Here's the result of poor A+B spec events design...

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Nixo
Have to agree, psychics are great in gt5 but as a game it stinks. And the tuning options are just lame, plus the damage ? why bother if cant get the thing done correctly.
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It's like they never seen damage before. The amount of damage to a car should be based on how hard you hit, not how many times. If Forza could do that, and actually have parts fall off, then PD has no excuse. Unbreakable headlights and windows? Come on Kaz!
 
As previously mentioned need for speed shift had one too many 'f's in the last word of its title. The physics were quite frankly a shambles and it took a major work around to get the vehicles to handkerchief like anything acceptable.

However, if you could mix the physics of gt5 with the game/career mode of shift you wouldn't be far of an awesome game.
 
Shift 2 looks like it will quite good fun but a different type of fun. It is just a peception of how racing is but most racing drivers feel very calm while driving while Shift 2 is like the opposite. Ecerything is like in your face but it brings fun to the aracade aspect. The developers of Shift 2 really need to stop mouthing off the competition as they seem very bad at it and keep contradicting themselves on insulting themselves too. They insult GT5 cars but also forgot that GT has a bigger selection of cars people like they drive as they call them than Shift 2.

Then they go on about physics being more realstic than any other game out on console and now mention this in the article implying that real life scientific approach to driving a car does not apply in their game. They are just aiming for a fun racing experience, why not just say they are just going for a fun arcade driving simulation of real life race cars?

They say physics simulation is subjective, I agree but it should be subjective to how cars react in real life, not their guess at how they wanted real life race cars to act and what race drivers feel. They are only going to have egg on their face with their big claims as people will compare it to PC sims and consoles sims. They would be better marketing it at the people who will be interested in this type of game the most, the ones that think Forza or GT or PC sims are boring as they require skills used IRL driving. What is the point saying it is more realistic than these games? The arcade market is just as big as the sim market, I know Shift 2 is trying to differentiate itself from the Need For Speed games arcade appeal but Shift 2 is really an arcade style take on real life racing, not the usual open world ones.

GT5 events suffer due to lack of the PP system and different difficulty levels of AI. I see GT5 as just the barebones of things to come in GT series. Most of the work gone in GT5 is just the physics, premium cars and tracks, and weather system, as well as new network code and game OS. They got a good foundation to build the game element in. GT6 will hopefully be as big as GT4 in game events.
 
I am not complaining about any of it. When I was a kid all I had to play with was a stick! :yuck:
 
Bluez_Freak
http://www.videogamer.com/news/gt5_isnt_a_game_claims_shift_2_producer.html

Shift producers bullying GT5 as not being a game.

As much as I hate this it is poor a-spec design and the "limitless" decision for all events, (making GT5's competitive racing a rare thing) generating these kinds of statement from competitors.

Come on PD, make the races FUN..
the awesome cars are there, the physics are there... make it challenging like some of the special events and the licenses are... or the first seasonals who had very strict limitations were so much fun...
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I am not sure why everyone thinks it's PD's job to make it competitive. GT5 is easy or hard as you want it to be.

The 6th seasonal races are just as competitive and fun as the first one if you choose to do so. Take the initiative.
 
I read that statement as more of a defense of why Shift shouldn't be compared to GT5... sort of clarifying how despite being similar, they are really different products.

If anything I read it as a pre emptive move against those who will compare shift 2 to GT5 and say shift 2 sucks because it's physics are worse than GT5...

BTW I would remind everyone that while PD has not to my knowledge been quite so blunt about it's competition Kaz was quite dismissive when talking about T10 and Forza and the GT fans are about the most brutal when it comes to smack talking the competition... I mean just look at GT5 and Shift...
 
Whilst I agree to an extent it's hilarious to see Shift bagging on GT5's physics. The physics in GT5 might not be perfect but they're a million times better than the monstrosity that was the Shift 1 physics, and from what I've seen 2 is going to be more of the same uncontrolable madness.
 
I platinumed Need For Speed Shift and I've been playing GT5 since the day it came out and yeah, Shift was a heck of a lot more fun. It all boils down to the AI. Shift had pretty good AI, you could race against it, it was competitive. And because of that, they could have scalable difficulty - your competition was automatically chosen to be challenging; you couldn't just modify your car and leave it all in the dust by the first corner. That's the heart and soul of a racing game.

In GT5 the AI drives into you like braindead zombies, rarely acknowledging your existence. And it's anchored to the track so while you're spinning wildly off into the grass, the AI car continues on unaffected. So if you do try to choose a car that's not too overpowered, you'll just get rammed into oblivion. And so damned near everybody just modifies their cars and then enjoys the game purely by driving around the tracks. Unfortunately these are the same tracks that were in GT4, and whatever new ones they made for this game are already old hat after being in GT5 Prologue.

Shift 2 Unleashed is going to have TWICE as many tracks as the first game (and there were a ton of tracks in the first game), twice as many cars, improved physics, and improved graphics. I've got it pre-ordered and I'm damned excited about it.

Now if you'll excuse me I suppose I should check if my B-spec race is done (for the 300th time) so I can buy another car and race it around a track I'm bored sick of.
 
Devedander
I read that statement as more of a defense of why Shift shouldn't be compared to GT5... sort of clarifying how despite being similar, they are really different products.

If anything I read it as a pre emptive move against those who will compare shift 2 to GT5 and say shift 2 sucks because it's physics are worse than GT5...

BTW I would remind everyone that while PD has not to my knowledge been quite so blunt about it's competition Kaz was quite dismissive when talking about T10 and Forza and the GT fans are about the most brutal when it comes to smack talking the competition... I mean just look at GT5 and Shift...
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Thats exactly how i read it, people taking it as a complete smack of GT5 must have tunnel vision.
 
Maybe if t EA stopped trying to "make racing fun", they'd put out a decent simulator.

If you don't enjoy racing already, any racing simulator will seem very clinical and stale. But, if you already see the fun that exists in racing or even just driving, then a simulator is just a place for your racing to take place. The game is racing. It's actually more of a sport. Things that are added to 'make racing fun' usually detract from any kind of pure simulation, which is what the true fans of GT are after.

I would point out to this fellow that one of the most popular video games in the world isn't even considered a video game... Online Poker. I think that GT and racing sims in general are closer to online poker than they are to typical video games. They've taken a serious, competitive game, and put it in to digital form in its purest possible state, in an effort to recreate the real thing in the comfort of your rec room. Just like racing, there are a bunch of versions that 'make online poker more fun', but anyone who enjoys poker for what it is doesn't want that crap. They want poker, pure and simple. Clinical and stale as it may seem to those who aren't poker fans.
 
Bluez_Freak
Kaz lives in his own "world". He has a certain perception of things and does not bother what's happening around the gaming world.
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I think this is a very relevant point.

When I look at GT5 I see a game whose structure is 10 years out of date with next-gen graphics and gameplay.

Its an assembly of contradictions, I'm relieved that the game adds up to more than the sum of its parts... it really could have gone either way.

I wonder if Kaz takes enough feedback from people who've spent more time designing 'modern' games? I suspect not. I'm not trying to take away from his passion or vision because they're evident throughout the driving/collecting/viewing experiences that GT5 does so magnificently. The problem is that they're strung together in a pretty mediocre framework albeit with some pretty icons.
 
Forgetful
Maybe if t EA stopped trying to "make racing fun", they'd put out a decent simulator.
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That was the point of that article, they "EA" are not putting out a simulator nor think that Shift2 should be compared to GT5 since GT5 is a "simulator." Shift2 is just a game that should be fun, it's not be taken as a simulation of driving or racing the cars or tracks in game.

If you ask me if your looking for a driving simulator then Shift2 shouldn't be on your list and your not the person they are aiming their game at.
 
TenEightyOne
When I look at GT5 I see a game whose structure is 10 years out of date with next-gen graphics and gameplay.

Its an assembly of contradictions, I'm relieved that the game adds up to more than the sum of its parts... it really could have gone either way.
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Well said. And with all the discussions about how GT5 fell short in many ways, the fact remains that it really is better than the sum of its parts. It's a fun game, and as frustrating as some of these little things can be, we still totally enjoy it.

What I wonder is, how much will the game be advanced in the time before Forza 4 comes out at the end of the year. The next 10 months may be critical for GT5 and PD.
 
Forgetful
Maybe if t EA stopped trying to "make racing fun", they'd put out a decent simulator.
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And if PD stopped focusing on making a simulator they could make a fun game...

I think that's the point EA was making, they are different products...
 
Forgetful
Maybe if t EA stopped trying to "make racing fun", they'd put out a decent simulator.

If you don't enjoy racing already, any racing simulator will seem very clinical and stale. But, if you already see the fun that exists in racing or even just driving, then a simulator is just a place for your racing to take place. The game is racing. It's actually more of a sport. Things that are added to 'make racing fun' usually detract from any kind of pure simulation, which is what the true fans of GT are after.
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I highly doubt if anyone on this forum has any experience at all with a true racing simulator. These are all games...pure and simple. Even the PC sims that are a lot closer to being a simulator than GT5 are still "games".

A "real" racing simulator would bore most of the GT fan base to death because there aren't 300mph cars, XP, and indestructible moving obstacles to bounce off of. :)

The problem with GT5 is that it's neither an excellent game or any type of sim; PD needs to pick one and work towards that goal.
 
BoneSawTX
That was the point of that article, they "EA" are not putting out a simulator nor think that Shift2 should be compared to GT5 since GT5 is a "simulator." Shift2 is just a game that should be fun, it's not be taken as a simulation of driving or racing the cars or tracks in game.

If you ask me if your looking for a driving simulator then Shift2 shouldn't be on your list and your not the person they are aiming their game at.
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but aren't the Shift guys the ones who originally brought that on?

without them saying what they said when they first revealed Shift 2, nobody would even think of comparing it to Gran Turismo. i certainly didn't think of Gran Turismo when i played the first one.

i actually thought "what a complete rip-off of GRID".
i liked GRID a lot.
i traded Shift for Metal Gear Solid with a guy at work.
 
I remember the first time I played shift, I took a tight 90 degree corner at 120mph by using the handbrake and didnt even drift...

Yeh sure go NFS...

(I want Underground 3 :'( )
 
Shift one was HORRIBLE. Yeah it was fun for like 5 minutes till you realized you drifted every single corner. I don't think Shift will ever be as good as GT5.
 
sumbrownkid
Do the Shift people really have to be bullies to put their games on notice?

Why can't they make a good game, and have the game speak for itself...
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I agree. Let the game speak for itself. Attacking other games to try and put yours on top by pointing out flaws in theirs and saying absolutely nothing about yours is brutal. This is EXACTLY the way American Politics are. Don't vote for them because they would do this. Vote for me instead, but I'm not saying why!
 
oh man, he realy opened my eyes
im going to sell my GT5, and buy NFS





NOT
 
I'm glad people will call them out, PD needs competition to stay competitive in the videogame market. They have a good game in GT5 but not quite a great videogame. With all of it's faults I had a ton of fun playing Shift & I'm really looking forward to Shift 2!! It should be a blast!
 
What a surprise that the GT5 fanboys(that includes me) don't like shift on a gt5 forum. If we went to a shift forum Im sure that they are laughing because they don't care about if the physics is realistic. They just wanna win and bump into every car on the way with cool damage effects but no mechanical damage. And not have to play 24 hour races to complete the game. (I might be level 40 by christmas 2011).

Most people won't buy either game, but if they had to pick one, I reckon most would play shift. Its just much more appealing to the average player. And I dont blame them...
 
Lol nfs shift was a great game and shift 2 will be great aswell. All of you angry fanboys, get over it, its called marketing. Shift will definitely replace gt5 for me come march 25. Like seriously, aspec was done in half a month, bspec is garbage and boring. what else is there to do in gt5?
 
With this being said, Shift sucked. I had it for 2 day's and the car hopping and straight cut gear sound made me get rid of it. As for GT5 i will say the racing isn't fun or entertaining at all, hence why i've stopped doing A-spec and B-spec. I just can't be bothered to go any further. I just wait for the new seasonal races and get my money that way.

Mainly i race online now, and i must say if no one is lagging it's great fun. The closest i've come to feeling like im in a real race.

This guy really don't have any room to talk. EA sports has put out just as many bad games as good. They've ruined Madden, Army of 2 is terrible, and nearly every racing game besides NFSU2 that EA has made is complete garbage.

Basically if you pay 60$ for Shift 2, your an idiot.
 
Rdp616
With this being said, Shift sucked. I had it for 2 day's and the car hopping and straight cut gear sound made me get rid of it. As for GT5 i will say the racing isn't fun or entertaining at all, hence why i've stopped doing A-spec and B-spec. I just can't be bothered to go any further. I just wait for the new seasonal races and get my money that way.

Mainly i race online now, and i must say if no one is lagging it's great fun. The closest i've come to feeling like im in a real race.

This guy really don't have any room to talk. EA sports has put out just as many bad games as good. They've ruined Madden, Army of 2 is terrible, and nearly every racing game besides NFSU2 that EA has made is complete garbage.

Basically if you pay 60$ for Shift, your an idiot.
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If you pay 60 for shift your an idiot? Thats a VERY ignorant and immature thing to say. Theres almost 7 billion ppl on this planet, but if one of them buys a game that YOU dont like then theyre an idiot? Ppl have different opinions about whats worth 60 and whats not bud...
 
Nixo
Have to agree, psychics are great in gt5 but as a game it stinks. And the tuning options are just lame, plus the damage ? why bother if cant get the thing done correctly.
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I read shift is going to have improved damage. Wheels can come off

Slighly Mad Studios is taking that even further with Shift 2. "Last year we had visual damage and performance damage, but we had kid gloves on," says Abney. "This year we have full, race-ending-state damage engine. You can bounce tires, rip off axles -- really destroy your car and end your race day."
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http://www.1up.com/do/previewPage?cId=3182601

One aspect of a realistic simulation that GT5 lacks is crashing. It is said people watch races for the crashes. And the excitement of racing is the fear of crashing. If Shift get the crashing right that will make up for any deficits small deficits in handling.
 
Tho Im a big GT fan and alwasy will be Im really looking forward to Shift 2 becouse I really enjoyed Shift as I waited for GT5, and the AI aint stuck to the ground like theyr cars weight much more than u in fact it seems the oposite becouse theyre sometimes flying while u trying to find a line so u dont get them on ur head its kinda hillarious and cool lol, in GT5 u cant push the AI off the track, theyr like bricks. btw the AI in shift played a bit too agressive pushin off the track all the time :@

Edit: deleted a stupid comment lol
 
BPskeet69
If you pay 60 for shift your an idiot? Thats a VERY ignorant and immature thing to say. Theres almost 7 billion ppl on this planet, but if one of them buys a game that YOU dont like then theyre an idiot? Ppl have different opinions about whats worth 60 and whats not bud...
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Im not gonna get into an argument about this, you know aswell as i do Shift 2 is gonna be no different than the first one. But yet you say your done with Gt5 once that comes out. YOU, like all of the other Shift lovers will buy whatever EA shoves out the door. IMO i refuse to give EA anymore of my money. Sorry you don't fell the same way...Bud.
 
Rdp616
Im not gonna get into an argument about this, you know aswell as i do Shift 2 is gonna be no different than the first one. But yet you say your done with Gt5 once that comes out. YOU, like all of the other Shift lovers will buy whatever EA shoves out the door. IMO i refuse to give EA anymore of my money. Sorry you don't fell the same way...Bud.
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Lol i rarely buy EA games. I think Shift was the last one i bought lol. I liked Shift, so i really wont care if Shift 2 is like it. Im sure it'll be better though. Dont confuse me for a Shift nut hugger lol, i bought the game, got a platinum trophy in it and had a hell of a time doing so, stopped playing though once CoD came out. Im pretty open minded about games, unlike yourself, also unlike yourself, i dont call people idiots for buying games im not interested in. To each his own.
 
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