TCv3 Judges, Grades, Scores, Awards, Battles...

[Kent]

Welcome! ​

This is the thread for judges. I'm sure you all remember this...
Link Here

Here's what we will be doing...
I will be serving as moderator/ senior judge.

Anyone may act as a simple judge.

This is the debate on TCv3's results.
Division by division, starting with FF and working to RWD, you all will do your best to discuss the cars of a designated category.

You must provide a list of the scores accompanied by the best T1 time you drove with the given car. (do not make large presentations with commentary, that comes later)

After posting that simple "first-to-last list with scores and t times" you are free to discuss the cars of the given division as you see fit in as many replies as you wish. At this point you may nominate for the special award as well as explain your opinion of each tuner (which you will be expected to do). Unsupported claims (such as scores not supported through follow-up replies) will be ignored and removed from the final results.

Replies to this thread will be monitored closely, any off subject material will be deleted (which applies to reviewing the proper cars and divisions as well). Any conjecture will be edited and claims may need to be proven (so be sure to mark those T times correctly and be sure to take your time with each car... Saving replays might not hurt either ).

Remember...

• Create Score List with T Times
• Respond with follow-up to scores and nominations for special awards

 

[Rotary Junkie]

Leo's Focus ST170
T1: 40.365
Score: 80/100

Roj's Accord Euro-R
T1: 40.998
Score: 78/100

drifting24/7's Spoon Civic
T1: 40.966
Score: 70/100

Soprano 3 1 3's 206 RC
T1: 40.251
Score: 94/100

nd 4 holden spd's Accord Coupe
T1: 40.275
Score: 90/100

mafia_boy's Infiniti G20
T1: 40.146
Score: 72/100

wrcsti's CR-X SiR
T1: 41.047
Score: 78/100

Rotary Junkie's Integra Type R
T1: 39.788
Score: 76/100

Snyp's Kusabi
T1: 40.443
Score: 80/100


Dat's all folks!

 

[Rotary Junkie]

Leonidae's Focus ST170

Reasonably quick, and loves to be pushed, but it's not right... It feels as if it's in a constant state of understeer despite hustling around the corners very quickly. Also, if you do NOT push it, it will seem worse than it is...

Roj's Accord Euro-R

Somewhat prone to wheelspin, and seems to change channels (in the cornering nature department) quicker than a 5-year-old with ADHD after six energy drinks. It will swap from FFOVER to understeer, back to FFOVER... And that hurts it most. If it had traction in second it would have scored better by a good bit, and getting it to be a bit more consistent would help it as well.

drifting24/7's Spoon Civic

More than happy to light the tires in any given gear despite an utter lack of torque, most likely due to the car's extreme light weight. If you don't mind flicking the throttle on and off constantly up to 4th gear in a 270hp car, however, it is decent handling... But the gearing could be better, and the car simply doesn't shine. I'm pretty sure that it DOES have the best P:W ratio out of all the cars, with only my Integra possibly contesting it, but it doesn't show that as it should. Cure the wheelspin, we'll talk later.

Soprano 3 1 3's 206 RC

Initial thoughts involved wheelspin, more wheelspin, a little more wheelspin, and lack of power. Turns out that the car can go plenty quick, and that there's very neutral handling. Oh, and the wheelspin went away. A goof up on my part putting it together, I assumed "LSD (Default)" to be the stocker.

After that was fixed... WOW. It's got the cornering down. Acceleration is not lacking either... Touge Monster? Bah, this wipes the floor with it. Matched in pace by two, outdone by one, but enough fun to take the calipers.

nd 4 holden spd's Accord Coupe

It goes. It stops. It corners. And it does it all without drama and without excessive wheelspin. Definitely a well-balanced car, and definitely friendly to those new to high-power FWD.

Not too much wrong with this car other than the occasional lighting of tires in second and it doesn't quite match the cornering speed of one (or two) other cars in this competition. It also is not the quickest in a straight line. However, this car is just about dead-on... It's very very close. But not quite.

mafia_boy's Infiniti G20

Sorry, Mafs, this car was rather disappointing.

You can have it do anything you want it to, so long as it involves wheelspin and an understeer bias. Excessive front camber, overly stiff rear suspension, and a willing powerplant conspire to make the car an uninspiring pile to drive. You see the P:W ratio and instantly think that it will be a burner... And then it just sits there spinning the tires into big white clouds. Oh, and once you get to a corner, slow down to proper entry speed, coast in a little, and get back in it like you would normally? Oh, hello Mr. Outside Wall, how are you today?

It's quick if driven right, but the line needs to be dead-perfect, and you have to be adept at controlling wheelspin in second as an upshift to third will keep it going as well as slow the car down.

wrcsti's CR-X SiR

Seems to be quick. Feels VERY nice through the corners. But then you look, and it's not as quick as it seemed, and it's not as nimble as it feels.

It's "decent" in all categories, but excels in none. "Jack of all trades, master of none" fits well here.

Rotary Junkie's Integra Type R

Too much of a freak to do very well. Fast, but poorly sorted and overpowered by a good bit. Too oversteery, too much wheelspin... Shades of a certain CIEN.

Snyp's Kusabi

I should dock points for how much of a PAIN IN THE ARSE it was to read his setup sheet, but I won't.

Car is awesome-to-bad*** through the corners, but the gearing quite simply kills it. I can't quite read how he got to the ratios, but I had to go to the recommended final, set autoset to 16, and then set ratios. 4th and 5th are WAY too far removed from the rest. Could probably wind up better through the corners as well, seeing as how camber, toe, and anti-roll bars were left stock. It does well for the power, but it's light. It corners well, but the Peugeot just about equals it.

Fix the gearing first.

 

[Rotary Junkie]

That's all of 'er, Olliver.

Good job to all, and it goes down:

1st: Soprano 3 1 3's Peugeot 206 RC: This IS the Touge Monster. Not the quickest or fastest, but balanced and fun. A seasoned driver in this could and would take down mountains.

2nd: N4HS's Accord: Balanced, but not as well as the Pug. Fun, but not as fun as the Pug.

3rd: Leo's Focus: A bit more wheelhop/slip than 230hp and 180 ft-lbs of torque should cause, gearing might help, but won't fix it.

--: Snyp's Kusabi: Great car, but really, the Peugeot feels better and doesn't have annoying problems with the gearbox slowing it down.

Special Award: Snyp's Kusabi: Fix the gearing, give it more time with the suspension tuning and diff. It will overtake the Pug. But what if the same was done to the Pug?

Touge Monster: Soprano 3 1 3's Peugeot 206.

 

[nd 4 holden spd]

Results as I see them
9th: Soprano 3 1 3's Peugeot 206
T1: 40.801
Score: 71/100

Tied for 7th: Mafia_Boy's Primera
T1: 39.509
Score: 85/100

Tied for 7th: VTiRoj's Accord Euro-R
T1: 40.372
Score: 85/100

6th: =drifting24/7='s Spoon Civic
T1: 39.565
Score: 86/100

5th: Rotary Junkie's Integra DC5
T1: 39.343
Score: 87/100

4th: wrcsti's CR-X
T1: 40.578
Score: 89/100

Tied for 2nd: Leonidae's Focus
T1: 39.747
Score: 94/100

Tied for 2nd: Snyp's Kusabi
T1: 39.810
Score: 94/100

1st Place: nd 4 holden spd's Honda Accord Coupe
T1: 39.282
Score: 96/100

(I'm fully aware how suss giving myself first looks, I'll exlain why in the follow-up post) (Plus they're only opinion scores anyway, not final results)

 

[nd 4 holden spd]

Nomination for spot in spot race: Snyp's Kusabi vs Leo's Focus.

Nomination for Special Award: wrcsti's CR-X for being the most precise and direct car out of the lot.

Opinons of cars:
Soprano 3 1 3's Peugeot 206:
It was easily the least responsive out of the lot, with each command seemingly taking at least half a second to have an effect on the car's behaviour. It was also the slowest of the lot in my hands (I pushed each car to close to their limits and didn't leave any one car until I was satisfied the time couldn't get much better). It has on-throttle understeer at low speeds too, which hurts at the hairpin and the chicane. It didn't have any wheelspin, but the gearbox was too wide for the track anyway, only just starting 5th gear at the fastest point. This seemed to hurt accleration also as that was left desiring a bit more speed. In short this car was slow and boring.

Mafia_Boy's Primera:
This car had pretty damn lowsy turn-in, and unpredictable ever-present wheelspin. It understeers a lot too. The car is however quite precise and an involving drive, this plus the fairly quick T1 time kept it from being in last place. Gearbox is also too long it seems.

VTi Roj's Accord Euro-R:
The rear on this car is always trying to slide around, but there is very little wheelspin, and it's all controllable. It needs a little more turn-in, but once you get used to the rear sliding a bit, you can control it and the car does run quite well, turning very freely with no pain understeer. Being just a little too slow and twitchy kept it from moving up the ladder.

=drifting24/7='s Spoon Civic:
This one has pretty bad understeer going over crests, and while the wheelspin is predictably controllable, there is a lot of it and it still becomes quite a handfull. The car is very stable and fast though, and the brakes make it very easy to control it while pulling up.

Rotary Junkie's DC5 Integra:
This car is super twitchy and it loses a lot of speed oversteering all of the time. This is probably resultant of the super stiff front springs in relation to the far softer rears. It also has pretty bad and unpredictable wheelspin. It is however the second fastest in my hands, and it has good turn-in. The fact it was fast and not the typical understeering FF kept this up from a much worse placing.

wrcsti's CR-X:
Wow, this is a fun drive. It is very precise and easy to control this car, with direct feedback all the time. The car has very little wheelspin, and pretty good turn-in. 2 things kept it from placing better, the wide gearbox and slow sector times were one, the other was an unforgiving nature. It's not easy to make mistakes with this car, but if you do, even a relatively small one, it will punish you with understeer, on brakes or on throttle.

Leonidae's Focus:
This car has very neutral handling, quite essential in this touge. It doesn't really understeer or oversteer, and the brakes are fairly adequate at getting the job done. The gears seem pretty well prepared, and the car has quite reasonable pace. The best thing is that it's extremely hard to make a mistake with this car at all.

Snyp's Kusabi:
Pretty much all of what I just said on Leo's car, except it does one thing better and one thing worse which equal them out. This is the most predictable and stable FF in the competition. But that comes at a cost of sometimes giving bad understeer if you mess the entry to a corner.

nd 4 holden spd's Accord Coupe V6:
I can't find much to fault my car on. The gearbox acts as a perfect 5spd (not one tuner's car used 6th gear throughout testing, mine and Leo's both reached the limiter in 5th). It has excellent yet controllable brakes and turn-in. There is very little wheelspin except at low revs in second (and naturally as with every car in the comp all through 1st), but it's not much and is super easy to control. The car feels very precise and responsive, but also very balanced. There is no understeer to speak of, and the only place a tiny bit of oversteer shows up is the hairpin, when it's more of a help than a hinderance. And of course it's the fastest in the competition.

 

[nd 4 holden spd]

Soprano 3 1 3's 206 RC

Initial thoughts involved wheelspin, more wheelspin, a little more wheelspin, and lack of power. Turns out that the car can go plenty quick, and that there's very neutral handling. Oh, and the wheelspin went away. A goof up on my part putting it together, I assumed "LSD (Default)" to be the stocker.

After that was fixed... WOW. It's got the cornering down. Acceleration is not lacking either... Touge Monster? Bah, this wipes the floor with it. Matched in pace by two, outdone by one, but enough fun to take the calipers.

It's not the fastest... Just the nicest for me.

With comfort comes speed. Mafs' car ate it, as did mine, but mine's too damn twitchy and oversteery, whereas his is too understeery and wheelspin-prone to do well. Power and only power saved those beasts.

And yes, the 40.251 is CORRECT for the Pug.

RJ on Soprano's Pug.

See, I completely disagree with you, this Peugeot is unresponsive and lacks any feel at all. Not to mention it's the slowest. (I discussed with Soprano, I have less power than him with all parts specified, like 10hp makes a huge difference though). It's just the most boring, if you want a comfortable ride take wrcti's CR-X or Snyp's Kusabi, they are comfortable. My Accord isn't bad either, but it's also very quick. I'm, sorry, I think the Peugeot is the biggest pile in here

 

[Rotary Junkie]

It's bloody FUN. It's got just the right balance for me. It's the easiest to nail the line with, and therefore it's quick. I too got 210hp from mine rather than the 224 specified, but the car is too bleeding nice.

I thought it was a steaming pile of dog crap at first as well ("Wheelspin in second with only 210hp? WTF?"), but then I found that he wanted the default FC LSD used... And it took the wheelspin, canned it, and made the car nicer overall. It then did EXACTLY as I told it all the way through multiple runs. First a 40.5XX. Then a 40.8 due to a screwed chicane. Then the 40.25. I may make another run in it tomorrow for the sheer fun factor of it.

 

[Pyrelli]

Run down of my results:

Joint 1st: Leonidae
T1 - 39.428
Score: 95/100

Joint 1st: nd 4 Holden spd
T1 - 38.999
Score: 95/100

3rd: Snyp
T1 - 39.531
Score: 92/100

4th: Rotary Junkie
T1 - 38.689
Score: 91/100

5th: wrcsti
T1 - 40.124
Score: 90/100

6th: Soprano 3 1 3
T1 - 39.883
Score: 87/100

7th: Drifting24/7
T1 - 39.443
Score: 85/100

8th: mafia_boy
T1 - 39.285
Score: 84/100

9th: VTiRoj
T1 - 39.959
Score: 80/100

 

[Pyrelli]

If you want to have the reviews in one then follow this link to a pdf with all the details: TCv3 Reviews (I gather this link is dying really quickly for some reason, let me know if it does and I'll do another).


Leonidae’s Ford Focus ST170’03 – 0’39.428 [95/100]

Overall the car was very consistent and I needed little, if any, adjustment of my “driving style” to get as much out of the setup as I felt I could. An obvious and positive trait was gearing which could be felt right from the start. The gearing from first to third gave the car good tractability whilst still keeping a strong sense of urgency to pull through the gears. Particularly for tracks with long uphill climbs I hate slow shifting and out of power-band gears, and in this area the Focus compared favourably to the Spoon Integra Type R.

The suspension settings of the car gave good longitudinal and lateral balance which was useful given the nature of the test course. The car never particularly swayed or dipped during cornering or harsh braking/acceleration and showed no signs of any adverse handling conditions; the latter of which is probably brought about by a solid LSD setup. Similarly the brake balance was also well thought out and proved to be firm and predictable. The power level was a good compromise, although with a little more I reckon it would have given the Accord Coupe a run for its money for the “fastest” sector time. Put plainly, this is a very well setup car.

[Video Replay, 20MB] [YouTube]


VTiRoj’s Honda Accord Euro-R’00 – 0’39.959 [80/100]

By the end of testing it, I had grown to quite like the car. It wasn’t perfect but provided everything went pretty well the car was very rewarding.
Perhaps a fault of the car, the power is very peaky and unfortunately the gearing wasn’t always kept in the optimum range; given the relatively low power that FWD’s are in effect limited to, this could have been the falling point of the car. As “1337” as third gear was, I felt this gear was the cars main weak point. When initially shifting into third, there’s a brief moment where the car appears to run out of puff. Going uphill, I feel this could have been shorter and perhaps first and second gears longer.

Other than that, the rest of the setup was solid. The suspension gave a stable platform, the brakes were pretty good and overall this gave the car a good shot at getting some quick times. This will probably sound more negative than it really is but this Accord is a jack of trades but a master of none.

[Video Replay, 20MB] [YouTube]


Drifting24/7’s Honda SPOON Civic Type R’00 – 0’39.443 [85/100]

My first impressions of the car revolved around how fast the car accelerates and more than anything, just how much wheel spin there is! Though this wasn’t too much of a problem and took about up to the first sharp corner to adapt to.

Whilst setting the car up, I did feel at first that the setup was a bit odd. However in use gave good balance, was quick to change direction and the brake balance was well set. Overall I would have preferred if the car was easier to drive. I felt that the excessive wheel spin held back the lap times and at times there was also a slight feel of understeer. If this was based on outright speed then I would mark this higher, but the cars flaws make this setup almost unapproachable for most and this is reflected in its score; though this is easily one of the most enjoyable cars in my mind 👍

[Video Replay, 20MB] http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=XuspxRoOIOk

 

[Pyrelli]

nd 4 Holden spd’s Honda Accord Coupe EX V6 (US)’03 – 0’38.999 [95/100]

This was very surprising. At first I thought it may be a bit big to perform and probably weigh too much but that turned out to be a load of rubbish. The car is eager to pull through the gears and the gears were well matched to both the engine power, the test route and keep the wheel-spin at bay. Given the large amount of torque this probably gave you the advantage of being able to use longer gears than the others, and more importantly allowing the car to really get away after each corner.

Like pretty much all of the competition the suspension was well thought out and gave a stable platform; it was able to quickly change direction, hold some neat lines and showed little/no adverse handling conditions (though I do believe that a slight oversteer would definitely have helped, especially at the ‘hairpin’). Turn in was good, if sometimes slightly vague but to be fair this was rarely a problem. As an indicator of how easy this car was to use, my first lap gave a sector time of around 0’39.3XX.

In terms of tuning and performance this car is marginally less than Leo’s Focus, but this cars main trait is its accessibility and this ease of use puts them equal in my mind.

[Video Replay, 20MB] http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=459AqtXPS3c

 

[wrcsti]

Maffs g20
39.796 FINAL
97/100

NDH4S Accord EX
39.929 FINAL
95/100

Snyp's Kusabi
40.077 FINAL
93/100

Soprano 313 206
40.733
92/100

VTiRoj's Acord euro
92/100

My CRX
41.114
92/100

Leo's Focus.
40.662
91/100

RJ RSX
40.008
90/100

=drifting24/7= Spoon Civic
40.424
87/100

 

[wrcsti]

testing scores
Leo's Focus.
40.662

Grips like there is no tomorrow. My feeble americanized puertorican mind can not get over the fact of how

fast it can go in corners and still stick to them. If you encounter slower corners the gearbox is well set

up and will get the powerband in very well while reducing tire sliping in corners. Overall a very nicely

tuned neutral car. This should be a rally car for pavement rallies. On a side note the antenna on the roof

seemed to help me notice where the car wants to go in corners which is a very nice touch that ford had on

it in a serendipity moment.
Maffs g20
39.796 FINAL

Car feels very planted and neutral in turns, but it doesnot like to be pushed too hard. This car is what

they meant when they said "go slow to go fast", but after a while you get used to it and start dropping

timwes each run. It also has quite a bit of tire spin on 1,2,3 gears and requires constant throtle

feathering to get it going well in the straights. Had you taken an extra hour to get rid of the off corner

understeer this would have been a touge monster car.

NDH4S Accord EX
39.929 FINAL

Car is very nimble through most corners but i kept making mistakes on the hairpin (just like on every

other car) which lead to the time slowdown. It drives like a AWD car, likes to kick out the tail and is

very responsive. It does however have a wierd slide if you trail brake (which happens to be my driving

style) which makes it unpredictable for about .2~.3s. This is about as good as they get.

Snyp's Kusabi
40.077 FINAL

Car feels planted like most of the competition. Reminds me of my CRX in sound, handling and gearing. The gears are very well set up if you can find out how to set them up, I had to make up 4th and 5th to what i thought was going to be the closest to the ones posted. It does have a hint of understeer but it is taimed and will mostly never come out.
My CRX
41.114

It might be the slowest car inthis competition, but it is because of my philosophy in tuning. If its made for total time dominance, you will never be able to make it happen 5 times in a row. i ran the exact same time of 41.16X for 3 times straight and then did a .13X and then the .114. Not many other cars in this competition can do that. It could have used more power to get lower lap times and better straight away speed. I am basing my score of 90 on the handling of the car and overall feel of it instead of time like mostly everyone else has done.
Soprano 313 206
40.733
first off i dont think one can do a 0.011 gear ratio for 4th gear in any car with 218 hp. Now the car seems to have gone to the darker more front tire screaching side. It lacks the twitchiness some of theese cars have but has become rather dull and slow in changing directions. It is also underpowered for the gearbox, it really needs about an extra 30-50hp to make it work better. Suspension wise it is not as planted as it may seem but weight transfers nicely and safely thus taking away the thrill some of the other cars have but adding a bit more to the constant times like my CRX. Although i may look like i am bashing this thing to pieces and being kindof biased away from puegots from WRC i actually would use this car for an endurance event that requred these rules and has been very good to me.
=drifting24/7= Spoon Civic
40.424

Understeer at its finest expesimen. The car is VERY quick in a straight line if its not spining the tires but the second you start to turn in no matter the speed it automatically starts going off the track. it is well set up for the hard right hander but the tire spin coming out really kills it. Reminds me of most american cars, the'll go fast in a straight line but you have to take turns at 10mph to not go off track.
RJ RSX
40.008

This is exactly what i meant when I said "If its made for total time dominance, you will never be able to make it happen 5 times in a row." This thing is insane, someone needs to tell RJ that FF doesnt stand for ****ing fearless, cause thats what you have to be to drive this.
VTiRoj's Acord euro

I could not find this car so i used pyrellis lap and what others wrote to see what this was doing, also i will have no time for this one
it appears to like to kick the tail out a bit. Tire spin is almost non existent and the gears apear to be relatively well set up for the track. Seems like alot of potential on this car too bad I couldnt find one .

nomination for award: RJs DC5,as the fastest one and funest one.

 

[Kurei]

FF Class Testing Results (Judge/Driver: Kurei)

(*Note: All T1 times are just cruise times, not official Time Attack numbers*)
1. Rotary Junkie’s Honda Integra Type R (DC5)
- T1 Time: 0’38.989 / Score: 92
2. Leonidae’s Ford Focus ST170
- T1 Time: 0’39.521 / Score: 91
3. Tie
-wrc sti’s Honda CR-X SiR
- T1 Time: 0’40.516 / Score: 90
-nd 4 holden speed’s Honda ACCORD Coupe EX V6
- T1 Time: 0’39.615 / Score: 90
4. Tie
-Soprano 3 1 3’s Peugot 206 RC
- T1 Time: 0’40.755 / Score: 89
-Snyp’s Mazda Kusabi
- T1 Time: 0’39.686 / Score: 89
5. VtiRoj’s Honda Accord Euro-R
- T1 Time: 0’40.654 / Score: 84
6. mafia boy’s Nissan Primera Te/Infiniti G20
- T1 Time: 0’39.852 / Score: 81
7. =driftin24/7=’s Honda SPOON Civic Type R
-T1 Time: 0’39.969 / Score: 79

Special Award Nomination: Rotary Junkie’s Honda Integra Type R (DC5)
(Reason discussed in Review post)
Class Battle Nomination: Is it possible to hold 2 battles ?, I personally would like to see Soprano’s Peugot take on wrc sti’s CR-X myself, they may not be the fastest, but they sure would make for one heck of an extra battle, they are very equal, like perfect rivals. If not then just RJ’s DC5 taking on Holden’s Accord or Leo’s Focus, their all relatively close for a decent battle.

 

[Kurei]

Judging Review

Rotary Junkie’s Honda Integra Type R (DC5) Review:
This car was quite a surprise, the handling was phenomenal, Some of you really dedicated BMI Hot Version fans might know that Keiichi Tsuchiya has described the new FD2 Honda Civic Type R with FR-like handling, that it handles like a FR, etc, well that’s exactly how I feel about this car, It handles like a FR, Its steering is also very precise and smooth, braking was strong, acceleration is how I like it, and it feels very light, I even managed to do a weight transfer drift out of the hairpin once with it

Why I chose it for the Special Award: This car simply fits Keiichi Tsuchiya's thoughts on the FD2 Honda Civic Type R, "It feels and handles like its an FR", Its fast as all get out for an FF, very fun, and looks pretty good too, other than that you have to drive it yourself to see why I like it so much

Leonidae’s Ford Focus ST170 Review:
Leo described the car to have Lotus-like handling, so what did I do ?, I bought it some Lotus wheel’s, did it help the car any ?, well not really. It’s got the mechanical grip he claimed it to have, it’s got strong brakes and stops fast like he said it did, It was very, very controllable, but I don’t feel it completely fills the claim of Lotus-Like handling, I mean where’s my over steer ? , but still a good car none-the-less.

wrc sti’s CR-X SiR Review:
The notes stated that this was a car brutally tuned for handling, and that it is !, First drive of the car I was baffled at how nicely balanced it is, Good Grip, Good Braking, Good Acceleration and Braking, A little bit of wheel-spin in lower gears, but nothing that a quick throttle-lift or shift-up fixes with little loss in speed.

nd 4 holden spd’s Honda ACCORD Coupe EX V6 Review:
One of the more large car’s in this class, but an interesting one, Acceleration was alright, Braking was strong, Grip was good, and it was a little over-steery, but controllable, And it might have just been me, but the car always seemed a little heavy in the corner’s and on the straights, making it not as fun as RJ’s ITR, But a well-built car still.

Soprano 3 1 3’s Peugot 206 RC Review:
This car is an excellent rival to wrc sti’s CR-X, but its main weakness is the under steer, which really kicked in while entering the hairpin, and accelerating out of it, It just couldn’t be over-come, It did have nice, strong Brakes, and moderate acceleration, about a medium-type of car.

Snyp’s Mazda Kusabi Review:
This car was a wild card to me, never really bothered to drive it when I won it before, so I didn’t really have any expectations for this. It was a good drive though, very balanced, a good car to practice basic FF technique in.

VtiRoj’s Honda Accord Euro-R Review:
This car has good “sleeper” looks to it, but its not that much of one as far as corners are concerned, It has a nasty amount of under steer in the corners, almost like driving in snow sometimes, and wheel spin also kicks in during acceleration, but the brakes are good and when its not under steering, its relatively stable.

maifa boy’s Nissan Primera Te/Infiniti G20 Review:
In its stock form, I will admit this car has mob hit squad looks to it, but the mob would not be satisfied with its tuned performance, It spins the wheels in the first 3 gears or so, It under steers quite often, and the ride gets really rough if you ride onto the sidewalks in the course, and with a nasty “BANG!” too, Everytime it happened I honestly thought I was breaking something, Its not a great car, but it could perform with a better set-up and softer ride

=drifting24/7=’s Honda SPOON Civic Type R:
This car does have quite the look, but not the performance you’d expect with it, wheel spin, under steer, marginal braking, and wasted acceleration from the wheel spin really bring the fun out of this car, making it a handful at all times, only getting a chance to admire it on straights with its good engine, but GT4’s engine sounds don’t even make that any fun, the least enjoyable entry in this class, the car does have potential, but it takes a lot more than this tune to achieve it.

 

[Rotary Junkie]

Wow, now that the more "****ing Fearless" as wrcsti puts it drivers are grading my car it seems to be doing better.

Then again, I did grade it down myself because I personally feel that I could have made it better, maintaining the cornering speeds it currently has and the attitude for oversteer, but toned it down so that it wouldn't rip the traction away from the fronts so easily.

Also should have lightened the less-understeery-by-nature RSX instead of the 'Teg.

 

[nd 4 holden spd]

Softer front spring rates should have done it. I felt the oversteery nature of your car actually hindered speeds on just about any corner unless you did it perfectly, the rears sliding meant a speed loss. You were almost there.

 

[Rotary Junkie]

I was thinking stiffer rears, they're way too soft as it sits.

 

[mafia_boy]

Want to swap spring rates RJ?? My Primera's too much, your ITR is too little.

*added bit* OI!!! CLEAN UP YOUR PM'S DAMMIT RJ!! 100% inboxes stop Mafs sending you crap through PM.

 

[nd 4 holden spd]

I was thinking stiffer rears, they're way too soft as it sits.

It's still a bumpy touge track, which is why all my cars have relatively soft springs in this (soft dampers anyway). To absorb all the bumps.

 

[Rotary Junkie]

Want to swap spring rates RJ?? My Primera's too much, your ITR is too little.

*added bit* OI!!! CLEAN UP YOUR PM'S DAMMIT RJ!! 100% inboxes stop Mafs sending you crap through PM.

Nah, I prefer mine. Oversteer is fun, understeer is a pain.

And I'm going to go back on Premo when I get back from Chicago, so I don't plan on cleaning it.

N4HS: Nah, stiff springs aren't always bad. In fact, while my 787B and Toyota 7 LOOK soft, they're quite stiff for their weight.

-Kyle

 

[Kent]

Well guys...
Start doing scores and judging for the AWD and RWD classes. 👍
You can continue to do the FWD class as well.
I'll be leaving the judging open for all classes for some time to come (probably about two more weeks).
Please drop in and give your impressions of all the cars.
Thanks for the participation!

 

[nd 4 holden spd]

RWD Judging through my eyes (touge monster T1: 37.508)

12th: wrcsti' RUF BTR
T1: 35.535
Score: 70/100

11th: nissan tuner's MR2
T1: 38.101
Score: 77/100

10th: =drifting24/7='s Trueno SS Version
T1: 38.685
Score: 82/100

9th: dimplz's MX-5
T1: 38.654
Score: 83/100

8th: Mafia_Boy's Silvia Q's
T1: 37.792
Score: 85/100

7th: r34Ben's GTS-t Skyline
T1: 37.166
Score: 86/100

6th: Leonidae's BMW 120i
T1: 36.783
Score: 89/100

5th: Rotary Junkie's RX-8
T1: 35.494
Score: 91/100

4th: Soprano 3 1 3's BMW M3
T1: 36.001
Score: 92/100

Tied 2nd: VTiRoj's NSX Type R
T1: 35.007
Score: 95/100

Tied 2nd: nd 4 holden spd's ASL Garaiya
T1: 35.104
Score: 95/100

1st: Snyp's Elise 111R
T1: 34.219
Score: 99/100

 

[nd 4 holden spd]

Firstly, everyone's cars handled great (except the BTR which was too wild), I had fun driving all 12 of them though- don't get me wrong. So here's some small reviews on each one and the occasional explaination why I ranked them the way I did.

Nomination for Spot Race: VTiRoj's NSX vs nd 4 holden spd's ASL Garaiya.

Nomination for Special Award: Soprano 3 1 3's BMW M3 for being so easy to use despite the scary size in relation to touge.

nd 4 holden spd's ASL Garaiya Review
It has good brakes and good turn-in. Brake too late and it may be a little reluctant to turn. It has really good grip and the car turns quite well. It gets through the first corner really well, but is a little upset by the bump in the chicane. It also needs throttle control at the hairpin if you do it in first gear. This car has no oversteer it seems, and very small understeer at low speeds at times. It's very easy to use.

VTiRoj's Honda NSX Type-R Review
It has slightly longer braking distances than a few in this comp. It grips and turns well with a hint of oversteer. It has good turn-in and the car is very responsive. The car handles most corners very well, except the chicane (where it is prone to oversteer over the bump) and the following left hander (again prone to oversteer over the drop in elevation), but is manageable on both accounts. It may spin the wheels in second at the hairpin from low revs, but any ape with half an idea of what throttle control is will control it.

Leonidae's BMW 120i Review
It has good brakes and turn-in, and goes through every corner without drama except the hairpin where it's a little prone to oversteer. It doesn't quite seem to be able to match the cornering speeds of the front-runners, but it's super easy to use. I got understeer a couple of times on the right hand sweeper before the hairpin, but they seemed to be more driver error than vehicle.

r34ben's Nissan Skyline GTS-t Review
This car can brake and turn really well except for one problem. It spins the wheels every chance it gets, even in higher gears like 4th and 5th when going over bumps. I can't get it out of my head that no LSD was purchased for this car, it's the only let down but it's a big let down. When the wheels do spin it leads to oversteer.

=drifting24/7='s Trueno Sprinter SS Version Review
Good brakes and turn-in. The car plows through most corners easily except the chicane where the bump can provoke wheelspin and oversteer. No understeer at all in this car. Ultimately too slow though I feel.

Soprano 3 1 3's BMW M3 Review
This car does what my Accord Coupe did in FWD, came out against cars half its size and shows them a thing or 2. No understeer or oversteer or wheelspin in this car. The brakes let it down, they seem to lock up a bit (the kind where they make the tyres screech a little bit), and so the turn-in and braking distances didn't quite seem up to par with the front runners. It was not phased by elevation changes or bumps either like so many here are.

Mafia_Boy's Nissan Silvia Q's S14 Review
The car has pretty good brakes and turn-in. The bump in the chicane can provoke wheelspin which can be difficult to control. I can't shake the low speed oversteer either, it's manageable, but it's still there. It's not much but it off-sets the feeling of the car slightly.

wrcsti's RUF BTR Review
Where do I begin? The car takes a long time to pull up, even longer if you don't want to drift. On level track it actually understeers pretty bad- give it an excuse though (bumps, elevation change, off-camber corners), and it will drift the night away. Most/all of its fairly quick lap time is done in a straight line. This car might be OK on a circuit, but not the touge.

Rotary Junkie's RX-8 Review
Braking distances are not too bad, but turn-in is. The car turns well under accleration. The bump in the chicane doesn't effect it too much, but the following left hander that decreases in elevation can provoke oversteer. That's not detrimental to lap times though. The car behaves pretty well otherwise, the bump in the chicane was the only place I got slight wheelspin. The high speed turning is not as good as the Touge Monster or everyone else. It is because of the turn-in (which was worse than Soprano), and the oversteer in that left-hander that Soprano's M3 ranks higher.

dimplz's MX-5 Review
Magnificent brakes, good turn-in. Not effected by bumps at all. Slight power oversteer which can be used to an advantage. No wheelspin at all. Gets though every single corner no fuss at all. Too slow to rank higher I'm afraid though. It is because of its no fuss usability and fractionally faster lap time that this MX-5 ranks higher than =drifting24/7='s Trueno. They are so close in feel and speed otherwise though.

nissan tuner's MR2
Brakes are good, turn-in is not. High speed turning capability is quite impressive, the car grips well. At low speed unfortunately there is understeer though. The car is not really phased by bumps and elevation changes. Because of the understeer and lack of turn-in it ranks lower than the MX-5 and Trueno.

Snyp's Lotus Elise Review
This car has awesome written all over it. Good turn-in (although you can get sideways if you brake too late). Permanent grip....just all the time. Even 1st gear is usable for launch out of the hairpin. Super high cornering grip. Super fast acceleration and lap time. Apart from brakes this beats everyone in every way. (brakes are a little weak). If it wasn't for the slightly sad brakes it would have scored 100.

 

[Rotary Junkie]

Bah, 5th. I want to know why.

And I think Roj's NSX either uses its power better or corners faster than your Garaiya... It's quicker but has a much worse P:W ratio.

 

[nd 4 holden spd]

The NSX does acclerate quicker, torque will do that, and the ASL is easier to use which is why I ranked it higher. Trust me though, you should be proud of yourself, you made a good car, and 5th is quite respectable in this company of vehicles.

 

[Rotary Junkie]

55-100mph acceleration...

NSX-R: 5.468 seconds

ASL: 5.005

I believe I've found WHY the ASL is slower accelerating for you: Power peak is at 7200rpm. You use automatic. Automatic will shift it at 7000rpm. So really, it only ever gets to use around 290hp, and that's right where it shifts. 270 at 6500. 250 at 6000. (Torque curve is dead flat, figures based on 220 ft-lbs of torque)

But then it STILL has 265hp average through the operating range (5700-7000rpm). Which puts it at a 2.75 P:W ratio or so.

The car is also light enough to beat out the NSX-R on torque to weight as well. 3.55 KG per ft-lb of torque against 3.84 for the NSX.

Torque argument null and void.


In other words, I don't feel that the Garaiya performs sufficiently. However, Roj's car is somewhat touchy (haven't run the Garaiya proper yet), so it wouldn't be TOO difficult to beat it out in that area.

 

[nd 4 holden spd]

Just drive them on the touge, my car reaches a max of 200km/hr when Roj's NSX reaches around 210km/hr I think. I considered giving myself a tie with him, but the ease of use my car presents over his put me that 1pt ahead.

Edit: Upon some reflection I've changed my results slightly, Mafia_Boy has been bumped up to 8th as I realised I wasn't quite driving it right (probably still aren't ) but it gave it a speed advantage and eliminated some understeer I was getting in it so now he's on 85 points.
I also realised I was wrong to separate myself and VTiRoj's NSX, so I docked myself a point and we are tied for second.

Edit 2: All reviews are up now for your reading enjoyment.

 

[wrcsti]

you only ran a 35.5XX in the BTR? I've ran 35.1XX in it a good dozen times. Well aparently you dont like the driving style of it at all.

 

[nd 4 holden spd]

I know it could go faster with more time and effort, but I'm not willing to spend hours getting the hang of it for 0.4sec. I just don't think it's suited to touge.