Motor City Tunes GT6
- Thread starter Motor City Hami
- 1,109 comments
- 497,879 views
- 1,973
- Florida - USA
- Flsurffisher
Do you know where the tire guide is? Which tire to use based on PP? THANKS!
- 4,803
- Dearborn, MI
- MotorCtyHamilton
Has someone done one of these? If you find it, let me know and I will link it in the FITT Physics thread.
- 1,337
- Wisconsin
- DaBomm4
- DaBomm16
I think what he is referring to is just a guide for what tires work best with each pp range. I ran across one once in GT5 but I didn't need it at the time so I moved on. I have not found it since tho. I think it would be handy tho for beginner tuners to have an idea where to start.
- 1,973
- Florida - USA
- Flsurffisher
Tuning the RUF Yellow Bird. 550pp and my dilemma is SS or RH. Decided to on the SS. This is turning out to be a tough tune. Getting there. I saw the guide referenced somewhere just can't find it.
- 4,803
- Dearborn, MI
- MotorCtyHamilton
I tried tuning the Yellow Bird six different times in GT5, but never posted it. I did 500PP and below on sport hard and did a maxed out version on racing hard. I was just never really happy with the tune, so never made it public.
- 1,973
- Florida - USA
- Flsurffisher
Did you get one on the BTR? I'm thinking they should be pretty similar. Getting there on the Yellow Bird. Gone from 2:14 down to 2:10. I believe it needs to be 2:04-2:06 range on Nurb GPF track. I've gone live on the tune attempt.
- 4,803
- Dearborn, MI
- MotorCtyHamilton
I don't remember if I posted a BTR tune, but I do remember building one and it was much easier than the Yellow Bird. The Yellow Bird was one of the most difficult cars to tune in GT5.
- 8
NSX Type R '02
470PP, 289hp, 1250kg
Paint: Lime Green Metallic
Tuned with G27 with Nixim Brake Pedal Mod and ABS 1
Tune built for the Acura NSX Super Lap Seasonal at Ascari - January 15, 2014
About the track, I am really liking the Ascari track. It seems to have most corners that you will see on other circuits. This is quickly becoming my favorite track to tune on. I will probably come back to this seasonal this weekend and make effort to drop my times further.
Pit Service
No Oil Change
Installed Parts
Comfort Soft Tires
Fully Customizable Suspension
Racing Brakes
Fully Customizable Transmission
Fully Customizable LSD
Triple-Plate Clutch Kit
Weight Reduction Stage 1
Carbon Hood
Window Weight Reduction
Tune
Ride Height 100/100
Springs 5.50/7.50
Dampers Compression 2/2
Dampers Extension 3/3
Anti-Roll Bars 3/3
Camber 0.0/0.0
Toe -0.05/0.25
Brake balance 5/4
LSD 14/12/32
Ballast 110
Ballast Position -25
Weight Distribution 48:52
Power Level 95.0%
Transmission
Final Gear to 5.500
Top Speed to 124
1st gear 3.000
2nd gear 2.100
3rd gear 1.645
4th gear 1.355
5th gear 1.155
6th gear 1.015
Final gear 4.300
Hi everyone, long time reader on the boards, but this is my first post. I felt compelled to try your tune after seeing so may positive responses. I took my NSX to the seasonal with your tune and ran about 225.8. I then put my tune on and was able to run a second faster. I then went back to your tune and found I had lost some rotation in the corners, probably due to the high decel on the LSD. I used a a lot more ride height, stiffer springs, and less LSD accel/decel. Here it is if you want to try it out and compare. The brake balance is pretty low, it may hurt stopping distance, but you pick up the ability to jump on the brakes and still be stable. ABS 1, TC off. I used your transmission gearing on both tunes.
Pit Service
No Oil Change
Installed Parts
Comfort Soft Tires
Fully Customizable Suspension
Racing Brakes
Fully Customizable Transmission
Fully Customizable LSD
Triple-Plate Clutch Kit
Weight Reduction Stage 2
Sports exhaust
Tune
Ride Height 115/129
Springs 7.20/8.50
Dampers Compression 3/3
Dampers Extension 3/3
Anti-Roll Bars 3/3
Camber 0.0/0.0
Toe 0.0/0.25
Brake balance 3/1
LSD 8/12/14
Ballast None
Ballast Position 0
Weight Distribution 46:54
Power Level 87.9%
- 8
I could never get this car right in GT5. I was pretty happy with this tune for the Bird in GT6. I am exploring higher ride heights and stiffer springs.
526PP, 462HP, 1150KG, ABS1, TC=off. You can add HP to get to 550PP. Hope you like.
Pit Service
No Oil Change
Installed Parts
Sports Soft Tires
Fully Customizable Suspension
Racing Brakes
Fully Customizable Transmission
Fully Customizable LSD
Triple-Plate Clutch Kit
Tune
Ride Height 120/140
Springs 6.80/8.40
Dampers Compression 4/3
Dampers Extension 4/3
Anti-Roll Bars 4/3
Camber 0.0/0.0
Toe 0.0/0.30
Brake balance 3/1
LSD 8/10/16
Ballast None
Ballast Position 0
Weight Distribution 41:59
Power Level 100%
My trans settings are probably not optimal. I just set to 149MPH, and used a 4.11 final gear.
- 12,342
- paracuru
- praiano63
Why do you post your tune in somebody else garage ????? Create your own post for it or your own garage to publish them.
- 8
- 32
- United Kingdom
- TVRFanboy83
- pistonhead83
- 1,973
- Florida - USA
- Flsurffisher
When you talk chassis stiffness are you referring to roll bars or spring rate?
- 4,803
- Dearborn, MI
- MotorCtyHamilton
I do not have a problem with having it posted here. In fact I will probably try it out and see if i can learn anything from it. So thanks for trying out my tune.
I do think there may be a better place for your tune and the discussion, though. You should probably re-post it in the NSX seasonal thread so that more people may find it and discuss it. I guess for next time there is a situation like this, post the tune over in the seasonal thread and then link it back here. You current one is just going to get lost by next week in my garage. It won't get linked here. Over in the seasonals, the good OPs are liking all tunes.
Thanks again for sharing. I think that it is interesting that you used more rear toe and less brake balance to offset the LSD decel reduction. I may test that. I think the biggest difference is that your tune used no ballast. What weight and HP was your NSX tune at.
As for the Yellow Bird, I will take that one as a suggestion and come back to it when I get to tuning it in GT6.
- 8
Thanks Hami. I had found your tuning guide and tunes and just wanted to discuss my findings with you. Maybe it would have been more appropriate to PM. I posted a BTR tune in the forum which may be better handling than the Yellowbird tune. I was just really happy that they can be tuned and driven hard finally.
The NSX has 267HP@244ft-lb and 1104kg. For me the NSX has decent balance, so I wanted to leave ballast as a last resort. By using less LSD decel, I was able the take the high speed corners wide open and let up briefly just before the apex and it rotates perfectly and you can get right back on the gas. Very little steering input is required. As you mentioned, the rear toe is compensating for the lower LSD decel giving stability when you get off the throttle. Using decel 30, I found the car wouldn't trail brake as easy. I always stiffen the springs so that I don't feel a lot of car movement during any transition. Right now I have not ventured into doing too much with dampers because the base settings seem to drive pretty well in most cars so far for me.
- 32
- United Kingdom
- TVRFanboy83
- pistonhead83
- 4,803
- Dearborn, MI
- MotorCtyHamilton
Sorry for butting in
It's fine. The situation was one of those gray area things and I don't tend to sweat stuff like that. Not looking for anyone new to argue with. Already have a couple of those who like to for some reason.
Thanks for stopping by the garage. I am up for talking racing, tuning or just having a cup of coffee.
- 4,803
- Dearborn, MI
- MotorCtyHamilton
How much of the lap time reduction do you think came from the weight reduction vs. the tuning changes? I may try your tuning changes at the weight level that I built the car to and then try my tune with your weight reduction. Might be an interesting test.
- 4,803
- Dearborn, MI
- MotorCtyHamilton
I am a happy tuner tonight. I have been working on a different way to think about tuning. It involves really focusing in on the problem to solve, then making a list of the possible options at play. It is one thing to know generally that lighter front springs and heavier rear springs can mean less understeer, but to know when to try that vs. other options available is the real key to my new system. Here is a sneak peak.
I am finding the above graphic very powerful in thinking about what is happening at each stage of the corner. Think of the circles as the tire's contact patch or even as relative to grip and change due to weight shifting. For example, if you are turning the outside front tire red at late corner entry, you have to ask whether you think that tire is overloaded, past it's maximum grip level or if you think it is being under utilized and needs more weight to shift to that tire.
The new guide would look something like this.
Late corner entry can be difficult to diagnose while driving in GT6. You may need to watch a replay instead of trying to see what the tire indicators are doing while on a hot lap. There is one condition that I see most often in GT6 at this point in the turn; a red, outside front tire.
GT6 Handling Tips:
Condition 1: Glowing red outside front tire in a medium to low speed corner
Options: Hypothesis is that the front tire is overloaded and past its maximum available grip. To fix this condition, test:
- option 1
- option 2
- option 3
- option 4
Condition 2: Glowing red outside front tire in a medium to high speed corner
Options: Hypothesis is that the front tire does not have enough weight on it and it is just sliding across the pavement. To fix this condition, test:
- option 1
- option 2
- option 3
- option 4
----------------------------------------
I have tested for almost three hours tonight and every change has produced pretty logical results. I want to test more cars this weekend before I call this my new tuning method, but hoping to finish the full write up and post it by Sunday night (maybe during the week).
I am finding the above graphic very powerful in thinking about what is happening at each stage of the corner. Think of the circles as the tire's contact patch or even as relative to grip and change due to weight shifting. For example, if you are turning the outside front tire red at late corner entry, you have to ask whether you think that tire is overloaded, past it's maximum grip level or if you think it is being under utilized and needs more weight to shift to that tire.
The new guide would look something like this.
Late corner entry can be difficult to diagnose while driving in GT6. You may need to watch a replay instead of trying to see what the tire indicators are doing while on a hot lap. There is one condition that I see most often in GT6 at this point in the turn; a red, outside front tire.
GT6 Handling Tips:
Condition 1: Glowing red outside front tire in a medium to low speed corner
Options: Hypothesis is that the front tire is overloaded and past its maximum available grip. To fix this condition, test:
- option 1
- option 2
- option 3
- option 4
Condition 2: Glowing red outside front tire in a medium to high speed corner
Options: Hypothesis is that the front tire does not have enough weight on it and it is just sliding across the pavement. To fix this condition, test:
- option 1
- option 2
- option 3
- option 4
----------------------------------------
I have tested for almost three hours tonight and every change has produced pretty logical results. I want to test more cars this weekend before I call this my new tuning method, but hoping to finish the full write up and post it by Sunday night (maybe during the week).
- 11,207
- Adrian, Mich.
- cargorat323
- CargoRatt
I am a happy tuner tonight. I have been working on a different way to think about tuning. It involves really focusing in on the problem to solve, then making a list of the possible options at play. It is one thing to know generally that lighter front springs and heavier rear springs can mean less understeer, but to know when to try that vs. other options available is the real key to my new system. Here is a sneak peak.
I am finding the above graphic very powerful in thinking about what is happening at each stage of the corner. Think of the circles as the tire's contact patch or even as relative to grip and change due to weight shifting. For example, if you are turning the outside front tire red at late corner entry, you have to ask whether you think that tire is overloaded, past it's maximum grip level or if you think it is being under utilized and needs more weight to shift to that tire.
The new guide would look something like this.
Late corner entry can be difficult to diagnose while driving in GT6. You may need to watch a replay instead of trying to see what the tire indicators are doing while on a hot lap. There is one condition that I see most often in GT6 at this point in the turn; a red, outside front tire.
GT6 Handling Tips:
Condition 1: Glowing red outside front tire in a medium to low speed corner
Options: Hypothesis is that the front tire is overloaded and past its maximum available grip. To fix this condition, test:
- option 1
- option 2
- option 3
- option 4
Condition 2: Glowing red outside front tire in a medium to high speed corner
Options: Hypothesis is that the front tire does not have enough weight on it and it is just sliding across the pavement. To fix this condition, test:
- option 1
- option 2
- option 3
- option 4
----------------------------------------
I have tested for almost three hours tonight and every change has produced pretty logical results. I want to test more cars this weekend before I call this my new tuning method, but hoping to finish the full write up and post it by Sunday night (maybe during the week).
Very impressive there Hami, taking the world of tuning to the next level.
Look forward to your write up.On another note, I was thinking that since we live so close to one another and we both are into tuning and I see you are starting to get into the TT's, maybe we could get together sometime and swap some ideas and just generally talk GT6. I think we could come up with some good stuff and bounce ideas off one another all the while testing at the same time. Let me know what you think. Kinda like a "Friday night cards with the tards" type thing.
Mercury1
Premium
- 333
- Sydney
- robmchugh
Very impressive. I am very grateful and learning heaps from all you guys. Seems you can teach 54 year old dogs new tricks.I am a happy tuner tonight. I have been working on a different way to think about tuning. It involves really focusing in on the problem to solve, then making a list of the possible options at play. It is one thing to know generally that lighter front springs and heavier rear springs can mean less understeer, but to know when to try that vs. other options available is the real key to my new system. Here is a sneak peak.
I am finding the above graphic very powerful in thinking about what is happening at each stage of the corner. Think of the circles as the tire's contact patch or even as relative to grip and change due to weight shifting. For example, if you are turning the outside front tire red at late corner entry, you have to ask whether you think that tire is overloaded, past it's maximum grip level or if you think it is being under utilized and needs more weight to shift to that tire.
The new guide would look something like this.
Late corner entry can be difficult to diagnose while driving in GT6. You may need to watch a replay instead of trying to see what the tire indicators are doing while on a hot lap. There is one condition that I see most often in GT6 at this point in the turn; a red, outside front tire.
GT6 Handling Tips:
Condition 1: Glowing red outside front tire in a medium to low speed corner
Options: Hypothesis is that the front tire is overloaded and past its maximum available grip. To fix this condition, test:
- option 1
- option 2
- option 3
- option 4
Condition 2: Glowing red outside front tire in a medium to high speed corner
Options: Hypothesis is that the front tire does not have enough weight on it and it is just sliding across the pavement. To fix this condition, test:
- option 1
- option 2
- option 3
- option 4
----------------------------------------
I have tested for almost three hours tonight and every change has produced pretty logical results. I want to test more cars this weekend before I call this my new tuning method, but hoping to finish the full write up and post it by Sunday night (maybe during the week).
👍
- 4,803
- Dearborn, MI
- MotorCtyHamilton
On another note, I was thinking that since we live so close to one another and we both are into tuning and I see you are starting to get into the TT's, maybe we could get together sometime and swap some ideas and just generally talk GT6. I think we could come up with some good stuff and bounce ideas off one another all the while testing at the same time. Let me know what you think. Kinda like a "Friday night cards with the tards" type thing.
Not a bad idea. How close are you do Dearborn? I don't remember.
- 1,973
- Florida - USA
- Flsurffisher
Thanks for putting in the work! Sounds like a winner. I see that front outside red a lot as well and my first thought is to stiffen the front springs. But I've also been seeing the both rear tires red as well on corner exit alot and have not solved that one yet.
- 285
- Oxfordshire
- Bread_45
When I saw those pictures with the circles for tyre load my eyes lit up, really liking this logic Hami 👍. Also a really good way of explaining things vs. the equivalent text that would be required - "a picture paints a thousand words".
This got me thinking, I remember in GT5 drawing similar diagrams for myself for damper tuning, in order to work out which dampers moved which way during different cornering phases. I've dug out an old reference I found back then from some RL suspension article, thought it might be of some interest.
Link: http://www.ozebiz.com.au/racetech/theory/shocktune1.html
One thing I remember from the article is that their "phase 4" wasn't immediately intuitive to me, but now I think it makes sense, with decreasing steering and increasing throttle, the weight is moving back inside and aft. Stiffer rear bump means that the weight comes back inside faster at the rear, returning the rear wheels to a more even load distribution faster = stability/less oversteer/more understeer. Before reading this article, I would always have thought that a stiffer rear bump damper would have made exit oversteer worse in all cases.
I guess a lot of it comes down to driving style, i.e. whether you conservatively unwind the wheel first, then press the gas vs. gas and unwind at the same time (trail-accelerating?!) etc etc. as different steering and gas inputs will make the load move differently.
Cheers,
Bread
This got me thinking, I remember in GT5 drawing similar diagrams for myself for damper tuning, in order to work out which dampers moved which way during different cornering phases. I've dug out an old reference I found back then from some RL suspension article, thought it might be of some interest.
Link: http://www.ozebiz.com.au/racetech/theory/shocktune1.html
One thing I remember from the article is that their "phase 4" wasn't immediately intuitive to me, but now I think it makes sense, with decreasing steering and increasing throttle, the weight is moving back inside and aft. Stiffer rear bump means that the weight comes back inside faster at the rear, returning the rear wheels to a more even load distribution faster = stability/less oversteer/more understeer. Before reading this article, I would always have thought that a stiffer rear bump damper would have made exit oversteer worse in all cases.
I guess a lot of it comes down to driving style, i.e. whether you conservatively unwind the wheel first, then press the gas vs. gas and unwind at the same time (trail-accelerating?!) etc etc. as different steering and gas inputs will make the load move differently.
Cheers,
Bread
- 4,803
- Dearborn, MI
- MotorCtyHamilton
The quick descriptions from that article, "for exit oversteer, change x" was what started me down this new path of thinking. I then re-read the damper and spring sections of Caroll Smith's Tune to Win and Don Alexander's Hogh-Performance Handling Handbook. All three articles helped me to look at a different way to analyze the problems. The unfortunate thing about all of this reading is that there are some conflicting pieces of advice on what setting solves what issue. Plus, add in there PD's interpretation of tuning and programming and there is a bit of testing to do. Had two good test sessions last night equating to 4.5 hours of tuning. Good stuff. Much more enjoyable night of tuning.
- 9
- Dieppe/France
- Gurney-Halleck
Motor City Hami said
Congratulations for your fair play on the post carrera964.
After a few training laps in free run, I returned to the seasonal event Ascari compare your setups.
I play with a DS3 contreleur.
After several rounds with the setup carrera964 I ais won almost three seconds!! on my old time 2'26 .009.
Also to be honest, I board caught your setup and turn.
And surprise! 2'24 .297 - 4549eme draw??
The difference is more the way I drive? only setups?
Thank you again for your configurations, they walk not bad for a DS3.
Congratulations for your fair play on the post carrera964.
After a few training laps in free run, I returned to the seasonal event Ascari compare your setups.
I play with a DS3 contreleur.
After several rounds with the setup carrera964 I ais won almost three seconds!! on my old time 2'26 .009.
Also to be honest, I board caught your setup and turn.
And surprise! 2'24 .297 - 4549eme draw??
The difference is more the way I drive? only setups?
Thank you again for your configurations, they walk not bad for a DS3.
Last edited:
- 4,803
- Dearborn, MI
- MotorCtyHamilton
Thank you.
You will not hear me say that I have all of the answers for everyone. There are so many situations in GT6, different cars, different tracks, different controllers, different driving styles. Fast tunes for me is my primary concern then it is hopefully sharing enough advice and how to so that others can find what is fastest for them.
- 4,803
- Dearborn, MI
- MotorCtyHamilton
AAR Cuda 340 Six Barrel '70
500PP, 414hp, 1300kg
Tuned with G27 with Nixim Brake Pedal Mod and ABS 1
Tune built for the FITT American Classics Shootout (Classic Muscle Class) at Laguna Seca Raceway - January 25, 2014
Slow in and fast out will be very rewarding to the test pilots. Blasting through corner entry and missing the apex is likely to to require a lift on corner exit. Get the braking zone right and clip the apex and you should be able to mash the throttle for a fast exit.
Pit Service
No Oil Change
Front aero for looks
Stock rims
Paint: Lime Light
Installed Parts
Sport Hard Tires
Fully Customizable Suspension
Racing Brakes
Fully Customizable Transmission
Fully Customizable LSD
Triple-Plate Clutch Kit
Carbon Drive Shaft
Engine Tuning Stage 2
Standard Computer
Sports Exhaust
Isometric Exhaust Manifold
Sports Catalytic Converter
Standard Intake
Weight Reduction Stage 3
Carbon Hood
Window Weight Reduction
Tune
Ride Height 100/102
Springs 6.00/6.00
Dampers Compression 3/3
Dampers Extension 5/5
Anti-Roll Bars 3/4
Camber 0.0/0.0
Toe -0.10/0.05
Brake balance 4/8
Transmission
Final Gear to 5.500
Top Speed to 112
1st gear 2.640
2nd gear 1.850
3rd gear 1.455
4th gear 1.210
5th gear 1.045
Final gear 3.925
LSD 9/14/5
Power Limiter 98.6%
Ballast 24
Ballast Position +50%
Weight Distribution 55:45
500PP, 414hp, 1300kg
Tuned with G27 with Nixim Brake Pedal Mod and ABS 1
Tune built for the FITT American Classics Shootout (Classic Muscle Class) at Laguna Seca Raceway - January 25, 2014
Slow in and fast out will be very rewarding to the test pilots. Blasting through corner entry and missing the apex is likely to to require a lift on corner exit. Get the braking zone right and clip the apex and you should be able to mash the throttle for a fast exit.
Pit Service
No Oil Change
Front aero for looks
Stock rims
Paint: Lime Light
Installed Parts
Sport Hard Tires
Fully Customizable Suspension
Racing Brakes
Fully Customizable Transmission
Fully Customizable LSD
Triple-Plate Clutch Kit
Carbon Drive Shaft
Engine Tuning Stage 2
Standard Computer
Sports Exhaust
Isometric Exhaust Manifold
Sports Catalytic Converter
Standard Intake
Weight Reduction Stage 3
Carbon Hood
Window Weight Reduction
Tune
Ride Height 100/102
Springs 6.00/6.00
Dampers Compression 3/3
Dampers Extension 5/5
Anti-Roll Bars 3/4
Camber 0.0/0.0
Toe -0.10/0.05
Brake balance 4/8
Transmission
Final Gear to 5.500
Top Speed to 112
1st gear 2.640
2nd gear 1.850
3rd gear 1.455
4th gear 1.210
5th gear 1.045
Final gear 3.925
LSD 9/14/5
Power Limiter 98.6%
Ballast 24
Ballast Position +50%
Weight Distribution 55:45
Last edited:
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