Time Trial #54

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Locking tuning sounds fair, but in reality it just gives an advantage to the people whose driving style best benefits that type of tune. Level playing fields aren't always level.
 
GTP_CargoRat
See, there you go spewing things out of your mouth which you have no idea of what you are talking about. It has nothing to do at all with jealously protecting one's times. I told you before, if you haven't got the talent, no amount of tuning is going to help you. There is no magical tune out there that is going to turn you into an instant superstar. Sure, it may help you shave a couple tenths off your time, but thats about it. No amount of tuning is going to change your talent level. I know this to be fact because I have used tunes before from people like Amo and the rest of the top drivers and their tunes were only good for a few tenths at best. That is why I took to tuning my own cars because I know what it is that I want from a car and what I want it to do.

Furthermore, anyone that has been a regular on these TT threads knows that I have no problem sharing my tunes or helping in any way I can. If you go back and look at past TT threads that I have participated in, you will see that I have no problem publishing my tunes. And if you should happen to beat me using my own tune, then good for you, I'm glad I could help. Its happened before where I've shared my tune and someone who is equal to me talent wise has beaten me with my own tune. I didn't lose any sleep over it and was simply happy I could help them achieve their goals. People here that know me know that the ultimate victory for me is helping someone achieve their goals. And for you to come on here and even incinuate that I will not share my tunes just for the sake of protecting my times is pure idiocy. That is what really pisses me off about you. For two weeks you call me out in two different threads, and here you are at it again incinuating that I won't share my tune because I'm afraid you'll inprove your time over mine. BS. You even called out one of my friends saying that he unfriended you because he was scared to be beaten by you. Again, BS. Dalone, who do you think you are that everyone is scared of you or worried about you beating them. Your behavior is really getting tiresome my friend. You are no one special here I am certainly not worried about you beating me. I think I have proved that. Now, just to further prove to you that you are wrong about me and your little incinuations, here is my tune. If it doesn't help you in the way that you hope, don't blame me, blame your talent level.:sly:

Vette Z06 '06

Aero 0/20
Ballast 164/12
Power Limiter 94%
LSD 10/14/12
RH 5/30
SR 13.0/12.5
Ext. 3/7
Comp. 2/6
ARB 3/5
Camber 2.0/0.5
Toe 0.10/-0.10
Brake Balance 1/5
Transmission
1st 5.969
2nd 4.170
3rd 3.224
4th 2.666
5th 2.249
6th 1.938
FG 2.000
TS 180
Set FG Set TS Gear ratios

Parts added.
Weight Red. 3 * Window Weight Red. * Carbon Hood * Chassis Reinforcement * ECU * Engine Stage 3 * Sports Intake Man. * Racing Air Filter * Sports Exhaust Man. * Cat. Conv. Sports * Titanium Racing Exhaust * All other upgrades.
655HP * 1342kg * Weight Partition 49/51

There you go. If it doesn't turn you into some super human top 10 driver, don't come crying to me.:lol: This works very well for me and my driving style. If it does help you or any others who may try it, then more power to you, glad I could help.

Dalone: I hope this puts an end to you calling me out in whatever way you can possibly find. After listening to you spew your nonsense for the last few weeks about me, I think I have went above and beyond my duties here as it concerns you. After all your crap I could have just as easily said FU, unfriended you and moved on...but I didn't so I hope that shows you what kind of person I am.

One last thing here. This is probably my last time here for awhile as I have to go in tomorrow for yet another back operation so I will be out of commision for awhile. I hope to be back tho sooner than later. Don't want to stretch this out any longer than I already have, so I will just say I will miss competing in the TT's and will miss all who I have competed against. Hopefully I will be back stronger than ever. Peace and god bless everyone. Hope to be back soon.

Mitch "CargoRatt"
NGU
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Thanks for posting that for others to try. I had a tune and I'm getting the right weight but I'm having to power limit more to get pp down to 580, is this cause I did a oil change when I bough the car new?
 
JBF1MSC
Thanks for posting that for others to try. I had a tune and I'm getting the right weight but I'm having to power limit more to get pp down to 580, is this cause I did a oil change when I bough the car new?
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I think Mitch is away for a bit, so on his behalf... yes, most probably 👍
 
Stotty
Edit... BTW, forgot to say, without tuning, the really fast guys will be even further ahead.
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it's not about winning, it's about learning.
You want to have the setup to go with replay, or a replay to go with the setup.
So, that being said, could you be so kind as to get on the first page:P
 
Stotty
Nice rant :lol:

If you're currently at 1'18.2 there's no miracle set up that is gonna gain you 1.6 seconds, so I wouildn't get worked up about Amo's tune - I've had access to his tunes in previous TT's and I have no idea how he get's them round so quickly... he just has a talent beyond most poeple to control weight transfers through the wheel, gas and brake pedal.

If you look at how he takes the 1st corner, he's using GT5's 'brake release oversteer' trait to precisely point the car at the corner... that's how he manages to carry so much entry speed. I can set a car up to do that with ballast, toe and brake settings, but to be able to control it that precisely isn't the tune, it's his skill.

In any case, you don't need to be at 103mph in turn 1 to set a fast 1st sector. I can stay within 0.1xx of him on a good lap at T1, and I'm dropping to 100mph in turn 1... but then I'm not getting as much oversteer on the exit and so I pull some ground back on him before the 2nd corner.

Here's what I'm using... 1'17.6 (24th), but I reckon this will run very low 17's once I figure the middle sector out.

Corvette Z06 (C6) '06 (that's a lot of 6's :lol:)
New car, no oil change, change rims

Parts
All weight reductions (no chassis strengthening), all power upgrades excl. supercharger, all other non-power altering mods, rear wing

Ballast 200kg @ postition 50
Wing 20
Power limiter 94.6%
Makes 659bhp @ 1,378kg for 580ppts

Settings
Ride 5 20
Spring 12.8 8.8
Rebound 5 4
Bound 4 3
ARB 2 6
Camber 1.6 0.8
Toe +0.20 +0.15

LSD 5 13 5

Brakes 4 4 (set as you feel comfortable with)

Gears (set max speed to minimum, then set individual gears)
1st 4.110
2nd 2.981
3rd 2.459
4th 2.060
5th 1.749
6th 1.483
Final 2.583

Good luck 👍

Edit... BTW, forgot to say, without tuning, the really fast guys will be even further ahead.
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Thanks for the setup info :) I may give this a try tomorrow, I am familiar with advanced trail braking techniques but I couldn't get my car setup so that it would do that into the fast corners :crazy:

Adrenaline
Locking tuning sounds fair, but in reality it just gives an advantage to the people whose driving style best benefits that type of tune. Level playing fields aren't always level.
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To a certain extent but the best drivers will be able to adapt their driving style to the car they are driving and if we all had the same setup at least you know that your driving is the only thing you need to work on and you don't have to worry about having the 'best setup' :)
 
Haha stotty has posted a setup :-) looks like I have a reason to go on GT5 at 5am again :-) will post my new time before 6am! Well I hope
 
Stotty
I think Mitch is away for a bit, so on his behalf... yes, most probably 👍
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Cheers.

Other thing is I can't change the gear ratios to what they should be. Which do you set first? Some are out of range.

Edit: Rims!
 
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Dhalism
it's not about winning, it's about learning.
You want to have the setup to go with replay, or a replay to go with the setup.
So, that being said, could you be so kind as to get on the first page:P
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We just had the perfect event then... the C7 Seasonal at the Nurb... everyone should ahve learned lots there 👍

McLarensFinest
Haha stotty has posted a setup :-) looks like I have a reason to go on GT5 at 5am again :-) will post my new time before 6am! Well I hope
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:lol:

Don't get excited... there's only so much you do with it... it's still pretty evil on camber changes... still got an idea to try yet 👍

JBF1MSC
Cheers.

Other thing is I can't change the gear ratios to what they should be. Which do you set first? Some are out of range.
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There should be a guide to how to set the gears in his post... make sure you reset the gearbox 1st.
 
Stotty
Edit... BTW, forgot to say, without tuning, the really fast guys will be even further ahead.
Click to expand...
In my frustration i thought i'd give your setup a try.
It's probably the first time i have ever driven another persons tune and had a pleasing drive. Got withit straight away. I really like the first turn and i've had less trouble in sector 2.
Started carefull with a 1:19.7ish gradually built up speed, got a 1:18.606 best before overcooking the downhill part in sector 2. But i feel that i dont want to beat my time with it, i want to get there by myself.
It feels lighter than mine and turns in better, everything else prety much perfoms the same. Yet to look at the settings there are vast differences. I'm going to get another car with my tune and work toward your settings to find the difference in feel. This will be great for the learning curve.

Well done. Its fantastic, eventhough i did not get to find what i can push it to. (might try it offline)

👍👍👍
 
Stotty
Nice rant :lol:

If you're currently at 1'18.2 there's no miracle set up that is gonna gain you 1.6 seconds, so I wouildn't get worked up about Amo's tune - I've had access to his tunes in previous TT's and I have no idea how he get's them round so quickly... he just has a talent beyond most poeple to control weight transfers through the wheel, gas and brake pedal.

If you look at how he takes the 1st corner, he's using GT5's 'brake release oversteer' trait to precisely point the car at the corner... that's how he manages to carry so much entry speed. I can set a car up to do that with ballast, toe and brake settings, but to be able to control it that precisely isn't the tune, it's his skill.

In any case, you don't need to be at 103mph in turn 1 to set a fast 1st sector. I can stay within 0.1xx of him on a good lap at T1, and I'm dropping to 100mph in turn 1... but then I'm not getting as much oversteer on the exit and so I pull some ground back on him before the 2nd corner.

Here's what I'm using... 1'17.6 (24th), but I reckon this will run very low 17's once I figure the middle sector out.

Corvette Z06 (C6) '06 (that's a lot of 6's :lol:)
New car, no oil change, change rims

Parts
All weight reductions (no chassis strengthening), all power upgrades excl. supercharger, all other non-power altering mods, rear wing

Ballast 200kg @ postition 50
Wing 20
Power limiter 94.6%
Makes 659bhp @ 1,378kg for 580ppts

Settings
Ride 5 20
Spring 12.8 8.8
Rebound 5 4
Bound 4 3
ARB 2 6
Camber 1.6 0.8
Toe +0.20 +0.15

LSD 5 13 5

Brakes 4 4 (set as you feel comfortable with)

Gears (set max speed to minimum, then set individual gears)
1st 4.110
2nd 2.981
3rd 2.459
4th 2.060
5th 1.749
6th 1.483
Final 2.583

Good luck 👍

Edit... BTW, forgot to say, without tuning, the really fast guys will be even further ahead.
Click to expand...

Wow. Instantly just matched my best time on the first lap then went .2 better on the second. Full of mistakes by myself as I get used to the car but its fast and controllable. Thanks

Although it may be coz I bought a red car. Red cars go faster. Heh. Still only a 1:19.104. I will be happy with a sub 19 time.
 
Edit... BTW, forgot to say, without tuning, the really fast guys will be even further ahead.
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Thanks for the tune! I've heard this said before that the really good drivers don't need to tune. Is that really accurate? Can you buy a Z06 out of the dealership and drive a 1:17? I am highly doubtful.
 
Thanks for the tunes Stotty.
Heres my Lancia delta s4 tune:
8427772853_fbbb8c5feb_b.jpg

letting off the accelerator and turning induces over steer which can be controled by stabbing the brake and applying a little throttle. Use 100% throttle to come out of corners and work through the gears (is what i have been doing). You need to keep the throttle at about 80% when braking on the fast straights and select the appropriate gear for the speed you're going as you decelerate.
The gear box is set to the minimum speed - 180kph (110mph?)
 
@tmsmiffs what he meant by the comment that, "really fast drivers would be farther ahead", is that if no tuning was allowed for anyone then the top drivers would have an even larger gap between their times and the rest of us. The top drivers are generally better at adapting to the handling characteristics of cars so can typically push them harder more consistently than most.
Tuning becomes a bigger benefit for the less skilled driver so works to help narrow the gap a bit.
 
Dhalism
i do wonder what happened to turismo-lester he was quite, well, fast
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He hasn't been online on PSN much for the past several months. I guess he's just really busy.

Thanks for the tune Stotty. I will try it in a bit. The setup I was using for the Z06 had too much oversteer. I'll check out whats good with this one.
 
wee cracked top 256 for teh first time ever thanks to Stotty's tune and a ghost from Raptors_Lucas, who drives exactly like me, but faster.
 
I've managed to crack into the 1:18's.. just.. heh.. currently sitting 191st.. could probably get mid 1:18's.. but i'd say that would be the limit of my ability..
 
Great tune Stotty :sly: Just had a quick shakedown before I set off to college and instantly got a 21 .804 first sector :) Will have a go at setting a time later :)
 
Stotty
If you look at how he takes the 1st corner, he's using GT5's 'brake release oversteer' trait to precisely point the car at the corner... that's how he manages to carry so much entry speed. I can set a car up to do that with ballast, toe and brake settings, but to be able to control it that precisely isn't the tune, it's his skill.
Click to expand...

So this got me going on the search engines.
My instinctive take on this is that it's all about weight shifting to the front at the right moment to get the steering to bite that little bit more. Again, instinctively, I'd say that releasing the throttle or applying the brakes would do this unless I had a very rear-bias brake setup, in which case releasing the brakes might tip the car forward a bit. (Am I on the right page here teacher? :dunce: I really want to get this 👍)
I found this thread called "can GT5 physics do lift off oversteer or brake oversteer?" which also argues a lot about the wording of certain posts in there.
I think lift-off oversteer (throttle release oversteer) is what we all experienced and had to learn to deal with in the Tuscany Murcielago and the Top Gear Lotus special events. I get this instinctively.
I think brake oversteer would be applying the brakes a bit more at a crucial point to swing the car around more, but would probably be as much a function of the correct bias as the amount of brake applied. I get this too and use it regularly.
Now brake release oversteer just makes my head spin, rather than the car :) If I had seriously rear-biased brakes and was braking, the nose might come up a bit (can't really see this happening by the way, just being imaginative, I still think the nose would go down, just less :)). If I then released the brake the nose would come back down and the steering would gain some traction...Am I there? Is Amo there? Arrgh headspin headspin!

Another thing is the car just came flying over a hill, so the weight is already shifted/-ing towards the front 'as we brake'...@@@@:banghead:

Corvette Z06 (C6) '06 (that's a lot of 6's )
Click to expand...

Just enough to make this a truly Demonic TT :sly:

Power limiter 94.6%
Makes 659bhp @ 1,378kg for 580ppts
Click to expand...

Hmmm... I got 652 bhp @ 1378 kg @ 89.1% for 580 pp, otherwise identical to yours but with skirts, driven 115 km and just did an oil change apparently....think I'll buy me a new one. Was yours 'driven in', if so how many kms? Finally, did you only buy the rear wing and not the front or rear skirts? Thanks.

Edit: I got the same as you with a brand new 0/0/0 car. Thanks.

Sorry about the double post.
 
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Stotty
Nice rant :lol:

Here's what I'm using... 1'17.6 (24th), but I reckon this will run very low 17's once I figure the middle sector out.

Corvette Z06 (C6) '06 (that's a lot of 6's :lol:)
New car, no oil change, change rims

Parts
All weight reductions (no chassis strengthening), all power upgrades excl. supercharger, all other non-power altering mods, rear wing

Ballast 200kg @ postition 50
Wing 20
Power limiter 94.6%
Makes 659bhp @ 1,378kg for 580ppts

Settings
Ride 5 20
Spring 12.8 8.8
Rebound 5 4
Bound 4 3
ARB 2 6
Camber 1.6 0.8
Toe +0.20 +0.15

LSD 5 13 5

Brakes 4 4 (set as you feel comfortable with)

Gears (set max speed to minimum, then set individual gears)
1st 4.110
2nd 2.981
3rd 2.459
4th 2.060
5th 1.749
6th 1.483
Final 2.583

Good luck 👍

Edit... BTW, forgot to say, without tuning, the really fast guys will be even further ahead.
Click to expand...

Man, your tunes rock!! 👍

My best was 1:20.324, tried your tune, did 4 laps... 1:19.2xx!! AWESOME!!

Thanks again mate for sharing your excelent tunes!! Will try sub 19...:nervous:
 
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Thanks for the thanks for the tune 👍

tmsmiffs
I've heard this said before that the really good drivers don't need to tune. Is that really accurate? Can you buy a Z06 out of the dealership and drive a 1:17? I am highly doubtful.
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I doubt you could run a 17 without any tuning... you would at least need to add all the parts to get to 580ppts, and adding ballast at the rear is critical to get the car to turn in... and you'd probably need to set the gears too.

SirAlanClive
Now brake release oversteer just makes my head spin, rather than the car :) If I had seriously rear-biased brakes and was braking, the nose might come up a bit (can't really see this happening by the way, just being imaginative, I still think the nose would go down, just less :)). If I then released the brake the nose would come back down and the steering would gain some traction...Am I there? Is Amo there? Arrgh headspin headspin!
Click to expand...

I'd be able to explain this so much easier in person... and I'm assuming you have a basic understanding of weight transfer and it's effect on tyre grip etc.

What is brake release oversteer? It's when you trail brake in to a corner, and the car oversteers when you release the brake pedal whilst still turning.

It indicates that releasing the brakes is causing a weight shift forwards - unloading weight from the rear and causing the rear to swing, much like lift off oversteer in a mid-engined car.

It's not something I've ever experienced in a real car, either on the road or on a circuit and IMO, this is a function of how PD have modelled ABS and it's effects on weight transfer.

When using ABS, it's almost as though you can have any 'sensible' brake balance (sensible by GT5 standards - ie; 2 or 3 higher on the rear) and still get roughly the same level of retardation. As a result, people run higher rear bias on FR cars as it allows better trail braking (ie; you can turn more whilst still slowing more effectively). I believe the game interprets this bias setting and transfers less weight forwards when you brake... so when you do release the brake more weight transfers forward, unloading the rear to some extent and causing oversteer.

Of course this is totally unrealistic, but provides the very skilled with another option to help turn the car in to the corner.

SirAlanClive
Hmmm... I got 652 bhp @ 1378 kg @ 89.1% for 580 pp, otherwise identical to yours but driven 115 km and just did an oil change apparently....think I'll buy me a new one. Was yours 'driven in', if so how many kms? Finally, did you only buy the rear wing and not the front or rear skirts? Thanks.
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You'll see at the top of my post - 'New car, no oil change, change rims'.

I did fit the other aero parts, but they are cosmetic only.
 
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Stotty
I'd be able to explain this so much easier in person... and I'm assuming you have a basic understanding of weight transfer and it's effect on tyre grip etc.
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I'll be staying four days (Thursday 14 th - 19 th Feb) at the top of Hyde Park on the Bayswater Road with the wife (in a hotel). I'd travel across the city to buy you a pint for some words ;). Lived in London at the beginning of the '80's up in West Kilburn and worked in Swiss Cottage so I'm pretty good at getting around.

It's not something I've ever experienced in a real car, either on the road or on a circuit and IMO, this is a function of how PD have modelled ABS and it's effects on weight transfer.
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That explains the headspin 👍
 
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SirAlanClive
We've all been there mate. Good luck ;-)
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She said she wants a night with me tonight no ps3 noooooo just hope she falls asleep early lol also was on for a 1.17.8xx but got scared in the last turn and out braked myself :-(
 
McLarensFinest
She said she wants a night with me tonight no ps3 noooooo just hope she falls asleep early lol also was on for a 1.17.8xx but got scared in the last turn and out breaker myself :-(
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Come on lad, I mean 'better than sex' is just a turn of phrase. :lol: You drive much better afterwards!
 
SirAlanClive
I'll be staying four days (Thursday 14 th - 19 th Feb) at the top of Hyde Park on the Bayswater Road with the wife (in a hotel). I'd travel across the city to buy you a pint for some words ;). Lived in London at the beginning of the '80's up in West Kilburn and worked in Swiss Cottage so I'm pretty good at getting around.
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Would be great to meet up, but I'm off to Geneva that weekend - then on to Argentiere, snowborading with a friend who lives over there :D
 
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