- 76
- France
- LilFab
You name it , a decade ago . Now you can still get high specific NA output from Porsche or ferrari lol . If you have enough money for a 458 special or 991 GT3 RS .
The next-gen MX-5 Miata thread
- Thread starter homeforsummer
- 2,674 comments
- 180,225 views
You name it , a decade ago . Now you can still get high specific NA output from Porsche or ferrari lol . If you have enough money for a 458 special or 991 GT3 RS .
- 426
- United States
- andrewhake
JUST BUY AN S2000.
- 629
- Ontario, Canada
- B-Line98
No
- 20,681
- TenEightyOne
- TenEightyOne
- 11,308
- Marin County
- 3,417
- NJ
- Rave2Grave
Get rid of the spare and get a can of fix a flat. Problem solved.
Moby45
(Banned)
- 2,881
- Tulsa, Oklahoma
- Moby45
No. People are asking too much for them. As much as I like them I am not going to waste my time trying to argue with a previous owner why his S2k isn't worth 20k. :-P
- 12,389
- Betelgeuse
- Beeblebrox_237
Moby45
(Banned)
- 2,881
- Tulsa, Oklahoma
- Moby45
Agreed, and while on the subject of Porsches. One can even buy a really good used Cayman for as much as some people are asking for their S2k's. In my humble opinion, the Porsche would be the better choice.
- 3,417
- NJ
- Rave2Grave
Cheapest S2K in my area is a year 2000 for $10k with well over 100k miles. I can get a NB or NC with that many miles for half and spend the $5k I saved on a Flyin' Miata turbokit, header-back exhaust and tires.
- 11,308
- Marin County
I've seen some pretty barking prices on S2ks lately. One (an early Ap1, no less) had more than 120k miles and the owner was asking $19k!
CodeRedR51
Premium
- 55,260
- United States
US announcement for those that might have missed it.
https://www.carscoops.com/2018/06/2019-mazda-mx-5-gets-power-new-features-goes-sale-usa-fall/
https://www.carscoops.com/2018/06/2019-mazda-mx-5-gets-power-new-features-goes-sale-usa-fall/
- 27,162
- United Kingdom
Drove one of BBR's turbocharged NDs (with around 250bhp). Nice car, but not sure it's really my thing. Made the car even sketchier in the wet than it is already (NDs lack steering feel which doesn't help) and the delivery was probably a little too linear - it felt more like an MX-5 with a 2.5-litre four-cylinder, than a turbocharged MX-5.Plenty of cash left over for a turbo, then.
Drove one a few hours ago, coincidentally.
Neat enough car, but a long way from perfection. Great engine let down by long gearing (an EP3 Civic R with less power feels quicker to me), to the extent I think a regular ND MX-5 might be quicker over most of its rev range, just as the ND is quicker than the GT86. Nice throttle response though and probably one of the best gearshifts I've used.
The steering didn't impress me at all though - in terms of feel and weighting it's closer to my old Insight than some of the modern stuff. An ND has better steering, albeit not by much, a GT86/BRZ has much better steering, and a Boxster (of any age) has vastly better steering. Given how important good steering feedback and weight is to a sports car, that was pretty disappointing.
For a while I regretted missing out on S2000s before they started getting more expensive, but I'm not so bothered any more. Still pretty gutted about NSXs though...
Danoff
Premium
- 32,987
- Mile High City
Those are still a bargain for the time being. It's not going to stay that way though.
- 11,308
- Marin County
Danoff
Premium
- 32,987
- Mile High City
I think $60k gets you a decent example. And for what I think it's going to do over the next 10 years, it is a bargain. I imagine not too long from now people will long for the days when they could have picked one up for that.
CodeRedR51
Premium
- 55,260
- United States
A lot of high profile Japanese sports cars are skyrocketing in value right now. A 1st generation RX-7 just sold for $20k. A 15k mile stock FD just sold for $40k. So it's definitely going around.
- 12,389
- Betelgeuse
- Beeblebrox_237
I think a lot of cars are going up in value right now. It's hard to know if there's a bubble but I think it's mainly down to the fact that new cars just don't offer the same kind of driving experience as the best driver's cars from the '90s and even '00s. They're not worse, just different, but that's enough to drive prices of other cars up as they get more sought after.
- 48,723
- Australia
So, essentially, the ND is better value. It's a newer, with more power, NA. I'm partial to the 1.5. Simply for less weight. It's fast enough for me.
The 2L will be an instant classic. When it hits the used car market, should still be for less than the aforementioned classics above.
The 2L will be an instant classic. When it hits the used car market, should still be for less than the aforementioned classics above.
- 27,162
- United Kingdom
There was a point in the UK when early, high-miles NSXs were below £15k. The same car today here is probably £35k plus. Realistically £50k for an NA1 and £70k+ for an NA2. I really, really wish I'd had a bit more cash when they were in the low five-figure rather than high five-figure range.
@05XR8 "Instant classic" is probably pushing it a bit for the 2-litre ND. At least over here we're only just starting to see nice NAs rising with the rest of the classic car bubble, and with such a huge choice of NA/NB/NCs to choose from, I imagine NDs will have to go through the same 25-odd year cycle before they reach rock bottom and start heading up in value again.
I can certainly see MX-5s remaining very popular though - you see way more NDs in the UK than you do GT86s. I think the entry-level 1.5 really gets people through the door of Mazda showrooms, as the price is less than most B-segment hot hatchbacks, and with basically no other non-hatchback competition at that price point (the Fiat 124 is a fair bit more) it has the market all to itself.
- 48,723
- Australia
I'm waiting for the reviews with the comment "this is the power it should have had from the start" or "Finally!".
I feel this ND180+(hp) could be seen as an MPS in the same vein as the Mazdaspeed NB. To me, they've made a "special" model thru an update. For this car to get 25/26hp increase, sportier suspension, thats a big deal. I think the 86 got a 5hp(?) increase.
Does this mean Mazda don't have to brand an MPS/Mazdaspeed version? Even though the price is up there compared to other sports cars, it keeps the price down to what could be an even pricier MPS.
- 11,308
- Marin County
It would be pretty awesome if Mazda offered the revised 2 liter in a stripped-down version of the Mazda 3. Aim for 2700lbs with that 181hp & 7500rpm. It would almost be better if it was just the base model rather than a MPS/Mazdaspeed special editon...a compact Q car.
marcvic
Premium
- 881
- USA
- marcvic
Before I chose my '13 FR-S, my search criteria was any sports car under $25K, and less than 75K miles (and manual trans). I drove cars from an ND MX-5 to a base Corvette C6, and lots of stuff in between (including AP1/AP2 S2000).
I also drove the 2nd gen Boxter and 1st gen Cayman, and they were far and away the best driving experiences of the cars that I test drove. Not artificially far and away like some like to say about the slightly quicker times of the current MX-5 vs the BRZ
, but they were seriously brilliant vehicles across the board compared to everything else! I was only turned off by the potential maintenance costs of daily driving that mid-mounted engine.I think the S2K engine, especially that AP1 that revved to 9K, gets downplayed a lot. How many other cars have an engine that does that out of the box? It does take a dedicated effort to rev it out that hard, but that was the most exciting engine of all the test drives. I think the surge in prices is 100% justified, especially considering how few are in the wild.
...
Very interesting about the bump in power though - the current ND is already plenty powerful for what it's supposed to be, I thought. Similar to the 86, racing off the line had best not be top priority
, but the combination of inputs/feedback/handling/power makes it insane fun to drive. The bump in power should make the power junkies happy, although some will still scoff at only 181HP. BTW, I remember hearing a rumor that in 2020(?) the BRZ/86 is also getting a power bump - the power struggle has begun!
- 11,308
- Marin County
Very interesting about the bump in power though - the current ND is already plenty powerful for what it's supposed to be, I thought. Similar to the 86, racing off the line had best not be top priority
For the ZN6 twins, I would honestly prefer a fuel mileage bump (in addition to a weight deduction, a guy can dream).
Those things barely get better mileage than a 6.2L Corvette!(I would love for you to say that the EPA figures are conservative and you actually routinely see 30mpg+ in mixed driving)
I just want a car that drives as well as my Porsche but is super cheap to maintain. How hard could that be?
- 10,828
- Belgium
- bramturismo
For the ZN6 twins, I would honestly prefer a fuel mileage bump (in addition to a weight deduction, a guy can dream).
(I would love for you to say that the EPA figures are conservative and you actually routinely see 30mpg+ in mixed driving)
I just want a car that drives as well as my Porsche but is super cheap to maintain. How hard could that be?
Right now my GT86 is sitting on 7.8L / 100km average across the 30,000km that I've put on it. That's about 36mpg.
Although I think the first owner drove this car harder than I did. When I left the showroom, the car had 15,000km on the clock with an average fuel consumption of 12L / 100km = 24mpg.
Moby45
(Banned)
- 2,881
- Tulsa, Oklahoma
- Moby45
While there are some very good points there I still can't agree with the surge in prices. I ran an S2k for two seasons in autox and had a lot of fun in it(luckily getting to daily it a few times those years). While the redline is amazing and fun to chase after the car is still not worth anything over 12k if it has more than 100k on the clock to me. It just doesn't make sense to pay 20k for a car that is 10+ years old with over 100k on the clock. It is not as special as a lot of honda fanboys claim it to be. That doesn't mean it is not an amazing car. But used car prices are just on the ridiculous side of things.
I am sure though, eventually we will all pay prices like that for older cars. Because aside from a select few, I don't really have any desire to own a brand new car.
- 40,419
It needs some torque delivered in a way that wouldn't have an RX-8 spit its coffee out more than it actually needs more power at the top. Then it would both be faster in most situations (if not overall) and have the fuel economy more consummate with what the drivetrain implies that Eunos_Cosmo mentioned above.
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marcvic
Premium
- 881
- USA
- marcvic
For the ZN6 twins, I would honestly prefer a fuel mileage bump (in addition to a weight deduction, a guy can dream).
(I would love for you to say that the EPA figures are conservative and you actually routinely see 30mpg+ in mixed driving)
Hah - so true about the fuel mileage! I mainly drive city miles, and usually average around 22-23mpg. When I make the 300 mile trip home on the highway, I am getting 33-35mpg.
I'd agree 95% of the time, but the market is consistently flooded with Honda's with 100K+ miles for what I think are somewhat absurd prices compared to similar vehicles in their class. People have a lot of faith in their reliability. My only experience with Honda is with my wife's old '93 Civic LX - we had well over 255K miles before dealing with serious fixes. Granted she did get it from her grandmother with around 120K miles on it.
Well that RX-8 engine is somewhat of an anomaly though isn't it? I agree though, the 86's problem isn't necessarily the overall torque figure, but the well-documented torque dip between 3500-4500. That's something the MX-5 doesn't suffer from, as it is much more linear and packs a punch down low.
.....
I'm surprised that they went for that big of a jump though - an almost 17% increase in power. I wonder if they decided on a power figure first and went to work, or went to work first and arrived at said power figure.
