Porsche 991 Information Released

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Seriously though, to me, the car looks exactly the same to be honest. I can see it's wider, and understand that it's a whole new car underneath, I just feel they should have went a bit more out there in terms of designing the car.
Like in TopGear - Jeremy Clarkson used to say "Porsche are the laziest designers in the world."
I used to totally disagree and could tell the difference between the 996 and 997 and still think the 997 is amazing. But with this new model I'm starting to side with the TV idiot.

Care to share the marketing tosh about what is new with this car?
Just seems like this car shares characteristics with the Carrera GTS underneath which is wider than the normal 997s, also isn't the Carrera S using the same engine as before? The gearbox is from the old car too.
Aero drag is the same number so the new design hasn't really affected the car greatly, I understand it's suspension and handling been improved though.
The interior is supposed to be all new but it doesn't really look like much has changed.

This is just my opinion and I respect everyone elses. I just want to know what really has changed in the new one.

Look at the new M3. Look at the new C class. Look at the R33 vs R32 Skylines. Look at the new GTi MkVI

All of those have about the same amount of style changes (if you can quantify that), and a fraction of the internal changes.

Go ahead and subscribe to the whole "Oh they didn't change anything dur dur" stupidity.

Watch the Top Gear review from a few years ago on the 997 Carrera S where they whine and whine about how it looks similar to old one, saying something like "They say they've changed every body panel, but what's the point if they make them look the same?"

Then watch the recent Aston Martin Virage review and they'll say something like "At first glance it looks a lot like all the other Astons, but if you look closely you'll see that every body panel is different"
 
1,328
People who Like 911s doesn't want it to be changed, they are just happy Porsche keep updating it in response to continuing technological advancement, and that every generation of car enthusiast can enjoy the 911 experience.

The 911 is unique in its positioning, it's a two seater coupe with great build quality, comfort, simplicity, compactness, great driving experience and decent performance, which gets updated every half a decade, consistently, with great continuity, no matter the times, you can always count on Porsche having a 911, you can literally grow up with the series.

Few car is as timeless as the 911, especially one that is relatively affordable.
 

F1GTR

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The 911 shape is a classic - it's what attracts potential buyers, they want to see that their new sports car carries some of the DNA of a legend. Porsche are doing the right thing by not 🤬 with it too much with each iteration.
 
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aadil717
I'm not "subscribing" to the Top Gear's whining about about 911s.
I just stated my opinion, I love 911s even from when I was a kid, always favoured them over Ferraris.
I totally understand F1GTR's viewpoint and agree with you, however at first I did not believe that this should be called an all new model as I could tell distinctly the difference between each of the older 911s however this one just looks like a facelifted 997 with LEDs and just a wider body, it's my opinion as no one can tell me what I see from my own eyes.
Maybe when I see this car in the flesh I will properly appreciate it.
I fully understand everyone's argument against my opinion and it looks great (as all 911s do) and will drive really well.
 
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Tommi

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I wasn't expecting it to be anything special so i'm pleasantly surprised. Really like the way the car looks and it's obviously going to be even more of a blast to drive because it's a 9191. 👍

Looking forward to the racing versions, I imagine they'll be even more awesome!
 

niky

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While incremental generational changes are par for the course for most automobiles, Porsche takes it to a different level.

Nissan changed the Skyline very little from the R32 to the R33... and then just a little more to the R34. When the G35/V35 came out, they dumped out everything and came out with something completely different... and the R35 is even moreso.

The Golf changed very little from the first model to the second... then a little more to the third... the fourth was a big step up, then the fifth was entirely different... the sixth is a small step.

-

Automakers go through these cycles of incremental changes leading to big changes leading to incremental. The last big change in styling for Porsche was the move from upright headlamps in the 964 to the aero headlights in the 993...

But since then, except for diddling briefly with scrambled egg headlights on the 996, the 911's styling has remained basically unchanged for seventeen years. Looks like Porsche wants to extend that for another several years with the 991.

Porsche is so deathly afraid of change that they've held onto the round headlamps long enough for them to go from "in" to "archaic" to "ancient" to "retro-cool". They could make Audi-style sculpted lights on the 911 and it'd still sell. They could put TRON style LED strip headlights on the 911 and it'd still sell. They could put incredibly ugly free-form acres-of-cheap-chrome headlights on the 911 and it'd still sell (witness the 996)... but they're too chicken to even try.

Aston? Don't get me started on Aston. They seem content to become the next Porsche. All identity, no innovation...
 
549
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While incremental generational changes are par for the course for most automobiles, Porsche takes it to a different level.

Nissan changed the Skyline very little from the R32 to the R33... and then just a little more to the R34. When the G35/V35 came out, they dumped out everything and came out with something completely different... and the R35 is even moreso.

The Golf changed very little from the first model to the second... then a little more to the third... the fourth was a big step up, then the fifth was entirely different... the sixth is a small step.

-

Automakers go through these cycles of incremental changes leading to big changes leading to incremental. The last big change in styling for Porsche was the move from upright headlamps in the 964 to the aero headlights in the 993...

But since then, except for diddling briefly with scrambled egg headlights on the 996, the 911's styling has remained basically unchanged for seventeen years. Looks like Porsche wants to extend that for another several years with the 991.

Porsche is so deathly afraid of change that they've held onto the round headlamps long enough for them to go from "in" to "archaic" to "ancient" to "retro-cool". They could make Audi-style sculpted lights on the 911 and it'd still sell. They could put TRON style LED strip headlights on the 911 and it'd still sell. They could put incredibly ugly free-form acres-of-cheap-chrome headlights on the 911 and it'd still sell (witness the 996)... but they're too chicken to even try.

Aston? Don't get me started on Aston. They seem content to become the next Porsche. All identity, no innovation...

Nailed it, Porsche are wimps that are afraid of changing the 911. They most likely think they will loose customers if they changed the design, Nissan took a leap and ended up with one of the best supercars (Or sports car) ever why cant Porsche take the same leap.
 
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xNEVER-ONEx
Nailed it, Porsche are wimps that are afraid of changing the 911. They most likely think they will loose customers if they changed the design, Nissan took a leap and ended up with one of the best supercars (Or sports car) ever why cant Porsche take the same leap.

The car has a identity. It is one of the most popular sports cars of all time. The GTR is good, but it hardly feels like a successor to the R34. The 911, along with Corvette, Mustangs, M3 among others are true sport car icons, because they have kept a certain formula and identity through out decades.
 

niky

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The Corvette has modernized itself over the years in terms of both looks and handling. The M3 has evolved along with the 3-series.

The Mustang... the new one is retro for retro's sake, but at least they have a clear definition between generations of Mustang.

There's no denying the 911 is iconic. There's no denying, either, that the car itself is an excellent showcase of how automotive engineering has progressed over the years. The new car is actually lighter than the old one, despite being bigger on the outside.

But as a barometer of automotive style, it's an anomaly. It's overly pandering to that small subset of enthusiasts who think the 911 is the 911 and nothing else. Any more so and it'd be the Land Rover Defender. Or the MINI.

You can't blame Porsche overly much for this, as they tried with the 928 and the 944 and buyers didn't bite, despite the 944 being arguably superior to the 911 in every way... and the 911 shape is largely dictated by the layout... but they can at least try something different every once in a while.
 
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xNEVER-ONEx
The Corvette has modernized itself over the years in terms of both looks and handling. The M3 has evolved along with the 3-series.

The Mustang... the new one is retro for retro's sake, but at least they have a clear definition between generations of Mustang.

There's no denying the 911 is iconic. There's no denying, either, that the car itself is an excellent showcase of how automotive engineering has progressed over the years. The new car is actually lighter than the old one, despite being bigger on the outside.

But as a barometer of automotive style, it's an anomaly. It's overly pandering to that small subset of enthusiasts who think the 911 is the 911 and nothing else. Any more so and it'd be the Land Rover Defender. Or the MINI.

You can't blame Porsche overly much for this, as they tried with the 928 and the 944 and buyers didn't bite, despite the 944 being arguably superior to the 911 in every way... and the 911 shape is largely dictated by the layout... but they can at least try something different every once in a while.
But they can still do that, and leave the 911 as is. They do have that new Ferrari fighter on the way. :)
 
39,441
Nailed it, Porsche are wimps that are afraid of changing the 911. They most likely think they will loose customers if they changed the design, Nissan took a leap and ended up with one of the best supercars (Or sports car) ever why cant Porsche take the same leap.
Aston hasn't made a car that looks different since 1993. These days, they literally change the front bumper and call it an entirely different model.


So I find it pretty funny that every time a new Aston comes out, people line up to praise it, but when Porsche sticks to the 911 design they are constantly bitched about. You may not know this, but there is a reason they reverted back to circular headlights after the 996.
 

niky

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I hate the new Astons. The only one I could bother to care about is the smaller Vantage, but not because of the looks...
 

Dan_

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I agree with Toronado, Porsche introduced many new approaches on their lineup over the years, the 944 being the most remarkable one. They have a new car on the works to be mid-engined and fight in the supercar market, so that must look distinctive enough, otherwise it'll fail. Leave the 911 be the 911, it's shape and headlights are a love or hate signature, trying to please everyone always hurts the character of the car.

I honestly think that shoveling (or trying to...) the 911-esque look on the Panamera, Cayenne and even the Cayman is the crucial factor that makes people complain about the predictability of their designs. I hope the boffins at VAG influence them to some degree and make significant changes where they make sense. But again, that's what I think and all the cars I mentioned above sell like bananas, so what I've said stands just as wishful thinking, not reasonable advice.
 

McLaren

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Nailed it, Porsche are wimps that are afraid of changing the 911. They most likely think they will loose customers if they changed the design, Nissan took a leap and ended up with one of the best supercars (Or sports car) ever why cant Porsche take the same leap.
Besides the fact they already did end up with one of the best supercars ever (the Carrera GT), Porsche doesn't have to take any leap with the 911 itself. The GT3/GT2/RS are proof enough that Porsche doesn't have take any sort of leap with the car's design to build one of the best sportscars the automotive world has ever seen. Why would Porsche mess with what they believe is perfection & what defines them....
 
549
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The car has a identity. It is one of the most popular sports cars of all time. The GTR is good, but it hardly feels like a successor to the R34. The 911, along with Corvette, Mustangs, M3 among others are true sport car icons, because they have kept a certain formula and identity through out decades.
1999 Porsche 911 GT3
porsche_gt3_02.jpg

2010 Porsche 911 GT3
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R32
Nissan_Skyline_R32_GT-R_001.jpg

R35
nissan.skyline.gtr.group.jpg


1993 Mustang
1993_ford_mustang_2_dr_lx_5_0_hatchback-pic-3961721581038753269.jpeg

2010 Mustang
sms_460_2010_mustang_b001.jpg


1993 BMW M3
l_cd0cfabf9bcb757925895b58f4bcbf63.jpg

2010 BMW M3
bmw-2010-m3-sedan-facelift-img_1.jpg


The GTR is just as iconic as the M3's the Corvettes and Mustangs yet they are the only ones who has taken a big step. If Porsche wants to retain a bit of the 911 they can leave the headlamps as is and redesign the whole car (Corvette and Nissans iconic round rear lamps)

Aston hasn't made a car that looks different since 1993. These days, they literally change the front bumper and call it an entirely different model.



So I find it pretty funny that every time a new Aston comes out, people line up to praise it, but when Porsche sticks to the 911 design they are constantly bitched about. You may not know this, but there is a reason they reverted back to circular headlights after the 996.

Totally agree, i think Aston is lazier than Porsche. Btw am not one of those people that line up to praise Aston, they are plain lazy.

Besides the fact they already did end up with one of the best supercars ever (the Carrera GT), Porsche doesn't have to take any leap with the 911 itself. The GT3/GT2/RS are proof enough that Porsche doesn't have take any sort of leap with the car's design to build one of the best sportscars the automotive world has ever seen. Why would Porsche mess with what they believe is perfection & what defines them....

Special edition can be made by any company and they will get a significant result over the base model, the design itself does not go against performance but it gets boring. The cars feels good to drive but they can do a whole lot better than they have been in recent years, i think that the GTR brought a whole lot of competition to Porsche that's why they started trying harder. I hop the GTR remains its competition for a while because never had competition that's why they lazed about for a while.
 
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I wish that the likes of Porsche and Aston Martin would make more different looking cars. New Porshes and Astons are about as different as new flavours of Mcflurry, or FIFA
 

TheCracker

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The GTR is just as iconic as the M3's the Corvettes and Mustangs yet they are the only ones who has taken a big step. If Porsche wants to retain a bit of the 911 they can leave the headlamps as is and redesign the whole car (Corvette and Nissans iconic round rear lamps)

In what way has Nissan taken a big step forward?

I wish that the likes of Porsche and Aston Martin would make more different looking cars. New Porshes and Astons are about as different as new flavours of Mcflurry, or FIFA

Why change a winning formula? The 911 doesn't need changing radically, it only requires freshening up a little every-so-often to keep it the best car in it's class. If the sales figures for the 911 ever start plummeting i'm sure Porsche will have to think again about it. But until then they only need to keep doing what they've always done.

Aston Martin are a small company that produces a relatively small amount of cars. They don't have the funds to keep developing new models so they carefully improve on what they already have. You just can't compare their development budget to that available to Nissan, BMW or even Porsche so they have to keep existing cars in production for much longer.

I usually have to second glance an Aston to tell the V8 Vantage, DB9 or Rapide apart since they do all have a strong family resemblance, but since they look fantastic anyway i don't see that as a problem.
 
39,441
If Porsche wants to retain a bit of the 911 they can leave the headlamps as is and redesign the whole car (Corvette and Nissans iconic round rear lamps)
And then be forced to change it back to the way it was before just like they did when they were designing the 997.
 

homeforsummer

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If Porsche wants to retain a bit of the 911 they can leave the headlamps as is and redesign the whole car (Corvette and Nissans iconic round rear lamps)

Round headlamps on their own do not make a 911.

The silhouette is what makes a 911. Change that and it's no longer a 911. Things like Nissan GTRs have never really had any particular visual identity apart from the rear round lamps - at the risk of offending the Nissan fanboys - the design has always been typically bland Japanese 2-door sedan, with a few details to beef it up. The R35 is the only design that's really moved on significantly.

Whatever way you shape that 2-door sedan it's still a GT-R as long as it has a powerful 6-cylinder turbocharged engine and a trick AWD system, and some round lights.

Likewise with the Corvette or Mustang - as long as they have a V8 in the front, power to the rear wheels and in the Corvette's case a plastic body, then they'll always be a Corvette and a Mustang.

Change the 911's styling too significantly and it ceases to be a 911. It's one of the most iconic shapes ever applied to a car. Perhaps Porsche could change some details here and there but the reason it's remained so similar for so long is because it works brilliantly.

If anything, Porsche's problem isn't how the 911 looks, but how they've made all their other vehicles to look like variations on the 911 theme. But then I like all Porsche's other models anyway so it doesn't bother me personally.

I hop the GTR remains its competition for a while because never had competition that's why they lazed about for a while.

In what way have they ever "lazed about"? Every single generation of 911 has pretty much defined that era of sports cars. The GT-R is simply one of the many challengers the 911 has had over the years.

Nailed it, Porsche are wimps that are afraid of changing the 911. They most likely think they will loose customers if they changed the design, Nissan took a leap and ended up with one of the best supercars (Or sports car) ever why cant Porsche take the same leap.

Apart from everything else, Porsche doesn't need to change the 911.

If it was their only model, then continually churning it out would be something to complain about, though as Niky points out, every attempt to replace it has failed.

None of that matters though as now if you want a different Porsche you can buy one straight from the showroom. Cayman, Boxster, Cayenne, Panamera and the occasional limited production supercar.

Why does Porsche need to change the 911 when it already offers alternative models?
 
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McLaren

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Special edition can be made by any company and they will get a significant result over the base model, the design itself does not go against performance but it gets boring. The cars feels good to drive but they can do a whole lot better than they have been in recent years, i think that the GTR brought a whole lot of competition to Porsche that's why they started trying harder. I hop the GTR remains its competition for a while because never had competition that's why they lazed about for a while.
Has nothing to do with being better than the base model. You said Nissan took a leap with the GT-R design & ended up with one of the best supercars/sports cars, so why doesn't Porsche take the same leap. Because they don't have to. They've already been building the best sports cars for years. I fail to see why they should suddenly change how the 911 looks when what they have accomplishes all their goals....

If you want to see Porsche take a leap, then look at their SUV & their 4-door. Nobody thought Porsche of all manufacturers should be making those types of vehicles, but they did. The Cayenne raked in the money to fund the other cars & the Panamera is now (or was at this point) the fastest 4-door car at the 'Ring. Sure, some could say, "They're ugly" though, but that doesn't mean much if those have remained the best selling models by the company.

The 911, though, doesn't need to change a thing about it's design. It's what says, "Porsche".
 

homeforsummer

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Probably. Probably a wider track too. Then there's all the other stuff like advances in tyre technology in the last few years... PDK probably helps too, for consistency if nothing else. And it's lighter, according to that article.
 

Dan_

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I'm not surprised, all the changes were made in order to make the 911 feel more sure-footed and grippier.

Amazing achievement, I wonder how quick the Turbo S and GT3RS will be. :eek:
 

RocZX

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911 (991) Turbo may have four- wheel steering
the car will be equipped with a four-wheel steering system which will enable the model to be nimbler than its predecessor. Little is known about the system, but it will likely work with the car's all-wheel drive system.

The car will reportedly be introduced in the fall of 2013, before going on sale in the spring of 2014.
Source:WorldCarFans
 

Kent

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Lies, damn lies, and statistics.
I'd be willing to bet 9 out of 10 track racers will take a stock gt3 over a stock carrera S for the win.

That said, I love the new 991 and hope they keep going as they have been.