Online is a frustrating experience

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jcmc968
I have just spent around an hour and a half online and have failed despite maybe 20+ attempts to compete in any sort of race whatsoever, it's not an uncommon experience for me. It is not down to connection issues - apart from the occasional incompatibility ones - the problem comes from both a design and a user etiquette perspective.

I had a rally car I wanted to try out and was happy to race one any of the smaller courses. I spot plenty of rooms that look fine to try but by the time I enter, they (slowly) load up and once I can access regulations I see that for a multitude of reasons I cannot use my chosen car. These reasons can be specific car selected, bhp limits etc. and of course the room host at that point has the right to set whatever he likes as his criteria, you just get no indication of this before you enter a room frustratingly as the only information you have there are NORMAL RACE and the virtually pointless RACE QUALITY. Often you will go in a room while a race is ongoing, wait patiently for it to finish as only then can you access regulations and then find out you do not qualify. A lot of time can be lost.

Even more frustrating is poor host etiquette. You get in a room, your criteria is fine, the Event Status says Free Run and Race but the host never actually starts a race, he can be messing about drifting, chatting to his mates, whatever. You comment in the room asking when the race will start and get no reply. This goes on until you eventually get really annoyed and leave. This happened a dozen times or so tonight. Surely if the room status is set to Free Run and Race then the rest of the room can force a race start after a certain amount of time? Again, this would be helpful if it is indicated on the room summary before you enter in the first place, perhaps the amount of time since the last race finished if one is currently not ongoing. Another big loss of time.

Final issue I experienced a few times tonight was getting kicked for no valid reason. I went in several rooms and was kicked out, the one regular factor in these seemed to be that everyone in that room was of a certain nationality and I was not of the same. Now, if someone wants to set up a nationality filter on room creation that no-one from another country can enter, well I still think that's not a good thing but it would at least save you entering, loading up, setting up your car and then getting kicked. Again, a lot of time wasted. I think perhaps you should have more than one person needed to kick someone too, I was kicked by this Spanish git last night after beating him in a hotly contested race, his last action being trying to plough into me but missing and ending up in a fence. Kicking me was done in a fit of pique which is not a good reason.

So yes, an annoying evening and these are all issues that I think are much more important to sort than implementing mechanical damage. I yearn for the simplicity of Prologue online at the moment.
 
I feel your pain. It is indeed a waste of time when you have to enter a game, load the track and then find out you're not "compatible". The lobby should show way more information so you can pick a better game suited to your needs.

As for prologue, the hp/weight points system worked like a charm if you ask me and enabling it for GT5 (as an option) would be freakin' awesome.
 
The easy answer is to start your own room. Then you control the tracks and allowed cars, you get to start the race and kick people who aren't playing nicely.
 
Sounds like people havnt learned about lounge yet. My god its the best thing in gt5. race with your mates, it doesnt go through that funny stuff actual online lobbys have. (all the network stuff and the dif loading times) and thats how you do priv races with mates.. so why dont pepz do it that way. Its in community then lounge.. if you want to join a mates just go to his tab in community and theres a little icon you click and you join the lounge he is in (even if the owner isnt a friend) I havnt actually botherd with the racing part online yet as all i read is negative.. If you want some nice clean races add me and we'll do some races. I think i would enjoy a race with you. PSN = F-Nichols
 
FN
Sounds like people havnt learned about lounge yet. My god its the best thing in gt5. race with your mates, it doesnt go through that funny stuff actual online lobbys have. (all the network stuff and the dif loading times) and thats how you do priv races with mates.. so why dont pepz do it that way. Its in community then lounge.. if you want to join a mates just go to his tab in community and theres a little icon you click and you join the lounge he is in (even if the owner isnt a friend) I havnt actually botherd with the racing part online yet as all i read is negative.. If you want some nice clean races add me and we'll do some races. I think i would enjoy a race with you. PSN = F-Nichols

This sounds nice and all but its rare I have 8+friends online at the same time who all want to pop into an online race. And even if I did, arranging it withought some decent chat options (I really do miss xbl sometimes) is quite time consuming.

For the most part I never have more than 2 friends playing gt at any given time, they ten not to be real "friends" but rather people I have friended through a random race online, and then they are usually either a specing or b specing in which case they don't really want to stop right now, and if they are in an online mood they are usually already online in sonme kind of race and it would be hard to say "droo out of that 8 person lobby and race this car with me".

Its easy to say just pop into some friends lobbies but in reality its not likely to work much unless you have some close dedicated gt friends.
 
I haven't played much online but I did try some time today and I've noticed nobody actually wants to race. More than half the rooms I went into today is people just crashing into each other the whole time. I tried to drive normally and not crash into anyone to show them that I'd like a fair race, but nobody seems to mind and just crash into you anyways. :/
 
Kaz should be tied to a chair, and MADE to race random online races for say 12 hours!

Bet you the online part of the game would get patched PRONTO..!
 
I just drift online now because whenever I create a 1337 room no one joins. I'll title it 700hp no aids pro only and I'll be lucky to get 3 people in half an hour. Society = broken
 
This is why a dedicated server works well. I'm not 100% sure if any console games use dedicated servers (I don't play any console games except the GT series) but I know that when I'm playing on a dedicated server on my PC, rules are normally enforced much more than they are in peer to peer games.

What I guess I'm trying to say is that a dedicated server allows for a stronger flow of players that enjoy the same gameplay, style, and rules. For some reason I find this hard to explain and I don't know if everyone can relate to this but you could think of a dedicated server as a bar. A lot of bars attract a certain group of people and you can usually tell just by walking in the door where you fit in and where you don't. Looking at it this way, would you rather join where you DO fit in or join where you DON'T fit in?. Only an idiot would have a reason for joining the latter.

This isn't to say that these servers are perfect. Of course you're going to get people that try to ruin the fun for everyone, thats going to inevitably happen with any type of server.

I don't know the difficulty of implementing such a feature, I'm sure many things would have to change. Thats not to say there isn't a substitute for not having any dedicated servers. If you're trying to start a serious/clean race, stay consistent with the title you name your room or something. Somehow you have to make a name for yourself/community so people know your intentions.

I'm no sociologist but I'm just telling you what I see first hand from about every PC game I've ever played online and I just think it works better. Dedicated servers for racing games might ultimately be a horrible idea, I'm not really sure. I'm just throwing ideas out there. The world would be pretty boring if no one ever tried to make things better! :D
 
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I usually host my online games... l felt the horrors of joining a online game and dealing with non stop lollygagging, kick outs, and other shenanigans.
 
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More than half the rooms I went into today is people just crashing into each other the whole time.

Does that surprise you? Look at GTP. There are thousands of threads dedicated to "OMG DAMAGE OMG DAMAGE OMG DAMAGE OMG DAMAGE MUST HAVE OH PLEASE PRETTY PRETTY PLEASE DAMAGE@!!!!!!!1!!"
 

It all depends on who is hosting the lobby. If the host is lazy then the room ends up populated by giggling 12 year olds. If you drive backwards or blatantly drive into someone in my room and I see it you will instantly be kicked. I like to think my pub lobbies are of a high standard because I'm a total a-hole. I even have damage enabled in my drift lobby now.

The trouble I have is no one wants to race seriously anymore. They all want to crash into each other on the TG Test Track.
 
...If the host is lazy then the room ends up populated by giggling 12 year olds...
Which makes me think that having a setting for age restriction might be a good idea. This would be feasible since the PSN account has your birth date registered. Now, how to make such a suggestion to PD....

DJ
--
 
The trouble I have is no one wants to race seriously anymore. They all want to crash into each other on the TG Test Track.

Trust me there are plenty of people out there that want to race seriously. We just have to find a better, more attractive way to group these people together. The real problem is that we all use the same, very "disconnected", interface to join races and that isn't really our fault at this point in time.
 
As said, start your own game or be more easy about which car you race online.
 
Well it's hard for me because I need to race with Aus/NZ people for lag reasons but I see hardly any organization here (GTP) to group some decent players from this region together.
 
I concur with the general quality of racing issue. I kind of expected it early in the life of the game, a mix of a lot of non-serious guys who want to win rather than race but will move onto another racing game within a month or two with all of us still generally finding our feet at the game which can lead to a lot of crashes that might be put down to over enthusiasm rather than being deliberate.

This is the community's issue though which for me is a little different from the general design flaws from PD which do massively undermine the whole experience. As someone said, hosting your room might be a viable route to go but not really if you are wanting to jump into a game for a quick blast. Sitting waiting for like minded people to join could take just as long as doing what I did. I will look at the community option as to be honest it's not really very well lain out nor explained. But similar issue to an extent, a race is decent for me if you can get 8 cars in it maybe and the chances to do that with online friends without prior organisation is hard.

So yes PD, why not design some sort of basic matchmaking system that will find you a race as most other online games boast rather than the hugely compromised system you have. Oh and another simple omission which I think is staggering, the lack of a button to mute voice chat in a room. Most people do not do this and you think we want to listen to children babble incoherently to each other in mono? Come on.....
 
I was going to post something like this myself. I can never get a decent race. If it is not a stupid drift room then it is a host who has no idea why anyone would ever want to restrict cars. It is drifting or a free for all. No fun at all. Makes me miss the structure of prologue. Never thought I'd be saying that one.

PD needs to do a few things:

1: Create car classes that are selectable in the lobby. Group cars by performance in easy to remember terms. Sure you can do this now by adjusting the power and weight regulations, but say I want to set it to use classics like the 512BB, what was its power and weight again?...

2: We need more and better searching options. Rooms have types now, that needs to be expanded into racing, track day, drift, shuffle etc.

Just with those two changes I think there would be a nice shift in culture towards better racing, or in fact racing period. As it stands GT5 online, more to the point the GT5 community is massively disappointing. It is PD's fault though. I've posts dating back to before GT4 saying that PD do not understand online racing. They have proven it yet again.
 
I was pretty much disapointed myself as well...

6 years of development and then the online mode is a drawback from GT5 Prologue! I have to agree to everything you guys have said so far, it's really hard to have some descent race. Many people just hanging around in the lounges and chatting, restrictions are changed as soon as you picked a car, people just crash into you and do not try to race like a sportsman... I'm really dissapointed...

I really don't understand why the development took so long and then there is just such a bad online mode?!?! But when I read interviews with Kaz that he wants to include the possibility to step out of the car and walk around to enjoy the landscape - then I know... Options are a joke, really!!! There are so many things I miss:

- statistics, rankings, online levels
- lounge restrictions regarding online levels
- statistics about fastest lap time after a race
- the great HP/weight points from GT5P - where abandon them?
- reasoning for kick out like "bad behaviour", "crash kid" and some according ratio for it so I don't need to first drive against these idiots before leaving the lounge again!

Of course, when the physical damage model is included (haven't raced yesterday) then there could be some changes. I also hope that all these baby-racers lose interest pretty soon and turn to Need for Speed... But so far I'm only racing with friends.

If you're interested in serious races, no intended crashing, add me: PSN - KippCorona
But watch out! I'm probably not as good as even 5% of you guys... ;-)
 
I just quit trying to race online, I've given it probably 10-12 attempts and at least half an hour but not actually had a proper race yet.

Rubbish design
 
I used to have the same problem, so now I either do my own room or I seek out other Gt planet members.
Incidentally I had some great racing with xchristox last night.
If you make lots of Gt planet friends you will always find someone good to race with in your lounge.

PS. Chris, sorry about all the spins, still getting the hang of no assists, give me a couple of days and your a.. is mine:)
 
I just drift online now because whenever I create a 1337 room no one joins. I'll title it 700hp no aids pro only and I'll be lucky to get 3 people in half an hour. Society = broken

I created a room titled "700hp damage no aids" last night, and in less than 30 minutes, we had 10 people racing, most of whom stayed for the 3 hours before I left.

There's still hope.
 
Trust me there are plenty of people out there that want to race seriously. We just have to find a better, more attractive way to group these people together. The real problem is that we all use the same, very "disconnected", interface to join races and that isn't really our fault at this point in time.

Agreed, I am only interested in proper racing, if I want to f.around and crash I'll play hot pursuit
 
I was pretty much disapointed myself as well...

6 years of development and then the online mode is a drawback from GT5 Prologue! I have to agree to everything you guys have said so far, it's really hard to have some descent race. Many people just hanging around in the lounges and chatting, restrictions are changed as soon as you picked a car, people just crash into you and do not try to race like a sportsman... I'm really dissapointed...

I really don't understand why the development took so long and then there is just such a bad online mode?!?! But when I read interviews with Kaz that he wants to include the possibility to step out of the car and walk around to enjoy the landscape - then I know... Options are a joke, really!!! There are so many things I miss:

- statistics, rankings, online levels
- lounge restrictions regarding online levels
- statistics about fastest lap time after a race
- the great HP/weight points from GT5P - where abandon them?
- reasoning for kick out like "bad behaviour", "crash kid" and some according ratio for it so I don't need to first drive against these idiots before leaving the lounge again!

Of course, when the physical damage model is included (haven't raced yesterday) then there could be some changes. I also hope that all these baby-racers lose interest pretty soon and turn to Need for Speed... But so far I'm only racing with friends.

If you're interested in serious races, no intended crashing, add me: PSN - KippCorona
But watch out! I'm probably not as good as even 5% of you guys... ;-)

Will be sending you a friend request this pm
 
The best solution for this? When PD finally get off their butt and implement everything they promised.. especially stuff they had back in the Prologue days

You know the PD created Prologue online events? The ones with the PP limits, set tyre and car combinations at a specific track.
Well why not have them start every 15 mins on a set time table on dedicated servers. People can enter and free run and qualify for the race before it starts as scheduled.

Separated in Begineer, Intermedate and Pro with full damage etc
 
I was going to post something like this myself. I can never get a decent race. If it is not a stupid drift room then it is a host who has no idea why anyone would ever want to restrict cars. It is drifting or a free for all. No fun at all. Makes me miss the structure of prologue. Never thought I'd be saying that one.

PD needs to do a few things:

1: Create car classes that are selectable in the lobby. Group cars by performance in easy to remember terms. Sure you can do this now by adjusting the power and weight regulations, but say I want to set it to use classics like the 512BB, what was its power and weight again?...

2: We need more and better searching options. Rooms have types now, that needs to be expanded into racing, track day, drift, shuffle etc.

Just with those two changes I think there would be a nice shift in culture towards better racing, or in fact racing period. As it stands GT5 online, more to the point the GT5 community is massively disappointing. It is PD's fault though. I've posts dating back to before GT4 saying that PD do not understand online racing. They have proven it yet again.

Totally agree with this. I ventured online for the first time last night, firstly with a group of 5 friends and we had some epic races. We've been racing together in Forza for the past three years. We picked the same cars with the same tyres and really had an hour and a half of fun. I then decided to check out some public lobbies, OMG! What a disaster, lobby host didn't have a clue, there were people in all sorts of cars, sliding, spinning, crashing. It was an absolute joke. No racing happened at all. So disappointing after the excellent experience I'd had with my mates.

There needs to be a class and PI type system. A weight an HP limit just doesn't cut it. The most important thing to guarantee good online racing is a system that ensures that everyone has a competitive car, at the moment thats just not the case. I do hope PD make some drastic changes to the online as I've seen how good it can be.
 
I get constantly good races, but the first thing when i search a room is i put the skid recovery on off, and then look for a good title.

Like yesterday the room FULL REAL, was awesome, i got 15 + races with awesome fights and good stuff! Full damage definately did the trick there!👍
 
I have an idea. How about License Tests being a requirement to play serious online races?

No Licenses = Basic, casual races with no rules attached. The rammers and cheats can stay here.

B+A Licenses completed = Amateur, races with 3-second penalties for hitting other drivers. No penalties for going off the road. Beginner drivers can stay here and improve.

IB+IA+S Licenses completed = Professional, races with 6-second penalties for hitting other drivers and going off the track. Good, clean drivers can race here.

The idea needs a little work but I think the basic concept would be a good addition to the series.
 
Kaz should be tied to a chair, and MADE to race random online races for say 12 hours!

Bet you the online part of the game would get patched PRONTO..!


lol..... but i think you're right :P
 
I don't think the PP system would work in GT5 tbh. There's too many cars to balance and you'd end up with overpowered cars that people will exploit
 
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