Porsche Reveals New 503hp, 992-Generation 911 GT3

I think it's the front suspension that adds the most to the performance improvement.
 
For those in North America, the GT3 configurator is now open:

https://cc.porsche.com/icc/ccCall.do?rt=1617182367&screen=2560x1440&userID=USM&lang=us&PARAM=parameter_internet_us&ORDERTYPE=992810&CNR=C02&MODELYEAR=2022&hookURL=https://www.porsche.com/usa/modelstart/all/

As expected, especially considering the ever worsening USD/EUR exchange rate, the base price is up by $18,000.00 in the United States over the 991.2. :ill: It's really a blow and about double compared to what I was hoping. But I bit the bullet and in early March I switched my long standing GT4 allocation over and I'm told, if the stars align, I should have a car by the summer of 2022. I'm not in a rush to pay an exorbitant ADM and be the first.

The US configurator has the option for the extended range fuel tank (which I selected) and some extended diverted stitching options and colored gauges (which I passed on) that I didn't see on the German site. But perhaps I overlooked them. Otherwise the options seems pretty similar.
 
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jjaisli
For those in North America, the GT3 configurator is now open:

https://cc.porsche.com/icc/ccCall.do?rt=1617182367&screen=2560x1440&userID=USM&lang=us&PARAM=parameter_internet_us&ORDERTYPE=992810&CNR=C02&MODELYEAR=2022&hookURL=https://www.porsche.com/usa/modelstart/all/

As expected, especially considering the ever worsening USD/EUR exchange rate, the base price is up by $18,000.00 in the United States over the 991.2. :ill: It's really a blow and about double compared to what I was hoping. But I bit the bullet and in early March I switched my long standing GT4 allocation over and I'm told, if the stars align, I should have a car by the summer of 2022. I'm not in a rush to pay an exorbitant ADM and be the first.

The US configurator has the option for the extended range fuel tank (which I selected) and some extended diverted stitching options and colored gauges (which I passed on) that I didn't see on the German site. But perhaps I overlooked them. Otherwise the options seems pretty similar.
Click to expand...

Color?
 
jjaisli
Like a Taxi. Shark blue was my second choice. VERY close. I may even prefer it. But I have a feeling that's what most people will choose.
Click to expand...

Shame you can't get the graphite blue interior on the GT3. Not that I'd advocate for that particular combination...
 
I kind of wish I could get deviating stitching in yellow to match the exterior. Well, that is to say, it's possible. But number one, ticking all the right boxes to make it happen adds about $8K onto the price. Lunacy. And two, once you go down that route, the car becomes a bit too 'specialized' and the ADM flag starts popping up, I'm sure. Depending on the boxes you click, there are a boatload of options.

If you go for the shark blue, there's a cheaper way you can select matching accents that aren't so pricey. But then shark blue itself is not a free option ($4,200.00) And then it only makes sense to order the blue stripe on the wheel which is also $700 more. And then you're right back into the "what the HECK am I doing" territory. I did also select the nose lift for obvious reasons. And the fire extinguisher seems like a bargain because it's ridiculously cheap compared to pretty much EVERY other option, including the decals. But then you think, wait, did i just select a $185 fire extinguisher? :ill: That's not cheap.

I get a real kick out of reading the comments on Rennlist. It's a hodgepodge between those that think the base price increase is borderline criminal, those who are stoic and shrugging, (not happy but, what can you do) and at the other end, you have the people who are clearly in a very different income bracket or at least want to project the image that they are in a very different income bracket, and they have to make a point that it's perfectly reasonable. :rolleyes::lol:
 
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jjaisli
Like a Taxi. Shark blue was my second choice. VERY close. I may even prefer it. But I have a feeling that's what most people will choose.
Click to expand...
Yellow?


I'm not American so a Taxi color could be anything.



I forgot to ask. What did you choose? Manual or PDK?
 
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kikie
Yellow?


I'm not American so a Taxi color could be anything.



I forgot to ask. What did you choose? Manual or PDK?
Click to expand...

Good point. Yes, yellow. :D If I was just buying a stock Carerra I may have preferred smoke or grey. But the GT cars should be a bit louder. And I think brighter colors just highlight the car's lines.

And 6 speed manual. I really respect what Porsche's done with the PDK. But I still find using my left leg is a bit more engaging and I'm thrilled that Porsche still has it as an option, even if it's a few clicks slower.
 
jjaisli
Good point. Yes, yellow. :D If I was just buying a stock Carerra I may have preferred smoke or grey. But the GT cars should be a bit louder. And I think brighter colors just highlight the car's lines.

And 6 speed manual. I really respect what Porsche's done with the PDK. But I still find using my left leg is a bit more engaging and I'm thrilled that Porsche still has it as an option, even if it's a few clicks slower.
Click to expand...
I would have gone for Shark Blue and PDK. I still prefer a manual over PDK but in this case, a road legal racing car needs to have a PDK.
 
I am digging the Python Green and Shark Blue colors, but mine would have to be Gentian Blue Metallic because man does it look good. Also it would have to be manual because I prefer it to PDK, but also to celebrate the fact that the car is even available in manual at all.

Yellow painted PCCBs, of course.
51097114307_886611d50e_b.jpg

51097114317_afce605b29_b.jpg


Interior with Shark Blue stitching and seat belts as well as white tach and chrono.
51097020531_f1aae36905_b.jpg

51097020491_52bcb042b7_b.jpg
 
Instead of using the configurator, I did a tax simulation (it seems that I like to do these simulations :sly:) for the GT3.

Price without options: € 174,639.30

Registration tax: €11,391.05 (you have a lot of options for this)
Yearly road tax: €2,760.23


Is it wrong to say that I'm just a tiny little bit jealous of you @jjaisli?
 
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kikie
Instead of using the configurator, I did a tax simulation (it seems that I like to do these simulations :sly:) for the GT3.

Price without options: € 174,639.30

Registration tax: €11,391.05 (you have a lot of options for this)
Yearly road tax: €2,760.23


Is it wrong to say that I'm just a tiny little bit jealous of you @jjaisli?
Click to expand...

The grass isn't always greener. The base purchase price in USD vs EUR is a bargain, no doubt. But it's not the deal of the century.

On a list price of $178,900.00 with options, I'll have to pay:
- luxury car tax (on vehicles over $45,000) 4% = $7,160.00
- gas guzzler tax (on vehicles with a combined EPA of less than...well...something. $7,700.00
- state sales tax of 6.625% = $11,858.10
- The dealer will likely charge a license and registration fee of around $400.00

So I'm already at: $27,118.10 in taxes and fees. Each state in the US has their own rules and taxes so this is never quoted on the configurators. Land of the Free. :D

And a lot of dealers charge an ADM on top of all this (Additional Dealer Markup) I'm playing the long game and I'm hoping NOT to pay but it will depend on the level of demand vs supply by next summer. But I'm already hearing that some early people on the list are paying $30,000~$40,000 in additional ADM. TBH, if my dealer tells me next summer that it's going to cost me an additional $30K, I'm probably out.
 
jjaisli
The grass isn't always greener. The base purchase price in USD vs EUR is a bargain, no doubt. But it's not the deal of the century.

On a list price of $178,900.00 with options, I'll have to pay:
- luxury car tax (on vehicles over $45,000) 4% = $7,160.00
- gas guzzler tax (on vehicles with a combined EPA of less than...well...something. $7,700.00
- state sales tax of 6.625% = $11,858.10
- The dealer will likely charge a license and registration fee of around $400.00

So I'm already at: $27,118.10 in taxes and fees. Each state in the US has their own rules and taxes so this is never quoted on the configurators. Land of the Free. :D

And a lot of dealers charge an ADM on top of all this (Additional Dealer Markup) I'm playing the long game and I'm hoping NOT to pay but it will depend on the level of demand vs supply by next summer. But I'm already hearing that some early people on the list are paying $30,000~$40,000 in additional ADM. TBH, if my dealer tells me next summer that it's going to cost me an additional $30K, I'm probably out.
Click to expand...
Damn. (If I'm allowed to say this). That's a lot of money. It seems that we are better off qua taxes.
 
kikie
Damn. (If I'm allowed to say this). That's a lot of money. It seems that we are better off qua taxes.
Click to expand...
Well, not trying to get offtopic, but it is a little more complex in my opinion:

The median income in USA compared to Belgium/Germany is depending on the sources at least 25%- 30% higher before tax.
https://www.worlddata.info/average-income.php
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Median_income
https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/median-income-by-country

And then consider the income tax / tax rates:

https://stats.oecd.org/Index.aspx?DataSetCode=TABLE_I6

Germany/Belgium for a single person : 39 %
USA: 24 %

So the average US person earns 25% more and pays like 60% of the taxes. And I'd say that they earn at least 30% more in those jobs that make buying a GT3 a possibility. In my profession, the US colleagues earn over 100% to 150-200% more on average! 470k $ on average VS about 120k EUR (hospital) to 200k EUR (private practice).
https://www.erieri.com/salary/job/orthopedic-surgeon/united-states
https://www.healthrelations.de/gehalt-facharzt-wie-viel-verdient-der-praxisinhaber/ (German)

But of course that varies from job to job and insurance, school/tuition fees etc are far more expensive in the States.
Still, those extra fees mentioned above (which aren't even a thing in most US states) are not changing the fact that owning those cars in the US is WAY easier and cheaper...
 
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Max_DC
Well, not trying to get offtopic, but it is a little more complex in my opinion:

The median income in USA compared to Belgium/Germany is depending on the sources at least 25%- 30% higher before tax.
https://www.worlddata.info/average-income.php
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Median_income
https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/median-income-by-country

And then consider the income tax / tax rates:

https://stats.oecd.org/Index.aspx?DataSetCode=TABLE_I6

Germany/Belgium for a single person : 39 %
USA: 24 %

So the average US person earns 25% more and pays like 60% of the taxes. And I'd say that they earn at least 30% more in those jobs that make buying a GT3 a possibility. In my profession, the US colleagues earn over 100% to 150-200% more on average! 470k $ on average VS about 120k EUR (hospital) to 200k EUR (private practice).
https://www.erieri.com/salary/job/orthopedic-surgeon/united-states
https://www.healthrelations.de/gehalt-facharzt-wie-viel-verdient-der-praxisinhaber/ (German)

But of course that varies from job to job and insurance, school/tuition fees etc are far more expensive in the States.
Still, those extra fees mentioned above (which aren't even a thing in most US states) are not changing the fact that owning those cars in the US is WAY easier and cheaper...
Click to expand...

Yeah it's a really hard comparison. Americans earn more and pay less taxes, but we are nickel and dimed for everything. :lol:

It's like buying Spirit Airlines tickets. Being American you get a pretty bare-bones package as standard. You want something? Yeah, there's a surcharge for that. And your medical field salary examples....well you can understand why our healthcare is so ****ing expensive.
 
Max_DC
Well, not trying to get offtopic, but it is a little more complex in my opinion:

The median income in USA compared to Belgium/Germany is depending on the sources at least 25%- 30% higher before tax.
https://www.worlddata.info/average-income.php
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Median_income
https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/median-income-by-country

And then consider the income tax / tax rates:

https://stats.oecd.org/Index.aspx?DataSetCode=TABLE_I6

Germany/Belgium for a single person : 39 %
USA: 24 %

So the average US person earns 25% more and pays like 60% of the taxes. And I'd say that they earn at least 30% more in those jobs that make buying a GT3 a possibility. In my profession, the US colleagues earn over 100% to 150-200% more on average! 470k $ on average VS about 120k EUR (hospital) to 200k EUR (private practice).
https://www.erieri.com/salary/job/orthopedic-surgeon/united-states
https://www.healthrelations.de/gehalt-facharzt-wie-viel-verdient-der-praxisinhaber/ (German)

But of course that varies from job to job and insurance, school/tuition fees etc are far more expensive in the States.
Still, those extra fees mentioned above (which aren't even a thing in most US states) are not changing the fact that owning those cars in the US is WAY easier and cheaper...
Click to expand...

I'll say something else about these statistics. They're based on income tax. In the US we pay both Federal income tax, and depending on the state, POSSIBLY also a state income tax. And in some states, the state taxes are also quite high. So from this alone, this statistic is possibly skewed. What's more, again, depending on the state, our personal property taxes are also quite high. If I include federal, state & property taxes, I mean, yeah, I'm not quite at Germany's rate, but I'm much closer to it than the "high" of 24% quoted as the US maximum.

And as @Eunos_Cosmo mentioned, when the average private university Tuition + room & Board is around $200,000.00 in the US, things have a way of evening out. And let's not talk about the cost of decent private medical insurance.

All that said, considering I paid only $27K for a new Golf VII GTI less than 2 years ago, yes, you're right, we still come out ahead.
 
Eunos_Cosmo
Yeah it's a really hard comparison. Americans earn more and pay less taxes, but we are nickel and dimed for everything. :lol:

It's like buying Spirit Airlines tickets. Being American you get a pretty bare-bones package as standard. You want something? Yeah, there's a surcharge for that. And your medical field salary examples....well you can understand why our healthcare is so ****ing expensive.
Click to expand...

Nickel and diming is the American Way.

wgTiwIu.jpg
 
Eunos_Cosmo
Yeah it's a really hard comparison. Americans earn more and pay less taxes, but we are nickel and dimed for everything. :lol:

It's like buying Spirit Airlines tickets. Being American you get a pretty bare-bones package as standard. You want something? Yeah, there's a surcharge for that. And your medical field salary examples....well you can understand why our healthcare is so ****ing expensive.
Click to expand...


jjaisli
I'll say something else about these statistics. They're based on income tax. In the US we pay both Federal income tax, and depending on the state, POSSIBLY also a state income tax. And in some states, the state taxes are also quite high. So from this alone, this statistic is possibly skewed. What's more, again, depending on the state, our personal property taxes are also quite high. If I include federal, state & property taxes, I mean, yeah, I'm not quite at Germany's rate, but I'm much closer to it than the "high" of 24% quoted as the US maximum.

And as @Eunos_Cosmo mentioned, when the average private university Tuition + room & Board is around $200,000.00 in the US, things have a way of evening out. And let's not talk about the cost of decent private medical insurance.

All that said, considering I paid only $27K for a new Golf VII GTI less than 2 years ago, yes, you're right, we still come out ahead.
Click to expand...

I'm aware of the fact that truly comparing living in the USA and Europe is complex and even within our respective countries it differs massivly.
For example living in and around Silicon Valley without a family income over 120k $ a year seems to be almost impossible and taxes/fees and general costs of living are way higher than a.e. Montana etc. Also comparing selfemployed VS employed usually doesn't work because of different possibilities for reducing taxes etc.
And as you said, taxes are just one, albeit very relevant, factor overall. You mentioned health care - some jobs in the US come with free health care. In Germany everbody has heathcare, but you have to pay 14,6 % + 3,05 % ( nursing/care insurance) of your income ( maximum is about 750 EUR a month). So Germany isn't all inclusive either. I also pay church tax 3,5% (could be avoided), unemployment insurance tax (2,4%) and
solidarity surcharge for Eastern Germany 5,5 %. That means that in Germany we pay up to 50% taxes and other goverment fees.

The overall tax burden seems to be one way to compare it:
https://taxfoundation.org/comparison-tax-burden-labor-oecd-2018/

FF613-21.png


And while you mentioned housing tax, sure, but housing on average (sure, not on Times Squre and Silicon Valley) is also a lot cheaper:
1 squarefoot on average is 118 USD, in Germany ( although you can't really compare the housing markets, but still the numbers give you an orientation) the average price per square foot is 365 USD ! (Over 1000 USD per squre foot where I live btw).

https://www.statista.com/statistics...-square-foot-in-new-single-family-houses-usa/

https://www.expatrio.com/living-germany/costs-living-germany/costs-housing-germany


So yeah, I mean I paid almost nothing for my whole education, while I know that in the States you can spend hundrets of thousands of dollars from kindergarden to university.

But I think we can agree, and you already did, that within the same profession, it is usually(!) "easier" to get a certain standard of living including a house and a nice carin the US.
Of course I won't forget some of the benefits of paying those taxes, like a pothole free Autobahn which allows those who can afford the GT3 to legally drive 180 mph ;).

Anyway, just saying... didn't want to hijack the thread. But I have to do my taxes this week and that's probably why i'm in the mood for this kind of discussion :lol:
 
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I was going to mention that Belgian's taxes are through the roof but as you can see above, we are on top of paying taxes. Taxes have improved over the last decade but it's still too much. Why do we have to pay so many taxes? Because of the unique and very complex (read: stupid and genuinely moronic way) Belgium operates. Luckily we have one of the best healthcare systems.
In these 20 European countries, residents earn the most money (Dutch). Belgium is in 11th place.

Whatever the situation is, I still want a Porsche 911 and I hope that I will get one one day.:D


The new 992 GT3 is probably the last aspirated 4.0L engine because of the emission laws in Europe. Or maybe the next GT3 will be a hybrid GT3. A 4.0L with a small electric motor?
https://www.motor1.com/news/405423/porsche-911-hybrid-coming-report/
 
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kikie
I would have gone for Shark Blue and PDK. I still prefer a manual over PDK but in this case, a road legal racing car needs to have a PDK.
Click to expand...

So I found that Porsche's "Shark Blue" color is the same as VW's "Cornflower Blue". Not just similar but ACTUALLY the same exact color. It's all in the "family".

It's just ironic because my daily driver is a 2019 "Cornflower Blue" VW GTI.

48507503967_e971c9b592_c.jpg


I thought they looked the same but I didn't realize they were actually the same color. But somehow it makes it even more ridiculous that Porsche charges SO much for this option. The cost of this color paint on the GT3 is actually almost 20% of the GTI's purchase price, brand new. And the paint wasn't extra. HAH
 
jjaisli
So I found that Porsche's "Shark Blue" color is the same as VW's "Cornflower Blue". Not just similar but ACTUALLY the same exact color. It's all in the "family".

It's just ironic because my daily driver is a 2019 "Cornflower Blue" VW GTI.

48507503967_e971c9b592_c.jpg


I thought they looked the same but I didn't realize they were actually the same color. But somehow it makes it even more ridiculous that Porsche charges SO much for this option. The cost of this color paint on the GT3 is actually almost 20% of the GTI's purchase price, brand new. And the paint wasn't extra. HAH
Click to expand...
I liked the commenter who shared the good news that only the Senior Techs will be allowed to paint the Shark Blue cars.

For $4,220, it better be painted by someone who knows what they're doing.
 
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jjaisli
So I found that Porsche's "Shark Blue" color is the same as VW's "Cornflower Blue". Not just similar but ACTUALLY the same exact color. It's all in the "family".

It's just ironic because my daily driver is a 2019 "Cornflower Blue" VW GTI.

48507503967_e971c9b592_c.jpg


I thought they looked the same but I didn't realize they were actually the same color. But somehow it makes it even more ridiculous that Porsche charges SO much for this option. The cost of this color paint on the GT3 is actually almost 20% of the GTI's purchase price, brand new. And the paint wasn't extra. HAH
Click to expand...

When you sell your GTI you should definitely market it as being Porsche Shark Blue
 
jjaisli
So I found that Porsche's "Shark Blue" color is the same as VW's "Cornflower Blue". Not just similar but ACTUALLY the same exact color. It's all in the "family".

It's just ironic because my daily driver is a 2019 "Cornflower Blue" VW GTI.

48507503967_e971c9b592_c.jpg


I thought they looked the same but I didn't realize they were actually the same color. But somehow it makes it even more ridiculous that Porsche charges SO much for this option. The cost of this color paint on the GT3 is actually almost 20% of the GTI's purchase price, brand new. And the paint wasn't extra. HAH
Click to expand...
According to a youtube channel (car journalist) Shark blue will be available for the 2022 992.

Two cars in the same color would be too much, so good choice on not choosing Shark Blue.
 
Just figured I would leave a few of these here, since the media embargo has now been lifted:


Like an "old school" Chris Harris review


(auf deutsch) For those who can follow, Daniel gets to drive a manual GT3.


(for those interested in it's "quirks and features")


Matt's take


MotoMan

Watching through all of those videos there's a general consensus that seems to take shape. Porsche improved the car in many small, subtle ways. Although the change to the double wishbone front suspension seems to be the biggest departure and a welcome one. But in doing so, they also made it a harder, leaner, more track focused car. The 992 GT3 seems to lean more toward (991.2 generation) GT3RS territory. It's no longer the kind of car you'd really WANT to daily drive.

I'm guessing as a result, when the GT3 Touring arrives, they will have softened the suspension a bit and made the ride more a throw back to the standard 991 GT3 in terms of boulevard comfort.
 
Double post to add "additional" media...


* I found this fascinating. After a few test runs, with the PDK, they were able to get acceleration runs that comfortably exceeded Porsche's own performance estimates. It's well known that Porsche is pretty conservative with their numbers. But to save you the trouble:
0-60 mph 2.87 seconds
1/4 mile 10.85 seconds (looks to be around 128 mph but not clear)
The GT3 has never really been about straight line performance numbers. But, yikes, considering the car weighs about the same and has about as much power (on paper) as the 991.2, that's a clear improvement. And generally faster than than the previous generation 991.2 GT3RS. I suspect some of it is down to the latest generation Cup 2 tires. A larger contact patch. Some of it to revised PDK launch control. And just an impressive platform.
 
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