Revised Group 3 and 4 cars?

[05XR8]

PD just need to do this for me. Done.
https://www.gt4series.com/

 

[Fabr_123]

Most race cars get a facelift or update during their life, such as the Audi R8 GT3 and Mercedes AMG GT GT3. This usually happens in order for them to remain competitive in the category, and I feel like PD should do the same with their Group 3 and 4 machines. It would be nice to see updated versions of the Mazda 6, Corvette C7, Mustang, Genesis, 4C, Beetle, etc. It wouldn't take up a lot of resources and would make the game feel fresher still.

Their fictional Gr.3 cars already had an outdated look even for 2016, which tells me that they had finished those cars a long time before GTS release.

The GT7 trailer showed the exact same cars from GTS, but it's still early to say whether or not they will update them. I hope so, I can't stand the round steering wheels on Gr.3 cars anymore.

 

[05XR8]

In GT Sport only the AMG GT3 and both RC Fs were up to date. NSX wasn't out yet. However, PD was ahead or probably got Honda's blessing to create the GR.3, before it debuted.
GR.4 Jaguar came out way before the real GT4 car(that raced in British GT). So have others that PD created.

I half think the reason PD delayed the game, wasn't about it was unfinished. It may have been about releasing too early and having players wait a couple years for the FIA Events. Remember, the game didn't come boxed with GT League. If the game released in 2016, the GR.3 cars were pretty much up to date in their life cycles.

If the game released in 2021, we'll get more of the same. The GT-R doesn't appear to be getting a 2020 model. The Evo AMG GT3, Huracan, NSX may debut. 488 will probably be in. New 720S, Vantage, 911 GT3 R.

I'm thinking PD will add the M4 GT3.

They'd probably delete the current M4 Gr.4 and add the new look M4 as an unofficial GT4.

We may also see the Camaro GT4.R alongside a C8 GR.4, with maybe both those model GR.3 variants(including the C8 GTLM).

Lexus will remain the same '17 model, but maybe a face lifted GR.4 and maybe the new IS F.

GR.3 Supra is 2018. The Supra GT4 would have to be in and 86 deleted. Maybe the new 86 Concept comes in as alternative.

I guess on the flipside, all the current race cars in GT Sport, could be in the Used Car Dealership. Next year, the SRO are having events for "old"(2009-2016?) GT3 cars during the Blancpain season.

 

[HyperzCars]

I would like to see AWD (4WD) in Group 3. AWD is in gr4 and if you ask people in after race chats do they want AWD in Group 3 rivals say yes especially when most players sign for Subaru or Mitsubishi expecting the Group 3 ones to be 4WD and then like myself, refuse to race them in RWD form. Just because the FIA RWD rules are now in GTS and GT7 dont mean we all have to play games under real FIA RWD Rules. Gaming was made for fun, not rules. I see a group 3 WRX i expect it to be 4WD and the BOP on the gr4 WRX and Lancer Evo are pathetic and reflecting the FIAs harsh and inhumaine rules onto gamers. Oh look lets buy GTS and race to the FIA RWD Rules? Really? They never use to be in Gran Turismo and now they are look at how many players Polyphony Digital lost. Have they done anything to get their customers back? No, they have neglected GTS and that is where they went wrong. 2014 and now 2020 and they failed to make a full on PS4 Gran Turismo. 7 years and all they released was a total "SLOW DOWN PENALTY" Project Cars has AWD in their GT A class which is the same as GTS gr3 . . . . . . . . . Dont listen to anything Polyphony Digital say until they actually do what their customers want, not what the FIA want.

 

[HyperzCars]

Their fictional Gr.3 cars already had an outdated look even for 2016, which tells me that they had finished those cars a long time before GTS release.

The GT7 trailer showed the exact same cars from GTS, but it's still early to say whether or not they will update them. I hope so, I can't stand the round steering wheels on Gr.3 cars anymore.

The WRX and Lancer Evo gr3 have little people racing them because since 2017 alot of players have asked and even demanded AWD in them two cars and instead they gave them less power, less top end speed, they get left behind on the straights, they cant be short shifted because the Turbo Lag is pathetic in the Lancers. As soon as i test drove the gr3 WRX and seen it was RWD i went to the Lancer and seen its RWD after veering off and spinning. I then deleted GT Sport and walked away. Until Polyphony Digital do what customers ask, gr3 is a pathetic tier of car. Gr1 has RWD vs 4WD too, so to does gr4 and most of the N class cars. RWD in a WRX and Lancer Evo What utter nonsense. Project Cars does it, Polyphony Digital not only ruin the gr4 WRX and Lancer with BOP thats intentionally made to cripple them two cars but they also have arragance and lack of care to anyone other than RWD lovers. GT7 and GTS where WRX and Lancers are RWD

 

[HyperzCars]

If they do make Gr. 3 EVO cars, I'm sure they are more than likely to have improved power, aerodynamics, reduced weight and maybe even a more aggressive design with newer liveries.

You state a good point. I was signed to Subaru and Mitsubishi and messages from other PSN players came through to my other PSN account from less skilled racers and higher ranked racers moaning the gr3 Lancer and WRX are RWD and they wanted AWD or in Japan its called 4WD. I was SS Rank and they assumed i was one of the live stage attendees which I am not. They asked me to tell Polyphony Digital to put 4WD in the as you say Evo and also the WRX. Still since 2018 PD made them slower, added more weight, less top end speed, BOP so harsh it prevents the aerodynamics from doing what they were made to do and lets be honest, the gr3 WRX and Lancer do look pathetic. Great to see two cars made in a tier they dont have any place in but they should never have put them as RWD. Gr3 is a class of car thats poorly managed and unfairly balanced. Even in slipstream i noticed the WRX maxxed out at 178mph while GTR and Vipers speed past in a replay displaying 178mph in the WRX and 189mph in other cars. That is unfair.

 

[Fabr_123]

The WRX and Lancer Evo gr3 have little people racing them because since 2017 alot of players have asked and even demanded AWD in them two cars and instead they gave them less power, less top end speed, they get left behind on the straights, they cant be short shifted because the Turbo Lag is pathetic in the Lancers. As soon as i test drove the gr3 WRX and seen it was RWD i went to the Lancer and seen its RWD after veering off and spinning. I then deleted GT Sport and walked away. Until Polyphony Digital do what customers ask, gr3 is a pathetic tier of car. Gr1 has RWD vs 4WD too, so to does gr4 and most of the N class cars. RWD in a WRX and Lancer Evo What utter nonsense. Project Cars does it, Polyphony Digital not only ruin the gr4 WRX and Lancer with BOP thats intentionally made to cripple them two cars but they also have arragance and lack of care to anyone other than RWD lovers. GT7 and GTS where WRX and Lancers are RWD

I'm sorry, but I don't agree with that. Gr.3 shouldn't have 4WD cars, while Gr.4 should only have RWD cars like Gr.3. Instead, there should be extra groups covering 4WD and FF cars. Mixing different drivetrains only makes the BoP process more complicated. Anyway, I think this is off-topic...

 

[HyperzCars]

I'm sorry, but I don't agree with that. Gr.3 shouldn't have 4WD cars, while Gr.4 should only have RWD cars like Gr.3. Instead, there should be extra groups covering 4WD and FF cars. Mixing different drivetrains only makes the BoP process more complicated. Anyway, I think this is off-topic...

If Gran Turismo does that it will loose the gamers that made it rich and famous. I signed a Petition thats floating around from people using GT Sports local area leaderboards to get 4wd in gr3 wrx and lancer, remove sport mode and back to Gran Turismos old roots or Polyphony Digital loose everyone other than their Top Rank and Sim Racers who they wont make enough money on . . . Gran Turismo served the General Gaming Userbase since 1998 with 4wd, rwd all in one class of car. It they remove that, GT7 will be ignored like Polyphony Digital have ignored its once loyal players since 2017 and Sony loose its players to the XBOX Series X. Pretty simple really. Alot of PSN customers only own PS4 for Gran Turismo which on PS4 is a joke. Decision is theirs to take, if they listen to their top rank or the FIA let them but GTS is low on players and GT7 will be the same. Shame. Once a Flagship racer now fastly entering its own grave.

 

[tankuroded]

Only one car would actually benefit from having 4WD in Gr.3, since it's actually 4WD even as a racer:

In absence of a Bugatti Gr.3 car, I figured they could pull a F1 GTR with that until I learned about the drivetrain of the car. Perhaps a special exemption just for this car?

Anyhow, the more I read about "which car goes to which class" discourse here makes me feel about possibility of kicking out all manufacturers without a RWD road car (except for Audi, Honda and Lamborghini as their midship 4WD cars had to be converted to RWD; other exemptions may apply) from the Manufacturer's Series, since the class system for Gr.3 and Gr.4 were built with that in mind.

 

[ScottPuss20]

It seems that PD wanted quantity over quality, and I think that's impacted the integrity of the classes somewhat. There are some odd cars in Group 3 and Group 4 that only serve to make up numbers on the grid. I don't want PD to remove all the cars they've created and let them hang out to dry, they are too valuable to throw away IMO. They should shuffle up the current classes and add new ones to ensure that each car has it's place and can race competitively, both online and offline.

 

[05XR8]

It is all about the Manufacturers Championship. The Bugatti is odd brand out. Still have no idea why a Gr.3 was not developed.

It'll be more choices if PD add Alpine, Maserati, and some brands that don't have a Gr.3 or GR.4. Then, possibly new brands to the game(Bentley, Kia, etc).

 

[05XR8]

Player ACC again. Thing is, PD don't need. A licence for certain series. Think that's been mentioned in several GTS threads. They did have DTM and BTCC in past GTs. GT3 cars, officially, in GT5 & GT6.

With Toyota and Mazda official partners, we won't see proper GT3 & GT4 grids. Unless PD O Mazda make a Gr.4 RX-VISION, well continue to see the AWD/FF/RWD mix.

 

[05XR8]

I can see this replacing the Gr.3&Gr.4 WRX. If not replacing, then. at least another option for Subaru.

 

[Unknown GT]

Knowing Kaz, I don't think the situation of the obsolete Gr.3 and Gr.4 cars will change, maybe something with Toyota and Mazda but the rest will most likely remain unchanged.

 

[MIE1992]

I, for one, welcome the idiosyncratic mix of cars in every group, including Gr.3. I think it's part of what sets GT apart from other racing games, and I think having a broad variety of cars in each group also allows for some automakers to have representation in those groups when they may not necessarily have a contemporary real-world race car for that group. So for example, I think there's not one, but two cars from Maserati that could go into Gr.3 - the GranTurismo GT3, and the MC12 Corsa. Indeed, we can already see that FIA GT1 will fit into Gr.3, with the Aston Martin DBR9 being added, so perhaps other GT1 cars like the Saleen S7-R could fit in, too. That's before we get into GTE (and possibly GT2) cars, as evidenced by the addition of the Porsche 911 RSR. Then there were the mid-90s GT1 cars that seem like a likely fit alongside the McLaren F1 GTR, such as the GT1-spec versions of the Toyota Supra A80 and Nissan Skyline GT-R R33. Of course, on the other hand, the late-90s GT1 cars like the Nissan R390 or the Porsche 911 GT1 would be a very unlikely fit for Gr.3, likely either being in Gr.2 or Gr.1 instead.

I also believe PD should limit the creation of made-for-game race cars (like the Alfa Romeo 4C Gr.3) for automakers that don't have real-world representation in that group, like we can see with the Hyundai Genesis Gr.3 and Gr.4, and I think it's likely both of these cars were conceived before TCR was a thing. On that note, I do wonder if TCR cars would fit into Gr.4 - I may've received an answer to that, but I can't remember it. Either way, it could allow for some real interesting manufacturer representation in Gr.4 if TCR was a good fit.

Overall, I think a lot of the valid concerns over balancing would be addressed if we simply had more events that limited the cars within a certain group, rather than having events that allow for any and every car within a certain class. You may recall that in GT Sport, we've had some daily races that featured Gr.1, but more specifically limited players to the Group C racers within Gr.1, or the Gr.4 races that limit players to the FF cars within that class - that's ideally the sort of thing that I'd like to see most of the time in GT7's equivalent of daily races. If I were running things, allowing every car within a group to enter would be incredibly rare, and if you wanted to see a wide variety of cars within a certain group, you'd be more likely to see that in the Manufacturers Series.

EDIT: I also wonder if the Lexus LFA that was used in the N24 could be a good fit for Gr.4, as well? Then there was also the Lexus IS F CCS-R that was added as DLC in GT6...

 

[meekrab]

EDIT: I also wonder if the Lexus LFA that was used in the N24 could be a good fit for Gr.4, as well?

Much closer to Gr. 3 than 4, it was intended to be the basis for a GTE car. It ran in the SP8 / FIA GT2 class and qualified right in the middle of the GT3 / 911 Cup field.

 

[MIE1992]

Much closer to Gr. 3 than 4, it was intended to be the basis for a GTE car. It qualified right in the middle of the GT3 / 911 Cup field.

Sounds good! I'd love to see a racing LFA in GT Sport, perhaps alongside the base LFA and the LFA Nurburgring Package returning - or at least the base LFA, haha!

 

[meekrab]

Sounds good! I'd love to see a racing LFA in GT Sport, perhaps alongside the base LFA and the LFA Nurburgring Package returning - or at least the base LFA, haha!

The more V10s the better!

 

[05XR8]

TCR cars are nearly GT4 speed with BOP and certain tracks taken into account. The way GTS is, TCR would fit in Gr.4.

 

[MIE1992]

TCR cars are nearly GT4 speed with BOP and certain tracks taken into account. The way GTS is, TCR would fit in Gr.4.

That could bode well for some automakers that are unlikely to otherwise have a car in Gr.4, like MG or Cupra.

 

[meekrab]

TCR cars are nearly GT4 speed with BOP and certain tracks taken into account. The way GTS is, TCR would fit in Gr.4.

I feel the opposite way, I would prefer more separate classes. Put the fake FF Gr. 4 cars in TCR with the real TCR cars. Add DTM cars to Gr. 2. Make separate categories for Group C, GT1, LMP hybrids, LMP2. It's bad enough we already have GTE and GT3 cars in the same group when the real cars are several seconds a lap apart...

 

[05XR8]

I feel the opposite way, I would prefer more separate classes. Put the fake FF Gr. 4 cars in TCR with the real TCR cars. Add DTM cars to Gr. 2. Make separate categories for Group C, GT1, LMP hybrids, LMP2. It's bad enough we already have GTE and GT3 cars in the same group when the real cars are several seconds a lap apart...

That's not feeling opposite. That's suggesting a restructure of the classes.

What I answered to, was how TCR fits with the current GTS classes. I'm all for PD to apply real world FIA, SRO, IMSA, GT3, GT4, LMP/Sports Cars and appropriate drivetrain vehicles, in their proper classes, for GT7.

 

[MIE1992]

I feel the opposite way, I would prefer more separate classes. Put the fake FF Gr. 4 cars in TCR with the real TCR cars. Add DTM cars to Gr. 2. Make separate categories for Group C, GT1, LMP hybrids, LMP2. It's bad enough we already have GTE and GT3 cars in the same group when the real cars are several seconds a lap apart...

I disagree. I think BoP can fix most of that issue, and then what'll really fix it is more events where you're limited to certain cars within a class, rather than permitting any car within a featured class. What comes to mind, is some of the daily races in GT Sport where you could only use the Group C cars within Gr.1, rather than being permitted to use any car within Gr.1; that's the sort of thing I'd like to almost constantly see, and any events where you could pick any car in a class would be incredibly rare.

I really do think that the interesting, perhaps even anachronistic mix of cars within each class not only results in something more interesting to play and watch, but also partially what defines GT, versus other IPs that may be a bit more strict with what cars race against each other. It also allows a wide variety of automakers to race against each other, whereas if Gr.1 was broken up, some automakers wouldn't be able to race against each other. For example, Lamborghini doesn't have a Gr.1 car yet, but I could see both the Group C-era Countach QVX and the VGT being there, especially with the latter's power figures and general shape. Overall, I defend GT's decision for Gr.1 to be for prototype racers, from Group C, to modern LMPs. My only suggestion is that I'd add a "Gr.1V" for much older prototypes like the Ferrari 330 P4.

But I definitely agree that DTM (at least, DTMasters) should be added to Gr.2, as those cars did race alongside Super GT GT500 cars at least once. That'd allow BMW, Mercedes-Benz, Audi, and Aston Martin into that group, though I'm unsure of the older, DTMeisterschaft cars like the Mercedes-Benz 190E Evolution II, or the Alfa Romeo 155TI.

I also propose a "Gr.2V" for Group 5 cars (specifically the 4th-gen ones), and race cars that followed similar rulings, like IMSA GTX or the DRM - the latter of which I believe is the predecessor to the DTM.

 

[05XR8]

Just sticking with the OP, marques like Mitsubishi and Peugeot would need to be overhauled.

I think Peugeot hav a couple sedans that could replace the RCZ. Similar to doing an Atenza GR.3/GR.4 duo.

Mitsubishi is much harder. The ASX maybe? First SUV to be a Gr.3 category car? I mean, bringing up the Beetle, it ain't exactly a GT car, even though there were real competition and an AWD sports model. PD could mod l an FYI or GTO, but the idea are for updated /updates-to models.

Renault are pretty easy with the GR.4(if they keep it FF). Not sure on the build time to convert a new Megane R.S. to RWD. A Gr.3 widebody could exist, as well as a Gr.4 rwd hatch.

I do wonder if PD would choose a Levorg for GR.4, as something different in that class. It's funky enough and could be AWD or RWD. Given the timeline during the development of GT7, it'd be old enough and current enough, in the PDLogic™ scheme of car builds.

 

[MIE1992]

First SUV to be a Gr.3 category car?

You might be onto something - I recall that Toyota has entered a CH-R at the Nurburgring 24h at least once.

I'm also not sure how many cars from various older IMSA series could be added, like GTO, GTP, and GTX, as I think some of those racers lacked headlights, which could be a problem. Meanwhile, I don't consider something like a NASCAR vehicle to be an issue because the tracks they typically race on are lit, unlike something like the Nurburgring Norschleife. But at any rate, I still think there's potential for those older IMSA series to be added, to fill out Gr.3 and Gr.1, especially the latter when it comes to GTP. Though then again, I think some of the potential GTP cars I'd personally add could have their roles filled by more modern vehicles, and it would seem that most GTP automakers already have Gr.1 representation, such as Mazda, Jaguar, and Toyota.

But more specifically, I was thinking of what vehicles Ford and Chevrolet could have in Gr.1, as they did both have an IMSA GTP racer. But Chevrolet could easily just use the far more modern Corvette C7 DPi, so that leaves us with Ford. My bet would be to use some LMP or Daytona Prototype that used a Ford engine, and/or was constructed by Ford, not unlike how the McLaren F1 GTR Longtail was listed as a BMW in GT4, due to using a BMW engine. With this logic, even Pontiac could be in Gr.1, and perhaps Lexus, too, at least if they don't plan on entering LMDh. (On another note, I'd love to see more Acura models, and they could easily have Gr.1 representation with either one of their LMPs or DPi racers.)

Or, maybe Ford could surprise us like Jaguar did and come out with a VGT, and it could happen to be in Gr.1.

 

[05XR8]

I wouldn't put it past PD to make a Ford GT LMP. There are a few renders, by artists, floating around in the net.

 

[05XR8]

Thinking about PD and older race cars. The Focus and Cruze (W)TCR cars, could fit the bill for Gr.4 choices. At least, to represent FF cars from the Americas. However, I won't say no to a TCR type class as suggested on Page 1. If classes remain thew same, with somany real world FF race cars, PD wouldn't have to build FF race cars to the extent of the FF converted to MR race cars.

 

[tankuroded]

I wouldn't put it past PD to make a Ford GT LMP. There are a few renders, by artists, floating around in the net.

Unlike production car class based (Gr.4/Gr.3 and maybe Gr.2?) cars, I don't think PD would make an LMP/Gr.1 car out of thin air or based on existing road cars - the closest they do is adapting existing VGTs intended as LMPs (N2025, LM55, Bugatti, Tomahawk GTS-R - and to lesser extent, L750R and Audi VGT).

 

[Stephen220378]

It would be nice to see them drop the fake class ******** and just make cars exactly what they are.

 

[05XR8]

We need a filter for models. Now, I know ACC is an official GT3 & GT4 game. So, they have access to all the cars. Even new Evo models. However, when selecting the season year, cars that have not run in that season, are gone. Case being, the GT-R GT3.

That car is not in the 2020 season. It's in the previous seasons. If we had a filter similar to this, GT5 or GT6, had GT3 only cars. As the current GTS car list have enough GT3 cars, we'd be missing the 911 RSR from such an optional grid.