learned to drive a stick today

[gibson]

Now I see way its better for road racing, lots more torque! I now also see why GT4 needs a clutch function, if it did, drifting would be easier!

 

[1X83Z]

Folks -- why not? Let's make this one of those threads.

Automatic > manual.

 

[Rotary Junkie]

Folks -- why not? Let's make this one of those threads.

Automatic > manual.

Oddly, I agree, so long as there's a manual mode that locks the converter and gives you full ratio control for road racing.

In drag racing, an auto can kill a stick if done right. Shift kit + high stall converter + trans brake = consistently quicker. Just keep it full auto for consistency.

Automatics shift quicker: FACT.

Automatics are more consistent at the 'strip: FACT.


All a stick is good for is making you feel like you're doing something.

 

[the Interceptor]

All a stick is good for is making you feel like you're doing something.

Actually, a stick does give you more control, simply because it's more versatile.

I agree about the 'strip thing though.

 

[ferrari_chris]

...

Automatics shift quicker: FACT.

...

Ask M5Power about that, and be sure to mention his recent experience in the 599.

And he's our resident manual shifting n00b.

 

[daan]

learned to drive a stick today

Good to see you're branching out, and you can now leaf those autos behind you.

 

[Rotary Junkie]

Ask M5Power about that, and be sure to mention his recent experience in the 599.

And he's our resident manual shifting n00b.

Er... The 599 doesn't have a conventional automatic.

 

[Jim Prower]

I think it depends on the auto...

"Comfort" Automatic (I.E., All modern American, Most Japanese, and about half European trannies) = bad.

"Sports" Automatic = good

Dual-clutch/SMG/F1 tranny = Better than stick, at least, on a track

 

[Bones Brigade]

it all depends on the application and the person driving. so what does it even matter?

 

[Joey D]

I know how to drive a standard transmission car, I just hate doing it. There is nothing fun about working the gears in heavy traffic or on a really snow covered road. Yes it's possible and people do it all the time but I personally can not stand messing with it. I like my car with the Agitronic transmission which lets me change the gears as I please but if I get sick of it I can just hit the stick over to D and just let the automatic do it's job. I actually get better mileage when I'm using the Agitronic because I can get the car into 6th gear sooner and keep the revs lower.

I honestly think you'll start to see the manual transmission go the way of the Dodo since automatics are becoming much better at sporty applications and if not autos you'll probably see manumatics start taking over as well.

 

[socomplayer2]

I personally love driving stick shift, I think it is sooo much more fun to drive than an automatic. I think it is more economical and keeps you more in touch with your car. When your driving manual you are more in tune with the way your car is running, you can drive sporty or economical. I can see why people don't like manual because of traffic and what not but for me I take pride in driving a stick car.

 

[YSSMAN]

Every car I've owned has been stick, its been a requirement, and it will continue to be one. I realize that I'm in a growing minority, and of course, I realize that fewer companies are offering them in their cars... But I don't care.

A few points...

- Bitching about using the clutch in heavy traffic is a cop-out. You don't have to hold it in gear the entire time, there are other ways of doing it right. Sure, the clutch can be a bit heavy in a car like a Mustang or whatever, but meh... Most cars it won't be bad.

- Complaints over shift speed are rather silly as well. Sure, I'm not going to argue over the points on a drag strip, but around the track and in any other performance application, 99% of the time you're going to see the stick being the better option with a driver who knows what he/she is doing.

...And while I certainly realize that technology has caught up with automatics in some applications (Jaguar, Mercedes, others come to mind), it will be the F1/DSG/PDK setups that eventually replace them. All of which technically are manual gearboxes...

- Lets face facts: Automatics are good at getting people going, for people who don't care about how they're getting from point A to point B. Automatics are good at making people think they're in control of the gearbox by putting flappy paddles on the side, buttons on the wheel, or a slot on the console. But you know what? The transmission still thinks it knows better (most of the time)...

===

I'm in a dying breed. I know it. But at the same time, I see a lot of hope when a bunch of kids I know want to learn how to drive stick, or for that matter, make the choice to start with their first car.

Its really quite simple: Driving stick is more fun, a more involved process, one that demands more respect... And in the end, returns with good memories, and a better fuel bill to boot.

=====

RE: Gibson

Congrats my man! This is the start of something that will likely lead you to a dark alleyway in which you will cry yourself to sleep realizing that your favorite car is otherwise unavailable without an automatic...

 

[Wolfe]

I was thinking of responding last night but YSSMAN has it covered. I agree completely with every point except for the shift times. The new CTS-V proved that a well-designed automatic can just be faster around a track -- too bad those extra tenths per shift mean nothing on the street, where we spend most of our driving time. There's more to driving than setting the fastest lap. What good is a fast car if it's sucked all of the enjoyment out of driving?

I would rather spend one trackday with a 5-speed econobox than a lifetime of trackdays with the Mercedes McLaren SLR. Don't even bother asking if I'd daily drive an automatic. If my car only has two pedals, there better damn well be a dual-clutch sequential in the transmission tunnel.

There is nothing fun about working the gears...on a really snow covered road.

Really? I mean, I'm not doubting your opinion, but a manual transmission offers the most control in the snow, allowing you to start from 2nd gear, slip the clutch so that you don't get wheelspin, disengage the clutch if you do, and easily rock the car if you get stuck (especially in a car with reverse in the upper left corner).

It also makes snow drifting easier, if that's something you're wont to do. Automatics are too unpredictable, the torque converter delays throttle input and makes it very vague, and you can't cut power from the wheels like you can with a clutch.

 

[Joey D]

I found an auto much easier to drive in the snow than a manual. If the Cooper had better tires it would be quite easy, especially with the traction control and stability control. I just hate dealing with the manual in the snow, but then again the only one I've ever driving in the snow was a Neon. I don't intentionally drift in the snow either since it's dangerous and I don't want to end up hitting something or putting the car into a ditch, so that really has no merit with my application.

Also the Cooper always starts in second gear unless you put it in sport mode or punch the throttle from a dead stop. I don't know if all cars do that, I know the Blazer didn't but that only have 4 gears.

 

[nissan tuner]

i was taught on how to drive a stick in a MX-5 this year and i loved every second of it

 

[gibson]

I worked all day driving the truck around, hauling things on my buddies farm with lost of fun (Read:twisty) dirt roads. Very fun to drive a stick, now if only it had a tach. For a POS, that little B2000 is fun, I might buy one. I only stalled it 5 times today, that about 15 less than yesterday.

 

[Jim Prower]

I learned on a 1931 Ford Model A. Non-synchro. Gotta wait for that massive flywheel to slow down before you can get it into gear. Hugely heavy clutch.

If you can figure that one out, you can shift ANYTHING...short of an 18 Wheeler.

 

[Bones Brigade]

I honestly think you'll start to see the manual transmission go the way of the Dodo since automatics are becoming much better at sporty applications and if not autos you'll probably see manumatics start taking over as well.

i actually think dual clutch transmissions will replace autos, not manuals.

 

[ROAD_DOGG33J]

i actually think dual clutch transmissions will replace autos, not manuals.

I can't really see that in America.

 

[Bones Brigade]

I can't really see that in America.

to most people its the same thing anyway; an automatic.

 

[mustangGT90210]

I worked all day driving the truck around, hauling things on my buddies farm with lost of fun (Read:twisty) dirt roads. Very fun to drive a stick, now if only it had a tach. For a POS, that little B2000 is fun, I might buy one. I only stalled it 5 times today, that about 15 less than yesterday.

Tach is important if you want to DD the thing. Did you stall the very first time?

I learned on a 1931 Ford Model A. Non-synchro. Gotta wait for that massive flywheel to slow down before you can get it into gear. Hugely heavy clutch.

If you can figure that one out, you can shift ANYTHING...short of an 18 Wheeler.

I'm kinda jealous. I learned in a 2006 Escape. Then transferred it to a 60's Land Rover for around the farm. That thing has heavy clutch to hold in!

 

[Perfect Balance]

My car will not have 2 pedals, end of story.

I hate automatics and everything about them. To me they say "laziness" and nothing more. I can shift on my own, and I'm better at it than an automatic too.


I also know when to shift better, and I have better response when I'm going to shift.

 

[gibson]

The first time I what, Drove it, yeah, I'm getting better though

 

[mustangGT90210]

My car will not have 2 pedals, end of story.

I hate automatics and everything about them. To me they say "laziness" and nothing more. I can shift on my own, and I'm better at it than an automatic too.


I also know when to shift better, and I have better response when I'm going to shift.

Automatic=reduced throttle response, worse mpg, slower shifts(in most cases) and a pretty disconnected feel to the car. Plus sitting one hand on the shifter and the other on the wheel just looks and feels stupid in an automatic

The first time I what, Drove it, yeah, I'm getting better though

My mom bet me I'd stall the first time. I cranked it up to 3500 RPM and dropped the clutch. Quick 5 bucks

 

[Joey D]

There is nothing lazy about an automatic, honestly I love having one and wouldn't want it any other way. I hate people that get an elitist air about them when they drive a manual. It's the owner of the vehicle's money, they should be able to buy it however they like without being critised for it.

 

[mustangGT90210]

There is nothing lazy about an automatic, honestly I love having one and wouldn't want it any other way. I hate people that get an elitist air about them when they drive a manual. It's the owner of the vehicle's money, they should be able to buy it however they like without being critised for it.

I didn't mean to sound elitist if I did. I'm just not a huge auto fan. If you like it, you're right, you're decision. Be my guest and buy whatever you want, I insist

 

[nissan tuner]

if it doesn't promote laziness of learning how to operate a clutch or bothering to, then why is it so common in america and nowhere else

these new Tiptronic and DSG are impressive though

 

[mustangGT90210]

if it doesn't promote laziness of learning how to operate a clutch or bothering to, then why is it so common in america and nowhere else

There goes my shot at being real and trying to difuse anything.

I don't have a problem with people who chose AT over MT, as long as they can drive the manual. If they can't be bothered to learn, then it's really their loss, as many affordable performance cars are faster with the stick

 

[Joey D]

if it doesn't promote laziness of learning how to operate a clutch or bothering to, then why is it so common in america and nowhere else

Because America is a big open place and in the 1950's everyone wanted to take to the roads with the newest technology. People got used to autos because the Big Three promoted the hell out of them on all their models from the 1950's onwards. I mean we had names like Hydra-Matic, Ultraglide, Powerglide, and Dynaflow, if that doesn't scream 1950's advertising I don't know what does.

 

[nissan tuner]

There goes my shot at being real and trying to difuse anything.

I don't have a problem with people who chose AT over MT, as long as they can drive the manual. If they can't be bothered to learn, then it's really their loss, as many affordable performance cars are faster with the stick

just a joke. but with this fuel crisis going on in america, i dont see why people aren't jumping through rings to get a manual car