Nascar ?

Discussion in 'Gran Turismo 5: Prologue' started by machscnel, Jan 10, 2009.

?

Do you want a NASCAR update?

  1. Yes

    79 vote(s)
    37.6%
  2. No

    131 vote(s)
    62.4%
  1. Parnelli Bone

    Parnelli Bone Premium

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    I'm hoping the answer is because: Daytona is also used for GT/circuit racing. The 24 Hours of Daytona, after all, isn't just an oval...they open up additional areas of the track so that there are left and right turns. :idea: I'm hoping that in GT5, PD will allow those other portions of Daytona to be used for racing. That would be divine! I just watched some of the 24 hours myself and kept fantacizing about doing a GT5 race there. :drool:

    Also let's not forget that NASCAR machines are definately NOT stock. Arguably they've never been truely stock. I have no idea why we call Winston Cup or NASCAR races "stock car racing".

    Even the engines in NASCAR have no bearing on the real-life design when compared to stock cars. Otherwise, the Toyota Camry would have a 3.3 liter V6 instead of a 360 cubic-inch V8 or whatever NASCAR rules stringently allow these days.

    Now this didn't used to be so. A few decades ago, the engines in NASCAR were the exact same size as the ones in the cars one could buy at the showroom...and a NASCAR win would guarantee a spike in showoom sales...hence the phrase: "Win on Sunday, buy on Monday".

    The cars in the Winston Cup used to have 427 cubic inch V8 or whatever proudly painted in bold letters all the way up their hoods! Different engines were used. Different bores & strokes. Different horsepowers. Cheating was also rampant, but that's another story...
     
    Last edited: Feb 17, 2009
  2. DaddyVDUB

    DaddyVDUB

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    Oh no I did'nt mean they had the same engine as the real cars,just that I think the block has to be a Toyota or Dodge etc design.

    And I have no problem at all with the Ovals its just the NASCAR cars I would not want.

    By far I would rather see Ausy super car V8s or the Trans am cars.
     
  3. Earth

    Earth

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    A NASCAR track (Daytona) is OK

    But NASCARs are not

    If that is true then,

    Le Mans is OK,

    But prototypes are not

    It makes more sense for Stock cars to be in this game then open wheel formula cars

    I do not like the new COT, but if you're going to include the Daytona oval then you might as well give us proper cars to race on it.
     
  4. Parnelli Bone

    Parnelli Bone Premium

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    Ah. I see.

    Yea, i don't have a prob with ovals, either. DAytona is perhaps the best oval ever! :D I agree, i would love to see TransAm or Aussie superV8s, too. Obviously since my "name" is Parnelli, i love old TransAm racing. The joys YouTube has brought, i've spent hours watching old NASCAR, IMSA, TransAm races! :tup: :cheers:
     
  5. 88c-v Racer

    88c-v Racer

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    if they do put stock cars in i would like to see both the old car and the COT. if PD would let you run a stock car race at one of the oval tracks with 43 cars would that be more fun than Suzuka with 16 cars? a race at Daytona with a stock car would be great, if all the cars are nearly identical in performance you would have to know how use the draft to your advantage. it would be the most interesting racing in the game.

    which would be a more exciting race to drive or to watch?

    this:
    [​IMG]

    or this:
    [​IMG]


    I say the first one.
     
    Last edited: Feb 20, 2009
  6. LR-tripowergto

    LR-tripowergto

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    +1
     
  7. magburner

    magburner Premium

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    I've never been a fan of NASCAR, thinking previously that it was a boring race around a simple oval track. That was until I started racing the Daytona Oval on GT5:p!

    When Daytona was a pro event, it was always the most popular race. I personally raced from zero right up to 2,000,000cr, and rarely if ever entered a less than full race. I cannot for the life of me understand why PD decided to gimp out such a popular race.

    Daytona pro was one of the most action packed and intense races I have ever raced on any racing game. The simple track layout belied the tactics and mind games needed to finish a race in first place.

    In the end though, I think that the Daytona Pro event was a victim of its own sucess. Many people were racing there, at the expense of other races.

    SO, I would say that YES, there should be a NASCAR event on GT5:p/GT5.
     
  8. Parnelli Bone

    Parnelli Bone Premium

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    I say the second one.

    If PD decides to have a go with NASCAR models (i refuse to call it "stock car" racing :rolleyes:), hopefully it'll be a seperate entity altogether.
     
  9. 88c-v Racer

    88c-v Racer

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    are you saying that PD should try and get the rights to NASCAR away from EA? if so, i agree. PD could make a much better NASCAR game than EA.
     
  10. Nicksfix

    Nicksfix Premium

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    Man , if that isn't the truth. :tup:
    EA Nascar is terrible
     
  11. Earth

    Earth

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    I think there are many types of motorsport fans.

    A few examples:

    A: Some fans watch the racing just for the crashes.

    B: Some fans (most NASCAR fans) watch the races for the passing and side by side action oval racing creates etc and don't care too much about the cars themselves

    C: Some fans (most F1 fans) watch the races to see the cars and enjoy watching them navigate complex road tracks and don't care too much about the quality of racing or passing

    I am a mix of both B and C

    To say NASCAR should not be in GT because you personally do not like it or you think it doesn't 'belong' reminds me of a time when people couldn't eat at the same diner because some people didn't like certain others and didn't think they 'belonged' or were 'worthy'.

    A proper stock car would make racing at Daytona all that more interseting.

    A Sprint cup stock car has 800 horsepower and weights 3,400 lbs with narrow tires that are the same size on the front and back with primitive aero dynamics.

    If the carburetor is unrestricted the cars would reach 225-230mph on the straights at Daytona. That means you would have to brake going into the corners to somewhere in the ballpark of 185mph. That's 40mph you will have to scrub off. So it wouldn't be just smash the throttle down around the whole track. Handling will play a factor.

    The heavy weight of the car, 3,400 lbs, would eat the tires up just like the real thing which would add another strategic part of oval racing which is taking care of your tires.

    Stock cars would also make High Speed Ring and Super Speedway more interesting because of their high horsepower high weight low down force combination.

    As for PD making a NASCAR game, I think they should focus on what they've been doing, and Papyrus should make a NASCAR game.

    NASCAR 2003 by Papyrus for the PC is still the greatest NASCAR game ever made. After Papyrus made the game EA bought the license to NASCAR games and that was it.

    [​IMG]
     
  12. 88c-v Racer

    88c-v Racer

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    i had some of EA's NASCAR games: 2004, '06, '09. not one of them is as good a the Papyrus NASCAR 2002 or 2003. i still play 2002 (2003 doesn't work) and even though its a 7 year old game it is still just as good as anything out now.
     
  13. Jay

    Jay Premium

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    I have Nascar Racing 2002 season, only Nascar game I have every played that is worth playing.



    Oh man the second one for sure :drool:


    Funnily enough the Nascar picture you posted has just the correct amount of cars for GT5, 16 :p
     
  14. 88c-v Racer

    88c-v Racer

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    i guess that shows that even with only 16 cars Stock Cars would make for interesting racing
     
  15. Parnelli Bone

    Parnelli Bone Premium

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    I think they could make a better NASCAR game too, but it should be seperate from GT5. Since all cars in NASCAR (all the modern ones, anyways) are really just the same car, development time & car-modelling shouldn't be as much of an issue. It's just a matter of painting on sponsorship decals and slightly different body shapes here and there.

    It'll probly never happen, tho. :indiff:
     
  16. Peter

    Peter (Banned)

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    The second one of course. Would you rather race in circles all day or take a super powerful Nissan GTR racecar to suzuka and crush those NSX's and Supras.
     
  17. McLaren

    McLaren Premium

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    Winning by large gaps does not immediately mean a "better" race. I believe he meant better as in which is more challenging & exciting to watch. And sorry, but Nascar takes it there when you understand how it works.

    The amount of strategy & intensity of the race is much higher than that of nearly all other motorsports. If you understand how the race works, you can see where trying to predict who out of 43 cars can keep their position and can know when will be the best time to pit can make the races "better" than other series'.

    Nascar is like chess. Not fun to watch, but contains a lot of strategy & intense moments for one to keep themselves ahead of the opponent(s).
     
  18. 88c-v Racer

    88c-v Racer

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    that's what i meant, i guess i should have been more clear when i said "better racing".
     
  19. Ardius

    Ardius

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    Although I agree mostly, this is not entirely true.

    If F1 fans didn't care about the quality of racing or passing then they wouldn't have complained about the dull-ness of Valencia, Tilke wouldn't keep trying to force long straights and hairpins on every new track and Senna isn't famous just for pulling out rediculous gaps on his competitors.

    But for the most part, yes, there is more interest in the side of technology and the ability on the track as well as ability to drive around people.

    And to answer the picture question - I like the second one, GT racing and Touring Car racing > almost all other race series.
     
  20. Ghost_drift

    Ghost_drift

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    You cant compare Sennas F1 career with the current F1 state. F1 is so boring now. I havent botherd to tune into F1 for a long time now. every time I catch a race I am yawning 5 miniuts into it. The tracks they use nowdays are these stupid FIA aproved pankake flat tracks. Only a few of the original "PRE F1 DOWNFALL" tracks are left.

    It is not the same sport as it was when Senna was still alive. At least they raced then. Now it is just like turning on GT4 and watching B-spec bob race.

    I would much rather tune into the JGTC, or LeMans. Or the GT series. F1 has turned into Buisness just like english football.
     
  21. turbosaabman9-3

    turbosaabman9-3

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    It is fun to watch NASCAR at a road course. They slide and bounce all over the place.
     

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    Last edited: Feb 21, 2009
  22. Ardius

    Ardius

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    That seems an extremely biased view and sounds like you didn't watch 5 minutes of any race......such a shame because last season was such a great season.
    I mean, how could you have watched races like Monza or Silverstone and felt that today's F1 isn't as interesting as yesterday's? I think perhaps some people's memories of how good F1 was "back in the day" are a bit exaggerated, ok, the drivers were more charismatic and there were some far better tracks back then. But to say that its extremely boring is just nonsense. Or maybe some people aren't the F1 fans they claim to be. I know full well there were boring races back in the 80s and 90s.

    And in any case, I'm not "comparing Senna's career to current F1" - I was pointing out F1 fans aren't all about lap times, that just seems to be what people assume, especially when they don't watch full races and make a judgement on the sport based on 5 minutes.

    Since when was F1 not a business? It certainly was back in Senna's day!
     
  23. Ghost_drift

    Ghost_drift

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    You realy cannot compare the racing of Sennas and Prosts Era with that of Hamilton and Massa. If you think the racing is as good today as it was back in the early 90's then you realy need to wake up. But this thread isnt about how boring F1 is it is about Nascar in GT5. so sorry for deviating from topic a bit.

    Personaly I would like all sorts of racing in GT. I am hoping for some 60's F1 cars maybe as downloadable add on. and maybe PD will release a full Set of stock cars in the same way.
     
  24. machscnel

    machscnel

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    It amazes me people are still willing to deny a spot for a NASCAR on GT5s' roster. It only has to be one car, different liveries. That's the beauty of stock cars, they are all relatively the same. All PD would have to do is make one NASCAR model, decide what liveries to add and that's it. That's why I advocated it as an update in my original post. You imagine how much value it adds.
    Say for instance they add Tsukuba. The amount of effort that goes into making a track is astonishing and I would say within a few weeks/months, people would be as bored as ever.
    Take a NASCAR as an update instead. A lot does go into each car model, but compared with to making a track it would be easy, relatively speaking. Not too mention the value you would get out of it. You could run any track with it(not that you would want to :sly:), run mini-Daytona's etc.

    All I'm saying is, when it comes to an update, little effort, maximum result should be the aim, as not to take away from the final product.
     
  25. Cap'n Jack

    Cap'n Jack Premium

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    I honestly don't know how, for example, the 1988 season where Senna and Prost won 15 of 16 races can compare to the '07 where the title went down to the last race with 3 drivers in with a chance, or '08 where 7 different drivers from 5 different constructors, including Scuderia Toro Rosso, won a round and once again the title went down to the final race, the final corner even!
     
  26. Ghost_drift

    Ghost_drift

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    Because watching Hamilton overtaking someone with the wrong tires, is full on excitement. (sigh). I except you are f1 fan boys here. but even you guys have to admit that the high point of 2008, was ferrari mechanics dragging a fuel hose up the pits. I know F1 is in a different time now, and health and safety dont actualy allow racing anymore. but come on F1 is just like watching some advertising posters go round and round.
     
  27. bicycleshorts

    bicycleshorts

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    Personally, that was the most immersed I've ever been watching any sport - not just motorsport. Six of us were sitting in the living room, all on the edge of our seats watching in complete silence as Hamilton lost the 5th place. There was not a single sound till we saw him go past Glock on the lasat corner - when we all jumped out of our seats and started screaming.

    This is from someone who's "casually" followed F1 for over 10 years.
     
  28. Cap'n Jack

    Cap'n Jack Premium

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    I don't consider myself a fanboy, I am a big fan of Formula One, but I do know that it has many flaws. I did find Lewis Hamilton overtaking Timo Glock very exciting! I wasn't even sure if he would be able to reach Glock in time, hell, I didn't even know Glock was running different tyres at that moment. Also, I'd like to know how the health and safety standards of F1 affect the racing, unless you're someone who watches motorsport for the spectacular crashes.

    I get that you're not a fan of modern F1, but I was just trying to make a point that in the last few years it hasn't been as bad as it is made out to be. :)
     
  29. Ghost_drift

    Ghost_drift

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    I just fined that the last 2 years has been a B spec bob race where it is won in the pits, you never see anyone actualy realy push and overtake anymore. (apart from that move Sato pulled on Alonso)
     
  30. DustDriver

    DustDriver Staff Emeritus

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    You forgot D, the fans of Touring Car championships who want to see side by side action, who like to look at the cars navigate on different (difficult) circuits and who love to see the crashes :D