Alex74 and everyone else, you're making this far more complicated that it needs to be. Senna is only 1.6 seconds slower on his other account because he is using the M4, a car that is likely to benefit a lot less from this bug than the Megane, which is the car normally used to set times 3 seconds faster than should be possible (track dependent). The Meganes biggest weakness is lack of front end grip on power, especially in traction zones and this bug dramatically improves that, so by removing it's weaknesses you are just left with the benefits PD have given it in order to compensate using normal physics, i.e. lower weight and more power.
 
You're right, and besides, knowing if it makes laps 1.6 or 3 seconds faster is not that important now, we know the bug's here. I'd have ran both the Megane and the M4 out of curiosity but I have a lobby to attend in 20 minutes.
 
Spurgy 777
@DriftMethod @GT_Alex74 and everyone else, you're making this far more complicated that it needs to be. Senna is only 1.6 seconds slower on his other account because he is using the M4, a car that is likely to benefit a lot less from this bug than the Megane, which is the car normally used to set times 3 seconds faster than should be possible (track dependent). The Meganes biggest weakness is lack of front end grip on power, especially in traction zones and this bug dramatically improves that, so by removing it's weaknesses you are just left with the benefits PD have given it in order to compensate using normal physics, i.e. lower weight and more power.
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You very well may be correct, but unless we see Senna drive the same course, same tires, with the Megane, and see a 3 second difference, we can't make that conclusion yet.
 
Spurgy 777
@DriftMethod @GT_Alex74 and everyone else, you're making this far more complicated that it needs to be. Senna is only 1.6 seconds slower on his other account because he is using the M4, a car that is likely to benefit a lot less from this bug than the Megane, which is the car normally used to set times 3 seconds faster than should be possible (track dependent). The Meganes biggest weakness is lack of front end grip on power, especially in traction zones and this bug dramatically improves that, so by removing it's weaknesses you are just left with the benefits PD have given it in order to compensate using normal physics, i.e. lower weight and more power.
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Assumption about the effect of this bug on various cars based on individual vehicle dynamics may not be a sound strategy to define the operation of this bug. For clarity, we should refrain from judgements about disparities in lap times and focus on collecting data that removes ambiguities.

Could RA1784 and TRL_SENNNA perhaps do some test laps in various cars to benchmark if the bug has consistent or varying effects?
 
It’s strange that people that know they have the bug are not coming forward.
This issue is gonna be fixed...
And they can leave this situation as someone that acknowledge the problem, and have the community’s support... or as “cheaters”.
 
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