Mclaren F1

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Stephanos82

Stephanos82

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Hi guys, I'm going to get straight to the point! Based on your knowledge with Gran Turismo or any other sim, do you believe it's possible for a Mclaren F1 to lap the Nurburgring in 7m11secs?

These sources say it did! They also report Mika Hakkinen as the driver!

http://www.sps-automotive.com/en_sps/track/07Nt_zonda.html

http://fastestlaps.com/cars/mclaren_f1.html

Personally, I find the lap time a bit unrealistic - even for the Mclaren F1! Now if we were talking about the Mclaren F1 LM then I would have had an easier time swallowing it! What do you think?
 
They don't have any sources, so I wouldn't trust them.
 
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The car is still an utterly astonishing machine even today when it's 21 years old. I don't think it's entirely impossible for it to pull such a time, but I'd rather see a video that proves it.
 
In game, why not. In real life... Well, I don't think F1 owners would want to risk their multi-million machines just to prove a point that's actually worth less than a paper it's printed on. {Shots fired.}

...I mean, really. I'm one of those people who don't give a rat's ass what a X car can do in Nurburgring or whatever...
 
In GT6 it can definitely do 7:11. I just did 7:12.985 with the stock car on sports hard tyres with no driving aids and in "zen-mode" (i.e. thinking of something else while driving).

In real life though? I'm not even sure if the car has ever been tested on the ring.
 
eran0004
I just did 7:12.985 with the stock car on sports hard tyres with no driving aids
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Purely out of curiosity, have you done the same in an MP4? I only ask because I've got a 7:16 under my belt in a stock MP4 on CS but I can't manage to crack 7:30 in the F1 on the same tires--I wonder which you're faster with.
 
Well I highly doubt it. I remember a thread on Pistonheads with a very nice gentleman who chronicled his experience with his McLaren F1. He found the suspension to not be adequate if memory serves because of some of the compromises used to make it a streetcar. It had some handling characteristics that would currently be considered bad but back then it was untouchable. He was spending a lot of time and money on overhauling the suspension and I think brakes to bring it up to modern specs. It was a very long thread and I really don't have the memory of how far he got since it was a while back...

That being said with 90's tires, brake and suspension tech there is no way it will do 7:11 on the Nurburgring as is imho. If someone were to upgrade the brakes, tires and suspension as that gentleman was doing a few years ago I could definitely see it happening. It was a phenominal car and still my all time favorite especially the F1 LM street versions.
 
TexRex
Purely out of curiosity, have you done the same in an MP4? I only ask because I've got a 7:16 under my belt in a stock MP4 on CS but I can't manage to crack 7:30 in the F1 on the same tires--I wonder which you're faster with.
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I got 7:10.619 with the MP4. That's on SH tyres though, I'll do another test on CS tyres.
 
eran0004
I got 7:10.619 with the MP4. That's on SH tyres though, I'll do another test on CS tyres.
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Not necessary if it's not something you're weren't already inclined to do. I got my answer. ;)

The MP4 has a fair bit more grip and doesn't seem to be affected by the funky alignment values as much as the F1.
 
TexRex
Not necessary if it's not something you're weren't already inclined to do. I got my answer. ;)

The MP4 has a fair bit more grip and doesn't seem to be affected by the funky alignment values as much as the F1.
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CS tyres:

F1 7:24.456
MP4 7:16.803

The F1 was easier to drive though, in my opinion. It kicked out the tail more than the MP4 but it was pretty easy to recover. The MP4 didn't kick out the tail as much, but when it did it was quite scary.
 
eran0004
CS tyres:

F1 7:24.456
MP4 7:16.803

The F1 was easier to drive though, in my opinion. It kicked out the tail more than the MP4 but it was pretty easy to recover. The MP4 didn't kick out the tail as much, but when it did it was quite scary.
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I guess I've just driven the MP4 enough, the only time it gets unsettled for me is when I blast across that corner of grass at the fastest point of Kesselchen. Thanks for the test though, and now I'm particularly proud of my 7:16 because I'm on a controller. ;)
 
I've managed a sub 7 lap time in a stock F1 on SH tyres.
 
TurismoBad
Well there's this one but he's not really pushing it to the limit.

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The track was clearly damp too.. I wonder what that 92% means in the weather conditions info they give in japanese just before the laps!
 
I watched some years a go video with McLaren F1 LM and Mika Hakkinen around ring... But now i can find that video on you tube. :(
 
brianwong
The tires really just aren't good enough for that.
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Sports Hard tires not good enough to sub 7 minutes or the factory Michelins not good enough for 7:11?
 
Stephanos82
The track was clearly damp too.. I wonder what that 92% means in the weather conditions info they give in japanese just before the laps!
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If it's anything to do with weather it's relative humidity.
 
I reckon a road going F1 could do 7 flat... as long as it was prepped by Woking with their test driver. You wouldnt need to tickle the engine, just the best shocks and brakes they have.

The GTR LM would be even easier.
 
The Nissan GTR lap record is 7.24.22, so I'd say that the F1 could achieve a 7.11.000 fairly easy.
 
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brianwong
A McLaren F1 from the factory did not have tires nearly as good as what Sports Hard represents.
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Agreed 110%
 
Snakebitten
Well I highly doubt it. I remember a thread on Pistonheads with a very nice gentleman who chronicled his experience with his McLaren F1. He found the suspension to not be adequate if memory serves because of some of the compromises used to make it a streetcar. It had some handling characteristics that would currently be considered bad but back then it was untouchable. He was spending a lot of time and money on overhauling the suspension and I think brakes to bring it up to modern specs. It was a very long thread and I really don't have the memory of how far he got since it was a while back...

That being said with 90's tires, brake and suspension tech there is no way it will do 7:11 on the Nurburgring as is imho. If someone were to upgrade the brakes, tires and suspension as that gentleman was doing a few years ago I could definitely see it happening. It was a phenominal car and still my all time favorite especially the F1 LM street versions.
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I think you refer to this from 2004? Just skimmed the first page but it's got to be the right thread. It's not that long then, actually.
http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?t=115241
 
If the Jaguar XJ220 has a lap time of 7.46 then how faster would a Mclaren F1 be? 10 seconds? 15 seconds? 20 seconds max? The 7.11 seems impossible considering that eras tyres and brake technology!

Simwise - I find it hard to do an 7.11 with the F1 LM with slicks in Assetto Corsa!

Tests on GT6 with Comfort Soft, no aids except ABS1!
XJ 220 7.45 (real 7.46)
Mclaren F1 7.35

The XJ220 seems to have more grip but quite less powerful!
 
JockeP22
Unrealistic for the MF1 perhaps, but not for Mika.
He could take a Lada around the Nordschleife in seven minutes.
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I'm not saying that Mika couldn't do it! I'm saying that it can't have been done with that car ;)
 
A couple of things (at least in GT ATM) that might skew the time a bit. GT doesn't do brake temperatures and such, and the tire temp system is....well it could be better. The main factor is that, like every single racing game, it's a zero risk thing. Crash into a wall and you can just hit restart. Don't have to try and preserve the car...well more importantly there's no fear of ending up in a horrifying crash of some kind.

But could it be possible? Put Sebastian Vettel or Allen McNish in the driver seat and it might do a 7:10. :p
 
catamount39
A couple of things (at least in GT ATM) that might skew the time a bit. GT doesn't do brake temperatures and such, and the tire temp system is....well it could be better.
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Add to that the arbitrary (and funky) alignment values.
catamount39
The main factor is that, like every single racing game, it's a zero risk thing. Crash into a wall and you can just hit restart. Don't have to try and preserve the car.
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I've brought this up as well, but it seems the thinking is that someone who races prefessionally--and successfully--won't be as fearful of pushing it to the limit. In fact, the hot lap scenario negates the whole tire and fuel preservation strategy as well.
 
TexRex
Add to that the arbitrary (and funky) alignment values.

I've brought this up as well, but it seems the thinking is that someone who races prefessionally--and successfully--won't be as fearful of pushing it to the limit. In fact, the hot lap scenario negates the whole tire and fuel preservation strategy as well.
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Yeah I mean...that's why I wasn't sure to add that last bit in there because to be a racing driver...you must absolutely put any fear of crashing in a box and lock it away because you can't have fear to be great. I guess it would stand true for trackday casuals though. :p

As with any sim or simcade game, it's 95% relatable to real life. Real life factors are tricky.
 
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