Sciaru BRZFRS (BreezeFrees)

  • Thread starter Thread starter Azuremen
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The problem with the Supra idea is everyone will have to compare it to a GT-R.
 
Eric.
You don't believe that these parts:

toyota-axio-gt300-01-thumb.jpg


Will fit this:

corolla.gif



Do you?
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I believe thats the US model (LE maybe) you are comparing to the GT300 car which is based off the Japanese Axio Model. Model year looks to be different too.
 
Eric.
And yes, the BRZ has sound deadening because, it happens to be, that 99% of people like to have the impression they aren't in some cheap POS deathtrap where you hear every piece of gravel get thrown around inside the fenders. Go buy something cheap that nobody would care if you stripped out to save 30lbs on your daily drive to work.
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I'm just using sound deadening as an example, to show that it is possible to make the car lighter, as that is one of the things that are usually taken out of Honda's type r range to save weight, among other things.
It looks like you're trying to tell me, I can't do what I want to a car I buy?
 
eight6er
I'm just using sound deadening as an example, to show that it is possible to make the car lighter, as that is one of the things that are usually taken out of Honda's type r range to save weight, among other things.
It looks like you're trying to tell me, I can't do what I want to a car I buy?
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Don't take it so seriously. I think he's implying that the vast majority of buyers don't want a noisy, uncomfortable car, so a little bit of extra weight in the form of sound deadening is of more benefit to more people, more of the time.

There are always people who want something lighter or simpler, and that's why people have the freedom to do as they wish with their own cars. It's much easier for an individual to remove some sound deadening than it is for someone who wants it to put it in themselves...
 
eight6er
It looks like you're trying to tell me, I can't do what I want to a car I buy?
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You personally can do whatever you want. But manufacturers have to make cars civil enough for the "common man" and that includes having sound deadening. I read somewhere that this car (BRZ/86) is about 80% high strength (light weight) steel. Aluminum hood, etc. They put a lot of time and effort into making it as light as they could, given the safety regulations that are mandated today. I think they deserve a round of applause for getting it as light as they have.
 
Does anyone know if they crash tested the car to make it legal for the US? Because I can't find any info on them saying anything about it.
 
homeforsummer
Don't take it so seriously. I think he's implying that the vast majority of buyers don't want a noisy, uncomfortable car, so a little bit of extra weight in the form of sound deadening is of more benefit to more people, more of the time.

There are always people who want something lighter or simpler, and that's why people have the freedom to do as they wish with their own cars. It's much easier for an individual to remove some sound deadening than it is for someone who wants it to put it in themselves...
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R1600Turbo
You personally can do whatever you want. But manufacturers have to make cars civil enough for the "common man" and that includes having sound deadening. I read somewhere that this car (BRZ/86) is about 80% high strength (light weight) steel. Aluminum hood, etc. They put a lot of time and effort into making it as light as they could, given the safety regulations that are mandated today. I think they deserve a round of applause for getting it as light as they have.
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Yes I agree with what both of you are saying, but it still does not mean a type r-esque version of the car will never come out/be possible. Like I said, I was using the removal of sound deadening as an example, as there have been production cars available before without it and like I also said before, I can always strip it out myself, if it bothered me that much.
 
I think more weight can be saved by making a spartan interior, than by removing any sound deadening and /or safety concerns. I for one, would be happy to do without a sculpted interior and gadgetry if it meant removing 10% of a sport car's weight.
 
RocZX
Does anyone know if they crash tested the car to make it legal for the US? Because I can't find any info on them saying anything about it.
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Homologation hasn't happened yet, some sources reckon it will be done next month.
 
CC570
I think more weight can be saved by making a spartan interior, than by removing any sound deadening and /or safety concerns. I for one, would be happy to do without a sculpted interior and gadgetry if it meant removing 10% of a sport car's weight.
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Yes you could lose a lot of weight getting rid of aircon, or just changing to full bucket seats.
 
They could take out the motor and use a bicycle drivetrain too! That'd save a ton of weight and it'd get amazing mpg's...
 
$24,000 car without air conditioning is :lol: worthy, if you're implying they should sell it that way.
 
homeforsummer
Incidentally, since Toyota is hinting that a Supra revival could be on the cards, can people stop asking for more power in the Toyobaru now? :sly:
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If they go about doing a Supra revival, I'd hope they do it in a manner similar to what was available in the mid/late '80s (ie, Celica-Supra) than the mad sports coupe of the early/mid '90s. I'd hope that Toyota would be smart enough to step away from forced induction and choose a six-cylinder powerplant. I'd hope for the rather powerful 3.5L V6 from the Camry, but that may be expecting too much.
 
YSSMAN
If they go about doing a Supra revival, I'd hope they do it in a manner similar to what was available in the mid/late '80s (ie, Celica-Supra) than the mad sports coupe of the early/mid '90s. I'd hope that Toyota would be smart enough to step away from forced induction and choose a six-cylinder powerplant. I'd hope for the rather powerful 3.5L V6 from the Camry, but that may be expecting too much.
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If they do a Supra, it will have to have 6 cylinders, as that was the basis for the split in the Celica and Supra line-up. Anything else would be sacrilegious, like putting the MR2 name on a FWD sedan or something.
 
I've always thought the current bland crop of Yarii would benefit from being called "le MR2"...
 
Azuremen
If they do a Supra, it will have to have 6 cylinders, as that was the basis for the split in the Celica and Supra line-up. Anything else would be sacrilegious, like putting the MR2 name on a FWD sedan or something.
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It would almost certainly be turbocharged too. It's by far the easiest method we have currently of extracting decent power out of something without making it too thirsty. The brand new F-whatever BMW 328i has a 2.0-turbo that makes 242bhp, but also does 44mpg UK/almost 37mpg US average, which is frankly astonishing. You could be talking a 300+ bhp Supra that still does 30mpg, in theory. Turbochargers are the way forward for most cars.

Apart from the GT-86 which is all the better without one.
 
R1600Turbo
You personally can do whatever you want. But manufacturers have to make cars civil enough for the "common man" and that includes having sound deadening. I read somewhere that this car (BRZ/86) is about 80% high strength (light weight) steel. Aluminum hood, etc. They put a lot of time and effort into making it as light as they could, given the safety regulations that are mandated today. I think they deserve a round of applause for getting it as light as they have.
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The Ginetta G40r is a similarly sized and powered sports car for the road and weighs 749kg. If, as a manufacturer, you are looking to sell a couple of hundred sports cars a year to enthusiasts you can make a light weight car. I f you hope to sell thousands and thousands. . . you need to add amenities and comfort which leads to a "lightweight" 1200kg car.
 
homeforsummer
It would almost certainly be turbocharged too. It's by far the easiest method we have currently of extracting decent power out of something without making it too thirsty. The brand new F-whatever BMW 328i has a 2.0-turbo that makes 242bhp, but also does 44mpg UK/almost 37mpg US average, which is frankly astonishing. You could be talking a 300+ bhp Supra that still does 30mpg, in theory. Turbochargers are the way forward for most cars.

Apart from the GT-86 which is all the better without one.
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There's already a supercharged GT86 being tested. It seems Toyota really seem to be pushing the case for supercharging over turbocharging, at least with the 86. It'd be a shame if, however unlikely, Toyota shy away from turbos completely just as most manufacturers are really embracing them as a staple.

Toyota‘s GT 86 hasn’t even made its way into the hands of consumers, but a high-performance variant of the new sports coupe is already in the works out in Japan.

It doesn’t appear that Toyota’s willing to just sit around and play second fiddle to Subaru‘s BRZ with Chief Engineer Tetsuo Tada telling the media that supercharged test cars have already been made and are currently being scrutinized by Toyota Racing Development (TRD).

In the past, TRD has been known to develop superchargers for various Toyota models, including Scion‘s tC coupe. With the FR-S inevitably taking over as Scion’s top-of-the-line sports coupe, seeing a TRD variant equipped with a supercharger would be no surprise. Toyota prefers the supercharger approach since it’s simpler than increasing the engine size, and altering throttle response with a turbocharger would compromise the car’s performance objections.
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A new Supra would certainly come in at a price and spec range to rival the GT-R and the new NSX/HSV. Seeing as that's the case, it's not unlikely that it could use a slightly detuned LF-A V10, much like the rumoured GS-F will possibly be using.
 
Supercharging begs the question then whether the next Supra would have a hybrid drivetrain. As we've seen on the old Mazda Xedos 9 and the new Micra DiG, supercharging is a good way of turning an efficient but not particularly powerful Atkinson-cycle engine into an efficient and decently powered Miller-cycle engine.

The Prius is another car on sale today that uses an Atkinson-cycle engine and the electric motor in that does the job making up the power deficit. We know already that Toyota has plans to expand the hybrid tech further into the range, so maybe the next Supra would be an incredibly high-tech sports car, along the lines of the Nissan GT-R, but part-hybrid? There might even be the possibility of a Porsche GT3 RSR-style deal, where the hybrid powertrain works the front wheels and petrol goes to the back wheels.

All speculation obviously, but if Toyota sees supercharging as a better option than turbos, it's all possible.
 
Eric.
$24,000 car without air conditioning is :lol: worthy, if you're implying they should sell it that way.
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No I was implying I would do it myself. Obviously if it was done in the factory they would drop the price and it's not that :lol: unless you never thought of the possibility it could be sold in a country where we don't need aircon.
 
eight6er
No I was implying I would do it myself. Obviously if it was done in the factory they would drop the price and it's not that :lol: unless you never thought of the possibility it could be sold in a country where we don't need aircon.
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Drop the price? Could go either way. Being Toyota it probably would drop the price though.
 
eight6er
Who would charge more for no aircon?

Also what is that Gazoo MN in your photos?
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Based on just the Aircon missing. Porsche GT3 RS costs more with no aircon.

And Gazoo is a tuning company, I guess they partnered up with Toyota and made this "MN" roadster thing. Idk I belive it's still a concept.
 
Kamuifanboy
Based on just the Aircon missing. Porsche GT3 RS costs more with no aircon.

And Gazoo is a tuning company, I guess they partnered up with Toyota and made this "MN" roadster thing. Idk I belive it's still a concept.
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Lol it would take a company like Porsche to do something like that alright.

That Gazoo thing looks like it's small, it might be fun if they ever made it.
 
eight6er
Lol it would take a company like Porsche to do something like that alright.

That Gazoo thing looks like it's small, it might be fun if they ever made it.
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It's not really uncommon. The Lambo Superleggera also is without aircon to it's LP560-4 base model.
 
Important to note that they aren't charging you for not giving you A/C, they're charging you for the effort it took to engineer and tune a lighter, stripped model. Things like spring rates and damper rates need to change. They also need to change up the production lines to include the titanium parts or what have you. A car without air con and a lightened version that doesn't have air con in it are two different things.

They're still overpriced IMO, but this Top Gear logic of expecting to pay for the actual parts in your car and little more is dumb.

EDIT: "A company like Porsche"? You mean every car maker ever?
 

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