- 1,466
- Canada
- mikethehockeyfan
livid...
- Thread starter Chris Notes
- 101 comments
- 6,129 views
- 84,439
- Rule 12
- GTP_Famine
There's absolutely nothing wrong with driving defensive lines lap after lap. If you think you're faster, use your speed to get past.
There's no need to pretend not to know why it happened. We all know why it happened - an overly aggressive driver who thinks they have the right to drive wherever they want didn't have the talent to get past fairly and used his car as a weapon instead.
Being the fastest car on the track is a skill. Defending your position is a skill. Overtaking is a skill.
Battering into people, whether 'defending' or 'passing' isn't.
- 15,854
- QLD, Australia
- Small_Fryz
I must admit with 13 races done, 7 wins, 4 poles and 5? fastest laps and only 2 races that were not "clean" I'm finding that the Japanese guys are actually very good!! Its rare I race against any Aussie or NZ drivers door to door, its mainly the Japanese guys and they have all been wonderful. I had a brilliant race on Blue Moon Speedway (admittedly we had a little bit of rubbing, but it was totally acceptable touring car stuff). As much as I would prefer to race with my European and US brethren, maybe its best to stay with the Japanese and enjoy the mainly clean racing!! They are bloody fast though!! top 10 times are always very hectic and full of no one but Japanese.
- 3,359
- California
- PumpinNumbies
If you're going to dumb down my entire stance on this subject with statements like this, then there's no point trying to have a civilized debate with you.
You're using the best case scenario of your side, against the worst case scenario of my side, and trying to use it as a blanket statement to dismiss my opinion. You are strawmanning, and I want no part in it.
We aren't talking about a clean driver who just runs a defensive line, as justification to 'batter' into him as the only means to get by him. That's garbage driving, and a garbage rebuttal. As I've made blatantly clear, we're talking about people who use multiple bad habits to 'block' or 'hold up' drivers with malicious intention, for extended lengths of time, when the race isn't on the line. I shouldn't have to explain every detail or make a list, but since it's come to this, here we go.
If a driver who knows you have a 1/4 car length on the inside, cuts across your nose.
If a driver who knows you have a 1/4 car length on the outside, drives wide.
If you get a run down the straight, and they subtly veer towards your direction, to squeeze, pinch, destroy your corner entry angle, or push you onto a curb/grass/wall/barrier.
If they brake check you early into a corner, to try and gain a gap.
If they swerve to block you, when you've used the draft or momentum on exit to begin an overtake.
If I spend 2 full laps getting by you squeaky clean, and in the very next turn after I overtake you, you dive bomb me, to take your spot back.
There are plenty more examples and things I, and I'm sure many of you, have experienced.
Any single one of these, fine. Multiple of these, occurring multiple times, in combination with targeted race lines that are slowing you both down while the pack ahead drives away... and in my opinion, you will begin to earn a 'bump'. Not a batter, not a dump, not a pit maneuver, spin or wreck. A small love tap directly to the center of your bumper. Doesn't even have to be in a corner, or entry, sometimes it's not even about moving them, but to let them know you're fed up with a moving road block in front of you. Sometimes just to apply enough pressure to force them to make a mistake of their own hand, get them to get on the gas too soon on exit, of drive in too deep, etc. You've exhausted your clean passing attempts, and they have squandered your patience.
In this scenario, if you are this driver, and you do these things (emphasis on the plural) I have no shame, in giving you a bump.
I am NOT talking about battering into people.
I am NOT talking about a clean driver who is just too equally matched for me to get around.
I'm talking about people who make targeted maneuvers to impede your progress.
I'm not afraid to use my car, to let those people know how I feel.
I wasn't afraid to in a real car, and I sure as hell won't be afraid to in a virtual one.
Sometimes... you deserve it. That's all there really is to it.
Sometimes, you'll have a better race, if you just let the faster guy get by, and draft him back to the pack that you let get away by insisting you 'defend'. Because to some people defending 6th place for 3 laps losing ground to the 3 cars in front of you, was more important, than being in 7th while catching those same cars. Just because it's 'clean' or 'legally defensive' doesn't mean it's good, smart, or respectable racing.
Back on topic... did anyone actually have input on the question I asked.
Does anyone else notice that your DR/SR have an impact on your penalties and SR sector indicators?
Example if an A-A driver and a C-C driver collide, that the C-C driver will be more heavily penalized, because the game assumes more fault was theirs. (Fake example for clarity)
- 84,439
- Rule 12
- GTP_Famine
A strawman is when you invent a position not stated and attack that instead of the statements actually made.
It's not a strawman if you have actually said these things.
Bolded, right there, you say you'll "bump someone on purpose" - which you clarify to mean "tap them off the driving line" - if they are "purposely taking defensive lines repeatedly through a race" if they "know that the car behind is faster" and they "refuse to yield".
They're not required to yield to a faster car behind. Defensive driving is a skill. Giving them a "bump" or "tap" off the driving line is just bad driving.
- 3,359
- California
- PumpinNumbies
So what you're saying is you think 'tap off line' and 'battering into people' are synonymous?
Or did you invent that position for me?
bat·ter1
ˈbadər/
verb
gerund or present participle: battering
- strike repeatedly with hard blows; pound heavily and insistently.
"a prisoner was battered to death with a table leg"
synonyms: pummel, pound, hit repeatedly, buffet, thrash, beat up, clobber, trounce
- 2,138
- Wales
- ARC_rono_thomas
Im sorry but you started off with the above and have moved the goal posts your now playing rugby.
This isn’t off topic, its just become something you don’t want to talk about.
- 84,439
- Rule 12
- GTP_Famine
Ah, I love it when they go to the dictionary. I prefer this definition:
Batter
noun uk /ˈbæt.ər/ us /ˈbæt̬.ɚ/
batter noun (FOOD)
A mixture of flour, eggs, and milk, used to make pancakes or to cover food before frying it:
Have another try at deflecting attention away from the fact that you said you will deliberately bump people if they're driving defensively and won't yield to you.
Batter
noun uk /ˈbæt.ər/ us /ˈbæt̬.ɚ/
batter noun (FOOD)
A mixture of flour, eggs, and milk, used to make pancakes or to cover food before frying it:
Where did I ascribe that position to you? I said that battering into people isn't a skill, I didn't say that you were doing it or that you thought it was acceptable.
Have another try at deflecting attention away from the fact that you said you will deliberately bump people if they're driving defensively and won't yield to you.
- 1,840
- United States
Both of those you mention are both basically those respective countries version of Nascar in the U.S. The running into each other is what attracts the fans. And yes even Nascar runs a couple of races a year on road courses.
- 369
- Ohio
qwbufp
(Banned)
- 642
- Montréal
- qwbufp
You had to save fuel unless you drove a Z4/R8/Citroën/FT-1... You had to run leaner fuel modes in the slower sectors in most other cars. It was very poorly done by PD. 4X would have made it more of a challenge.
- 665
- Edmonton, AB
- GTP_Torontoblue
- 1,840
- United States
Case in point is if you have exhausted your clean passing attempts and have lost your patience then again it is apparent that their race pace and racing line is sufficient to to warrant that, you do not deserve to advance you racing position.
No matter how you try to paint it if you cannot pass the leading cleanly and must resort to bumping, nudging, forcing or bulldozing them out of the way then you are the exact type of racer that should be in the lowest class of SR ratings and then you can race against other racers with your same mindset.
Only then do not come back and complain about how dirty the racing is down there, the game has made provisions and rankings for those that think rubbing is racing and they have made rankings for those that think any contact besides purely accidental is too much contact.
Also as far a a racer is concerned I have more respect for the clean racer that defends and finishes 6th cleanly than one that wins by bulldozing their way to the front. Which one do you think is the better racer?
- 1,840
- United States
Sounds right, I was driving a Viper. If so that was some awesome racing and you deserved the position! I was able to get just enough out of the Viper in the right places to just to hold you back until right at the end and bow to your skills to pull off taking the position right at the end! It was loads of fun and you for sure earned the advancement!
- 3,359
- California
- PumpinNumbies
You aren't listening and I don't care anymore. If I try to pass you clean, and you blatantly block, swerve, brake check, cut me off, shove me onto grass, curbs, or against walls, multiple times you don't deserve your racing position either, and I have no sympathy for drivers who get a taste of their own medicine.
If you race clean and I can't pass you clean, I'll never intentionally touch you. Read that again. Take a breath. I'm referring to people who refuse to let you pass clean and call it 'defensive' when they're actually 'dirty'.
Isn’t there a “pick a lane and race in it” general rule for racing? I understand a block move, but if you block like 4 times in a straight isn’t that dirty racing?
Immediate search results:
“the reasons for throwing an open black are relatively straightforward. Blatantly driving another car off course, exceeding pit lane speed limits, excessive blocking”
That’s about exactly what I understand Adrenaline is trying to say the other car is doing. As he’s passing them they veer him onto the grass (off the course), excessive blocking, etc. In real racing wouldn’t they get black flagged for that stuff? It sounds like he’s saying he would just nudge them into an unnatural line to move them the heck out of the way.
Immediate search results:
“the reasons for throwing an open black are relatively straightforward. Blatantly driving another car off course, exceeding pit lane speed limits, excessive blocking”
That’s about exactly what I understand Adrenaline is trying to say the other car is doing. As he’s passing them they veer him onto the grass (off the course), excessive blocking, etc. In real racing wouldn’t they get black flagged for that stuff? It sounds like he’s saying he would just nudge them into an unnatural line to move them the heck out of the way.
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qwbufp
(Banned)
- 642
- Montréal
- qwbufp
Generally, you can change your line once and you can get back on the racing line on corner entry if you’re clear of the car behind or you must hold your line if a car is beside you. Weaving is not clean racing. You’re also not supposed to change your line in braking zones to block or crash other drivers in a sweeping motion. Please tell me if I’m wrong 
Generally, you can change your line once and you can get back on the racing line on corner entry if you’re clear of the car behind or you must hold your line if a car is beside you. Weaving is not clean racing. You’re also not supposed to change your line in braking zones to block or crash other drivers in a sweeping motion. Please tell me if I’m wrong
Exactly, I’m missing why adrenaline is getting so much hate, is he just not liked on the forum and it’s sport to bash him? Sorry I’m new here
qwbufp
(Banned)
- 642
- Montréal
- qwbufp
Maybe because there are so many kamikazes in Sport Mode that everyone is tired of being hit and any comment that seems like it’s condoning some form of contact is heavily frowned upon? I don’t know. But blocking is legal as long as you pick a lane and hold it until you can rejoin the ideal race line. I block sometimes to kill the other driver’s run and I often get rammed as they don’t seem to understand how racing is supposed to be. I never push people off track and I watch my radar non stop to be sure the other driver is not alongside me. You get to know how most players behave online. I’ll let pass the clean drivers but if someone has been hitting me in previous races. I’ll be driving as defensively as possible without risking both our races. There should be a real racing tutorial in the racing etiquette thing. Rubbing is racing up to a certain point.
Some of the most memorable racing moments have involved drivers racing defensively but respectfully. If you’re behind, you have to keep a safe margin with the car in front especially if you don’t know the driver of that car. Etc. I’ll stop there.
Yeah I hear the frustration. I just started sport, so my driver rating is less than my actual skill and MAN do I get punted often. I wonder if anyone watched the forced video about being a torpedo at all. I absolutely get that frustration, but if someone is passing me or has their nose under me I’m absolutely not coming down or up on them to push them off. From what I can tell, he’s talking about people doing exactly that type of stuff to him and probably ruining both of their driver / sportsmanship rating.
I mean he said he was S rating for sportsmanship, doesn’t that kind of guarantee he’s not bumping / wrecking people as a habit?
- 1,840
- United States
I can accept that and fully be on board. In your earlier post you did not convey that message only in my and it seems others interpretations that if you felt a racer was holding you up driving what you considered a slower pace taking defensive lines early race particularly and the lead pack was getting away it and you could not find a way to quickly pass cleanly it sounded as if nudging the lead car out of the way was acceptable to attempt to have a good race finish.
No one likes to race with people that have no qualms about using the bulldozer and dive bombing methods to advance their positions and most racers that do try to race clean would like to see the penalties for such behavior in race be much harsher from what I can tell by reading multiple threads and post that broach on the subject.
Glad to hear that what it seemed you conveyed was hopefully incorrect in how you actually race!
- 448
- Santa Cruz, CA
- Reikeimaru08
That's interesting. I'm in servers crammed full of Americans, Canadians and Brazilians and the majority of my races are pretty clean. It's my fault more often than not when I get involved in an accident and even then it's mostly just love taps. Probably just the time I play at, since the kids are off being irrelevant they can give me clean runs so that's just one observation.
- 1,840
- United States
No one is trying to bash any one because of dislike or who they are.
People want clean racing within the rules and with a sense of sportsmanship and respect for your competitors on the track.
Someone that conveys through their post that contact and bulldozing to clear a racing line is an acceptable behavior on the track will not get favorable replies as there are too many right now actually showing that behavior on track messing up the racing for those that try to race cleanly as possible.
There will always be incidents through mistakes or misjudging a situation but intentional contact is poor sportsmanship.
- 96
- Honolulu, Hawaii
Well, the start is probably the most exciting part of an entire race. In real life, they screw up as well. So it's not exactly a new thing to see. Most of the real action happens right then and there. It's what decides placement for the entire race almost. Ghosting everybody I wouldn't really work as it would take a little bit of that fun out of it.
- 1,424
- Kansas City/MO/US
- BallPtPenTheif
- BallPtPenTheif
i had a funny race today. this weaving idiot kept me behind the 7th spot even though he was slow as hell. i knew he would ram me so i just kept feinting cuts to openings that weren't' there, making him ricochet like a pinball on the course. every time he would come back onto the course he would try to ram me, so i had to keep backed up and re-attack while never committing. at the end of the race he had a 12 second penalty and i took 5th. i was dying laughing at the score screen.
- 2,065
- San Antonio, Texas
- Obi-Tonobi
Exactly why I do not do Sport Races, controlled lobbies way better. Sport rating means nothing anyway except how tolerant you are to keep at it.
- 1,840
- United States
I have to disagree,.
One thing I have found to affect the quality of racing within the Sport classes seems to be picking the times of the day or evening that I race.
Seems to be more of a pattern of during certain periods where there more chances of having crashfest mentalities being more prominent in the sport lobbies.
I have avoided most of the nations and manufacture cup events as it seems that many people hear the words points and world rankings then any type of sportsmanship goes out the window and the bulldozers are one of the main vehicles of choice.
I personally also only race online on tracks and with cars I feel I know well enough to not through being unfamiliar will mess up someone's race due to my lack of preparation to be able to race cleanly.
An online race is not the venue to learn a new course or the handling characteristics of a new to you car or tuning set up.
Using my logic and racing during what I think are the best times I find that about 8 or 9 out of 10 races I run online are very good races with little to no intentional ramming or bulldozing. About 1or possibly 2 races out of 10 you will usually find a tool or two that will be totally out of control driving way over their head or some that have the bulldozer mentality and both of those types be aware of contact or being rammed at any point of the race.
I do have a SR ranking of S which I am sure helps. It is not uncommon here recently to have multiple races in a row where you are racing in the pack and at the end of the race collect the "clean race bonus".
To me that shows that you can race among strangers, race close and race clean.
FUNanywhere
(Banned)
- 654
- India
Even i think region is the key here. I have had my fare share of bad races coz of some guys driving like real bad but most of the times its really good,clean and competitive.
Has to be region thing. Maybe your region has bad drivers.
Has to be region thing. Maybe your region has bad drivers.
