GT 6 physics messed up after 1.03 update ?

  • Thread starter Thread starter Raf Laureys
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Classic MR, RR cars must feel very boring now due to its low power. I remember driving them in Goodwood events and some of them were surprisingly tail happy when driving not carefully enough. But it was fun!!! I can't say how much it was realistic, I never droved MR car in real life but i liked old physics more.

All this mess makes me want to delete 1.03 patch and play as it was before 1.03... i feel like PD has broken my game :( the only problem here is that i wont be able to race online if i do that.
 
The problem with any discussion (about physics) here on :gtplanet: is that it is dominated by angry comments towards either PD or other members of this forum, mostly by users who have very little clue about what they're talking about.
I base that comment on sifting through hundreds of pages of 'discussions' trying to find some more in-depth information or just normal comments that contribute in a different manner for example to show the magnitude of a problem ("Hey, I noticed this too!")
So, each and every thread about the subject turns into a mess rather quickly with OT posts about other members (like this one, I know) and their driving abilities.
These people all forget that we are on the same team. We are all people who enjoy GT6 and want the best experience.
Sure, the definition of 'best experience' differs a lot between players and this can be discussed in a civilized manner, well at least in theory it can.

I am not saying the physics were right (or wrong for that matter) to begin with, I am just saying that the discussion is going nowhere every. single. time.
Almost nobody posts any evidence or examples of their claims (a replay video with the HUD shown would give some valuable input.
The slightest hint of comment on someones abilities to drive or the notion that SRF is there for a reason (If the game is too hard, turn on SRF) turns into a full blown flame war.

I know, there is a smartass in every thread as well who posts something similar to what I am posting here. But just as you feel your need to vent your anger, I feel my need to vent my frustration.

I am not directing this at someone specific. However, if you feel anger boiling up inside you while reading this, it is probably directed at you.

As you were!




Ps: I actually posted this in the one thread that still has some potential….
 
I watched my pre 1.03 replays yesterday and it looked wired. It looked slow, it looked like i was afraid to push car harder because of no reason. It doesn't looks like i was driving on the edge of grip (i swear i was back then!). Today, basing on what new physics show me in that replay, I think I would push that car harder.

Replay is only set of instructions, i think that 1.02 or 1.01 or 1.00 physics aren't carried over in replay and what you get, is old replay with new physics. So it's not an evidence utill you watch it on earlier build of GT6.
 
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I don't want to turn this into a "more or less realistic physics" discussion. The main thing is they've made a change that almost completely destroys the drivingexperience. IMO Overnight GT6 has changed from awesome to something very underwelming. Sad but true. I also don't understand how someone who's passionate about driving cars in anger can even be remotely satisfied with this. Before this update there was so much more feeling trough the wheel, you could actually feel the weight built up as the fronts gripped, now if you turn in there's always a lack of response and you feel basically nothing . The Sauber Mercedes at Spa felt grippy and nervous pre-update and now it jus understeers, understeers and keeps understeering, terrible and braking or lifting the throttle to get a weightshift gives almost no reaction. This feels really artificial and not like driving a racecar anymore. I've never complained about sound, standards, graphics or whatever because to me the physics is what really matters, what you feel when you're driving, how the car responds and reacts and before this update it was the best GT installement until now IMO. This change is just terrible, it was so much better.
 
Bad thing is that they don't reveal what they changed and was it only for some MR cars or all(or all cars). Some MR cars were ok before the batch and some were unrealistic.
 
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Raf Laureys
I don't want to turn this into a "more or less realistic physics" discussion. The main thing is they've made a change that almost completely destroys the drivingexperience. IMO Overnight GT6 has changed from awesome to something very underwelming. Sad but true. I also don't understand how someone who's passionate about driving cars in anger can even be remotely satisfied with this. Before this update there was so much more feeling trough the wheel, you could actually feel the weight built up as the fronts gripped, now if you turn in there's always a lack of response and you feel basically nothing . The Sauber Mercedes at Spa felt grippy and nervous pre-update and now it jus understeers, understeers and keeps understeering, terrible and braking or lifting the throttle to get a weightshift gives almost no reaction. This feels really artificial and not like driving a racecar anymore. I've never complained about sound, standards, graphics or whatever because to me the physics is what really matters, what you feel when you're driving, how the car responds and reacts and before this update it was the best GT installement until now IMO. This change is just terrible, it was so much better.
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Have you fiddled with the FFB settings?
Maybe if you set them to a stronger setting you will get some of the feel back.
 
I cannot tell for other cars but loved Stratos before and still fells stratos after 1.03. Car is death sentence if you don't do slow in fast out ,but now I got a feeling that there is a bit more time from a moment when you start felling that engine wants to overtake you ,to a moment when that actually happen and you're s*****d :D:D:D Dunno, if that's just placebo cause i got fun with DS3 and 3rd person view for last few days and now i'm back to DFGT and cabin view. FFb is on 5-6.

PS. as someone mentioned before this is 3rd or 4th thread about same thing > after 1.03 physics :D do we really need more threads about same problem ?
 
Sad but this "physics" tweak is only changed grip level on tires, not even stable change, if you go to Pit and change tires (same compound) game will change grip level higher than it was before pitstop. Amount of change is easily noticeable and on some cars it feels really bad, some it feel just better after that.
PD has to decide what grip level they want to offer, 'coz this changing model is really out of question.
 
I don't know if you noticed this, but you are talking about (again) ONLY for MR cars in this thread... Only the first post said about the change on all cars and not only MRs, but as all other ppl is talking about R8, Stratos, ecc... Guys, they are all MRs, the only one not MR-typed is the R8 road version which is 4WD but still, his engine is in the middle of the car, so if the problem was a bad distribution of weight on some MRs, it works also on Lambos, R8 and other 4WD mid-engine cars...

By my point of view (I drive with only ABS 1 and for road cars i usually downgrade tyre compound, DFGT as device), I didn't try again much the cars I've already driven before 1.03, so I can't say it. But for those I tried in these days (Genesis 3.8 track, X-Bow R, GT-R Black edition, DeltaWing 2013, other) I found them quite similar to what I thought to find:
- Genesis it's a bit understeerish if u drive clean, but got high power in the rear tires so it go more on oversteer than understeer if driven to the limit;
- X-Bow R honestly i thought to find it more grippy, but it can be related on a mistake on CM tyre physic for this car;
- GT-R Black edition it's a bit more oversteerish and, at the same time, more agile on the front than in GT5, so this might be correct;
- DeltaWing 2013 meh, u complain about cars are less fun, easier to drive and more understeerish after 1.03... Try this car like me, only with ABS 1 and push it to the limit, I got lot of troubles on the hotlap with it on Sarthe 2013 because the car just spin out very easily if you are too aggressive on the brakes and corner entrance. Plus, if you exagerate just a little bit on the throttle, the car will betray you.

Obviously this is only a my point of view, just like i said before and can be not right. Plus, I still didn't driven cars I've already driven before the patch other than NASCAR @ Motegi Speedway (which seems exactly the same to me, but the race is too simple to say).
 
I just tested a couple of single racing combos in my lobby. Nothing unusual to report. Everything just like a couple of days ago. No added grip after pit stops.
More testing..
 
Not sure if it's placebo effect kicking in after reading this thread, but I swear I was getting bad mid-corner understeer on an S13 I was using at Tsukuba. The turn 4 hairpin after the chicane, the hairpin before the back straight, and the final sweeper all seemed to give me more understeer than usual. I ended up having to trail brake in more and give a bit more gas mid corner to "throttle steer" the car to help it make the turn.

Maybe I was just having a bad day and initially entering the turns too fast, or lifting off the gas too much mid corner, but something didn't feel right.
 
I've tried to set up some racecars (Sauber Mercedes and Honda NSX) to get a more responsive front end by softening the dampers and antirollbars at the front and stiffening the rear and this helps a little but you can't take it to far and still that floaty feeling on turn in is really hard to dial out, if not impossible. The Sauber feels better though.
I've also done the crazy thing of mounting grippier tires at the front of a few hothatches and it made a few dull cars rather interesting to drive. The Renaultsport Clio actually gets a more realistic handling with lift-off oversteer that can be corrected with your right foot, just like in the real world. Comfort hards at the rear and comfort softs at the front.
This trick can be done with slower roadcars with some nice results but it's a bit to much if you have to mount less grippy tires at the rear of a racecar. You regain a sharp turning front end but the rear feels very loose and leaves almost no margin for error. I've tried it with the Chaparral 2D though. Race-hards at the front and sport-softs at the rear. With all aids off you have to be really carefull and you can slide a bit but not to much and though your going slower it felt better and more rewarding to drive than with the Original 1.03 physics. Still it shouldn't be the case that we have to try all these weird things to get the cars to feel more responsive. Specially because it felt just right before the update. Off course the changes I've tried are not usefull if you're looking for more speed or better laptimes, I was just trying these in search for a more rewarding drivingexperience.
 
Raf Laureys
I've tried to set up some racecars (Sauber Mercedes and Honda NSX) to get a more responsive front end by softening the dampers and antirollbars at the front and stiffening the rear and this helps a little but you can't take it to far and still that floaty feeling on turn in is really hard to dial out, if not impossible. The Sauber feels better though.
I've also done the crazy thing of mounting grippier tires at the front of a few hothatches and it made a few dull cars rather interesting to drive. The Renaultsport Clio actually gets a more realistic handling with lift-off oversteer that can be corrected with your right foot, just like in the real world. Comfort hards at the rear and comfort softs at the front.
This trick can be done with slower roadcars with some nice results but it's a bit to much if you have to mount less grippy tires at the rear of a racecar. You regain a sharp turning front end but the rear feels very loose and leaves almost no margin for error. I've tried it with the Chaparral 2D though. Race-hards at the front and sport-softs at the rear. With all aids off you have to be really carefull and you can slide a bit but not to much and though your going slower it felt better and more rewarding to drive than with the Original 1.03 physics. Still it shouldn't be the case that we have to try all these weird things to get the cars to feel more responsive. Specially because it felt just right before the update. Off course the changes I've tried are not usefull if you're looking for more speed or better laptimes, I was just trying these in search for a more rewarding drivingexperience.
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I drive almost all cars in GRAN TURISMO with different front and rear tires since GT4.👍
 
@Flaren89, Bug is felt easiest on MR car, but definitely affects ALL cars, ALL Drivetrains. (This different grip before and after pitstop)
 
In GT6 I can't put wider tires only in the front.
I can't adjust tire pressure to reduce grip at the back and get the right car balance.
I can only put (for example) front-sports medium and rear-sports hard tires.
But one degree grippier tires at the front is too much for some cars.
Therefor I need:
Racing soft tires
Racing soft tires 1
Racing soft tires 2
Racing soft tires 3
Racing medium tires
Racing medium tires 1
Racing medium tires 2
Racing medium tires 3
Racing hard tires
Racing hard tires 1
Racing hard tires 2
Racing hard tires 3
Sports soft tires
Sports soft tires 1
Sports soft tires 2
Sports soft tires 3
Sports medium tires
Sports medium tires 1
Sports medium tires 2
Sports medium tires 3
Sports hard tires
Sports hard tires 1
Sports hard tires 2
Sports hard tires 3
Comfort soft tires
Comfort soft tires 1
Comfort soft tires 2
Comfort soft tires 3
Comfort medium tires
Comfort medium tires 1
Comfort medium tires 2
Comfort medium tires 3
Comfort hard tires.
With these tires I will be able to adjust the right car balance that I want.
 
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sumbrownkid
So PD got the physics wrong the first time, as the R8 LMS Ultra threads on there would tell you, but yet now PD has got the physics wrong again according to some posters saying MR's are now more understeery?

As far as I feel about it, MR cars, especially the demon's child that is the R8 LMS Ultra feel more stable, but you can also take that as understeer in general. I have no qualms about it so far, but to those that like the oversteer aspects of MR cars I can understand the frustration.
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I think PD have struggled to simulate MR cars since GT5. I haven't driven the R8 LMS since the update but bought the Diablo GT2 the other day and it's a joke. Snap oversteer on lift off and power, I sold it straight away.

I understand that MR cars can be difficult to tame but a lot of them are undriveable in GT6
 
CarreraGT
I think PD have struggled to simulate MR cars since GT5. I haven't driven the R8 LMS since the update but bought the Diablo GT2 the other day and it's a joke. Snap oversteer on lift off and power, I sold it straight away.

I understand that MR cars can be difficult to tame but a lot of them are undriveable in GT6
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I just bought the diablo GT 2 today, what tires were you using as I don't get any of the what you experienced. Also are you using pad or wheel?
 
That's a good point actually, I find every single car I need to tune for quicker turn-in.
I remember back in GT5 and possibly GT6 1.02 I needed to tune some cars for quicker turn-in but also many I needed to tune to reduce snap-oversteer.
I might compare GT6 1.03 physics to GT4 physics, where you would be fighting understeer all the time.
But isn't this more realistic? In all of my driving experience, going too fast = understeer....
 
dtimefeel
That's a good point actually, I find every single car I need to tune for quicker turn-in.
I remember back in GT5 and possibly GT6 1.02 I needed to tune some cars for quicker turn-in but also many I needed to tune to reduce snap-oversteer.
I might compare GT6 1.03 physics to GT4 physics, where you would be fighting understeer all the time.
But isn't this more realistic? In all of my driving experience, going too fast = understeer....
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Not really, deeps on the tire. Everyday street tires yes. But racing tires such as SM, SS and so it takes a lot more to get them to that edge.
 
OdeFinn
@Flaren89, Bug is felt easiest on MR car, but definitely affects ALL cars, ALL Drivetrains. (This different grip before and after pitstop)
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Only seems to affect race tires though, I have ran the Willow event a bunch of times of SS tires and always just as fast after pitting as before. On race tires I have saw a noticeable difference in lap times.

I also do not get what people are talking about some huge difference in 1.02 to 1.03 I have saw no difference other than the wheel width being corrected, Cars that are heavy in the rear still are tricky just like before. My BTR laps times are unchanged before after 1.03 no noticeable difference in the feel of the car either.
 
OdeFinn
@HBR-Roadhog, easier to notice on racing tyres, but surely affects on all compounds.
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I have noticed the second set not wearing as long as the first when on SS tires but grip and lap times do not seem to be affected. I have ran the same race numerous times on SS tires in several different cars and am not seeing a dip in lap times after pitting, even see my fastest lap sometimes after pitting and always see comparable lap times.

On Race tires this has not been the case however, very noticeable difference in both grip and tire life after pitting
 
BLACK86
I just bought the diablo GT 2 today, what tires were you using as I don't get any of the what you experienced. Also are you using pad or wheel?
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I'm using a pad (which doesn't help I know). Tyres were stock so I assume racing hard
 
@HBR-Roadhog, use Brands Hatch Indy as testing track and you'll notice grip loss on other compounds also.
This bug is also on Off-line pitstops, even on Arcade drive thru pit changes grip :)
 
Raitziger
Bad thing is that they don't reveal what they changed and was it only for some MR cars or all(or all cars). Some MR cars were ok before the batch and some were unrealistic.
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Agreed, when a fundamental game system is changed there really should be build notes...

I've yet to run 1.03 but I'll check it out tonight.
 
A staggered set-up with wider tires on the rear than front will induce more understeer. The replacement wheel bug made all replacement wheels and tires the same width front and rear which would make the car oversteer more easily. Maybe those who are having problems with more understeer are feeling the effect of the wider rear tires from 1.03 fixing the bug. I am sure that this is not the last adjustment that PD will make to the cars physics so if you do not like it now then stay tunes. It may get better. Of course, it could also get a lot worse! :eek:
 

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