The General Anime Thread...

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AOS-
This....
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I understand the show's explanation that

There's the alpha worldline where Mayuri is fated to die.

...I'm just saying that it's utterly moronic. And I gave an example as to why, which has yet to be countered.

For it to be impossible for Okabe to jump to a worldline where Mayuri doesn't die without undoing the D-Mails, things invariably have to happen differently without cause or reason other than "she's fated to die".

If she gets pushed into a moving train for instance, Okabe should be able to time-leap and grab the person who pushed her before they do that. But in Steins;Gate, the worldline will just invent some other cause for her death. Something that wouldn't have happened before, and has no cause other than "because she's fated to die".

So dumb. For a show that otherwise is about time-travel and changing things through causation and the butterfly effect, it's really annoying and comes across as lazy, poor writing.
 
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I think that's was just Okabe's dumb judgment... even I could have figured out a way to prevent it...:lol:

but yes, I agree about your first point...

Really, I firmly believe there has to have been at least one d-mail he could have sent that could have taken him back to the Beta line... and that would have been to tell himself not to tell Daru..no; don't tell anyone... about Kurisu being stabbed.

Undoing d-mails is one way to fix the problem, the most straightforward method may I add... Like I said before (or maybe I didn't), I'm fine with the way they chose to do this since Okabe already chose to let other people send d-mails and screw up the world...having to undo a dmail from someone who we thought was a good person made for some excitement...

Plus, this was based on a visual novel after all so they had to give every character some level of attention.
 
Undoing all those D-mails is not the most straightforward method of saving Mayuri, if that's what you're saying. :p
Just time-leap once and save her. Except wait, the show won't allow that because there are other reasons why the D-mails need to be undone and so it lazily uses Mayuri as an excuse.
 
Just deal with it.... I'm pretty sure they didn't just do a single one to solve everything because that would have cut out a lot of stuff from the VN...

I'm also pretty sure the story would have ended so fast if they did that. After all, it's a thriller; it HAS to keep you in suspense. :p
 
AOS-
Just deal with it.... I'm pretty sure they didn't just do a single one to solve everything because that would have cut out a lot of stuff from the VN...

I'm also pretty sure the story would have ended so fast if they did that. After all, it's a thriller; it HAS to keep you in suspense. :p
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I did deal with it. And subsequently, all you Steins;Gate fanatics should deal with my determination that it's a good, but not great, show. :p
 
You're forgetting the fact that everyone dies eventually. Why do you think I keep saying her death in that world line was sooner? And every time he did a time-leap in an attempt to stop her from dying, it didn't work.

Okabe found out that no matter what he did in that world line, it was hopeless because Mayuri was going to die anyways. He time-leaped just to watch her die so he would know how much time he has left to undo the d-mails.

Same thing goes for Kurisu. Which is why future Okabe used the knowledge from all his failed attempts from time-leaping to devise a plan to save both of them by creating a new worldline.

Is it really that hard to get all of that across to you?
 
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slybugga
You're forgetting the fact that everyone dies eventually. Why do you think I keep saying her death in that timeline was sooner? And every time he did a time-leap in an attempt to stop her from dying, it didn't work.

Okabe found out that no matter what he did in that timeline, it was hopeless because Mayuri was going to die anyways. He time-leaped just to watch her die so he would know how much time he has left to undo the d-mails.

Same thing goes for Kurisu. Which is why future Okabe used the knowledge from all his failed attempts from time-leaping to devise a plan to save both of them by creating a new worldline.

Is it really that hard to get all of that across to you?
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I get that. I'm just saying it's STUPID.

No **** everyone dies eventually. Okabe time-leaping to prevent Mayuri from getting shot by Moeka should've jumped to a new, different worldline where her death is postponed until the distant future where she dies of natural causes or in some freak accident, instead of the ******** "they're stuck in this 'timeline' where Mayuri's death is specifically fated to happen unless he undos the d-mails".

Is it really that hard to get that across to you??
 
yaywalter
I did deal with it. And subsequently, all you Steins;Gate fanatics should deal with my determination that it's a good, but not great, show. :p
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It's a really good show... of ALL TIME...

It's a fantastic suspenseful show.... of post-2010....

you can like a show all that much more if you didn't expect it to be as good as shows in the 90s... we all know Anime was at the top of the hill during that time... we all know shows now aren't as good anymore... so I don't see why one needs to keep comparing new shows with stuff in the past. Compare it to shows of its time.

It's still a great show to me.... I like the time-travelling, I like the characters (except Ruka... and Moeka), I like the humour, I like the character designer, I like the Divergence Meter, I like the IRL and outside media references, I like the tuturu, and I LOVE the cliffhanger moments....
 
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AOS-
It's a good show... of ALL TIME...

It's a GREAT show of post-2010....you can like a show all that much more if you didn't expect it to be as good as shows in the 90s... we all know Anime was at the top of the hill during that time... we all know shows now aren't as good anymore... so I don't see why one needs to keep comparing new shows with stuff in the past. Compare it to shows of its time.
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It's not a great show of post-2010, it's still just good. I don't rate shows relative to the time they came out.

But if I did, it still wouldn't be great. Madoka's better. More suspenseful, better plot twists, and it manages to maintain its writing integrity up until the very end.

I like the time-travelling, I like the characters, I like the humour, I like the character designer, I like the Divergence Meter, I like the IRL and outside media references, I like the tuturu, and I LOVE the cliffhanger moments....
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I like those things too, but that doesn't fix the show's problems for me.
 
In the Alpha Worldline, Mayuri Dies.

In Beta Worldline, Kurisu dies.

Worldlines are the rope. Timelines are the twine. All the twines eventually lead to the same end.

Okabe did move timelines every time he time-leapt or undid d-mails. Different twines, same rope.

New d-mail moved him away from the divergence line where he could cross worldlines.

He couldn't keep d-mailing his way to another worldline because he would keep moving further way from the divergence point. Which is why he had to undo the d-mails.

And this whole changing fate thing can also be applied to Madoka.
 
slybugga
In the Alpha Worldline, Mayuri Dies.

In Beta Worldline, Kurisu dies.

Worldlines are the rope. Timelines are the twine. All the twines eventually lead to the same end.

Okabe did move timelines every time he time-leapt or undid d-mails. Different twines, same rope.

New d-mail moved him away from the divergence line where he could cross worldlines.

He couldn't keep d-mailing his way to another worldline because he would keep moving further way from the divergence point. Which is why he had to undo the d-mails.
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That's nice and all, and I know that the show tries to differentiate between the two for its own devices, but...

The differentiation between "worldlines" and "timelines" is nonsense.
Okabe should've been able to move to a different timeline AND worldline by time-leaping and greatly changing his actions.

And this whole changing fate thing can also be applied to Madoka.
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Yes, but that happens at the very end of Madoka. So up until that point, it's fine.
I've already picked apart Madoka's ending and I don't really feel like doing it again. :p
 
Loliblade ver2
Yes, IF he greatly changed his actions. He didn't.
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Yeah, he kinda did. He didn't just time-leap and drink a Pepsi instead of Dr. Pepper. He actively tried to save Mayuri, which should've easily been able to move him to a timeline AND worldline where she was saved.
 
yaywalter
I don't rate shows relative to the time they came out.
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That's fine, but I do it... since you're only going to be out looking for more new shows to watch eventually...
YippieDancer
But if I did, it still wouldn't be great. Madoka's better.
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Just because one show was better than the other doesn't make the show of a lesser greatness a bad show, as that's what you're nearly implying.

Both Steins;Gate and Madoka are good shows and definitely worth watching over other shows of this time. After that, it's a matter of personal taste.
 
It's not nonsense. Suzuha explains it in the show.

She went over everything in fact. You can't cross worldlines unless you cross the divergence point at 1.0.

And saying Okabe time traveling to stop Mayuri from dying is a ****** plot device is saying Homura time travelling to prevent Madoka from becoming a witch is also ******. They're doing the same thing.
 
AOS-
Just because one show was better than the other doesn't make the show of a lesser greatness a bad show, as that's what you're nearly implying.
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No, I'm implying that if any post-2010 show judged relative to its time is great, it's Madoka. I'm not saying Steins;Gate is bad at all.

Both Steins;Gate and Madoka are good shows and definitely worth watching over other shows of this time.
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Agreed. But we're still just starting this whole "post-2010" thing. I'm willing to bet that there will be many better shows before 2020.


slybugga
It's not nonsense. Suzuha explains it in the show.

She went over everything in fact. You can't cross worldlines unless you cross the divergence point at 1.0.
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The whole divergence point/meter stuff is nonsense too, more or less added just to keep people from thinking too hard about the flaws in the writing.

Regarding Madoka, I'm not giving it a free pass either. It has flaws too. But they happen closer to the end, where it doesn't hamper the tension and suspense for the whole last half of the show as was the case with Steins;Gate for me.
 
Then let those shows come on their own time... you don't strive to the future to make crappier stuff after all.. but FOR NOW, those 2 said shows are still good...

*closes brief case*
back to doing my close-reading of SFII
 
AOS-
Then let those shows come on their own time... you don't strive to the future to make crappier stuff after all.. but FOR NOW, those 2 said shows are still good...

*closes brief case*
back to doing my close-reading of SFII
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Indeed, nobody ever said they weren't good.

I recommended Steins;Gate for a reason...
 
Mommy, daddy, stop fighting! :(


I'll get in on this when I finish the show.
 
yaywalter
The whole divergence point/meter stuff is nonsense too, more or less added just to keep people from thinking too hard about the flaws in the writing.
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jackie-chan-meme.png
 
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slybugga
jackie-chan-meme.png
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Okabe should've been able to diverge from the alpha worldline to a variety of other ones with ease through time-leaping, and without undoing the D-mails to make a "divergence meter" reach a specific "divergence point". Just saying.







Out of curiosity, how far into Steins;Gate are you, Sephy?
 
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No he couldn't. It's a stated fact that you cannot cross worldlines unless you cross the 1% divergence.

When the show starts in the beta worldline the divergence is 1.13XXXX. Upon sending that accidental d-mail to Daru it caused him to cross into the alpha worldline at divergence point 0.57XXXX.
 
Just to be clear...

Time-leaping wasn't used to travel to other world lines... it was used to only send the user's memories back in time up to 48 hours...
"Time line" is just a word we're mixing up with "World Line"
What was done to travel back to the Beta line was just undoing a dmail

Just saying....

edjt: Actually, I've been meaning to ask, yay4walnuts...

If you feel so strongly that a single d-mail could have saved Mayuri.... what would you have written?
 

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