Production Car Racing (GT4, CTSCC, PWC GTS/TC, MX-5 Cup, etc)Touring Cars 

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Pete05
I see your point but, what happens if your car already comes with aero as standard fit from the factory?
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If it's built with racing in mind, they should race like that. If the Aston GT8 went racing in GT4, that's how it should race.
first-drive-2017-aston-martin-vantage-gt8-review-car-and-driver-photo-668977-s-429x262.jpg


The GT4 M4 pretty much looks like the GTS
0p90215443_highres_0.jpg


shelby-gt350r-grattan-07.JPG

landscape-1478018357-mustang-gt4-ford-performance-2.jpg

Now, I'm sure rules & regulations may govern the size or use of aero, but if that wing on the GT350 road car is built to run on the highway as well as circuit racing, I don't see why it's not it can't be run as is in GT4. that GT4 wing is massive. Why it also needs those canards in "production" car racing, not sure.

Meanwhile, the Cayman GT4, pretty much, runs as is.
gallery-1466088805-roa070116fea-clubsport09.jpg


I much prefer this over the aero heavy GT
md_maserati-gran-turismo-mc-racing-01.jpg
 
Aero is awesome, glad GT4 is the way it is right now. 👍 Aero gives a modern racer its teeth and shows what its meant to do, competition.
 
05XR8
If it's built with racing in mind, they should race like that. If the Aston GT8 went racing in GT4, that's how it should race.
first-drive-2017-aston-martin-vantage-gt8-review-car-and-driver-photo-668977-s-429x262.jpg


The GT4 M4 pretty much looks like the GTS
0p90215443_highres_0.jpg


shelby-gt350r-grattan-07.JPG

landscape-1478018357-mustang-gt4-ford-performance-2.jpg

Now, I'm sure rules & regulations may govern the size or use of aero, but if that wing on the GT350 road car is built to run on the highway as well as circuit racing, I don't see why it's not it can't be run as is in GT4. that GT4 wing is massive. Why it also needs those canards in "production" car racing, not sure.

Meanwhile, the Cayman GT4, pretty much, runs as is.
gallery-1466088805-roa070116fea-clubsport09.jpg


I much prefer this over the aero heavy GT
md_maserati-gran-turismo-mc-racing-01.jpg
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The only problem you end up with then is, manufacturers making endless 'Evolution' models to outdo each other.
If the rule makers put a sensible limit on minimum numbers required to be recognised, that solves that problem.
What GT4 doesn't need is people finding their new car obsolete at the end of the season.
 
I don't mind a little extra aero, but not a fan of widebody additions. One of the big reasons I am not liking the new TCR cars, and one of the reasons I like VASC so much is that they keep everything inside the fenders of the cars.
 
05XR8
I just wish GT4 held off the aero.
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Yes and no. I think some of the aero stuff is alright, but the Maserati and Ford in particular are about as extreme as I would want it to see, as well. I like that GT4 is sort of like a super touring car category (ignoring the prototypes), I wouldn't want to see the mods get any more extreme than they are now.
 
That's the thing. Extreme, is the Sin & X-Bow. Those are cool, but way out the box. The aero part of the series has more aero than original GT3 cars.

Pete05
The only problem you end up with then is, manufacturers making endless 'Evolution' models to outdo each other.
If the rule makers put a sensible limit on minimum numbers required to be recognised, that solves that problem.
What GT4 doesn't need is people finding their new car obsolete at the end of the season.
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No doubt. I just had a look at the 2018 Camaro ZL1 1LE. It just needs slicks, roll cage and stripped interior.

R1600Turbo
I don't mind a little extra aero, but not a fan of widebody additions. One of the big reasons I am not liking the new TCR cars, and one of the reasons I like VASC so much is that they keep everything inside the fenders of the cars.
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That's what I like about GT4, S-Tai & CTSCC.
 
Aero doesn't matter too much on GT4 cars anyway, with the near stock weight and power the cars will be too slow to take advantage of huge aero.

The Biggest Issue for the catagory long term will be Evolution models if or when they come the bigger the Catagory gets.
 
Just now getting around to watching the Conti race from Daytona, and I have to say, those GT4 Mustangs are a little too quick. The Cayman's and the McLaren's are pretty close though.
 
Aero makes sense as they seem to be marketing the class to gentleman drivers who will do a lot better when the car is stable and predictable. It makes for better racing all around.

But yes, it opens the door for endless development and next thing you know these cars will look like circa-2007 GT3 machines if it's not kept under control.
 
Just finished the Cayman Cup race. Nice to see larger numbers in the GS field this year, now we just need a larger variety of cars...
 
Snaeper
Aero makes sense as they seem to be marketing the class to gentleman drivers who will do a lot better when the car is stable and predictable. It makes for better racing all around.

But yes, it opens the door for endless development and next thing you know these cars will look like circa-2007 GT3 machines if it's not kept under control.
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I can understand the first part of your post. It's the second part which winds up being the result.
 
05XR8
I can understand the first part of your post. It's the second part which winds up being the result.
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Its a problem thats existed in touring and sportscar racing since the dawn of aerodynamics.

Just look at what most series that ran Group A rules turned into.

It might be a cycle we'll forever battle.
 
There's no real solution to manufacturers evolving overly competitive cars (look at the Ford GT for Weathertech...I'll slap someone who says they designed the new Ford GT as a street car and then magically turned it into a race-car platform, etc.). Sadly we need/want manufacturers to produce budget-friendly turn-key products for race teams - it boosts numbers (kills diversity though - remember when CTSCC had stuff like WRXs in the field, etc.?). I think it's a kind of necessary evil.
 
So, can Panoz take an Esperante GT2, put the new roof on it, update it to modern GTE aero regs and run a 17 year old car in GTLM too?
 
Snaeper
Aero makes sense as they seem to be marketing the class to gentleman drivers who will do a lot better when the car is stable and predictable. It makes for better racing all around.

But yes, it opens the door for endless development and next thing you know these cars will look like circa-2007 GT3 machines if it's not kept under control.
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Nope. Mechanical grip is none Pro friendly. It's understandable to anyone who can drive. Aero is for Pro's and some of them can't adapt to it which is why some good GT drivers never make the transition to prototype cars.
 
mwoodski
So, can Panoz take an Esperante GT2, put the new roof on it, update it to modern GTE aero regs and run a 17 year old car in GTLM too?
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Good question...I had no idea Panoz was still trying to do this. I saw one of their Esperantes in person back in...2005? Unimpressive car at the time (from a build quality standpoint). I have a hard time believing someone with Panoz's background and connections couldn't actually make a genuinely new/better effort (see: every small British car manufacturer...etc.).

Does GT3 have sales regulations for homologation, etc?
 
TheElbows
Good question...I had no idea Panoz was still trying to do this. I saw one of their Esperantes in person back in...2005? Unimpressive car at the time (from a build quality standpoint). I have a hard time believing someone with Panoz's background and connections couldn't actually make a genuinely new/better effort (see: every small British car manufacturer...etc.).

Does GT3 have sales regulations for homologation, etc?
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Probably not considering there's a Ginetta GT3 car.

They tried making an all-new car with the Abruzzi.
 
mwoodski
Probably not considering there's a Ginetta GT3 car.

They tried making an all-new car with the Abruzzi.
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The Ginetta GT3 is only homolagated in Britain though, its not allowed in international competition for that very reason. The GT4 however, is allowed.

And to note the Abruzzi, we all know how that hopeless thing turned out. :lol: Probably why Panoz only messed with the roof of the Esperante to make the Avezzano. :lol:
 
Tired Tyres
Nope.
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I'm sorry, I stopped reading here. I find this to be an obnoxious way to start your response and far too many gtplaneteers use this kind of dialogue.

It's really killed my enthusiasm for interacting around here lately.
 
Improved Production soon to start at Adelaide.
The little Sunny(I'm going for that one :D ) and 1600 are cool. RX-7s on the grid. A little KE-70, Tsuchiya N2 inspired AE86, 80s Bluebird. Diverse grid.

Edit: Well that does it for the Sunny.

The leading 86 has a 3GS engine. Pretty quick versus the following EG6.

Edit 2: There goes the S14.
 
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05XR8
Improved Production soon to start at Adelaide.
The little Sunny(I'm going for that one :D ) and 1600 are cool. RX-7s on the grid. A little KE-70, Tsuchiya N2 inspired AE86, 80s Bluebird. Diverse grid.

Edit: Well that does it for the Sunny.

The leading 86 has a 3GS engine. Pretty quick versus the following EG6.

Edit 2: There goes the S14.
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What happened to the Sunny & S14?
 
Pete05
What happened to the Sunny & S14?
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The pole sitting Sunny had engine failure. Maybe too much boost. Same for the S14(it was moving up spots quickly from mid field to around 7th.

To note, there were a couple more Sunnys on the grid. A Magna as well.
 

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