@homeforsummer: I'm glad you're having fun. Keep at it and we'll have a go at each other when you think you've come to your "final" conclusion.
Having a go at each other? Oh you cynic you
Anyway, my kind of "conclusion" is below.
The inside wheelspin may be a little excessive but you ve got to remember some of the older cars are on very skinny tyres of period specific compounds with alot of body roll and an open diff.
I've only driven modern cars in the game so to me the wheelspin is a little excessive and it's not a feeling I'm basing on cars with skinny tyres. Though you're right, the tyres do seem to be modelled well with regard to compound and things like width making a difference. But they're still a little
too keen to spin.
The extra feeling of weight transfer is perfect, but your right the car selection does help over GT5p and also the chase cam view is more descriptive of this phenomenon where as GT5p 's is utter crap!
I don't use chase cam view so that doesn't bother me
My verdict - GT5P vs. Enthusia with regard to physics
For starters, bear in mind that I only use a joypad. I'm sure both games are even more impressive with a wheel, and ideally that's the way they should be played, but at the same time they're both still games and not
actual real life, so they should be fun and give a sense of realism even with a humble pad. I'm happy to say that both games are enjoyable with a pad, GT5P maybe a little more so but I shall come to that in a second.
Suspension
Enthusia is clearly better with regard to modelling suspension movement. The little graphic that shows weighting (or lack of) on each wheel and centre of gravity is helpful for this, especially with the aforementioned wheelspin because you can back off the throttle to the exact amount to stop the wheel spinning. This would be something that you'd
feel in real life but in a game it's handy to have.
Gravity and weight
This ties in with the above because the effect of these rely very much on realistic suspension movement to give a realistic feeling. Again, EPR is better than GT5P in these areas. The jumping and landing physics in GT5P can be well illustrated by the jump at Eiger, and we all know that this is less than realistically represented. Enthusia does a much better job of taking off and landing, giving you the feeling of individual wheels leaving the ground and a good feeling of them landing again, or bouncing in some circumstances. It feels much easier to lose control on a heavy landing if you've got the wrong amount of throttle/brake/steering on.
Weight transfer is more pronounced too in EPR. Lifting or braking, or adding more throttle all have a large effect on cornering attitude.
Tyres and traction
This is a more even battle. GT5P was a massive step forward over GT4, the car feeling much more "connected" to the road, giving a better feeling of tyre scrub when over/understeering, not as easily spinning away power from a standstill and actually giving good forward motion even so out of a corner, when a car in GT4 often felt like it was just spinning away it's power. At the very least, it's predictable. EPR is less predictable for me. It's still very good - sliding and drifting physics certainly seem well modeled, as is the more realistic feeling when powering off from a standing start - there's wheelspin, but it's more easily measured than in GT5P, and miles ahead of GT4.
What I'm not as keen on, as mentioned in my earlier post, is the ease to which an inside wheel spins away it's power in a corner. A good example to illustrate this would be the Nissan Micra I started on. Regardless of skinny tyres or unsuitability of a shopping car to circuit racing, I find it hard to believe that on the limit of grip in a 60mph corner, a 1.4 Micra would have enough power to spin it's inside front wheel if you applied more throttle. Understeer? Sure, it's only got so much grip, but it's only got so much torque too. Even at lower speeds the spin is excessive. No low-powered FWD I've driven in real life has been as keen to spin it's inside wheel at good speed - say, 40mph accelerating hard out of a roundabout. Powerful hot hatches? Again, sure, but not city cars.
A stint in cars like the AW20 MR2 (mid-rear) and S14 Silvia (front-rear) showed the same problems, even when more and more lock was allowed with the limited slip diff. By and large, the AWD cars are fine for this trait.
If anyone (Wolfe?
) would like to enlighten me then please feel free. What I do notice is that the joypad is much less responsive in Enthusia than it is in GT5P, and harder to modulate brake and throttle. More on this below.
Steering and "chuckability"
I didn't know quite how to phrase this title, other than it's how realistic it feels to throw the car about, how quickly the car reacts to steering inputs etc. For this, I think GT5P, and indeed GT4 and games like LFS have a definite edge over EPR. The fact that GT5P is closer to LFS in this respect leads me to believe that GT5P is more accurate at representing this.
In GT5P, every action has a definite reaction. You turn, and the car follows, either following your line, understeering or oversteering depending on what you do with the other controls. EPR doesn't seem to do this. The steering seems less accurate, more wallowy (a feeling possibly heightened by the extra suspension movement the cars have increasing the time it takes for your action to result in a reaction). Maybe I've been spoilt, but I've never driven a car that's felt as vague as any of the cars in Enthusia, be they city cars or sports cars. In GT5P I rarely use full steering lock even on the little joystic, whereas I find myself basically on full steering lock quite a lot on Enthusia, just to get a reaction.
Joypad observation
Until I got a rumble joypad for GT5P, it felt oddly detached after playing GT4 and feeling constant vibrations depending on the surface and car. GT5P is now like this, but EPR isn't, and adds to the wallowy, weird feeling when cornering. I like vibrations as I go over kerbs, or when I'm accelerating in a FWD, as it gives a good "substitute" feeling for torque steer or the wheel moving in your hands. The only rumble effects that EPR betters GT in general for are those on the rally circuits, which give you a really good feeling of the surface you're on. So why not more of this on the normal circuits?
Conclusion
Considering everything between GT5P and EPR, I'd personally put them on a level. If EPR had the same feeling of the car being "alive" that GT5P does, then it would greatly, greatly enhance the game. As it is, the great physics are unfortunately dragged down by all the cars feeling sluggish to respond and wallowy, whether you're piloting an E30 M3 or a Toyota Landcruiser.
GT5P definitely has a lot to learn with regard to gravity, weight, more detailed suspension movement and all that jazz, though.
On a note unrelated to physics, at the moment I'd place Enthusia as my preferable game. Without doing a whole review on it, the tracks are great, the car choice is fantastic and the physics are real enough for my liking, so it's a more enjoyable game than GT5P. However, I can see it being mothballed when GT5 eventually arrives, but I suppose I can enjoy it for some time yet... and there's still GT4 waiting on my shelf, too.
($40 aussie so it cant be too expensive???) .....2nd steal (not borrow) the PS3 from your sister (chicks dont usually play PS3 that often do they?) and 3rd lock yourself in a room for 3 days (G25 is a must!!!!)........then give up some analysis on the physics 👍
But i am lucky that i have ps3 with software bc and used enthusia was only 8€ internet auction.
