HEY PD! Shuffle Race Mode For User Created Lobbies Please

Discussion in 'Gran Turismo Sport' started by VBR, Jul 26, 2018.

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Would you like a Shuffle Race mode in GT Sport's public & private lobbies?

  1. Yes

    89.9%
  2. Meh

    7.3%
  3. No

    2.8%
  1. Rizla

    Rizla Premium

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    Really enjoyed watching Trial Mountain again. Was going... Brake, brake brake, wait for it, wait for it, Go go go... Like I was playing it myself. :lol: Still looks great.

    Oh aye, shuffle races... Absolutely. :tup:
     
  2. ShiftingGears

    ShiftingGears

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    It's a no brainer as far as I'm concerned. It has to be there.
     
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  3. Snaeper

    Snaeper Premium

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    So @VBR has had me fire up GT5 to watch my replays. Seems my car and credits have been wiped but my replay library was intact.

    Found my streak of win replays I'd done. First was a massive five lap race on a course creator track in a Mercedes E55(?) AMG against a Pagani Zonda, a pair of Ferrari 458's, a CTR Yellowbird and an SL55 AMG. As if learning the randomized track wasnt enough, rain was thrown into the mix. Despite a challenge from one of the Ferrari's and the Pagani, I walked away with an easy win due to keeping my car out of the walls. Sports Hard tires all around!

    Next was a BMW M3 (E92) a good car for sure, but it was at Le Mans which is not a track the car is strong in when facing an Audi R8 5.2, Lamborghini Countach 25th Aniv, Dodge Viper GTS, Ferrari California, and Merc SLS-AMG. The race started at night with a menacing flurry of snow that proved to be nothing. While all cars were in contention at one point, with a large early lead by the Mercedes, it would come down to a three way battle between the Merc, Viper and my M3, although the Lamborghini and Ferrari remained within striking distance. A hiccup by the Merc would give me the lead right before the final chicanes, giving me a a hard fought win.

    The final race would take place on the Top Gear Test Track against... Another five cars. All races were 6 cars total! Classic GT indeed with these! My Toyota Supra RZ might sound like an impressive ride, but a pair of Cobra 427's (one standard and one premium), another Viper GTS, an Audi R8 4 2 and a Lamborghini Murciealago LP 640 would prove stiff competition for my humble Japanese Grand Tourer..

    The Lamborghini retired early, but the lead was largely fought between the premium Cobra, Viper and Audi (the standard Cobra fell off pace and also retired) with my Supra hovering in the pack for most of the race. By the last lap it came down to a battle between the Viper and I, though, and went all the way to the final turn with the Viper's infamous rear end biting it hard as I powered around to steal the victory!

    I think my next car was a Fiat 500 so the race wasnt memorable.
     
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  4. AfraidRacer

    AfraidRacer

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    Haha, seems very interesting. Definitely want to see this!
     
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  5. Boston77

    Boston77

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    327
    I’ve met a lot of friends through shuffle racing. I still have many of those same friends that I race with today.
    Shuffle racing was incredibly fun. It was almost always competitive. It was tight, close quarters racing.
    It has given me some of the most memorable times I’ve ever had in the GT series and maybe all the other sims I’ve raced over the last 20 years. It was that good!
    To those that never had the chance to try it, I’m sorry you missed it. Perhaps one day it will make its return and we can all enjoy it together.
    :cheers:
     
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  6. oneloops

    oneloops

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    307
    Yes, please !
     
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  7. superwally

    superwally

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    Yes. Shuffle racing was the very best of GT. It was also a way to drive cars you would have otherwise not experienced.

    I don't think it's incompatible with Sport Mode at all, and in a way it predicated the way sport mode would be-there was a way to track driver performances and then apply those stats to the lobby, and there was a BOP system ranking the cars. I would love to see Race A be set up in Shuffle Mode fashion for the week with multiple available cars that get assigned based on driver performances as they race.
     
    KONTRAone likes this.
  8. AlanH49

    AlanH49

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    521
    An extra ‘Shuffle Race’ option would be great. Makes even more sense with so many cool Gr.X cars that rarely get a competitive outing.
     
    VBR likes this.
  9. VBR

    VBR Premium

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    Rizla, KONTRAone, The Cake and 6 others like this.
  10. eran0004

    eran0004

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    The point is that the challenge is to do the best you can with what you’re given, and that the races are more diverse. Sometimes the best drivers will have the worst cars and that will give average players a chance to compete for the win. Sometimes the worst drivers will have the best cars and that gives them a chance to not end up dead last for once.

    It’s a game mode for having fun races, rather than for serious competition.
     
  11. King Rocket

    King Rocket Premium

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    Shuffle was my favourite, I would love to see it make a return.
     
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  12. WestRoadZ

    WestRoadZ

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    Racing online in GT5 I was almost always was looking for lobbies named;

    Clean Shuffle, No Aids except ABS
    &
    Clean Spec, winner chooses car

    Of course with track vote in each. Would kill hours with race after race. Made some really good friends and memories back then :)
     
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  13. jagenigma

    jagenigma

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    There would be a hell of a difference in lap times for sure. For example, the samba bus being an n100 wouldn't get the same lap time as a miata being in the same class. Their top speed, cornering ability, and stability are just way too different. The classes being rated by power instead of pp is weird.
     
  14. gtpierre

    gtpierre

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    333
    I kind of understand the point now, but considering we have DR ranks and SR ranks, I would guess that as long as the matchmaking works fine, terrible, average or good players should have a chance to win the race against the people with who they are matched.

    I guess shuffle would work for some people and not for some others. I would rather have more one-make "daily race" so that I actually get to race all my cars
     
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  15. VBR

    VBR Premium

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    Shuffle was a race mode available in user-created lobbies in GT5, & I want that mode back in user-created lobbies In GT Sport. It has nothing to do with Sport Mode, & I'm not suggesting it be implemented there in any way shape or form.
     
  16. JayRS200

    JayRS200

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    385
    I can just imagining Kaz laughing at us right now at the fun we could be having.

    Was the last fun thing introduced to GTS the campaign?
     
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  17. Snaeper

    Snaeper Premium

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    Shuffle would be a mess in Sport Mode. Too much contact from drivers trying to come to terms with their cars during the race. DR's and SR's would plunge.

    But a perfect way to have entertaining, fair lobbies.
     
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  18. Voodoovaj

    Voodoovaj

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    Seems like an overwhelming favourite. Race specific BoP would be a great feature to accompany it.
     
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  19. Vegard

    Vegard

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    It would be a game mode best suited for open lobbies, with Sport Mode being the serious E-sport mode that it is.
    We often ran shuffle->spec->shuffle->spec with the winner picking the PP/spec car.

    A trick I used to gain an (unfair?) advantage was to ask for 100% water + rain and then allow Sport Hard tyres as the softest compound. Most people would fit the Sport Hards, not knowing that they tended to aquaplane in the wet. Meanwhile I'd storm through the field with my Comfort Soft shod* car.

    *is this a correct use of the word?
     
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  20. VBR

    VBR Premium

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    I was in a Tuning Prohibited race in GT5 once when a similar situation occurred. The weather was on random & raining, but there was 25% surface water to start with, & the room was set to SH tyres. I knew from experience that if it went up to about 30% then CS tyres would have an advantage. Of course, I chose a 4WD car, & I got one that was slightly under the PP requirement as I knew it was fast & stable. I gambled on the CS tyres as well, & the surface water did indeed increase. I ended up going from last but one out of a grid of fifteen to second place on the Nord in one lap against some very fast Shuffle & Spec regulars. I checked everyone else's tyres in the replay, & nobody except me had thought to switch to CS tyres. Sometimes winning a race, or finishing on the podium, is decided by tactics before the race has even begun...


    :cool:


    Yep, that's the right word.
     
    Last edited: Apr 8, 2019
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  21. Satomiblood

    Satomiblood

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    Bolded for emphasis.
     
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  22. CRN_G-TR

    CRN_G-TR Premium

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    16 people in Lobby Autoshuffles To Dirt Track, 1 guy left in Lobby :gtpflag:
     
  23. Boston77

    Boston77

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    327
    You get to pick the track(s) you want.

    The cars are what are “shuffled” each race.
     
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  24. NJ72

    NJ72

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    I used to love shuffle racing. The massive headache when you got the Dodge RAM pickup or the AC Cobra was immense.

    Likewise the dirty shuffle racing was some of the best fun I've had on a racing game. Period.

    I've created a few dirty N300 lobbies which have been fun, anything up to N500 works, but the problem is that people don't read the room title and get annoyed when you start driving dirty...
     
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  25. VBR

    VBR Premium

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    Shuffle.jpg
     
  26. NJ72

    NJ72

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    This guy gets it! lol

    Thinking back, there was a LOT of tactics to doing well in a dirty shuffle room. There's a fine art to driving like a complete idiot and getting away with it. Knowing which corners to cut, exactly when to try a pit maneuver - how to avoid the people who just wouldn't brake (mind you, still need to do that in some Sport mode races...)
     
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  27. HarVee

    HarVee

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    Though I'm not currently playing GTS, I voted yes. The most fun I've ever had in online mode was in GT5 when I'd get a slow car and manage to get into the top 3 position. Or in rarer occasions I'd get one the goofy cars like the midget. It was a way of allowing me to experience and 'test drive' several of the cars I'd probably never consider otherwise. There was also the sense of strategy that the single player campaign lacked.

    If this comes back as a feature, it would definitely entice me to play.
     
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  28. RAYzRAYz

    RAYzRAYz

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    I got an email that VBR commented in an old GT5 shuffle thread. It made me log back into Gtplanet after years of being away ~2013 or ~2014.

    Clean Shuffle race lobbies were by far the most fun I've ever had in any online racing game. It somehow attracted the fastest and cleanest drivers in GT5. When you get home and find that lobby filled with fast and clean drivers, you just join and have a blast for hours.

    When you are placed in an even playing field, no modding, using similar cars, street tires, you had to be fast to win. When I first joined shuffle lobbies, I was bottom 20% every race, then after sometime, I found myself to be top 3 most of the time, even after reverse grids.

    I'm pretty sure the shuffle racing lobbies helped me get fast enough to qualify for the US finals 2013 GT Academy (Thanks to those super fast drivers I found myself racing with every day). I have not touched GT in years but I would go out and buy an entire setup if shuffle races came back!

    Bring back Shuffle!
     
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  29. VBR

    VBR Premium

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    There were 3 main options; the first was setting the Game Mode to Shuffle Race (all races were then locked to Reverse Grid Based on Previous Results).

    Shuffle 1.jpg


    The second main option was the Shuffle Base, which was essentially the same as choosing the PP for the pool of cars. All depending on the setting, the cars were assigned either CS or SH tyres. You couldn't change this, which was a good thing as it became the perfect antidote to the Racing Soft Brigade mentality on show in most other lobbies.

    Shuffle 2.jpg


    The third main option was the Shuffle Ratio. This setting affected how big the pool of available cars was & thus the difference in speed between them. Choose a higher number, & you'd end up with lots of cars with many seconds difference between the fastest & slowest ones assigned. Choose a smaller number, & you'd have fewer cars but ones closer in performance. The general idea was that faster drivers were given slower cars, & slower drivers were given faster cars (based on their finishing position in the last race). It didn't always work how it was intended to 100% of the time, but it sure was a heck of a lot of fun & produced some incredibly interesting races!

    Shuffle 3.jpg


    The problem with most Shuffle lobbies was that the host wasn't discerning enough to set the Shuffle Ratio properly; the default setting of 5 produced way too much of a difference in speed between the cars, & the field spread out far too much during the race. A setting of 1 gave too many of the same cars in the pool, while a setting of 3 would start to produce too much of a difference in the relative speed between the cars again. My favourite setting was 2, as it gave out a great selection of cars that were also, for the most part, fairly evenly matched. With the exception of Grid Order, all the other settings you can see in the screenshots above were available for use in Shuffle Mode as well.



    :tup:
     
    MIE1992 likes this.
  30. MIE1992

    MIE1992

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    Fascinating. In that case, here would be my proposal to revive shuffle races using the more current system.

    First off, the Shuffle Base could be based around the power/weight ratio, rather than PP or category, and would be set as the approximate mean of the cars' p/w ratio. In this regard, no category would be "off-limits." Next, the Shuffle Ratio could be the maximum amount the car with the worst power/weight ratio could have that metric differ from the car with the best power/weight ratio, which would be set as a parameter of hp/lb (or bhp/kg). I.e. the shuffle ratio would be the range to the shuffle base's mean.


    EDIT: Here's also my proposal for reviving Quick Match from GT6.

    To begin, this would be separate from Sports Mode, as it'd be unranked multiplayer, like the lobbies. There would be no qualifying, as in the GT6 version. When selecting Quick Match, you'd be randomly placed into a certain race type, all with various motifs based on events in the campaign. You also will be able to pick between up to ten provided cars. (Some events will have less available cars as there may be less than ten to fit the motif, such as one-make events.) So for example, you could be placed into a "J-Sports Meeting" race wherein you can only pick between unmodified Japanese road cars within N300, meaning your choices could include various Nissan Skyline GT-Rs (likely not the R35 though), Supras, and so on. The track would similarly follow this motif, with it being a track from the campaign's version of the event. So for this example, the track could be Fuji Speedway.

    Specifically within this example, and using cars from the most recent version of GT Sport, the vehicles I'd personally designate as provided cars would be the following:

    Honda Civic Type R '15
    Honda NSX Type R '92
    Mazda RX-7 Spirit R Type A '02
    Mitsubishi Lancer Evolution X Final Edition '15
    Nissan Fairlady Z Version S '07
    Nissan Skyline GT-R V-Spec II Nur '02
    Subaru Impreza 22B-STI '98
    Subaru WRX STI Type S '15
    Toyota Supra RZ '97
    Toyota GR Supra RZ '19
     
    Last edited: Apr 21, 2019
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