GT7 and Virtual Reality Headsets

Assuming it's in the $300-$500 range and available on GT7, what is your interest level?

  • Love it, need it, gotta have it!

    Votes: 82 42.5%

  • Love it, but it's a little too expensive to justify for me.

    Votes: 36 18.7%

  • Skeptical but I'll keep an open mind and wait for the reviews.

    Votes: 47 24.4%

  • Not my thing, not interested.

    Votes: 28 14.5%
  • Total voters
    193
JKgo
...I was going through BBC as usual, and came across this quick interview with Sony's Kaz. Kaz Hirai, I mean. :P

He talks about "over 100" games ready for PSVR. No name droppings though...

http://www.bbc.com/news/technology-35249215
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So what he is telling us is that there are 100 games that were programmed to use a piece of hardware that didn't exist when the games were programmed...color me skeptical :boggled:
 
...Kaz probably meant to say 100+ VR "experiences" as that's the buzzword right now.

MustangManiac
So what he is telling us is that there are 100 games that were programmed to use a piece of hardware that didn't exist when the games were programmed...color me skeptical :boggled:
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...??

I'm sorry, fellow Mustang fan - I highlighted the part that I don't quite get.
 
MustangManiac
So what he is telling us is that there are 100 games that were programmed to use a piece of hardware that didn't exist when the games were programmed...color me skeptical :boggled:
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Hardware goes through prototyping phases where most of the software required is normalized, since they know PS4 capabilities. That is, if you have a notion of what kind of performance you'll need for a screen at X resolution refreshing at Y rate, you can develop the software.
PSVR prototype (previously called Morpheus) was unveiled to public in early 2014 by the way. They started delivering devkits in June 2014.

Hope that helps.
 
cutmeamango
Hardware goes through prototyping phases where most of the software required is normalized, since they know PS4 capabilities. That is, if you have a notion of what kind of performance you'll need for a screen at X resolution refreshing at Y rate, you can develop the software.
PSVR prototype (previously called Morpheus) was unveiled to public in early 2014 by the way. They started delivering devkits in June 2014.

Hope that helps.
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Did you mean June 2015 or was it 2014 really? I have been in the electrical engineering field for over 20 years and never seen a dev-kit released 1.5 years before hardware release, a lot can change in that time, especially in this field! Dev-kits and prototype hardware usually release at the same time, or close. Like I said, it's kind of hard to program for something when you don't have anything to test it on i.e. the hardware.
 
👎 Not interested at all! I Wish PD would just focus on making all premium cars, and adding Porsche to the car list, AI and, frame rate improved. GT7 would be a hit, Just goes to show PD is more focused on there interpretation of a great Sim instead of its customers. I'm done waiting on Sony and PD, Too busy enjoying the heck out of FM6.
 
MustangManiac
Did you mean June 2015 or was it 2014 really? I have been in the electrical engineering field for over 20 years and never seen a dev-kit released 1.5 years before hardware release, a lot can change in that time, especially in this field! Dev-kits and prototype hardware usually release at the same time, or close. Like I said, it's kind of hard to program for something when you don't have anything to test it on i.e. the hardware.
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Five lines and a link mate. Five lines, and a link. What's so hard about reading and fact-checking that? :confused::nervous:

Prototype HW was early 2014. Two thousand fourteen. MMXIV.

Devkits (which are the required software updates for signaling and what not, and prototype headsets), were sent to developers first and third party in mid 2014.
Morpheus support was added in April 2014 for the Unreal 4 SDK.

Hardware (again, the headset) became retail ready (that is, specifications, build, materials, homologation are final for the first consumer version) and entered mass production at the last quarter of 2015.

There you go, now you've seen it and a 20 years record is now shattered. Another revelation: That's common in R&D. And you may want to seat for the next one:
You could program for the PS4/PSVR and test it with an Oculus DK1 (or not HIL at all if you don't have the headset) due software specifications, portability and scalability! Must be crazy hearing all that at once. :eek:
 
cutmeamango
Five lines and a link mate. Five lines, and a link. What's so hard about reading and fact-checking that? :confused::nervous:

Prototype HW was early 2014. Two thousand fourteen. MMXIV.

Devkits (which are the required software updates for signaling and what not, and prototype headsets), were sent to developers first and third party in mid 2014.
Morpheus support was added in April 2014 for the Unreal 4 SDK.

Hardware (again, the headset) became retail ready (that is, specifications, build, materials, homologation are final for the first consumer version) and entered mass production at the last quarter of 2015.

There you go, now you've seen it and a 20 years record is now shattered. Another revelation: That's common in R&D. And you may want to seat for the next one:
You could program for the PS4/PSVR and test it with an Oculus DK1 (or not HIL at all if you don't have the headset) due software specifications, portability and scalability! Must be crazy hearing all that at once. :eek:
Click to expand...

Ah, I see, absolutely nothing has changed in the hardware from mid 14 to last quarter 15. That's hella lead time mate, especially in this business. We usually go from idea to production in a year max, but like I said, what do I know...I have only been doing this for 20+ years. By the way, might I ask just how many electronic devices you have been a part of producing in the past couple of decades?
 
MustangManiac
Ah, I see, absolutely nothing has changed in the hardware from mid 14 to last quarter 15. That's hella lead time mate, especially in this business. We usually go from idea to production in a year max, but like I said, what do I know...I have only been doing this for 20+ years. By the way, might I ask just how many electronic devices you have been a part of producing in the past couple of decades?
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Hahahaha You've got be ****ing kidding me. First, where do I say nothing has changed from initial prototypes for development and final hardware? There's even a clear separation in my wording between Prototype and Retail Ready.

Of course specs change, you can accompany its iterations and see that they increased pixel density in the center, higher refresh rate panels, added support for asynchronous morphing, better weight distribution and so on.

Thing is, VR is primarily a HEAD-MOUNTED DISPLAY. Being the veteran electrical engineering professional you are working in electronic devices, you should know what that means.
 
I do believe that a PS VR headset or equivalent could be actually good value, even at what seems like the high prices being charged by Sony, HTC, etc.

You see, if you were to buy a television that offered the most immersive experience possible, bearing in mind it would be nowhere near as immersive as a VR headset, it would something like a curved 3D television set, which would set you back around the same sort of price, if not more, for a larger screen size. Now, I get that you can't use a VR headset for every single game, or indeed, things that aren't games, but you wouldn't necessarily be using the 3D very often, I wouldn't think. Furthermore, I personally I don't like the curved effect - it does very little for me when standing in the optimum position, and then offers massive amounts of glare on the screen if you sit to the side of the centre position. With that in mind, the VR headset offers a massively more immersive experience, and so long as you don't mind being restricted to a smaller number of games, it will be something quite spectacular to use.

I guess a VR headset falls into the same category of accessory as a steering wheel. I really only use my wheel for a tiny number of games compared to how many I actually have, really mainly being Gran Turismo 6, DiRT Rally, Driveclub, Assetto Corsa, and Project CARS - five games out of the hundreds I have, but because it enhances the experience of that limited selection of games to such an extent compared to an ordinary controller, it's a worthwhile purchase. The VR headset serves a similar function - it enhances a relatively small number of games in a more specialised and impressive way than the more "generic" methods of 3D and curved screen (more likely 2D -> 3D conversion because of the dearth of 3D content). For me, I feel as though that would be worth it - VR + wheel would be an expensive but frankly peerless way of experiencing virtual motor racing.
 
chzsln485
I do believe that a PS VR headset or equivalent could be actually good value, even at what seems like the high prices being charged by Sony, HTC, etc.

You see, if you were to buy a television that offered the most immersive experience possible, bearing in mind it would be nowhere near as immersive as a VR headset, it would something like a curved 3D television set, which would set you back around the same sort of price, if not more, for a larger screen size. Now, I get that you can't use a VR headset for every single game, or indeed, things that aren't games, but you wouldn't necessarily be using the 3D very often, I wouldn't think. Furthermore, I personally I don't like the curved effect - it does very little for me when standing in the optimum position, and then offers massive amounts of glare on the screen if you sit to the side of the centre position. With that in mind, the VR headset offers a massively more immersive experience, and so long as you don't mind being restricted to a smaller number of games, it will be something quite spectacular to use.

I guess a VR headset falls into the same category of accessory as a steering wheel. I really only use my wheel for a tiny number of games compared to how many I actually have, really mainly being Gran Turismo 6, DiRT Rally, Driveclub, Assetto Corsa, and Project CARS - five games out of the hundreds I have, but because it enhances the experience of that limited selection of games to such an extent compared to an ordinary controller, it's a worthwhile purchase. The VR headset serves a similar function - it enhances a relatively small number of games in a more specialised and impressive way than the more "generic" methods of 3D and curved screen (more likely 2D -> 3D conversion because of the dearth of 3D content). For me, I feel as though that would be worth it - VR + wheel would be an expensive but frankly peerless way of experiencing virtual motor racing.
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There are other issues that affect VR headsets when it comes to racing though, especially with a wheel. For one thing, you can't see your buttons or your gear shifter and that could be a huge hindrance, maybe even making it impossible for some people to find it useful. Third party apps are also a thing with next generation games and really come in handy for uncluttering your screen and you can't see those either if you have a VR headset on. I've really grown accustomed to seeing information on my tablet and android phone and I'm not sure I want all that information back up on the screen and in my VR headset, cluttering up what is supposed to be an immersive experience. Another thing I think about is, when racing, how do I want to get the information about where other drivers are in relation to me? Do I really want to press a button to look behind me and see the back seat? Do I want to press different buttons and look beside me? What will that be like? Do I want arrows popping up on my screen? Would a spotter app ala iRacing be a better, less intrusive solution? I don't want devs to simply port games meant to work on a big screen without considering how it's going to play out in VR.
 
Imagine Euro Truck Simulator 2 on PS4. Backing up your rig and turning your head completely and people around you ask "what the hell are you doing?" and you casually reply "I'm backing up my rig.:sly:"

:lol::lol:
 
Tired Tyres
Erm? You just LOOK to your left and right! You LOOK at your mirrors, you LOOK at the dials. Can't help you with gears though. I use paddles so I don't have a problem. :cool:
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Pretty much. Also, I don't ever really look for or at my gear stick when driving in real life, and I'm unlikely to do the same with a racing wheel when playing a game (as long as I know where my shifter is in relation to my wheel, it'll be fine).
 
Tired Tyres
Erm? You just LOOK to your left and right! You LOOK at your mirrors, you LOOK at the dials. Can't help you with gears though. I use paddles so I don't have a problem. :cool:
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Mirrors only give a tiny glimpse of what you need to see and you only have fractions of a second to do it. Open wheelers have no central mirror either. The left/right mirrors on a Lotus 25 or Lotus 49, for example, are very small and not much use for looking behind you. If are superman and can check all three mirrors in just one second at 200 km/h, you will have moved 55 metres on the track and you have to reorient yourself at the same time so that's not very practical in an intense racing situation nor will the mirrors guarantee that you see all you need to see. The best solution for online will probably still be some kind of radar app like HeliCorsa from Assetto Corsa and the mini-map from GT5 because you don't have to move your head to use it just your eyes. And that still doesn't help with finding the gearshift and all your buttons. In a modern sim there are lots of buttons. Adjusting brake balance on the fly is common, turbo boost, engine start, exit and enter the track, cruising through menus making tuning adjustments in the pits and much more, all have to be done while wearing the headset.

It won't simply be a case of putting on your VR headset and everything will be the same except you're wearing a headset. Accomodations will need to be made in the game design so that it's possible to wear the headset and only have to access a tiny number of buttons while doing so otherwise it'll be just a hotlapping curiousity rather than a useful sim racer's tool.
 
That's funny. How do real race driver check their mirrors then? ;) Seriously, you check them on the approach to a corner before the breaking zone. You don't need to look at them again unless you screw up the exit. Want to check to your left or right to see if anyone is there. TURN YOUR HEAD.

Buttons on the wheel? I never look at my G29. Everything is where I know it is supposed to be and gets used for what it is set for in Assetto Corsa or Pro Cars. In both cases I switch off all on screen data in the interests of immersion. It won't be any different via VR. You are seeing a problem where there isn't one unless you have extra button boxes. I don't so there isn't one for me.
 
I have been using a DK2 Oculus Rift with iRacing for the last year. I have no problem finding buttons or finding the gear stick - muscle memory kicks in. As for mirrors, I use the car mirrors just like real life. Normally I have no HUD shown on the display but I do have a button on the steering wheel assigned to toggle on/off the info about gaps to my competitors. I used to have triple monitors but not any more, for me VR is way, way better. It's like real life, just blurrier and with a restricted (100 degrees or so) field of view - makes me smile every time I use it.
 
Tired Tyres
That's funny. How do real race driver check their mirrors then? ;) Seriously, you check them on the approach to a corner before the breaking zone. You don't need to look at them again unless you screw up the exit. Want to check to your left or right to see if anyone is there. TURN YOUR HEAD.

Buttons on the wheel? I never look at my G29. Everything is where I know it is supposed to be and gets used for what it is set for in Assetto Corsa or Pro Cars. In both cases I switch off all on screen data in the interests of immersion. It won't be any different via VR. You are seeing a problem where there isn't one unless you have extra button boxes. I don't so there isn't one for me.
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Mirrors don't tell the whole story. On many cars they are very small and very limited as to what you can see and I've never seen a game where they were adjustable. Something like HeliCorsa will always be better for tight sim racing than a visual check with or without VR. My point is that VR will be more effective and more widely used if it's adapted to racing games with sim racing in mind, and not just racing. Whatever is available to the non-VR user should be available to the VR user. I use many buttons on my G27 when driving. Tuning brake balance, handbrake, lights, toggling the rear view, ABS, TC, Turbo Boost etc. I can't accomodate all of them on the wheel so some have to go on the shifter. IMO that would be very awkward to have to find a button on my shifter in the heat of the battle.

marky5244
I have been using a DK2 Oculus Rift with iRacing for the last year. I have no problem finding buttons or finding the gear stick - muscle memory kicks in. As for mirrors, I use the car mirrors just like real life. Normally I have no HUD shown on the display but I do have a button on the steering wheel assigned to toggle on/off the info about gaps to my competitors. I used to have triple monitors but not any more, for me VR is way, way better. It's like real life, just blurrier and with a restricted (100 degrees or so) field of view - makes me smile every time I use it.
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How do you negotiate the menus in iRacing? Is it cumbersome when tuning for example?
 
Johnnypenso
Mirrors don't tell the whole story. On many cars they are very small and very limited as to what you can see and I've never seen a game where they were adjustable. Something like HeliCorsa will always be better for tight sim racing than a visual check with or without VR. My point is that VR will be more effective and more widely used if it's adapted to racing games with sim racing in mind, and not just racing. Whatever is available to the non-VR user should be available to the VR user. I use many buttons on my G27 when driving. Tuning brake balance, handbrake, lights, toggling the rear view, ABS, TC, Turbo Boost etc. I can't accomodate all of them on the wheel so some have to go on the shifter. IMO that would be very awkward to have to find a button on my shifter in the heat of the battle.

How do you negotiate the menus in iRacing? Is it cumbersome when tuning for example?
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The mirrors in iRacing are adjustable in the same way they would be in real life. The restricted rear visibility for the central rear view mirror is also like real life so it can be important to adjust it for the best view possible.

As for the menus, they're presented as a large flat screen hovering in front of you. So really, just like having a big 42" or something monitor in front of you. No problem to negotiate them.
 
marky5244
The mirrors in iRacing are adjustable in the same way they would be in real life. The restricted rear visibility for the central rear view mirror is also like real life so it can be important to adjust it for the best view possible.

As for the menus, they're presented as a large flat screen hovering in front of you. So really, just like having a big 42" or something monitor in front of you. No problem to negotiate them.
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Thanks. This is what I'm talking about when I say the game has to be designed with VR in mind. If I'm not mistaken, iRacing has a virtual mirror too right? In AC for example, you can move around quite a bit in the cockpit, to the point where the rear view mirror can't be seen and sometimes that's a better driving position, for me anyway. So things like a virtual mirror and adjustable exterior and interior mirrors should be standard in all VR racing games.
 
Johnnypenso
Thanks. This is what I'm talking about when I say the game has to be designed with VR in mind. If I'm not mistaken, iRacing has a virtual mirror too right? In AC for example, you can move around quite a bit in the cockpit, to the point where the rear view mirror can't be seen and sometimes that's a better driving position, for me anyway. So things like a virtual mirror and adjustable exterior and interior mirrors should be standard in all VR racing games.
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The virtual mirror doesn't work with the Rift in iRacing due to technical issues at the moment. I assume that at some point they will get it working. However, even if they do, I think I will keep it off as it will break immersion a bit. I want it to feel as close to driving a real car as possible.
 
just on the point of using wheels and VR sets.

I was having a little think about it. In all the sim games ive played (GT6, PCars) you select what wheel your using in your settings before you do anything.. right? (T300, T500, G27, G29 etc).

So what if the display represents the wheel youve selected on the virtual car..
now i know it wouldnt be overly glorious to be driving a LMP1 or a GT3 Car with a T500 on your virtual dash..
but it would solve a few peoples issue of not being able to have a representationof their wheel while using a VR set..

to be clear. im ok using my wheel and a VR set with any represented wheel. I know where my buttons are. And i use a Ferrari F1 wheel also.

Just thinking of the little guys. yay or nay?
 
MrF1
just on the point of using wheels and VR sets.

I was having a little think about it. In all the sim games ive played (GT6, PCars) you select what wheel your using in your settings before you do anything.. right? (T300, T500, G27, G29 etc).

So what if the display represents the wheel youve selected on the virtual car..
now i know it wouldnt be overly glorious to be driving a LMP1 or a GT3 Car with a T500 on your virtual dash..
but it would solve a few peoples issue of not being able to have a representationof their wheel while using a VR set..

to be clear. im ok using my wheel and a VR set with any represented wheel. I know where my buttons are. And i use a Ferrari F1 wheel also.

Just thinking of the little guys. yay or nay?
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The problem is not the wheel itself, it's not being able to see your hands.
 
...GameStop CEO lets slip possible PSVR launch window:



Fast forward to 3:35. He says: "Sony VR launching in fall."


...How much does he actually know, I wonder?
 

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