How good we be in real life?

[Nightmage82]

I can't help watching F1 and other car races on tv and thinking that given any car there i would be so much better than most of those drivers. does anyone else think the same?

The amount of hours we put into gran turismo, perfecting racing lines, using different types of cars, our knowledge of setups, gearings, all that. we must be at least equal to some of the top people there... when i see people like villneuve crashing their cars all the time or coulthard not being able to finish a race, it just makes me think these peepz have been given their places because of their contacts and don't deserve to be there because there are plenty more people around who are better but don't have a chance to show their skills.

i went karting recently and not only did i win the races, but i lapped everyone there at least once (even the second place person), and i wasn't racing complete noobs either. and im sure that is almost entirely thanks to gran turismo, different controller but same principles. in fact it was much easier because of the excellent view and the feedback from the kart.

who agrees with me?

 

[chinwa00]

Well sure, when you accomplish something on GT3 you feel that you can compete with professionals, but you should remember that this is only a "simulator." Which means, this game isnt perfect, and you can get away with things on the game that you cant in real life. I'm not saying that it doesnt teach you anything, but most F1 drivers go through tough training just as we do. I just dont think "gold club" members can compete with real experienced drivers.

 

[Driftster]

Ok seriously, alot of the things that are factors in GT3, such as gear ratio's wouldn't serve us much of a purpose, considering GT3 is host to the "Magic transmission" in which you can add .002 teeth to a gear and get any ratio you want. You also can't forget the whole issue of body roll in a car, which isn't well played out in GT3. I do agree with you on the fact that Gran turismo has helped make some better racers out there. Because I personally have been able to go to a nearby open road course and did better than quite a few seasoned vetrans out there. Of course the ones with the highly tuned cars surpassed me, but I was lapping cars I shouldn't have a chance at. I do owe that to gaming, simply because gaming gives you excellent hand eye coordinate and superb reflexes.

 

[Nightmage82]

heh thanks for the responses so far, yeah i was expecting people to say "well just cause u are good in the game, don't think u'd be a don in real life" but my driving track+road has improved immensely because of this game (and one or two others) and i'd just love to get a shot at the big stuff cause it can't be that much harder, though i know its probably unlikely.

 

[T13R]

Well I find that if u are in good shape, dont weigh too much, and been playin racing games for years (specially GT3) then I think someone can have gained enough skill to be fast in real life. Its easier to find the good racing lines. But thats where it ends. There are still so many things to learn to become a very good race car driver. Heal-toe is one of these things. Ive been to a racing school, and mastering heal-toe is crucial for Formula type cars with unsynchronised gear boxes. Im not saying F1 tho. And Im not saying its not possible to be competitive in real life, but you need alot more experience than GT3. Go-karting is pretty good experience. I weigh some 40 lbs more than my brother, but with all this GT3 playing, I was able to easily beat him, and my cousin at go-karting. My cousin is like 50 lbs lighter than me. So yea, be a skinny bastad, with tough forearms and a good neck, and your set

 

[Solid Lifters]

Personally, I think you just had the "racer" in you come out finally. After all, you did join a forum for GT which proves that car racing is very meaningful to you like it is for me.

The GT game series can never simulate the real racing experience but it does give good pointers on the proper mechanics of racing, to some degree.

Remember, those F1 cars can reach six times the force of gravity, 6g's, around corners and count how many corners times the number of laps and...(Solid Lifters reaches for a vomit bag.)

Continued success on your new racing career.

 

[TruenoAE86]

Originally posted by Nightmage82
I can't help watching F1 and other car races on tv and thinking that given any car there i would be so much better than most of those drivers. does anyone else think the same?

I went karting recently and not only did i win the races, but i lapped everyone there at least once (even the second place person), and i wasn't racing complete noobs either. and im sure that is almost entirely thanks to gran turismo, different controller but same principles. in fact it was much easier because of the excellent view and the feedback from the kart.

who agrees with me?

I would say that GT3 is a good trainer but it's not nearly as good as driving a real car on a real racetrack. GT3 can definitely improve your driving; it will give a sense of what a car will do in certain conditions. Still, 1 hour in a real racecar will be more effective than 100 hours of GT3.


Just a reality check; no offence, but in no way would any of us be better drivers than F1 drivers, or any other pro driver (unless you happen to be a pro driver yourself). They are there for a reason, and most of them started driving at a very, very young age and really are the best in the world. Do you ever watch the Olympics and say “hey, I could run faster than that guy!” or “lift more weight”. It’s the same with auto-racing. You have to start young and you have to be committed. Too bad it’s so expensive; it’s really not something that everyone can do.

 

[xAkirax2004]

never thought of it like that

 

[chinwa00]

After looking at my first post, i realize that it didnt come out right. I feel much of the way TruenoAE86 does. btw, do you actually own a 86? I'm 15, and I should have enough money next month.

 

[Injected8706]

Originally posted by TruenoAE86
I would say that GT3 is a good trainer but it's not nearly as good as driving a real car on a real racetrack. GT3 can definitely improve your driving; it will give a sense of what a car will do in certain conditions. Still, 1 hour in a real racecar will be more effective than 100 hours of GT3.


Just a reality check; no offence, but in no way would any of us be better drivers than F1 drivers, or any other pro driver (unless you happen to be a pro driver yourself). They are there for a reason, and most of them started driving at a very, very young age and really are the best in the world. Do you ever watch the Olympics and say “hey, I could run faster than that guy!” or “lift more weight”. It’s the same with auto-racing. You have to start young and you have to be committed. Too bad it’s so expensive; it’s really not something that everyone can do.

👍 👍 well said

 

[T13R]

Originally posted by TruenoAE86
Do you ever watch the Olympics and say “hey, I could run faster than that guy!” or “lift more weight”. It’s the same with auto-racing. You have to start young and you have to be committed. Too bad it’s so expensive; it’s really not something that everyone can do.

Maybe if PD would do "The Ultimate Olympic Simulator" I would say "I can run faster than that guy!" and, "I can lift more weight than that guy!"

Just a thought..

 

[Super-Supra]

I would have to agree with you, There are so many stupid driver's who can't drive. I'm sure, that if some of us Gran Turismo 3 Racer's were given chances we would be the best.

 

[Bollocks#999]

Originally posted by Nightmage82
I can't help watching F1 and other car races on tv and thinking that given any car there i would be so much better than most of those drivers. does anyone else think the same?

Lets see you try and beat these guys, they have been doing it all their lives and not just on a computer game

Originally posted by Nightmage82
i went karting recently and not only did i win the races, but i lapped everyone there at least once (even the second place person), and i wasn't racing complete noobs either. and im sure that is almost entirely thanks to gran turismo, different controller but same principles. in fact it was much easier because of the excellent view and the feedback from the kart.

come down to my local go-kart track (if you are ever over this way ) and I'll find you some competition, and I'll gaurantee you that you will not come close to lapping these guys
These guys are the best indoor karters in Victoria, with other centres having to cheat to beat us

so sorry i dont agree with you on these 2 points

 

[Vasco]

Originally posted by TruenoAE86
I would say that GT3 is a good trainer but it's not nearly as good as driving a real car on a real racetrack. GT3 can definitely improve your driving; it will give a sense of what a car will do in certain conditions. Still, 1 hour in a real racecar will be more effective than 100 hours of GT3.


Just a reality check; no offence, but in no way would any of us be better drivers than F1 drivers, or any other pro driver (unless you happen to be a pro driver yourself). They are there for a reason, and most of them started driving at a very, very young age and really are the best in the world. Do you ever watch the Olympics and say “hey, I could run faster than that guy!” or “lift more weight”. It’s the same with auto-racing. You have to start young and you have to be committed. Too bad it’s so expensive; it’s really not something that everyone can do.

 

[ving]

nah, things like g-forces arent the same in gt3.... ie there isnt any...
and the feedback on the whell is going to be totally different too.
wind, bugs, debris on the road like car parts after crashes andoil spills....

its nice and safe on yer lounge playing but there are certain realities of RL that just arent in the game.

but it makes me wanna try

 

[Rat Bastid]

I've always had good instincts as a driver, 15+ years & not ONE accident (thank God). The game may have helped some, but it's not REAL. There's no oil on the road, squashed animals, kids on bikes, cops, uneven pavement, etc. etc. There's no risk of any damage or injury to anyone!
If you're on a road or track, your anticipation/reaction time shrinks the faster you go. Add to that constsantly getting jolted by a super-stiff suspension, full cage frame & tires, G-forces, 100+ MPH, EVERYBODY wants to pass you. Watch your marks, watch your mirrors, watch 50' ahead, watch your guages...... Yeah it's intense & I do it as much as I can (within reason) in my daily driver.
All I'm trying to say is it's not as easy as it looks & I have huge respect for any pro driver. (You should see me when some idiot tells me they watch NASCAR for the wrecks.)

 

[Naoki]

Originally posted by Rat Bastid
I've always had good instincts as a driver, 15+ years & not ONE accident (thank God). The game may have helped some, but it's not REAL. There's no oil on the road, squashed animals, kids on bikes, cops, uneven pavement, etc. etc. There's no risk of any damage or injury to anyone!
If you're on a road or track, your anticipation/reaction time shrinks the faster you go. Add to that constsantly getting jolted by a super-stiff suspension, full cage frame & tires, G-forces, 100+ MPH, EVERYBODY wants to pass you. Watch your marks, watch your mirrors, watch 50' ahead, watch your guages...... Yeah it's intense & I do it as much as I can (within reason) in my daily driver.
All I'm trying to say is it's not as easy as it looks & I have huge respect for any pro driver. (You should see me when some idiot tells me they watch NASCAR for the wrecks.)

👍

 

[Rat Bastid]

Thank you.

 

[Drift260Z]

Originally posted by Nightmage82
I can't help watching F1 and other car races on tv and thinking that given any car there i would be so much better than most of those drivers. does anyone else think the same?

The amount of hours we put into gran turismo, perfecting racing lines, using different types of cars, our knowledge of setups, gearings, all that. we must be at least equal to some of the top people there... when i see people like villneuve crashing their cars all the time or coulthard not being able to finish a race, it just makes me think these peepz have been given their places because of their contacts and don't deserve to be there because there are plenty more people around who are better but don't have a chance to show their skills.

i went karting recently and not only did i win the races, but i lapped everyone there at least once (even the second place person), and i wasn't racing complete noobs either. and im sure that is almost entirely thanks to gran turismo, different controller but same principles. in fact it was much easier because of the excellent view and the feedback from the kart.

who agrees with me?

Umm, I don't. I say just as people before me said, IT'S A VIDEO GAME. I want to learn how to drift(I'm 15 years old), I watch, no, worship the D1GP and I have been watching Keiichi, Taniguchi, Ueo, Nomuken, ect. and I am studying their technique and I can do the same stuff they do, except on Gran Turismo 3. So what you just said is kinda like me watching Ueo and Keiichi(Drift King) on a Option(2) video/Drift Tengoku video and saying "Phhbbt, I can do better than they can" when I know very well it would take me in excess of 5-9 years(be drifting 2-4 days each week) as to be skilled enough to compete in the D1GP(championship for drifting). It is just plain ridiclous. Sorry if this came off as a flame.

 

[Driftster]

Originally posted by Drift260Z
Umm, I don't. I say just as people before me said, IT'S A VIDEO GAME. I want to learn how to drift(I'm 15 years old), I watch, no, worship the D1GP and I have been watching Keiichi, Taniguchi, Ueo, Nomuken, ect. and I am studying their technique and I can do the same stuff they do, except on Gran Turismo 3. So what you just said is kinda like me watching Ueo and Keiichi(Drift King) on a Option(2) video/Drift Tengoku video and saying "Phhbbt, I can do better than they can" when I know very well it would take me in excess of 5-9 years(be drifting 2-4 days each week) as to be skilled enough to compete in the D1GP(championship for drifting). It is just plain ridiclous. Sorry if this came off as a flame.

Drift260Z, if you can finish a F1 race no matter what place you're in. Technically you did better than coulthard. No it's not like you watching Ueo and Keiichi Drifting. Because that takes technique. Finishing a race doesn't. As far as you being able to "do the stuff they do,except on Gran Turismo 3", no you can't. They have this quaint little device called a clutch, Gran Turismo 3 doesn't, which sends that concept out the window. Now your whole idea of you watching, not participating in, just spectating from a distance further than the fans in the nose bleed section is identical in principle that nightmage was talking about. He believes that playing GT3 will improve his driving skills, and I agree with him. You on the other hand think watching a video, which isn't an instructional video by the way, will help you learn a type of motorsport. You've successfully intertwined yourself within a paradox.

 

[Drift260Z]

Originally posted by Nightmage82
I can't help watching F1 and other car races on tv and thinking that given any car there i would be so much better than most of those drivers. does anyone else think the same?

The amount of hours we put into gran turismo, perfecting racing lines, using different types of cars, our knowledge of setups, gearings, all that. we must be at least equal to some of the top people there... when i see people like villneuve crashing their cars all the time or coulthard not being able to finish a race, it just makes me think these peepz have been given their places because of their contacts and don't deserve to be there because there are plenty more people around who are better but don't have a chance to show their skills.

i went karting recently and not only did i win the races, but i lapped everyone there at least once (even the second place person), and i wasn't racing complete noobs either. and im sure that is almost entirely thanks to gran turismo, different controller but same principles. in fact it was much easier because of the excellent view and the feedback from the kart.

who agrees with me?

Umm, I don't. I say just as people before me said, IT'S A VIDEO GAME. I want to learn how to drift(I'm 15 years old), I watch, no, worship the D1GP and I have been watching Keiichi, Taniguchi, Ueo, Nomuken, ect. and I am studying their technique and I can do the same stuff they do, except on Gran Turismo 3. So what you just said is kinda like me watching Ueo and Keiichi(Drift King) on a Option(2) video/Drift Tengoku video and saying "Phhbbt, I can do better than they can" when I know very well it would take me in excess of 5-9 years(be drifting 2-4 days each week) as to be skilled enough to compete in the D1GP(championship for drifting). It is just plain ridiclous. Sorry if this came off as a flame.

 

[Drift260Z]

Originally posted by Driftster
Drift260Z, if you can finish a F1 race no matter what place you're in. Technically you did better than coulthard. No it's not like you watching Ueo and Keiichi Drifting. Because that takes technique. Finishing a race doesn't. As far as you being able to "do the stuff they do,except on Gran Turismo 3", no you can't. They have this quaint little device called a clutch, Gran Turismo 3 doesn't, which sends that concept out the window. Now your whole idea of you watching, not participating in, just spectating from a distance further than the fans in the nose bleed section is identical in principle that nightmage was talking about. He believes that playing GT3 will improve his driving skills, and I agree with him. You on the other hand think watching a video, which isn't an instructional video by the way, will help you learn a type of motorsport. You've successfully intertwined yourself within a paradox.

1st sorry about the double post. Hey Driftster, did I say GT3 WOULDN'T improve your driving skills, no I didn't even touch on that subject, but do I think it's true, to an extent, HELL YES. Also about the D1GP drifting in Gran Turismo, it kind of came out wrong, I meant that minus the clutch, I just use the e-brake and a lot of power to make up for it as much as I can. Also Nightmage82 said he watches it sometimes and think to himself that "he would be so much better than these guys" not that he could finish a race. They have been doing this as their JOB in REAL LIFE, not in a VIDEO GAME as a HOBBY. I know anyone can just finish the race, even that though would be a challenge because I can garauntee that none of us on this board has driven a Formula 1 spec car. Just think how hard it would be to control a car that accelerates that fast, sticks to the road like glue, and has that quick of a steering ratio, it would be just a bit hard even finishing in my opinion.

 

[Duke]

I'll tell you this. My college roomate ended up being senior Tech Editor for Car & Driver. His name was Don Schroeder. He drove a lot of fast cars, he had training, he was an automotive engineer so he understood the technical limits of the cars, and he had lots of experience testing cars at those limits.

He was killed testing a Mercedes at 150+ mph.

One of his fellow C/D writers was given an opportunity to drive a Champ car, similar to an F1 car. The guy managed one lap around an easy course before spinning it off the track the first time he put the throttle to it. One glance at the telemetry, and the real driver said "well of course you spun, you were still in second gear when the boost came in."

So, if you think that playing this game will make you a race driver, you're insane. Grassroots Motorsports has said that GT3 and a good force-feedback wheel is helpful in keeping you in practice over the off-season... but they're assuming you already have real racing experience, not that you're getting it from GT3.

No offense, but when you younger guys start getting your licenses, don't think for one minute that you're prepared to drive like that in real life. It's a totally different ballgame.

 

[Pupik]

Originally posted by neon_duke
I'll tell you this. My college roomate ended up being senior Tech Editor for Car & Driver. His name was Don Schroeder. He drove a lot of fast cars, he had training, he was an automotive engineer so he understood the technical limits of the cars, and he had lots of experience testing cars at those limits.

He was killed testing a Mercedes at 150+ mph.

My very late condolences, Duke. I remember opening that issue proclaiming what had happened, and I couldn't pick up a controller or magazine for days. You figure that happens to race drivers, not magazine editors.

Anyhow, here's what I thought about a year ago.

 

[Nightmage82]

Originally posted by neon_duke
No offense, but when you younger guys start getting your licenses, don't think for one minute that you're prepared to drive like that in real life. It's a totally different ballgame.

hehe having had a license for over 4 years now and with experience on the track and daily experience in virtually any kind of driving conditions i wouldn't say im a total novice.

admitedly im not saying i could jump into a champ car and instantly feel at home and be able to demolish the all time lap record after a few minutes.

when i first started driving i thought i'd be a god as soon as i was old enough to legally do it. i had first started karting and driving tractors back when i was 12, and tractors are a b*tch sometimes so i thought i had good throttle control but i really didn't understand the workings of a car at that age and none of my experience helped me learn the basics. i was just as crap as anyone else when i started driving but once i had the basics done, all my computer gaming and previous experience came into play BIG TIME. once the process of actual driving became subconsious, the signals from my brain that took into account weight movement, racing lines, wheelspin etc were the same, only instead of being used on a controller, they were used on a real car.

thats where someone's analogy to running the olympics or watching a video breaks down. just watching the stuff doesn't help you train ur split second reactions in real time like say gt3 does.

ok gran turismo may not provide ur body with the g-force on the corners like real driving but if your not aware that the force is there, your car will fly out of the track if you try something rash. the fact you get so much feeling from a real car makes it easier to detect whats going on as well as making it slightly more difficult in terms of the strains put on your body.

also the amount of mechanics you have to tweak your car and help you decide on the best setups make that part at least as easy as it would be in gran turismo. when ur racing around in any of your tweaked cars, you can sense for example that the front needs more downforce, or ur back tyres need more camber etc, its just something you instinctively know, plus the onboard telemetry in an f1 car will give you even more feedback than gt3 ever does.

im not quite sure what im trying to prove here, i guess im just a little jealous that they are driving those machines and im not . but im also disappointed that schumacher (indeed both of them) are so much better than everyone else. im trying to say that there are plenty of drivers out there who would give them a good run for their money, much better than some of the current drivers are doing at the moment.

 

[Duke]

Putting on a Formula 1 effort - even to just be a backmarker - is so incredibly freaking expensive that they wouldn't dream of giving the seat to anybody other than someone they think is the best
driver they can possibly afford.

And thank you, pupik. We didn't keep in touch except occasionally, but it still saddened me to hear of his death.

 

[liquidyellow]

I went to a racing school myself a few years back and after my experiences I have nothing but respect for anyone who makes it as far as F1 let alone wins races and championships.
Thats in any era by the way.

 

[Solid Lifters]

I would just like to add that I live in Southern California, and for the past several months there hasn't been a week that went by where I didn't here of a story on the local news about some damn fool teenager crashing and killing someone or himself/herself because he/she was racing.

Just because you see the movie THE FAST AND THE FURIOUS and play racing games dosen't mean you can race a car in real life. Like neon said, it takes skill and lots of experience and still bad things can happen that cause serious injury or death.

One last thing, did you ever notice how F1 cars have treaded tires? They have to. F1 cars go to fast on slicks and cause soo many g's on the driver, the drivers start to pass out! (7 to 9 g's). I doubt that any of you have spent time even reaching 3 g's in life. The wildest rollercoasters hit only 2.5 g's! Just something to think about.

 

[Bollocks#999]

they are actually going faster on grooved tyres now than when they did on slicks

 

[Nightmage82]

Originally posted by Bollocks#999
they are actually going faster on grooved tyres now than when they did on slicks

indeed and they didn't change to grooves because of the g's, it was cause the fia wanted to slow everything down to make it safer and more competitive.