PD expecting too much from gamers?

[ubergill]

Grinding is a proven gaming mechanism that rewards long term play but I don't think the game is furnished with enough variation to make the amount of racing needed to progress to X1 levels, well, fun...

With games like Call of Duty, the multiplayer aspect adds longevity to the game and this could - and should - be the case with GT5 but I'm sorry to say PD missed the boat with their online offering.

Multiplayer would have been a great way to boost xp after finishing the extreme races while progressing toward the X1, skills perfected, courses learned with the infinite possibility that human opponents can offer.

 

[SuperCobraJet]

Its a direct result of the level up way.

Although with enough events it could have been eased somewhat.

In this game the player is made to feel as if your being compressed or extruded through a short funnel, or the proverbial hamster on a wheel.
No options, no open-endedness, no wide-track concept.

Sure there were guardrails in GT4, but you were on a much more liesurely, many more options to get there approach.

After GT4, I can't believe the narrowness and lack of depth to this game.

 

[TheTechnobear]

X1 - question is, is the bronze low enough for most to achieve?
( elite racing gamers will beat vettel on a game, just not on a real track )

Grinding - we should enjoy racing lots (that's the game), but we need variation ... More combo of cars and tracks.
eg , I love racing the fireblade, but if I want xp/credits I basically can only race it for 3 laps on London or top gear, against British opponents... It's fun, but gets repetitive after awhile.

if pd said I had to race 100s of races, but with any car I want, on any track I want with similar opponents , would I mind, of course not... In fact Im not sure you could even call it grinding

In forza they had noticed this, in fm3 everything earns credits, online / offline... So you can create any track combo with ai in any car and earn credits/xp.
Note: not saying fm3 is better, I way prefer the physics in gt5 , just saying it's possible

 

[ubergill]

if pd said I had to race 100s of races, but with any car I want, on any track I want with similar opponents , would I mind, of course not... In fact Im not sure you could even call it grinding

In forza they had noticed this, in fm3 everything earns credits, online / offline... So you can create any track combo with ai in any car and earn credits/xp.
Note: not saying fm3 is better, I way prefer the physics in gt5 , just saying it's possible

Good shout, as well as multiplayer, custom races would make the grind less of a grind!

 

[niceness-dk]

X1 - question is, is the bronze low enough for most to achieve?
( elite racing gamers will beat vettel on a game, just not on a real track )

Grinding - we should enjoy racing lots (that's the game), but we need variation ... More combo of cars and tracks.
eg , I love racing the fireblade, but if I want xp/credits I basically can only race it for 3 laps on London or top gear, against British opponents... It's fun, but gets repetitive after awhile.

if pd said I had to race 100s of races, but with any car I want, on any track I want with similar opponents , would I mind, of course not... In fact Im not sure you could even call it grinding

In forza they had noticed this, in fm3 everything earns credits, online / offline... So you can create any track combo with ai in any car and earn credits/xp.
Note: not saying fm3 is better, I way prefer the physics in gt5 , just saying it's possible

I am thinking the exact same thing. I FM3 I loved setting up my own little track day on various tracks, selecting offline opponents, and actually earning cash for that. I miss such a feature in GT5. I still prefer GT5 though.

Other things could be done to make the gamer waste less time. Such as rewarding XP for TRYING events, even though you don't get bronze, silver or gold. I have spent 3,5 hours on what I would call "nothing".

PD could also make the XP rewards bigger as your level increase. Kinda like your salery increasing in the same pace as the inflation.. If PD don't come up with some changes to the XP-system, I can only picture my self quiting a-spec mode in a few levels (currently level 30)..

 

[ezzyos]

I am thinking the exact same thing. I FM3 I loved setting up my own little track day on various tracks, selecting offline opponents, and actually earning cash for that. I miss such a feature in GT5. I still prefer GT5 though.

Other things could be done to make the gamer waste less time. Such as rewarding XP for TRYING events, even though you don't get bronze, silver or gold. I have spent 3,5 hours on what I would call "nothing".

PD could also make the XP rewards bigger as your level increase. Kinda like your salery increasing in the same pace as the inflation.. If PD don't come up with some changes to the XP-system, I can only picture my self quiting a-spec mode in a few levels (currently level 30)..

Quit / semi-retire A-spec once you get the X1

That's what I did. Absolutely despise the mmorpg aspect of the game.

 

[niceness-dk]

Quit / semi-retire A-spec once you get the X1

That's what I did. Absolutely despise the mmorpg aspect of the game.

I'll quite a-spec as soon as I own every car in the game. The problem here is, that the 3,5 hours I was talking about, was spent trying to get bronze in the Red Bull event. I'm down to 16 seconds now and then. If I keep that pace of improvement, I might be lucky to have the X1 by new years eve. Or the game could just gift it to me as a xmas present. But I kinda doubt that.

Well, back to driving the Nordschleife in the EV's. Oh yeah, that's the stuff!!

 

[xNEVER-ONEx]

GT5 is a artificially lengthened to make up for the lack of "content." The A-spec is a joke for a game that took this long to be developed, B-spec is essentially the same thing but at least the prize cars are better. The special events are unique and interesting, but for the average gamer (plus the majority of people who play this game with a ds3), its bit over their heads.

All in all, what PD did over the last 6 years is rehash GT4 and port it for the PSP, and make 200 cars and handful of tracks super pretty. And awesome physics. Sony is lucky that a third party dev can't touch GT5 in terms of quality on the PS3.

I think the perfect solution to the game would have been 3 difficulty settings for GT Life. Beginner, Professional and Extreme. Beginner for casual gamers who bought the game because it looked cool. Professional for guys like me who have experience on past GT and a lot of video gaming exp in general. And extreme for those guys who are, well extreme.

 

[ezzyos]

I'll quite a-spec as soon as I own every car in the game. The problem here is, that the 3,5 hours I was talking about, was spent trying to get bronze in the Red Bull event. I'm down to 16 seconds now and then. If I keep that pace of improvement, I might be lucky to have the X1 by new years eve. Or the game could just gift it to me as a xmas present. But I kinda doubt that.

Well, back to driving the Nordschleife in the EV's. Oh yeah, that's the stuff!!

Using controller or wheel for the vettel thing?

 

[ezzyos]

GT5 is a artificially lengthened to make up for the lack of "content." The A-spec is a joke for a game that took this long to be developed, B-spec is essentially the same thing but at least the prize cars are better. The special events are unique and interesting, but for the average gamer (plus the majority of people who play this game with a ds3), its bit over their heads.

All in all, what PD did over the last 6 years is rehash GT4 and port it for the PSP, and make 200 cars and handful of tracks super pretty. And awesome physics. Sony is lucky that a third party dev can't touch GT5 in terms of quality on the PS3.

I think the perfect solution to the game would have been 3 difficulty settings for GT Life. Beginner, Professional and Extreme. Beginner for casual gamers who bought the game because it looked cool. Professional for guys like me who have experience on past GT and a lot of video gaming exp in general. And extreme for those guys who are, well extreme.

co-sign.

 

[JMII]

if pd said I had to race 100s of races, but with any car I want, on any track I want with similar opponents , would I mind, of course not... In fact Im not sure you could even call it grinding

Agreed! If the AI was consistent and you could return to the lower series races for more XP/credits the game would 100X more fun and less of a grind. However as is there is no reason to return to the Sunday Cup (for example) and re-race it even with the most underpowered car because the XP points are a drop in the bucket once you've reached level 20. I'm at Level 17 and already the "grind" is getting old, mostly due to the lack of credits. There are tons of cars I want to buy but I need to save my credits to buy the type of cars you need for level 20 and up.

 

[daspianist]

To address the question directly:

Yes, PD is expecting too much from gamers when it comes to beating a world record formula 1 champion for Gold.

 

[niceness-dk]

Using controller or wheel for the vettel thing?

Using a controller.. I know it makes it a lot more difficult. But I don't have a wheel. Nor do I intend to buy one, as I actually don't have a place to put it in my one-room appartment

 

[niceness-dk]

To address the question directly:

Yes, PD is expecting too much from gamers when it comes to beating a world record formula 1 champion for Gold.

THANK YOU SO MUCH!! I've been waiting for someone to say that 👍

 

[ezzyos]

Using a controller.. I know it makes it a lot more difficult. But I don't have a wheel. Nor do I intend to buy one, as I actually don't have a place to put it in my one-room appartment

I see. Good luck either way though. 👍

 

[Saidur_Ali]

To address the question directly:

Yes, PD is expecting too much from gamers when it comes to beating a world record formula 1 champion for Gold.

The gold time is meant to be challenging. There will be no fun if they just give the Gold for doing a slow time. It is also a Level 30 challenge and not meant as a beginner challenge. I haven't got to the challenge yet, but I wouldn't want the gold time to be for example, get gold if you are only 5 seconds slower than Vettel. Vettel most likely only spent a little time on it compared to us gamers, and would most likely beat his time by a good margin if he played on the three tracks longer with the X1. It is not like the X1 challenge is impossible for us gamers as the game has only bean released for less than two weeks and someone has already got all golds in that challenge.

So was PD expecting too much from gamers when it asked for us to try and beat the world's most successful rally driver named Sebastien Loeb? He has won the last 7 World Rally Championships consecutively.

Also was Studio Liverpool asking too much of gamers when it asked Wipeout gamers to beat Zico (Who more or less came to perfecting his lap) to get that trophy?

If you are aiming to beat the fastest time, expect it to be a challenge and not something that will be a walk in the park. Vettel in the X1 video was driving 3 seconds slower than his best times and he practised until he got quicker. It is not like everyone of us will give up if they are not immediately faster than Vettel. It takes time to figure out how the car works and then to drive it on the limit. It is like some of you guys are expecting it to master the car in the first attempt. The car is so quick that you can improve your lap time by a big chunk just by mastering one corner at a time with the car.

The higher level gold times are not meant for the average Joe. I don't want PD to go the way of other games such as Hot Pursuit where gold times are easily done. Even if I can't do it, I will say I don't deserve it and if I do get the gold times I can say I am faster than Vettel.

 

[RobGT81]

I think its right that some golds are hard to get, its a challege and GT5 is going to be around for a good few years so its not like you have to beat it quick before all your mates and get prestige 15 times a week to look cool

 

[niceness-dk]

Actually.. If Vettel did a flying lap at 1:04.xxx time on Nurburg GP, he didn't get gold

I don't want PD to make the gold times easier.. But it would be very nice if they could adjust the bronze times just a little, so it wouldn't take forever to achieve the bronze. If you get gold, you get the car for free. If you get bronze, you can buy the car for 20mil.. Somebody else can think of a prize for silver then

 

[Saidur_Ali]

Actually.. If Vettel did a flying lap at 1:04.xxx time on Nurburg GP, he didn't get gold

I don't want PD to make the gold times easier.. But it would be very nice if they could adjust the bronze times just a little, so it wouldn't take forever to achieve the bronze. If you get gold, you get the car for free. If you get bronze, you can buy the car for 20mil.. Somebody else can think of a prize for silver then

I think they are expecting too much for game pad users but for wheel users the gold time is right. I haven't got to the challenge yet and most likely won't be near to Level 30 for at least another two weeks (Have university work to do). I don't know if they improved the digital steering rate for pad users specifically for the X1, if it is the same rate as it was in GT5P for the F2007 then I think it is way to hard to get the Gold or it might even be impossible. We will see if anyone claims to have got Gold or even Silver with a controller in the coming weeks to see if it is even possible. I think the Bronze times are fair considering it is a level 30 challenge and not a low level one.

 

[niceness-dk]

I think they are expecting too much for game pad users but for wheel users the gold time is right. I haven't got to the challenge yet and most likely won't be near to Level 30 for at least another two weeks (Have university work to do). I don't know if they improved the digital steering rate for pad users specifically for the X1, if it is the same rate as it was in GT5P for the F2007 then I think it is way to hard to get the Gold or it might even be impossible. We will see if anyone claims to have got Gold or even Silver with a controller in the coming weeks to see if it is even possible. I think the Bronze times are fair considering it is a level 30 challenge and not a low level one.

Most of the time my problem is, that I turn too hard. The car simply handles too well, if you use a controller.

To be honest, I thought the same thing as you do. Heard of people who spent 6+ hours just to get near bronze. And I just thought "HA!!" and was very confident when I had my first try.

I also have a lot of studying to do the next couple of weeks, so I will not make any progress, but I look forward to hearing from people who beat the challenge after being as far from bronze as I am..

 

[Saidur_Ali]

Most of the time my problem is, that I turn too hard. The car simply handles too well, if you use a controller.

To be honest, I thought the same thing as you do. Heard of people who spent 6+ hours just to get near bronze. And I just thought "HA!!" and was very confident when I had my first try.

I also have a lot of studying to do the next couple of weeks, so I will not make any progress, but I look forward to hearing from people who beat the challenge after being as far from bronze as I am..

Have you tried braking deeper into the corner and then turning later? If it allows you to turn hard then if you minimise the amount you brake and increase the speed you take in then you should be able to go faster. Have you played with the F2007 before, that was quite hard to drive fast with a controller, but much easier with a steering wheel. Someone with a wheel who got the gold times has both full throttle and a little amount of brake on S curves in Suzuka and uses the corner grip to slow him down. Maybe you could try that technique with the controller.

I have the added advantage of trying to beat the Gold time using the same machinery as Vettel, the Logitech Driving Force GT so I have no excuse when I try and beat him .

 

[Akmuq]

The grind is way to long. There's no way you should have to repeat events unless you want to. I remember having to grind in gt4 because I had no idea of the sheet amount of events there is. It was awful.

The red bull x1 is so hard to get so you can show it off to the world online. It's the same for those classic le mans racers. It shows commitment and skill.

Also has anyone seen the x1 in white? It's awesome.

 

[gold_ultima]

Honestly, if the game was easier, I wouldn't be playing it. I like games like Megaman, Star Tropics, Little Nemo. Not this new age Ratchet and Clank don't want to hurt the kid's self esteem s**t. I play real games that are real hard. Just like real life.

 

[niceness-dk]

Have you tried braking deeper into the corner and then turning later? If it allows you to turn hard then if you minimise the amount you brake and increase the speed you take in then you should be able to go faster. Have you played with the F2007 before, that was quite hard to drive fast with a controller, but much easier with a steering wheel. Someone with a wheel who got the gold times has both full throttle and a little amount of brake on S curves in Suzuka and uses the corner grip to slow him down. Maybe you could try that technique with the controller.

I have the added advantage of trying to beat the Gold time using the same machinery as Vettel, the Logitech Driving Force GT so I have no excuse when I try and beat him .

Haven't driven the F2007. I've driven the PD Formula One and I managed to win a couple of the races in the Formula One WC quite easy. But the X1 is just insane. Eventually you can get used to it, but imo it takes way to long. The 4-5 hours of practicing could have gotten me half the way to level 31. Now it just feels like I'm getting nowhere. But perhaps I will suddenly get the bronze. I will keep trying that technique you mentioned..

 

[d3br34k5]

Its just like real life, more you practice better you are, Even if you are an AVERAGE gamer, you can still get all BRONZE medals and win the game. I like GT games because all can play but if your really HARDCORE player you distinguish yourself by getting all GOLD trophies. I hate that many games these days are SUPER EASY, everyone can get a PLATINUM trophy in Uncharted 2 , but only the hardcore can get Platinum trophy in GT5.

Quoted for truth.

Some of the folks here need to give Demon's Souls a go. Now that's a hard game.

Not everyone is going to be able to gold every event. Let the elite have their exclusivity while we try to cope with our mediocrity.

Practice.

 

[SleazyBig slim]

In the past I played lord of the rings online and had several high level characters.
There where always quests and some grinding to reach the highest level .

But ,however I love GT5, the ammount of grinding to reach level 40 in this game is insane!!
So much more than a game like lord of the rings...and that for a racegame...

Everyone want than X1...but not everyone has the skills to get bronze...so yes for a lot of us it will be grinding till lvl 40 to buy the X1 (20.000.000 credits)..except if they come up with some nice content to make the journey more enjoyable.

SO we can buy the X1 at lvl 40? Awesome if true!👍

 

[chris78cpr]

If you think Gold'ing Vettel's challenge is hard you surely havn't played 'Super Mario: The Lost Levels'!!!!!!!! Now that was a proper old school, kick you in the arse because it's so damn hard game.

I think i just showed my age...... Ah crap!

 

[paraclete]

What PD needs to add in is some kind of race generator where you can use the custom track editor and then select whatever kind of cars you want to race against and get a set amount of XP/credits based on that.

Frankly I'm pretty bored of being forced to re-race Daytona until I hit 30 or 40. The game is fine up until level 25, but then there are NO races to be had.

 

[niceness-dk]

SO we can buy the X1 at lvl 40? Awesome if true!👍

Yes we can. It's available in the dealership when you reach lvl 30. You just have to get 31.000.000 more xp to get it. Compare that to the fact that you have earned 2.930.000 xp, when you reach lvl 30.. Complete the Indy500 4 times every day for a month, and you are there

 

[chris78cpr]

On a seperate note, i have to agree with several of the posters. Games are not designed to be easy. If you take any game it has an element of skill and a sesne that to dot he best, do 100%, you need to master it.

As GT5 stands it has many flaws but at the same time it is fantastic. If you don't want to get to level 40 by repeating the same races then don't do it. But don't complain you arn't allowed to do the things that Level 40 allows.

For me i don't mind doing the same races, i will dip in and do a bit with one car, then use another car, then a diff car and enjoy the experience learning each car. I'll then have a break and play some Call of Duty, or some Donkey Kong, or some Layton and then i'll go back to GT5 and move up another half level.

If i got to level 40 and had the X1 in my garage after 12 days of the game being out then i would feel cheated by PD. They put 6 years of development time into this game and by all right they should make it a difficult game. I want to be playing this for the next two years, three years, four years even. I want to still be working towards a goal, still working towards the next $10million car i want to buy. Its like Pokemon, you can do most the game with general play, but if you want a Level 99 team it takes A LOT of time, or to catch all the pokemon it takes A LOT of time.

I am a hardcore gamer, i love each and every system and play all types of games and i look forward and appriciate the fact that PD and Kaz have made GT5 something that will be an investment of my time to get 100%.