The Last of Us Part II

[MMX]

Just finished the game today, as well, and agree with the above. It was good, but could've been better.

 

[VBR]

It's pretty unanimously agreed...

Ad Populum.

...but you're still allowed to enjoy the games.

Thank you so much for giving me permission to enjoy my favourite video game, it's much appreciated!

 

[Firehuntah]

I also completed the story. While this definitely wasn't as good as the first game (how could it be, that game was just perfect in my opinion) I still really did enjoy the game and its story. There are many flaws though so that's a bit of a shame. Didn't really expect that from a Naughty Dog game. But yeah.. if you can look through them, the game is still quite good. I will say this though, for people who haven't played it yet. Go and play The Last Of Us part 1 first! You will understand everything that's happening in part 2 a lot more and you'll probably appreciate the story more as well, or at least be more involved with it.

So.. going more in depth now, so into the spoiler tag we go. Do not read if you haven't completed the game yet. And if you are going to read, well good luck. It's quite a bit of text.

Spoiler

Going straight into it, the main talking point of this game, Joel's death. I really do not understand the writing here, how can Joel and Tommy both be so careless to walk right into that trap with Abby? Saving her is one thing but actually going to her place with all those people they don't even know, entering the building and sharing their real names? Like, really? This isn't like them at all, in the first game Joel didn't trust anyone really, besides Tess and maybe Henry and Sam a little. But other than that, he really should've known better. Maybe Tommy even more so as he really should protect all of those people living in Jackson. He even invited Abby and the others to come there and take supplies before heading out while not even knowing any of them! I really don't get it. What I also don't get is that Abby gets saved by Joel and Tommy (she would've gotten killed or infected otherwise) and then still goes on to hurt both of them and well, killing one of them. I mean, after playing a bit more you can tell that Abby actually isn't all that bad. So why did she not care one bit about Joel and Tommy saving her life?

So.. obviously what happened to Joel I really didn't like at first and I understand why many people are so upset by this. Joel is a really great character and to see him die so early on in the game feels really bad. I really wanted to go back to the parts where I played as Abby and jump her straight off a cliff. But yeah, obviously you can't continue the story that way. I also really hated to play as her again later on in the game. That is until I saw why Abby actually wanted to kill Joel. I must say, that's definitely a valid reason, she lost her father because of him saving Ellie in that hospital in such a brutal way. From that point on I really did understand and care for Abby a lot more. However, the long parts playing as her in Seattle felt really awkward and stretched at times. I felt they could've at least shortened that a little bit. Especially after that cliff hanger with Abby pointing the gun at Ellie at the theater. You really want to know what happens next but no, you have to play as Abby for a few hours first. I mean, after going through those parts with Abby I really did like that we got to see the stories on both Ellie's and Abby's side. But I feel like they could've done that a bit later.

Now onto the part I really did not like at all and still don't after completing the game, entering that theater as Abby and seeing her perspective of shooting Jesse and Tommy. Then we have to play as her and try to kill Ellie. Really?! What was Neil Druckmann thinking? This was just not a good idea. I actually let Abby die a few times on purpose to see what would happen. Sadly, we had to continue like this and couldn't skip this part somehow. Ofcourse, no one wants to kill Ellie, and I really wanted to play AS Ellie in this part. Still hate that we didn't get to. Why was it more important story wise to play as Abby at this point? It really wasn't. Thankfully they didn't kill Ellie off at this point, anything would've been possible really with Joel already getting killed so early on in the game.

So yeah, that was the end. Abby spares Ellie and Dina and they both end up living a happy life on their farm with JJ, deciding that's best for them and revenge just isn't worth losing all this. Pretty cool epilogue. Ofcourse they wouldn't want to go back to Jackson either with Tommy being dead and all. Maria would never accept them back in there! Hmm, wait there's a visitor with a horse, who would it be? Oh wait, what?! Tommy, but how in the hell is he still alive? He was shot in the head by Abby. Major flaw in my opinion. What follows next as well. The whole Santa Barbara thing feels completely unnecessary. Ellie goes all the way over there to still get revenge and then in the end lets Abby go anyway? What was the point of that really? Either Ellie should've just realised that before starting that final fight and just went their seperate ways with their own boats, or the game should've just ended at that farm together with Dina. I really didn't like that fight with Abby. How were they both even still able to? Abby was tied up on that pole for quite a while already and Ellie was badly hurt. Really don't see how they could've lasted as long as they did.

The only thing I guess I did like about Santa Barbara is that it makes a part 3 possible. With the Fireflies being out there somewhere, surely Abby and Lev are going to there. And with Ellie still being alive and immune, the Fireflies would still want her to work on a cure for the infection. Would it be possible for both Ellie and Abby to meet again and maybe actually work together at some point? I don't know.. not even sure if I really want a part 3 to be honest. As I said, the story should've just ended at that farm and perhaps the whole series as well. Just a happy ending, why not? It's going to be difficult to make a good part 3 out of this right now. Especially with so many people being pretty negative about part 2 already.

So you might ask, what did I actually like so much about this game then? I liked how it told 2 stories pretty much, the one of Ellie after the events that happened in part 1 and the one of Abby. I like how in the end it made you care about both of them, even though one of them seemed so evil at first because of killing Joel in a such a brutal way. I also really liked how we got to see Ellie's character develop. Sure, it wasn't the way we wanted or even expected. But still, with all the events happening it was very interesting to see. Also cool to see how in the end Joel and Ellie's story is very similar to Abby and Lev's story. Or at least they tried to make it seem that way. What I also really liked were all of the flashbacks, especially all the ones with Joel obviously. But I didn't mind the others either. Just one where there was a flashback inside a flashback, that was a bit odd..

Without looking at just the story, I think this game looks really fantastic. The characters, their animations, facial expressions and all of the areas you go to are all so beautifully made. Someone here said that it looks like a dumbed down PS5 game. Maybe that's the case, who know how much better it'll look like on PS5 anyway? But comparing to other awesome looking PS4 games, this one really didn't disappoint in my opinion. One of the best looking games you can get on PS4 right now.

So yeah.. that was my pretty long opinion on this game.

Can I say just one more thing I didn't like? Dina and Mel, both being pregnant, both just willingly going out to fight infected and other groups of people. Why is that even a thing in this game? Does Neil Druckmann have some weird fantasies with pregnant women or what? I'm sorry, that's just another thing that really wasn't necessary in this game. Didn't mind it so much with Dina as she actually stayed at the theater eventually. But with Mel it just felt weird all the time.

And I forgot about Owen, I really liked his character as well, seemed like a good guy, just being around bad people. Too bad he got himself killed, he didn't really give Ellie a choice there. Then again, would Ellie have spared Owen and Mel after they would've showed Abby's location? I'm not sure.

 

[MMX]

Good read @Firehuntah. Yes I read all that, and felt the same way about most of the game too. Also funny that you mentioned the double flashback. When it started I laughed and said to the wife, they're actually doing a flashback in a flashback.

I've started another playthrough, to get the most out of it, plus I missed finding some stuff.

Spoiler

Also something that bugged me, is the inconsistent difficulty. I'm not the best at heavy combat and just want to enjoy these types of games, so I always play at the easiest level. There were multiple times where I wasn't sure I was going to get past what were essentially boss battles. Died a bunch but got through them.

 

[McLaren]

Having had more time to rewatch some parts & think on it, I still feel that the story in this game would work a lot better & be more well-received if it was a stand alone game. A lot of the criticisms on the plot & ending would likely be there, but they wouldn't be as strong if this is where we started off on the TLOU's journey. Without the backstory & play through of Part I, we lose any of the connection to its characters making it far easier to sympathize with both characters & enjoy playing both viewpoints rather than spending 10 hours with a lot of possible aversion people seem to have had.

This of course, would take a lot of the emotional punch out of the game since you don't care as deeply about the characters. But given a lot of the feedback so far (not even hateful, just folks who feel obviously underwhelmed & unsatisfied but still like the game), I don't think the risk the developers took telling the story they did necessarily paid off anyway, so the emotional punch it does succeed on giving probably isn't the one it intended; a lot of folks have been left confused & unfulfilled.

I continue to believe it's an achievable story that can deliver the thought-provoking, emotional ending they wanted, but man, it had to be told a very specific way to get there. Part I set the bar very high with how well it sat as a stand alone story. It definitely needed Bruce Straley back or at the very least, a well-established writer (someone of Nolan's stature) that's used to writing out these types of stories.

 

[ROAD_DOGG33J]

Spoiler

Especially after that cliff hanger with Abby pointing the gun at Ellie at the theater. You really want to know what happens next but no, you have to play as Abby for a few hours first. I mean, after going through those parts with Abby I really did like that we got to see the stories on both Ellie's and Abby's side. But I feel like they could've done that a bit later.

....

And I forgot about Owen, I really liked his character as well, seemed like a good guy, just being around bad people. Too bad he got himself killed, he didn't really give Ellie a choice there. Then again, would Ellie have spared Owen and Mel after they would've showed Abby's location? I'm not sure.

Spoiler

Oh it wasn't just a few hours. It was it's own separate game. I somewhat couldn't believe how long it took to get back to that point. In one section, I thought they moved it relatively quickly (maybe day 1 into 2 or before), but then it slowed way back down again.

I also really liked Owen. He turned out to be the most sensible of the characters there, except for that part when he wanted to leave Mel behind and follow Abby with Yara.

Well if you look at the back cover of the game, the game did what it says it will do...relentless pursuit.

A lot of the stuff that happens in the game was also kind of revealed in the trailers.

 

[Firehuntah]

Also funny that you mentioned the double flashback. When it started I laughed and said to the wife, they're actually doing a flashback in a flashback.

Yeah, that actually was quite funny, I laughed at it too. It made sense to do it though, but still felt a bit weird.

I've started another playthrough, to get the most out of it, plus I missed finding some stuff.

Same here. My playtime for the first playthrough was somewhere between 25-30 hours, don't remember right now. Really tried my best to discover everything and find all of the collectibles. But after looking in the menu I realised I still missed so many things. Don't even know how. Think I'll just use some guide for this next playthrough and see if I missed anything story wise meanwhile.

Spoiler

Also something that bugged me, is the inconsistent difficulty. I'm not the best at heavy combat and just want to enjoy these types of games, so I always play at the easiest level. There were multiple times where I wasn't sure I was going to get past what were essentially boss battles. Died a bunch but got through them.

Spoiler

True, there were some areas that were more difficult than others. Especially the fights with Ellie in the theater and the one with that big weird infected creature was quite difficult compared to the rest of the fights. Died many times there. But still, at normal difficulty it was all pretty much doable. Just had to restart a few times sometimes. I guess that's why they're indeed some kind of boss battles, always a bit more difficult.

Having had more time to rewatch some parts & think on it, I still feel that the story in this game would work a lot better & be more well-received if it was a stand alone game. A lot of the criticisms on the plot & ending would likely be there, but they wouldn't be as strong if this is where we started off on the TLOU's journey. Without the backstory & play through of Part I, we lose any of the connection to its characters making it far easier to sympathize with both characters & enjoy playing both viewpoints rather than spending 10 hours with a lot of possible aversion people seem to have had.

This of course, would take a lot of the emotional punch out of the game since you don't care as deeply about the characters. But given a lot of the feedback so far (not even hateful, just folks who feel obviously underwhelmed & unsatisfied but still like the game), I don't think the risk the developers took telling the story they did necessarily paid off anyway, so the emotional punch it does succeed on giving probably isn't the one it intended; a lot of folks have been left confused & unfulfilled.

I continue to believe it's an achievable story that can deliver the thought-provoking, emotional ending they wanted, but man, it had to be told a very specific way to get there. Part I set the bar very high with how well it sat as a stand alone story. It definitely needed Bruce Straley back or at the very least, a well-established writer (someone of Nolan's stature) that's used to writing out these types of stories.

I don't know, I personally didn't mind this as Part 2. Surely it wasn't what most of the people wanted or expected from the game and I can understand all the bad reviews and negative thoughts. But if this is the way the developers wanted to continue the story, so be it. Looking at it that way, it's definitely more enjoyable to play the game and see how the story and characters develop with everything going on. Could they have done a better job with different writers? Sure, maybe. But well.. this is the game we have right now, that's not going to change.

Spoiler

Oh it wasn't just a few hours. It was it's own separate game. I somewhat couldn't believe how long it took to get back to that point. In one section, I thought they moved it relatively quickly (maybe day 1 into 2 or before), but then it slowed way back down again.

Spoiler

Yep, that could've actually been part 3! At first I thought it was just the part with young Abby, showing why she wanted to kill Joel. But then we got that big white text Seattle Day 1 and I got really confused. They really did drag that way too long. While it was nice to see the story from Abby's side I was really happy to finally get to the part where Abby finds out that Owen was killed. But they really should've switched back to Ellie at that point and not stay with Abby.

Also I forgot to mention something in my long post, do you agree?

Spoiler

Tomb Raider no longer has the most brutal death scenes/animations, TLOU Part 2 is king there now! Don't know if that's a good thing or not.. but had to mention it.

 

[McLaren]

I don't know, I personally didn't mind this as Part 2. Surely it wasn't what most of the people wanted or expected from the game and I can understand all the bad reviews and negative thoughts. But if this is the way the developers wanted to continue the story, so be it. Looking at it that way, it's definitely more enjoyable to play the game and see how the story and characters develop with everything going on. Could they have done a better job with different writers? Sure, maybe. But well.. this is the game we have right now, that's not going to change.

Except that's been the main criticism. The story & the character development is flat & flawed with its logic, in terms of continuing the story from the the first game, thus leaving it not enjoyable at all to a huge base of players.

If the reasoning is "this is what they decided to go with & we have to live with it", then the developers have to follow that same mantra when it comes to the harsh backlash the game is receiving.

 

[ROAD_DOGG33J]

IGN Article about some of the decisions made in developing the game

Spoiler

https://www.ign.com/articles/the-last-of-us-part-2-was-once-more-open-world-how-abbys-role-changed

 

[ROAD_DOGG33J]

Wow, some people are sending death threats to a voice actor for a certain character.

 

[Rossell2]

I saw that this morning. Disgraceful behaviour.

 

[F1GTR]

Finished the game last night, it dragged a little at points but overall it was time well spent. The gameplay was solid and quite the adrenaline rush at times. The story was good, one of the most mature and challenging game narratives I've played and it really highlights the strength of video games as a narrative medium in exploring otherness. It's bleak, uncompromisingly brutal, and I think that time will treat this game kindly. There is one unnecessary gameplay decision toward the end but overall I think it's a great game and actually a little better than the first. Top 5 of this gen for me.

 

[SPhilli911]

Wow, some people are sending death threats to a voice actor for a certain character.

I can't wrap my head around that kind of behavior, it's messed up. Naughty Dog has been dealing with quite a lot of BS like that over this game and none of it is justified.

 

[SPhilli911]

There is an interesting theory going around about the game's ending...

Spoiler: Spoiler

Someone noticed some minor details which are super easy to overlook that may hint at a "happier" ending.

Very interesting, and honestly, before reading this theory I thought Ellie was unusually calm during the final scene in the farmhouse, but I chalked it up to her being "numb" to the events that you experienced throughout the game and Ellie dealing with the beginnings of moving on/ closure.

I like to think this is true. A small bit of light at the end of a dark story, but I suppose the player is going to make of it what they want.

 

[MMX]

There is an interesting theory going around about the game's ending...

Spoiler: Spoiler

Someone noticed some minor details which are super easy to overlook that may hint at a "happier" ending.

Very interesting, and honestly, before reading this theory I thought Ellie was unusually calm during the final scene in the farmhouse, but I chalked it up to her being "numb" to the events that you experienced throughout the game and Ellie dealing with the beginnings of moving on/ closure.

I like to think this is true. A small bit of light at the end of a dark story, but I suppose the player is going to make of it what they want.

Not so sure about that myself....

Spoiler

Dina told her before she(Ellie) left that she(Dina) would not be there when she got back. I think this is why she wasn't surprised. I also think she left the guitar, because she couldn't play it anymore, with two fingers missing. When she tried to play, she missed a note or two, because of the missing fingers. No point in keeping it.

I feel like they've set it up for a 3rd part, and it could go a couple different ways.

 

[Firehuntah]

So I'm on my 2nd playthrough now. Tried some things but didn't work unfortunately.

Spoiler

Was at the part where Joel gets killed, right before opening that door. You're actually able to shoot Ellie's pistol and rifle at that part, and you can use listen mode to see Abby and Joel through that door. So I take out the rifle, aim at where Abby's head is in listen mode and pull the trigger. And what do you think?

Ending credits rolled. Was so weird to see. Joel's alive!

Wait no.. that's not what actually happened. The rifle's bullet just hit the door and didn't go through.. It's a wooden door, really?! Couldn't even set it on fire with molotovs either. Even just randomly shooting and making a lot of noise, nothing happens. You only hear Joel scream a few more times and they all still act very surprised when you enter that room.

Really does suck how you can't influence this story one bit. Ah well, just have to accept it for the 2nd time that Joel is no longer there.

 

[FuriousDemon]

Just finished part 1. It was fun and I liked the story until the end.
They should have given the player a choice to make instead of forcing it on you. I guess they were planning on part 2 even back then, otherwise I feel like they could have let you make a choice and the game would have been even better for it. Kind of like the ending of Prey that I thought was excellent.
Overall, game seems a bit overrated to me, but maybe I’m not that impressed since I played on PS4. For a PS3 game it must have been really good.

Let’s see if part 2 is as controversial as they say. Gameplay seems much improved. Graphics too.
I’m not too attached to the characters of the first game, and that seems (?) to be what all the fuss is all about, so I’ll probably like it more than most. See you on the other side.

EDIT: So far 4 hours in and I’m very optimistic. I like it a lot more than part 1 and excited to see and play more. Part 1 took me a long time to get into, not the case here. I guess the extremely negative reviews are mostly coming from either

Spoiler

people who can’t accept that Joel had it coming based on what he did at the end of part 1, people who like to be “edgy” and criticise because it’s cool, or, to put it as nicely as possible, “conservatives”.

It really is pretty amazing what ND managed to accomplish on PS4 hardware. I’m sure most of those stories about overworked devs are true as the game seems very well polished and extremely well optimized.

 

[kilesa4568]

I went into this game spoiler free other the gameplay demo (and the bloody annoying leak that got plastered everywhere!) and while I know about the review bombing, this was easily the most enjoyable survival horror game I've ever played. Turns out a lot of reviewers talk out of their arse.

Great plot with a lot of very likable (and not so likable) characters and an emotional roller coaster ride with all the very realistic violence. No punches pulled and the tension was epic. I was twitching at everything (on my brightness turned up to max but still too dark TV...) and don't mind saying that it scared the bejeezus out of me way more times than I'd want to admit. The 1st game hit a paternal nerve but this game is as raw as it gets and...

Spoiler: end and plot spoiler

getting to know the people and dogs you're slaughtering in inventive ways really reinforces the ending. Hours of killing each other's factions and getting to see their personalities adds a level of guilt I've not experienced in a game and I actually didn't want Ellie and Abby to fight in the end. I was happy with the outcome. Peace at last but it'll probably be the slaver Rattlers looking for revenge in TLOU3. Maybe a seriously OP Ellie and Abby pairing?

After a look under every stone first run (gotta love the exploration) with lots of upgrades, new game+ is already underway and I'm enjoying not using as much stealth this time around...other than setting up a few traps and readying my guns beforehand anyway...

Epic game that'll see as many run through's as the first played to death title.

 

[DesertPenguin]

Any decent NG+ changes or just the simple enemies have more health and deal more damage?

 

[Firehuntah]

Any decent NG+ changes or just the simple enemies have more health and deal more damage?

I honestly haven't really noticed any difference. It's supposed to be a little bit more difficult though. But maybe it's because I know what's coming now that I'm more prepared for it and it's actually easier that way. And having all the upgrades from the first playthrough ofcourse really helps, that makes it much easier and also much more fun to play. So, maybe when doing new game+ it's better to go with a higher difficulty setting to really get a challenge.

 

[kilesa4568]

Any decent NG+ changes or just the simple enemies have more health and deal more damage?

Spoiler: just in case other people don't want to know

You get 5 new options with a slider to set the aggression and passivity of allies and enemies, more or less vigilant, and a last slider to set the resources from scarce to plentiful.

Game+ modes are slightly more difficult than the original modes too as you have upgrades already in place.

 

[FuriousDemon]

Im actually interested in reading the notes left by various people you never meet in this game. This happens rarely for me in games as it’s usually not worth it. In this game, the notes usually tell their own powerful stories and are generally well written, just like the main story. I particularly liked the sequence of notes that talked about Boris and his fate. The only other game in recent times that made me want to do that was 2017 Prey. That ended up being a game that I actually had a desired to replay and is one of my favorite games of the last decade. I can see the same being true here as well.

 

[FuriousDemon]

So I just finished the game. I can honestly say that it was one of the most finely crafted pieces of art I’ve had to experience in recent times that for me was only spoiled, albeit slightly, by

Spoiler

the final fight that happened in the game. It felt a bit too forced and too “gamey” if you will.

I guess the whole epilogue part in general could have been taken out and I would have thought the game delivered a powerful and coherent story. Yet, they chose what they chose. I understand why. It’s different from what I would have preferred, but that’s the point of both parts of this franchise. Both stories are finely crafted works of art that want to tell a specific story and the player just acts as a witness and a force that pushes the narrative forward. The fate is already written long before the final credits roll.

I guess that’s the part that so many players have a problem with. (Some) players wanted their own version of the story and don’t want to accept the one presented to them, even if it makes sense and fits well with the narrative.

One thing’s for sure. I’m jealous of people who have not had a chance to experience this game yet.
For those who finished the game, I suggest watching this amazing video review of both games by a talented reviewer I discovered as I was looking at what others have thought about it.

 

[TypeRDC5]

Bit late to the party but finally finished this game.

Now part 1 was my favourite game on ps3 and possibly even my favourite of all time, I was actually disappointed when I saw there was a part 2 announced as I thought the original was perfect, the story could not have been any better and the ending is perfect.

It says something of how much I like the first game as no other game I thought was perfect and did not need a sequel.

Saying all that I knew it would never be as good as the first game and I was proven correct.

Still an absolute masterpiece and the early massive plot twist was definitely a shocker but I thought needed to be done to create a motive for the second game however I dont think the story or ending was handled correctly and agree with most of the spoiler tags on this thread.

Part 2 is definitely a better game than the first game, the locations, the graphics, the set pieces are all amazing but the story is just not as good as the first game but then again I dont think any game will ever top that...

Another plus note it is perfectly set up for part 3 and still one if the best games of the generation, if the first game didnt exist this wouldve been received so much better than it has been. Still enjoyed my time and unlike the first game I am ready for a sequel.