Poll: What aid-tools in sport mode should be allowed ?

[Voodoovaj]

Tires, tune, and aids in the description

MUST I use aids, or must I not use aids? What is the challenge? ABS off too?

 

[Alpha Cipher]

MUST I use aids, or must I not use aids? What is the challenge? ABS off too?

You outlined the challenge yourself. No aids, ABS off. I used aids on that one

 

[Voodoovaj]

You outlined the challenge yourself. No aids, ABS off. I used aids on that one

Challenge accepted. It might take a bit.

I'm sitting at 1:18.1 with no ABS right now with an optimal of 1:17.7. I'll get there.

 

[OutlawQuadrnt]

IIRC, GT Academy disabled some aids. So, there is your precedent.

I forget which ones were disabled but GT Academy turned most of them off for their time trials and events. No guarantee they will do the same for certain future events but it is possible.

 

[Voodoovaj]

You outlined the challenge yourself. No aids, ABS off. I used aids on that one

Well, congrats. I don't know how you got a 1:16.4 because I couldn't come close.

Best ABS Default lap - 1:18.153

Best NO ABS or Aids lap - 1:18.196 (just one, I could not lap consistently faster than 1:18.9's, but ONCE I managed to stick with the ghost and not lock up)

Best All aids - CSA strong, etc, as in the video you posted......1:19.451. 3 full seconds slower than your lap.

So, there's obviously some sort of technique to it which I am missing. None the less, as I have stated over and over, the aids slow me down. Maybe it's subconscious because I don't use them, maybe it's technique, maybe it's both, but it's definitely not a case of turn the aids on and go fast. There has to be more to it. Aside from it being terribly unenjoyable.

Maybe it's a bug. We found a bug were grip gets turned up from time to time, maybe this is another.

 

[DriftMethod]

Well, congrats. I don't know how you got a 1:16.4 because I couldn't come close.

Best ABS Default lap - 1:18.153

Best NO ABS or Aids lap - 1:18.196 (just one, I could not lap consistently faster than 1:18.9's, but ONCE I managed to stick with the ghost and not lock up)

Best All aids - CSA strong, etc, as in the video you posted......1:19.451. 3 full seconds slower than your lap.

So, there's obviously some sort of technique to it which I am missing. None the less, as I have stated over and over, the aids slow me down. Maybe it's subconscious because I don't use them, maybe it's technique, maybe it's both, but it's definitely not a case of turn the aids on and go fast. There has to be more to it. Aside from it being terribly unenjoyable.

Maybe it's a bug. We found a bug were grip gets turned up from time to time, maybe this is another.

@Alpha Cipher is just fast. Take away aids, add aids, whatever, but Cipher will still be fast.

I firmly believe that everyone should have their choice of whatever combination of aids that help them get faster laps, drive more consistently, be safer on track, or just have more fun. At some point PD may start to change how aids work (actually they already have) or what they allow and that's fine too. I'd support asking for options to set up lobbies with more restrictions, but Sport Mode should encourage more people to race, not cater to any one group.

 

[simsimsheree]

I believe PC2 got it right. The CSA in PC2 can only be applied if you play with a pad. And room hosts have the option of setting 'Realistic Aids' for each Group of cars. Mind you, being on a wheel, I'm not sure if CSA can still be used in a room set to 'Authentic', but I would rather expect so, and have no problem with that, seeing as no real car is ever driven with a gamepad!

OTOH, they also did a far better job of tire and car handling, so artificial aids aren't as seemingly essential as they are with GTS's arcade handling.

Now, don't get me wrong, I also think that PC2's refusal to dumb down the handling model or setup complexity at a hypothetical 'Beginner Mode' level so that GTS level drivers can enjoy their first experiences and not face the dauntingly steep migration experience is what has turned it into a barren wasteland compared to GTS's massive player base, but that's another story... LOL

But at least PC2 knows pad drivers need a little extra help, but wheel drivers don't.

Maybe PD will eventually come to this realization.

 

[Voodoovaj]

@Alpha Cipher is just fast. Take away aids, add aids, whatever, but Cipher will still be fast.

I firmly believe that everyone should have their choice of whatever combination of aids that help them get faster laps, drive more consistently, be safer on track, or just have more fun. At some point PD may start to change how aids work (actually they already have) or what they allow and that's fine too. I'd support asking for options to set up lobbies with more restrictions, but Sport Mode should encourage more people to race, not cater to any one group.

That test didn't open my eyes to anything new. When I turn CSA on strong, in any car, I go slower. CSA on weak and I can keep up. But CSA off is always my fastest.

You first line is what I believe to be true about everyone. "Take away aids, add aids, whatever, but ________ will still be _____." Doing that test only affirmed my believe that aids do not drastically change anyone person.

Maybe there's an exploit that I don't know about, but the aids seem balanced to me.

 

[DriftMethod]

That test didn't open my eyes to anything new. When I turn CSA on strong, in any car, I go slower. CSA on weak and I can keep up. But CSA off is always my fastest.

You first line is what I believe to be true about everyone. "Take away aids, add aids, whatever, but ________ will still be _____." Doing that test only affirmed my believe that aids do not drastically change anyone person.

Maybe there's an exploit that I don't know about, but the aids seem balanced to me.

Part of it is just what you're used to and comfortable with. CSA will feel strange if you are used to counter steering on your own and expect the back to push out a bit.

For myself, in a Gr.3 car at Suzuka, going around Dunlop really makes CSA noticeable. I have to adjust my line and steering depending on CSA. I don't know if it's faster, but I do feel a bit more confident with it and that makes a difference in a race, especially longer races with tire wear.

 

[Alpha Cipher]

That test didn't open my eyes to anything new. When I turn CSA on strong, in any car, I go slower. CSA on weak and I can keep up. But CSA off is always my fastest.

You first line is what I believe to be true about everyone. "Take away aids, add aids, whatever, but ________ will still be _____." Doing that test only affirmed my believe that aids do not drastically change anyone person.

Maybe there's an exploit that I don't know about, but the aids seem balanced to me.

I sort of knew the results would be skewed going into this test either way, since our skill levels are different. That's the point I wanted to make during this test. I just didn't like that you said "take any gr. 1 car with any aids and I'll beat it", since that's dependent on skill level as well. Now that you tested it all by yourself, you took the skill level factor away, and now you have balanced results.

Anyway, your results are interesting; not a whole lot of difference without CSA and ABS. Makes me wonder if I stil really need CSA (The last test I did on it was December)

 

[Voodoovaj]

I sort of knew the results would be skewed going into this test either way, since our skill levels are different. That's the point I wanted to make during this test. I just didn't like that you said "take any gr. 1 car with any aids and I'll beat it", since that's dependent on skill level as well. Now that you tested it all by yourself, you took the skill level factor away, and now you have balanced results.

Anyway, your results are interesting; not a whole lot of difference without CSA and ABS. Makes me wonder if I stil really need CSA (The last test I did on it was December)

And meaning often gets lost in forums. What I meant was to highlight that CSA isn't the magic bullet that everyone makes it out to be. Also, just as you pointed out, skill level varies so much from player to player that placing blame on the aids for a players lack of performance is misplaced.

 

[Rinsky]

@Alpha Cipher is just fast. Take away aids, add aids, whatever, but Cipher will still be fast.

I got some first hand experience on this the other day when we were in a lobby together. He doesn't consider himself an alien but I didn't see anyone come close to the times he can produce.

I'm really looking forward to racing with him in our endurance race next week. It will be interesting to see how many laps he puts me down by in 1.5 hours. My guess is 2 only if I can remain mistake free for that long.

 

[Alpha Cipher]

I got some first hand experience on this the other day when we were in a lobby together. He doesn't consider himself an alien but I didn't see anyone come close to the times he can produce.

I'm really looking forward to racing with him in our endurance race next week. It will be interesting to see how many laps he puts me down by in 1.5 hours. My guess is 2 only if I can remain mistake free for that long.

Nuschel set a faster lap than I did there or I think I beat it, but only by a small margine

And meaning often gets lost in forums. What I meant was to highlight that CSA isn't the magic bullet that everyone makes it out to be. Also, just as you pointed out, skill level varies so much from player to player that placing blame on the aids for a players lack of performance is misplaced.

Ahh, fair points

 

[Rinsky]

Nuschel set a faster lap than I did there or I think I beat it, but only by a small margine

You beat it. It showed you with the FL

 

[Alpha Cipher]

You beat it. It showed you with the FL

Oh cool
But yeah, I think it's by less than a second, or 5/10ths. I consider myself an astronaut but I don't think I'm an alien yet

 

[Macboyilija]

Just a little kick of the topic !

 

[Lord of Tranz]

Controller and steering wheel users should be split, no fuss. Seperate racing.

Also a fan of more balanced racing. No aids in online competitive races, but do whatever offline/with friends and such naturally.

The FIA stuff especially must be equal. Makes the winner a true winner if everyone has the same platform.

 

[kilesa4568]

Controller and steering wheel users should be split, no fuss. Seperate racing.

Why?

 

[Lord of Tranz]

Why?

Obvious reasons. Balance mainly.

 

[Rinsky]

Obvious reasons. Balance mainly.

The gap between the two may not be as big as you might think. There are a lot of people on here who are just as fast with a DS4 as any wheel users.

 

[kilesa4568]

The only deciding factor between the two is the person using them.

 

[mthomas_95]

There is zero laptime difference between wheel and controller. It's usually just some wheel users getting salty about a controller guy being faster than them, or controller guys deciding within 10 seconds of starting the game that it's impossible to be smooth without a wheel

 

[fastone371]

So, how do you not have fun when entering a sport mode race?

Do you go in already thinking you're the only person not using aids and because of that you won't have as much fun as you'd like? Do you check everyone's aids during the warm up before the race? If so, why? Why don't you assume everyone's driving with ABS only and carry on having fun? Or do you get disappointed if on a tight corner you see another driver getting away because he doesn't have as much wheel spin (he can be just a good driver or have TCS, why assume the latter)?

It all sounds a bit weird to me tbh.

I discover what aids a person is using when I save a replay to find out if the huge crash that cost me a win was my fault or my opponents. Then I usually discover that even though my opponents dash looks like an Xmas tree on Christmas Eve with every possible light flashing and blinking he still couldn't manage to brake on time or get thru a chicane without short cutting it a T-boning me all the way to the nearest airport.

 

[DriftMethod]

There is zero laptime difference between wheel and controller. It's usually just some wheel users getting salty about a controller guy being faster than them, or controller guys deciding within 10 seconds of starting the game that it's impossible to be smooth without a wheel

I am one of the people that believe a wheel is faster. All of you super fast controller drivers just have a plethora of talent.

 

[fastone371]

There is zero laptime difference between wheel and controller. It's usually just some wheel users getting salty about a controller guy being faster than them, or controller guys deciding within 10 seconds of starting the game that it's impossible to be smooth without a wheel

You may or may not be correct but 1 thing that is a problem for many using the DS4 is the minute adjustments to keep a car online. I have been hit broadside countless times while passing a car and the person next to me is just trying to keep his car on line. As far as a DS4 possibly being as fast as a wheel that would only be because thats the way PD wants it to be. I think PD has built in many little things into the game that make it substantially easier to drive with the DS4. You certainly see it when a car in front of you is zigzagging 3 lanes wide going down a straight yet you cant make up any time, all of that wheel movement should rightly be costing quite a bit of time. I dont get salty about how a competitor plays his game, I bought a wheel because to me that is how a racing game should be played, use a keyboard if you wish, it is no skin off of 🤬. That also makes me wonder what PD is doing to the races during sport mode races. You have the timer on the screen showing when you are behind/ahead of your fastest lap and you can see the timer change from blue to red and how easy it is to scrub off a full second because you brushed the wall, not hit the wall, just brushed exiting the corner. Yet during a race you can be .500 behind the car in front and he brushes the wall yet many times you barely make up any time, what gives??

 

[Macboyilija]

I dont think one is much faster than the other. I do like the idea of separating them, but only as an option. Problem is that the servers will probably be too empty.

So we will just leave it like this and keep on complaining over and over again

 

[matrix_gt1]

You may or may not be correct but 1 thing that is a problem for many using the DS4 is the minute adjustments to keep a car online. I have been hit broadside countless times while passing a car and the person next to me is just trying to keep his car on line. As far as a DS4 possibly being as fast as a wheel that would only be because thats the way PD wants it to be. I think PD has built in many little things into the game that make it substantially easier to drive with the DS4. You certainly see it when a car in front of you is zigzagging 3 lanes wide going down a straight yet you cant make up any time, all of that wheel movement should rightly be costing quite a bit of time. I dont get salty about how a competitor plays his game, I bought a wheel because to me that is how a racing game should be played, use a keyboard if you wish, it is no skin off of 🤬. That also makes me wonder what PD is doing to the races during sport mode races. You have the timer on the screen showing when you are behind/ahead of your fastest lap and you can see the timer change from blue to red and how easy it is to scrub off a full second because you brushed the wall, not hit the wall, just brushed exiting the corner. Yet during a race you can be .500 behind the car in front and he brushes the wall yet many times you barely make up any time, what gives??

i think its consistency and racing. Time trials are pretty equal with DS4 n steering wheel. But when your in a pack of 20 cars going around a tight track, I feel its even harder to keep clean with a DS4.