Suzuki Cappacino RM Racing 4-17

[diabolicwyvern]

@StigsHero

When we'd practice, we'd enter the pits and hit 'drive' Upon, reaching the end of the pit, we'd turn around and drive back to the starting line. We'd line up in whichever order we all agreed upon and having everybody still, would start the race. This worked every time with no issues. It probably follows the same principles as everyone running laps then heading into the pits. I'm good with any way that works and takes little time

 

[watermelon punch]

(Although we could use a steward to police-watch replay)

I will volunteer to participate in that duty. I enjoy watching replays almost as much as racing! Plus, in the actual race I would probably be bringing up the rear & being lapped because of my grandma driving, and would miss most of the action in the actual race. So I'd enjoy seeing what I missed. LOL

The best procedure is to have everybody in the pits when the "start" button is pushed, and everybody stay there until the countdown is finished. Then, because everybody is stationary and in the same general location, it's easier for the game to figure everything out.

I think this is true. I've not tried the pit method. But I know i had better experiences in online races when I press the pause button (& let the computer drive the car?) when the race countdown begins. Somehow it seems to go more smoothly when I've done that.

 

[BrandonW77]

@ diabolicwyvern

I've experienced that method before too, with mixed results. I'm generally in favor of whatever is the simplest and requires the least from the drivers. It seemed we'd often have one person who took off around the track instead of making a u-turn out of the pits and that would screw everything up. As long as everyone knew the procedure it worked fine, but it was very tedious and time-consuming.

Sorry that I sound like such a nay-sayer, I'm really not trying to be negative about any of this. Just trying to share my experiences, and these are some things I encountered in the past that negatively effected my enjoyment of the racing so I figured I'd point them out early. Just my opinions though, I'm fine with whatever is decided. 👍


Brandon

 

[MindlessRiff]

I'd be up for participating in this! Depends heavily on times though really so I won't be totally sure if I can until I know some dates, but whatev!

 

[Culkin]

Well I dont mind trying to help organise things with people to atleast get a practice session going

Im guessing we're going to be looking at getting the Cappucino's fully tuned so the only difference between them is Driver Skill/Tuning, the next call is do we use Race Soft and have a Mandatory pit stop or Race Hard for shorter races without pit stops or even both therefor having a sprint race and championship race in the same night?

i like the idea of the qualifying then leaving the pits and setting ourselves up before starting the race however if that wasnt to work would we be open to (if we ran 2 races per night) letting GT5 randomly set the grid up for the Sprint race then used reverse grid slowest first for the Championship race?

 

[watermelon punch]

Sorry that I sound like such a nay-sayer, I'm really not trying to be negative about any of this.

Yes, you're a right debbie downer.

J/K!!!

Seriously it's best to be honest, even if it's not upbeat. Better to share the knowledge of experience! Especially if it's not good & can be prevented in future.
To be honest, I really didn't understand that whole manual grid set up plan. I think it made me nervous because i do not have a headset, and I worry about anything requiring a lot of complex communication.
That said, I'm good at following orders. haha And nobody probably wants to hear my 2 cents anyway.

someone will recommend a mic/headset to me I know - I would dearly like one but when I said so to my bf, he was not keen on that at all... and I could hardly blame him - how would I feel if he was online racing with a bunch of women. LOL
If there was a women's league here, I'd happily join it. But I can't find any such thing! )

Well I dont mind trying to help organise things with people to atleast get a practice session going

Im guessing we're going to be looking at getting the Cappucino's fully tuned so the only difference between them is Driver Skill/Tuning, the next call is do we use Race Soft and have a Mandatory pit stop or Race Hard for shorter races without pit stops or even both therefor having a sprint race and championship race in the same night?

I need practice, that's for sure.

Can someone explain to me the idea of mandatory pit stops? Do you choose when to make the pit stop or is it pre-determined or just depend upon the particular race? (very new to this, please forgive newbness ty)

 

[BrandonW77]

Mandatory pit stops are usually just to add an extra element of strategy and realism. In shorter races they're not necessary, but in longer races your tires will start to go away and it gives you a chance to get some fresh rubber on there.

Usually it's up to you when you would pit, and that's where the strategy comes into play. If you're easy on your tires you can pit early and try to make them last till the end. This would drop you down the field early, but you would be away from traffic and be able to put down fast laps which could pay off at the end. Or you could pit late and try to open up a gap on the field after they make their pit stops, but then you'll be on cold tires at the end when everyone else's tires are at prime temperature. Strategy!!

 

[ToXiiC_xMW]

i have persmission to use the rules from the previous series aynone who can organize well and who knows what they are doing is open to start it up

 

[diabolicwyvern]

@ diabolicwyvern
Just my opinions though, I'm fine with whatever is decided. 👍

Not a problem. I vote for whatever is the best combination of ease and correct result

 

[diabolicwyvern]

Im guessing we're going to be looking at getting the Cappucino's fully tuned so the only difference between them is Driver Skill/Tuning, the next call is do we use Race Soft and have a Mandatory pit stop or Race Hard for shorter races without pit stops or even both therefor having a sprint race and championship race in the same night?

As previously stated, we used racing softs last time round and easily managed 25-30 minutes on the tires before anyone began losing biblical levels of grip. The cars max at 477-479 PP (137-39HP) after break-in. They are tail happy on most tires, so removing aids will greatly increase the importance of driver skill 👍 Is there a decision on the use of aids?

The car has the best chance at catching people out on tracks with elevation drops or banked corners. So any of the Cape ring variants and Autumn Ring make for great racing. We could have a simple in lounge or open lobby pre-season type race to judge driver skill, learn the cars better for those who have not driven them and understand better the lines for certain courses

 

[watermelon punch]

They are tail happy on most tires, so removing aids will greatly increase the importance of driver skill 👍 Is there a decision on the use of aids?

I'm new to racing games, I don't use a wheel, and I'm not a very good driver.
And one thing I can say is that those "driver aids" don't do diddly bop as far as I'm concerned, so I don't give a flying mouse's doopah if they're set to on or off.

Honestly, I wish someone would explain to me how they help bad drivers, because I don't find them helpful at all. LOL Am I just not doing it right? haha

Traction control being at the top of my most useless list. All that has ever done for me is slow me down by making harder to get out of corner turns when I need to be accelerating, I'm sitting there in a stasis field.

I don't even know what active steering is supposed to do. (And yes, I've read the description, and I still don't understand.)

The ONLY time I found one of the drivers aids helpful was to put on the skid recovery thing on the sebastian loeb special event thing.
And I really couldn't say why. I just know when I tried it with it on, I did better on the dirt tracks especially. But I'm so terrible with dirt tracks, that I was just trying things willy-nilly to see if ANY change would be desirable. haha.

Now if there was a drivers aid that prevented you from getting spun round when someone makes a dirty pass, I'd be interested in that aid. LOL
But the best I've come up with is to just be in what I call a "more stable" car. Obviously that's not relevant in a 1-make race. )

 

[fatrab]

I'm keen for this league. Will follow the progress..

 

[turbogeit]

Just a suggestion.

I see most of you have not so much experience in organising races.

I have some experience in this in our WSCC-club (hosting a 246 HP Group N race). Our club had its own website, but is coming back to the GTP forum (our webhost is too disappointed by GT5 and returns to Forza 3). Most series in WSCC are low HP races (less than 400hp)
If you are interested, I can propose to organize this in our club. We have an internet meeting this night to discuss our future strategy. We are also hoping to find some new members for our series because when we started working with our own website, there was no more communication on GTP and new members stopped to come in.

Let me know something.

Other issues:

- There is no way to avoid GT5 to give an incorrect starting grid other than a line up in a first warming up lap. But that is a time-consuming activity (someone has to control all laptimes via the watch screen). In WSCC we gave up. Due to the huge aspiration phenomenon, especially on low HP cars, grid is not such important. What we do for some competitions is to organize 2 races with in race 2 a reverse order grid.
- The starting problem (not starting all at the same time) can appear when there are more than ten cars on the track.I have had it once. Solution: start with a warming up lap and have a standing start at the end of lap 1 (ex. real start at 2'30 on the clock or something like that).

 

[C-ZETA]

I went for the last Cappuccino Cup on here, made for some pretty good racing. Would make a good excuse for me to get 'Starbucks' as I named the Cappuccino I used there up and running again. Although I actually have two other fully modded Caps.

 

[BrandonW77]

I have some experience in league racing and I've encountered several of these hiccups. There's one solution I've seen that works every time and actually leads to more fun. Have a qualifying race before the actual race, something short like 4 or 5 laps. After that race is finished everybody re-enters the track but stays in the pits, then when the race is started it will line us up in the finishing order of the qualifying race results. As long as nobody goes back on track and sets a time everybody will be lined up properly.

There's also the option to start the field based on reverse order of the last race results. I personally like this option because it leads to closer racing, the fast drivers have to work their way back to the front and the slower drivers get to start up front and try defend. If the fastest drivers start up front then they pull away quickly while the slower drivers wallow in the back. With the reverse order start there is so much more door-to-door and bumper-to-bumper racing, and that's what most of us want I think.

The only problem with the reverse order start is the possibility of people "sand-bagging" during the qualifying race, driving slow on purpose so they can start at the front for the feature race. But if some points are given for the qualifying race (top 5) then that should keep people from sandbagging. In the end this all leads to more racing and less confusion/work, so everybody wins!

Just my two cents. 👍


Brandon

 

[turbogeit]

@StigsHero: that is indeed a possible solution.

 

[diabolicwyvern]

I'm new to racing games, I don't use a wheel, and I'm not a very good driver.
And one thing I can say is that those "driver aids" don't do diddly bop as far as I'm concerned, so I don't give a flying mouse's doopah if they're set to on or off.

(I believe the more powerful the car/the higher importance the Aids have?) The default TC setting of 5 is garbage, but leaving it on 1 is beneficial to me on high end cars. On level 1...the game allows your car to remain fairly close to the fastest line, but I'm far less likely to have a crisis--which I consider beneficial. If having the TC on 1 means I can run laps at 85% of the top time, but cut the % of corners I wreck by that same margin...I'm sold. Skid recovery I've only found helpful on cars I have not applied the strut brace or chassis stabilizer...whatever they call that 20K mod. I probably mispoke when I said "greatly" but I do think the TC is beneficial.

On a side note....You can Improve the Capps in every way possible with the correct Diff settings. If you're able to marry the LSD with your driving style, the cars a marvel to drive.

 

[watermelon punch]

Have a qualifying race before the actual race, something short like 4 or 5 laps. After that race is finished everybody re-enters the track but stays in the pits, then when the race is started it will line us up in the finishing order of the qualifying race results.

This is what the organizer did in the Low HP Race - I raced in the European race yesterday. It worked fine. I thought the qualifying race was a great idea. Not to mention that we got credits for it. LOL. (I'm very interested in my credits bottom line ya know. lol)

There's also the option to start the field based on reverse order of the last race results. I personally like this option because it leads to closer racing

This is how it was in the Low HP race. Being 2nd in grid order didn't really help me not get lapped. But it was a 42 lap race with just 4 cars.
Reverse grid order would be more relevant in a 1 make race especially with say 8+ cars.

But I don't care one way or another how the grid order is set. I just like the idea of the qualifying race being an actual race, if that makes any sense. I thought that was a fantastic idea when the host/organizer did that at the Low HP race.

The only problem with the reverse order start is the possibility of people "sand-bagging" during the qualifying race, driving slow on purpose so they can start at the front for the feature race.

At least in a 1 make race of this type probably be less of that. It's going to be bleeding obvious if someone's sandbagging.
(Note: if there is a reverse grid order set up - and you come in behind me in the qualifying race, and then lap me in the race, I will make ruthless fun of you. LOL )

(I believe the more powerful the car/the higher importance the Aids have?) The default TC setting of 5 is garbage, but leaving it on 1 is beneficial to me on high end cars. On level 1...the game allows your car to remain fairly close to the fastest line, but I'm far less likely to have a crisis--which I consider beneficial. If having the TC on 1 means I can run laps at 85% of the top time, but cut the % of corners I wreck by that same margin...I'm sold. Skid recovery I've only found helpful on cars I have not applied the strut brace or chassis stabilizer...whatever they call that 20K mod. I probably mispoke when I said "greatly" but I do think the TC is beneficial.

On a side note....You can Improve the Capps in every way possible with the correct Diff settings. If you're able to marry the LSD with your driving style, the cars a marvel to drive.

Thank you. This makes more sense to me now. Now I understand why sometimes playing with the TC & SRF can help on things like license tests & Sebastian Loeb, but I don't see a difference with MY cars. In Sebastian Loeb and the license tests & such, you're using a car they give you, NOT your own car you've set up to your liking. So that's probably why it helps with those, but in cars I set up myself, of course it wouldn't necessarily because I'm doing the car the way I want to begin with.
I always set those things to off when I'm playing with fixing a car up the way I want it, so that's probably the answer.

I pretty much do the "chassis" thing under the top tuning option (where the choices to lighten the weight are), on every car I have!! LOL The reason I do that is because my BF told me he found it's a good idea & most cars generally handle better. So I do it, and sometimes when I find a car feels "wrong" somehow, I go back & check, and sometimes I've forgotten to do that 20k thing (always makes me think of an underwire upper ladies undergarment LOL).

And in my cars, I've heard people say they never restore the engine or chassis in their cars in GT Auto, and don't notice anything... But maybe that's why - maybe they're using the SRF & so therefore don't notice??
Because even on low hp cars... I do feel the need to do the chassis restoration... maybe more often on some cars than others. Particularly more often on antique cars, and the higher the car & the older, the more often.

But some of my favourite cars that I use the most - say for grinding seasonal, or whatnot, I've done chassis restoration more than a couple times on some of them. The difference might not be pronounced, but when you've grinded the same seasonal track, in the same car, and your times just start going down, then I know something's up, even if it's not obvious in "the feel" of the car.

So this has been enlightening, thank you.

If you're able to marry the LSD with your driving style, the cars a marvel to drive.

Oh, the full adjustable LSD is something I put in every car.
I'm forever playing with that LSD every time I set up another car. ESPECIALLY long (wallowing) antique cars, cars with big snoots or long rears, or powerful cars that are particularly heavy or particularly light.
I tend to use ballast adjustment with LSD to make the car into something I won't crash.
My bf tells me I'm sometimes sacrificing speed with my LSD settings, but like you said, my time IMPROVES if I'm not WIPING OUT. LOL

In fact, when I've seen that in some online racing leagues, using the adjustable LSD is barred - I've thought - OMG I'd be in BIG TROUBLE. LOL
But when they say "no aids" - I think - well that doesn't matter! haha.
Now I'm starting to understand. )

So I wonder if the "driving aids" compensate for poor LSD set up too?
Because the mini cooper cones TGTT b license test is giving me a hard time (only one in the B section I can't get at least silver in), and I've thought if only I could adjust the LSD on the car... And I think you're not allowed to adjust the SRF or TC or something on it, so it must be related!

I'll have to play around with the driving aids on The Midget. That's ONE car I can't seem FIX with the LSD/suspension settings. The car's steering is just WEIRD. When I heard that people were grinding the seasonal k-cup eiffel track with the midget, I got car sick just thinking about it!! LOL
(note: I got car sick doing the Indy road course muscle car seasonal in my Mercury Cougar. LOL)

Anway, about the cappucino ... I'm still testing different things on it. The one link I found to a "set up" - was a good starting point (forget where I saw that link, OP should put that link in the top OP maybe?)
But it wasn't quite right, I think I changed things already from there. But definitely a better starting point for me.

If anyone wants to practice with the cappucino with me send me a friend request
After the PSN is back up, that is. {
PSN: wat3rm370n
(put coffee racecar or something in the subject because being a female, I don't accept friend requests from persons unknown without a reason THANKS)

I need all the practice I can get with other real people on the track. ) Plus it's much more fun than chasing my best-time ghost.

 

[BrandonW77]

So is anybody taking the reigns here? Looks like there's enough interest to get started but we don't have a time/date set and ToXiiC needs somebody to be in charge of organizing this as a league. I'd be willing to step into some kind of administration/organizer role if somebody that ran in the previous Capp Cup is willing to be a co-administrator. I think a league works best with at least 2 people in charge anyway, if for no other reason then having two people available to host practices/races if a scheduling conflict arises. But there are other benefits too.

I did not run in the previous Capp Cup so I'd have to read up on the history of it, and I'm willing to do that. But it would be good to have an advisor with actual Capp experience so we can keep things that worked well and modify those things that didn't. I could create a GTP Social Group to keep things organized and make it easier for the group to find info and discuss ideas. I have run a group before so I know how to do that. 👍

What do you think? Anybody ready to tackle this with me and get some races going? Also, we should probably start discussing times/days. Weekends are usually best for me, prefer early to mid afternoons.


Brandon

 

[turbogeit]

I think it is indeed best to be two for administrating a competition: a host and a back-up host.

A social group is a good idea (I administrate one myself), but don't forget to assure your communication on the general public forum. I speak from experience. With our WSCC racing league, we created our own website. We had an important number of racers and stopped communicating on GTP. The result was the following: as series continued, we had a normal, to be expected, fall out (gamers that did not continue until the end) and because of the lack of communication on GTP no new members came in. Result: we are now back on GTP and will soon close our members only website and do all communication via GTP's public forum and our members only social group. So: don't make the error we made.

Personally, I'm not free on weekends except saturday evenings late (after 10pm GMT), and sunday evenings after 9 pm GMT, but since you're in Indianapolis, your afternoons could be my evenings.

 

[BrandonW77]

I've experienced some of the issues you mentioned about members and such, and it's always good to keep it open to the public and attracting new members.

I am GMT-4 right now so I think 10pm GMT would be around 6pm my time. That's a little late for my preferences, but it could work out ok if that time's good for others.


Brandon

 

[Dapper]

I drove this car around for a few minutes yesterday, offline obviously, and I can't believe anYone would use any tire other than sports tires. Also, short shifting is so useful in making it go fast that I was down to just a couple shifts at Grand Valley East/reverse. Anyways, once I can get back online I'll host some rooms that will accommodate this car and I'll post it up in here just in case anyone wants to join me. 

 

[BrandonW77]

I think our goal is to produce very close racing without having to worry about excessive tuning. With sports tires a good tune is required, and those who aren't good at tuning will always be at a disadvantage. With racing tires you don't have to worry about tuning as much because the car will already handle well due to increased grip. That means we can just worry about track knowledge and driving skill/strategy which usually produces better/closer racing. I've been in leagues where one or two people were expert tuners and could always get an extra couple seconds out of a track and the best anybody else could hope for was 3rd or 4th place. To me that's no fun at all, I want to bang doors and bumpers and fight for position. Racing tires produces that. 👍

Plus, these are "race modified" cars, so having street tires on them seems as counter-intuitive as having racing tires on a street car.


Brandon

 

[Dapper]

I forgot to mention I used (because I suck at tuning I usually always use close to stock settings) almost stock settings, except I add some camber, lower it as much as possible, and raised the top speed a lot. It handles great on any tire, but when you put on tires that have unrealistic amounts of grip then the amount of steering, brake, and throttle input become rather null, especially on a car that weighs 600kg. And don't forget it is a modified street car, not a race car such as a 787B, or Minolta.

If you want completely numb cars that have no character with close racing then just turn on standard physics, or skid recovery as it is now called, and turn boost on and you will be able to go wide open around every track side by side. Or play Mario Kart or something similar. But that isn't what I like, so when I open a room according to the way I like to play you can join or not (Im guessing not).

 

[BrandonW77]

Yeah, I feel kind of the opposite way most of the time. I've never felt like the cars are numb with racing tires, just a little more forgiving and easier to drive at the limit. Sports soft tires can be ok but any sports tires cause the car to be more of a handful and hard to control.

It seems the trend with a lot of racing leagues is to make the cars as hard to drive as possible by putting crappy tires on them, so only expert tuners can get rid of that crappiness and have any success. I think the main interest in a league with this car is because it's easy for anybody to jump right into and have fun with. Especially with the race mod.

As for the "modified street car" thing, well the GT class in ALMS and Grand Am series are "modified street cars" and they use slick racing tires. I'm sure they don't feel numb with no character.

Now I should point out that I have not RM'd my Cappuccino yet, so obviously I haven't done any relevant tire testing on the different compounds. But I've seen so many leagues I would have been interested in until I test drove the car on some sort of sports tire and realized the car was not fun to drive because of the tires. I don't want to participate in a league where the car isn't fun to drive. Ultimately I'm sure this league will open a vote for which tires to use, but I think Race Hard would be a nice compromise and make the series more available to the casual driver who isn't a tuning expert.

 

[watermelon punch]

I think our goal is to produce very close racing without having to worry about excessive tuning. With sports tires a good tune is required, and those who aren't good at tuning will always be at a disadvantage.

But doesn't that mean someone with a better tune on racing tires will be even better?

Plus, these are "race modified" cars, so having street tires on them seems as counter-intuitive as having racing tires on a street car.

I agree to a point... But just an FYI. MY bf did auto cross in real life, and they put racing tires on street cars all the time. Of course, many of the street cars in some classes were NOT street legal anymore (in ways other than tires). But my bf's car WAS street legal, and he did put racing tires on it for the races. I know this because he still has a few old slicks lying about in my storage cottage. haha. (And he's still driving the car he used in auto cross!)

So this whole basing tire selection in the game on so-called real-world basis, is way off. Basically, using anything but RACING tires on a RACE track is kind of off-realism.

You also wouldn't be putting a racing flywheel on a honda civic you use to take your baby to the doctor & do your grocery shopping. LOL

They wouldn't put comfort tires on a formula 1 car in real life to make it "feel more real". LOL.

It's a matter of taste in the game. There's no true "real life" equivalent exactly.

You put crappy tires on cars in the game because you don't have to worry about having yourself cocooned in a carbon fiber tub in case you get hit & have an accident that sends you & the various parts of your car exploding in different directions.

I get unsettled when I hear someone complaining that the low hp cars are "numb". That probably means that this person is a hardcore gamer, bored with a lot by now, and totally out of my league & outside my style of play, and what interests me in online racing.

If that's the case here, this probably isn't the race for me. A hardcore gamer would NEVER find racing me much of a challenge, in ANY set up.
I daresay the way Dapper talks, he could probably beat me if he was driving an unmodified Corsa Comfort, and I was driving a souped up Lotus. LOL

I had figured, perhaps wrongly, that a one make race of such low power cars, would attract the same kind of average sofa-players, so to speak. I figured hard-core gamers would not be interested in such a race... They'd be in races on wet tracks with oddball sports cars or some such thing. haha!

APPEND NOTE: I wrote this BEFORE I saw stigshero's last post!! LOL I totally missed that. (And I agree with it. Except I have tried the race modified cappucino a bit.)

 

[Johnnypenso]

I was in a Cappy league recently and it was a lot of fun. For a car with 138 hp that weighs as much as a large Harley it was incredibly tough to tune. Seemed like every track had one corner where the Cappy turned into a toboggan on ice. Smoothness and momentum is the key with this little car. Get her out of shape, get the wheels sliding and you'll lose a couple of seconds a lap easily each time you do it. You have to find the edge of grip and not exceed it to get the best times.

I'd be up for another league for sure but weekends are no good for me. We ran on Tuesday nights last time and had a full room just about every week until the end. They also ran a parallel Sunday league as well which was also well attended.

 

[diabolicwyvern]

Seemed like every track had one corner where the Cappy turned into a toboggan on ice. Smoothness and momentum is the key with this little car.

Exactly, Yuri. The rampant understeer I recall best was on Turn 4 at Tskuba. I must have been facing the inner wall on 20% of the laps

 

[Mudd]

Just finished my first ever testing with the Capp (since I can't do my regular Friday online racin) and it is definately one of the more fun cars to drive. I used sport softs for testing only because that's what was on it. I felt that it was plenty controllable on those even with unchanged suspension. (though I'd did manage to spin out off a rumble strip) I really don't care too much which tires we use, as I'm certain a field full of these cars is gonna be a blast. Just thought I'd put my opinion out. I'm gonna get my Z28 RM out now because I'm tired of actually looking around at the crowd and scenery while I'm driving. Lol

 

[Dapper]

It's a matter of taste in the game. There's no true "real life" equivalent exactly.

I agree it all about taste. But corner speeds are a true to life fact that doesn't lie, and racing tires, softs in particular, offer corners speeds that are too high and totally unrealistic.

I get unsettled when I hear someone complaining that the low hp cars are "numb". That probably means that this person is a hardcore gamer, bored with a lot by now, and totally out of my league & outside my style of play, and what interests me in online racing..

Of course everyone has different joys in life, and this means me and you probably enjoy different things inside the confines of GT5. But I've driven this car for countless hours in GT5p setting laps on the leaderboards, which I set top 5 times, often top 1 or 2 times, in almost every track in GT5p, and this is absolutely not a numb feeling car, but that was all done on the equivalent of sport medium tires with no tuning, and I assure you, and everyone else, that putting sticky tires on this car takes away from the experience of driving it. With that said, I am indifferent to which tires you choose to use while driving it. 👍

Also, I maybe a hardcore PS3 racer, but I take offense to hard core gamer! GT5 is the only game for the PS3, and I only play games on the PS3.