nascars

[Baltimore212]

are all nascars exactly the same? is there a difference in tuning like in real life?

 

[David Bailey]

They are built to run equal (to borrow a line fron days of thunder) however I found Jeff Gordons 24 car seems to be faster dunno why? If you're stuck on the oval track either A or B spec try switch all aids off & the brake balance to 0. No kidding it works.

 

[soupcan]

They are all slightly different, at Daytona the 2010 Fords have the fastest lap times.

 

[GTP_CargoRatt]

They are all slightly different, at Daytona the 2010 Fords have the fastest lap times.

Sorry, but I have to disagree with you. After all my many hours of testing, and I mean many, I have found all the NASCAR cars to be the exact same when it comes to performance. With my testing at Daytona, my Toyota Camry was fastest in a solo run, only by a mere .015 seconds. I tested every single NASCAR car and they were all within .050 of each other. In actual races when I used to race online all the time, they were all pretty much equal also, with no make having a clear advantage.

Anyone that knows me, knows just how much I used to drive and test these cars looking to see if any one car had an advantage performance wise over the other.....and the answer is no. I can even transfer tunes from one make to the other with no difference at all in performance. I have 4 NASCAR tunes: Daytona, Indy, a road course and Motegi oval and they all transfer from one make to the other. Now I know everyone is going to have an opinion about this and we have even hashed this very thing out in a few other threads, but for me personally, you will never convince me otherwise. I have all my testing and data that I logged that convinces me they are all the same.....and that holds true for the Gamestop car also as that car is also no faster than the other ones.

 

[Baltimore212]

thanks fo rthe info

 

[soupcan]

Sorry, but I have to disagree with you. After all my many hours of testing, and I mean many, I have found all the NASCAR cars to be the exact same when it comes to performance. With my testing at Daytona, my Toyota Camry was fastest in a solo run, only by a mere .015 seconds. I tested every single NASCAR car and they were all within .050 of each other. In actual races when I used to race online all the time, they were all pretty much equal also, with no make having a clear advantage.

Anyone that knows me, knows just how much I used to drive and test these cars looking to see if any one car had an advantage performance wise over the other.....and the answer is no. I can even transfer tunes from one make to the other with no difference at all in performance. I have 4 NASCAR tunes: Daytona, Indy, a road course and Motegi oval and they all transfer from one make to the other. Now I know everyone is going to have an opinion about this and we have even hashed this very thing out in a few other threads, but for me personally, you will never convince me otherwise. I have all my testing and data that I logged that convinces me they are all the same.....and that holds true for the Gamestop car also as that car is also no faster than the other ones.

Here is my testing at Daytona. (Used Time Trial in Arcade mode)

I used a generic tune on all cars tested.
Front and Rear 15 20 10 10 7 toe and camber zero's
20/40 Downforce, 00 on BB, no weight added, stock lsd and my transmision setup.

1. 41.062 2010 #43
2. 41.066 2010 #99
3. 41.096 2011 #99
4. 41.099 2011 #43
5. 41.106 2011 #83
6. 41.112 2010 #24
7. 41.129 2011 #48
8. 41.131 2010 #83
9. 41.134 2011 #24
10. 41.137 2010 #48
11. 41.155 2011 #88
12. 41.166 2010 #18
13. 41.175 2010 #20
14. 41.205 2011 #11
15. 41.221 2011 #42
16. 41.241 2010 #42
17. 41.228 2010 #11
18. 41.366 2011 #14

Try the same test and see if you can get the #14 to run with the #99 or #43.

 

[cjr3559]

Great, the one I bought was #14. Go figure. And I thought they were all the same. Shute.

 

[Turbulence]

Here is my testing at Daytona. (Used Time Trial in Arcade mode)

I used a generic tune on all cars tested.
Front and Rear 15 20 10 10 7 toe and camber zero's
20/40 Downforce, 00 on BB, no weight added, stock lsd and my transmision setup.

1. 41.062 2010 #43
2. 41.066 2010 #99
3. 41.096 2011 #99
4. 41.099 2011 #43
5. 41.106 2011 #83
6. 41.112 2010 #24
7. 41.129 2011 #48
8. 41.131 2010 #83
9. 41.134 2011 #24
10. 41.137 2010 #48
11. 41.155 2011 #88
12. 41.166 2010 #18
13. 41.175 2010 #20
14. 41.205 2011 #11
15. 41.221 2011 #42
16. 41.241 2010 #42
17. 41.228 2010 #11
18. 41.366 2011 #14

Try the same test and see if you can get the #14 to run with the #99 or #43.

Thanks for the info, I normally run a 2010 Stewart and bought a 2010 AJ. After I broke in the AJ I did you test.

41.108 for the AJ and 41.413 for the #14, I'm sure your transmission set-up is better than mine. Care to share it?

 

[Johnnypenso]

If Cargo says they are equal I'd go with that. I don't believe anyone has tested to the levels that he has. If u are getting different results I'd say there's a flaw in your testing and/or driving, no offense.

 

[Lock2Lock]

I think the only one that is above the other ones is the DLC pre-order Game Stop Fantasy Nascar. Even though it has a few extra HP, I believe that it is the same situation as what CargoRat was saying.

 

[soupcan]

If Cargo says they are equal I'd go with that. I don't believe anyone has tested to the levels that he has. If u are getting different results I'd say there's a flaw in your testing and/or driving, no offense.

No offense to you or cargorat but, I did the testing and I know a few others who have done the same and the results are what they are. Most of them are close but the #14, #11 and #42 don't match the '10 Fords in speed at Daytona.

Pretty easy to take a 2010 or 2011 #14 and use the same tune on a 2010 Ford and see what you get.

Somebody else try it and see what you get.

 

[killerjimbag]

No offense to you or cargorat but, I did the testing and I know a few others who have done the same and the results are what they are. Most of them are close but the #14, #11 and #42 don't match the '10 Fords in speed at Daytona.

Pretty easy to take a 2010 or 2011 #14 and use the same tune on a 2010 Ford and see what you get.

Somebody else try it and see what you get.

Really? I have put as much testing in as Cargo and he is bang on.No one drives the same every lap.Do 10 laps with each car and average out the speed or time,little more accurate.

 

[GTP_CargoRatt]

I think the only one that is above the other ones is the DLC pre-order Game Stop Fantasy Nascar. Even though it has a few extra HP, I believe that it is the same situation as what CargoRat was saying.

The GameStop car has no more HP than any of the other cars. It tops out at 892 HP just like the rest of them.

To the others that support me, I greatly thank you. You are the ones that know just how much testing that I have put into these cars...about 6 months worth. Again, thank you for your support.

Just for 🤬 and giggles, I will run the test again and post my results.

EDIT: I just want to further say, like I always have, all this testing in solo runs does not amount to a hill of beans when it comes to actually racing at Daytona where drafting and driving skill comes into play. And yes, it does take some amount of skill to drive in a crowd.

 

[Lock2Lock]

The GameStop car has no more HP than any of the other cars. It tops out at 892 HP just like the rest of them.

To the others that support me, I greatly thank you. You are the ones that know just how much testing that I have put into these cars...about 6 months worth. Again, thank you for your support.

Just for 🤬 and giggles, I will run the test again and post my results.

Oh ok. I never knew if they fixed it/ever existed. Thanks for clarifying that.

 

[LooseLugNuts]

No one drives the same every lap.

You have never been in a room with Whoosier testing at Daytona then, lap after lap within thousands of each other when she is in a groove. Freaking amazing to watch. Whoosier's the one who first told me about the Fords being faster solo and I have never seen anyone put down faster laps than her at daytona.

 

[GTP_CargoRatt]

Oh ok. I never knew if they fixed it/ever existed. Thanks for clarifying that.

No problem. 👍

As for this test, I need your tranny setup, what tires you used, was the car fully broken in or was it stock at 824 HP. I need all specifics please. It would have been better to leave the trans stock also but I guess it doesn't matter if all cars have the same settings. Please get back to me asap with the specifics as I don't have much time here left with the game as I am moving here real soon. Thanks.

EDIT: I don't completely understand your settings either. Why don't we just do this to simplify things. Everything stock, HP at 892, no downforce, no aids, RS tires.....in Practice Mode as I already have 100 cars set to my favorites. (All of my hybrids to keep them separated from my non hybrid cars.)

 

[soupcan]

You have never been in a room with Whoosier testing at Daytona then, lap after lap within thousands of each other when she is in a groove. Freaking amazing to watch. Whoosier's the one who first told me about the Fords being faster solo and I have never seen anyone put down faster laps than her at daytona.

Hey Nuts, how are you? Yes I have seen her do the same thing, that's when I started testing all the different cars.

No problem. 👍

As for this test, I need your tranny setup, what tires you used, was the car fully broken in or was it stock at 824 HP. I need all specifics please. It would have been better to leave the trans stock also but I guess it doesn't matter if all cars have the same settings. Please get back to me asap with the specifics as I don't have much time here left with the game as I am moving here real soon. Thanks.

Sorry Cargo not giving up my tranny setup but, It wouldn't change anything in terms of testing as long as you used same setup in all cars. It was a 3-speed just to tell you. All cars are broken in at 892 and all had chassis reinforcement. And I agree 100% solo doesn't mean anything in a race but it sure matters in a room with qualifying and is great for testing.

 

[soupcan]

No problem. 👍


EDIT: I don't completely understand your settings either. Why don't we just do this to simplify things. Everything stock, HP at 892, no downforce, no aids, RS tires.....in Practice Mode as I already have 100 cars set to my favorites. (All of my hybrids to keep them separated from my non hybrid cars.)

Good test idea Cargo, just finished doing it myself.

I did 7 laps throwing out first two and averaging last 5 laps.

2010 # 43 average 41. 637
2011 #14 average 41. 939

3 tenths between them pretty much follows my earlier test.

 

[grashopper]

If you just do full throttle runs on the speed tests to keep it equal what times do they run by comparison in each test?

 

[GTP_CargoRatt]

Hey Nuts, how are you? Yes I have seen her do the same thing, that's when I started testing all the different cars.



Sorry Cargo not giving up my tranny setup but, It wouldn't change anything in terms of testing as long as you used same setup in all cars. It was a 3-speed just to tell you. All cars are broken in at 892 and all had chassis reinforcement. And I agree 100% solo doesn't mean anything in a race but it sure matters in a room with qualifying and is great for testing.

Well, if you are not willing to give out your tranny setup, then there is no use for me to go any further in my testing. You are putting me at an unfair advantage as far as testing goes in that it is not going to be a fair test comparison. I two have a 3 speed setup but it could be well different than yours. If you are not willing to give up your ecact settings for this test, then I am not going to continue to waste my time with this. Everything should be exact, including trans setup, for this to be a fair test comparison to yours. All of my NASCAR settings are already packed away and I don't feel like digging them up. So either you share your exact settings for this, or I am done here.

Edit: First: Yes, the tranny setup makes all the difference in the world on a solo run lap, especially if you are running a 3 speed. Proof is in my times below running a tweaked 4 speed. I did a quick test using the two cars in question, Stewart and Edwards, and this is what I came up with.

Stewart: 41.806
Edwards: 41.832

As you can see, quite a bit slower than your special 3 speed setup so that flaws the test comparison right there. Also, you can see that Stewart was faster, but not my much. And you can ask anyone here that I have raced with in the past, I run the smoothest NASCAR lines that can be run at Daytona. So, like I said before, if you are not willing to share your whole setup, then there is no way to make this a fair comparison.

So for now, I'm not will to go any further with this test. I've got better things to do with my time in this game than do testing with someone that doesn't want to do it on a fair and equal basis. Later.

 

[grashopper]

I decided to try a speed run. It might not be the perfect test but it should give a idea if there is any differences without human error.
I used cars all bought fresh from the dealer, not touched in any way.
Used a controller to be sure there was no differences in wheel wobble and held the trigger full throttle before selecting to start the test to be sure it was the same for each car. Ran one car of each make 3 times.
Odd the 0-60 and 0-100 times are the same but not the distance tests.

 

[Turbulence]

I just did the 0-60, 0-100, 1/4 mile and 1 mile as grasshopper did using the #14 and #43. They are within a few thousands as he shows.
I then did the test Cargo suggested, all stock other than 20/40 downforce and the 2010 Ford is almost 3 tenths faster than the #14 as Soupcan is saying.
Nobody get upset, just adding an additional data point.

 

[Johnnypenso]

I just did the 0-60, 0-100, 1/4 mile and 1 mile as grasshopper did using the #14 and #43. They are within a few thousands as he shows.
I then did the test Cargo suggested, all stock other than 20/40 downforce and the 2010 Ford is almost 3 tenths faster than the #14 as Soupcan is saying.
Nobody get upset, just adding an additional data point.

This question is for anybody that owns both cars. Is there any difference at all in the power curves of the two cars, specifically where the HP and PP peak? If the power curves are identical, then it's possible the cars have different levels of grip.

 

[Turbulence]

This question is for anybody that owns both cars. Is there any difference at all in the power curves of the two cars, specifically where the HP and PP peak? If the power curves are identical, then it's possible the cars have different levels of grip.

I'll have to go look to be sure but I think they were identical HP/TQ curves. One interesting think is the Stewart had 633pp with 20/40 DF and the Ford is 632pp with the same 20/40. Every single other number was stock and identical between both cars so something is different somewhere between the two, grip level maybe what it is.

 

[GTP_CargoRatt]

This question is for anybody that owns both cars. Is there any difference at all in the power curves of the two cars, specifically where the HP and PP peak? If the power curves are identical, then it's possible the cars have different levels of grip.

I just checked. The power curves of both cars are exactly the same. You're suggestion could very well be the answer but I myself still am not seeing any big differences on the track although I only tested for a short time last night. If what you are saying is true, then that possibly could have gotten changed somewhere down the line in one of the patches/updates as all of my testing was done early on in the game. Looks like I'll have to go back and do some updated testing. First thing I am going to check are the gear ratios of each car as those could very well have changed also in one of the earlier patches/updates. So if anything, its going to be grip level like you said or the gear ratios have been made to be different from make to make. When I did all of my extensive testing though, everything was the exact same on all cars as far as the gear ratios, specs, everything. Like I said though, that was all done within the 1st year of the game so it is quite possible that some things could have been changed along the way.

 

[Johnnypenso]

I just checked. The power curves of both cars are exactly the same. You're suggestion could very well be the answer but I myself still am not seeing any big differences on the track although I only tested for a short time last night. If what you are saying is true, then that possibly could have gotten changed somewhere down the line in one of the patches/updates as all of my testing was done early on in the game. Looks like I'll have to go back and do some updated testing. First thing I am going to check are the gear ratios of each car as those could very well have changed also in one of the earlier patches/updates. So if anything, its going to be grip level like you said or the gear ratios have been made to be different from make to make. When I did all of my extensive testing though, everything was the exact same on all cars as far as the gear ratios, specs, everything. Like I said though, that was all done within the 1st year of the game so it is quite possible that some things could have been changed along the way.

We have no idea how the changes affected the various Nascar cars so like you said, one of the updates, particularly the one that equated online and offline performance, may have affected the grip levels of some of the cars. Testing will reveal the difference and may have already exposed it, and if everything else is equal and identical in tuning and power graphs, the answer must be in the grip levels, something of course, we cannot see. Kind of a silly mistake on PD's part I would think.👎👎

 

[soupcan]

So my testing might possilby be of some value, go figure.
And to give credit where credit is due, I got all this infomation from WhoosierGirl almost 8 months ago, she is the one who had originally tested all the cars and passed the info to some of us. I just redid the test when I had enough cars and was also trying to match her times.
The #14, #11, #42 and I think either or both of the #18 and #20 have 633pp when at 892hp and 20/40 aero, and they are the slowest of the nascars at Daytona.

 

[GTP_CargoRatt]

We have no idea how the changes affected the various Nascar cars so like you said, one of the updates, particularly the one that equated online and offline performance, may have affected the grip levels of some of the cars. Testing will reveal the difference and may have already exposed it, and if everything else is equal and identical in tuning and power graphs, the answer must be in the grip levels, something of course, we cannot see. Kind of a silly mistake on PD's part I would think.👎👎

Yep, I'm completely with you on this one. More than likely the grip levels although I am not completely ruling out the gear ratios either. I've got a gut feeling something has changed in that area also. Just a hunch I have. The times that he posted from his test you could not even get close to back in the day. I had one of the fastest solo runs and if I remember right, it was around 41.5xxx, and that was with a 3 speed setup so something has definitely changed here.

Also, until he shares his "secret" trans settings, there is no way to duplicate his test with any kind of fairness or equality to it. That's why I said to re-do the test with stock settings, except the RH needs to be at 15/15 to avoid bottoming out in the corners, for a more accurate test between people.

@soupcan: Like I said, all of my testing was done early on and some things may have gotten changed through various patches/updates. If you want an equal test between members, all settings are going to have to be the same as I stated above. I'm going to do some testing and investigation of my own later today. All cars will be brand new with no break-in as I don't have time to sit here and break in every single NASCAR car. But yea, it seems as though something has changed since all my testing was done.

 

[LooseLugNuts]

Faster times have been possible at daytona for along time now, these videos she posted are eight months old. And the last ghost race room I seen her in she was running 40.94's online but that was a few months back. The online and offline are closer now but not dead even.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FCPoJRyCpVI

 

[killerjimbag]

You also might want to watch out for those super soft tires,and other hacks some people run.Solo lap times mean absolutely didly squat as does qualifying times.Lets just say some peolple who raced in that Nascar Series were not "playing by the rules" so to speak.Yes and a certain individual comes into my rooms and others and get's his rear end handed to him in every race and leaves.His solo lap times don't do a damn thing in our rooms.

-''- I could post the names of the hackers,but I can't so send me a private message and I will gladly expose who the cheaters are.It's actually pretty sad when you have to cheat in a Nascar room.