TVR Griffith : 200mph,1200 kg and 0–60mph in less then 4 secs
- Thread starter RocZX
- 255 comments
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- 12,389
- Betelgeuse
- Beeblebrox_237
- 314
- United States
OH please be real. TVR is one of my favorite manufacturers of all-time. And please, pleeaaassee sell some cars in North America. I've waited for so long to see the return, I just hope it isn't handled the same way as Lancia's return
- 290
- Cascavel, Paraná
- dragonsuniverse7
Just saw that TVR is probaly returning in 2015, with two-car lineup:
"TVR has come back from the dead after being on ice since 2006 when the company's then-owner, Russian billionaire Nikolai Smolensky, couldn't find a buyer for this characterful British carmaker. Smolensky had resisted bidders for a long time, but a group of investors led by Les Edgar recently made him a worthwhile offer for an undisclosed sum, and he's now reportedly a supporter of the brand's return. Edgar is part of a three-man executive board that will pilot the TVR brand back into the marketplace by 2015, starting with a lineup of two new cars that he recently talked about with Autocar.
The new models will stick to TVR tradition by retaining a front-engine, rear-wheel-drive layout. Edgar described the first new model to Autocar as "a secondhand Aston," also noting that the new company will build cars that are as mechanically simple and free of electronic nannies as possible, keeping them in character with what TVR was building when it went under. That means cars that Edgar likes to call "supercars for the common man," with pricing that ranges from £50k to £80k. Edgar says the question of whether TVR will continue its tradition of developing and building its own engines is undecided, but doesn't think sourcing an engine from another manufacturer would compromise the cars' character. As for what the new models might be called, the new owner says he and his team may use existing names from the TVR fold, but they would still like to build all-new cars rather than merely update the old ones.
When Edgar and his team bought TVR, they received the company's name, design rights and assets, the latter of which includes Blackpool Engineering, a company set up by Smolensky that, among other things, contains a store of jigs, molds and spare parts for existing models. Edgar hopes to sell those parts and the company's service expertise to owners of existing TVR models. Once the business of selling cars, parts and service is up and running, he says breaking even could be a minimum of three years away, and if that all goes well, a return to Le Mans racing could be possible, as well."
I saw this on Autoblog.
What do you guys think about it?
"TVR has come back from the dead after being on ice since 2006 when the company's then-owner, Russian billionaire Nikolai Smolensky, couldn't find a buyer for this characterful British carmaker. Smolensky had resisted bidders for a long time, but a group of investors led by Les Edgar recently made him a worthwhile offer for an undisclosed sum, and he's now reportedly a supporter of the brand's return. Edgar is part of a three-man executive board that will pilot the TVR brand back into the marketplace by 2015, starting with a lineup of two new cars that he recently talked about with Autocar.
The new models will stick to TVR tradition by retaining a front-engine, rear-wheel-drive layout. Edgar described the first new model to Autocar as "a secondhand Aston," also noting that the new company will build cars that are as mechanically simple and free of electronic nannies as possible, keeping them in character with what TVR was building when it went under. That means cars that Edgar likes to call "supercars for the common man," with pricing that ranges from £50k to £80k. Edgar says the question of whether TVR will continue its tradition of developing and building its own engines is undecided, but doesn't think sourcing an engine from another manufacturer would compromise the cars' character. As for what the new models might be called, the new owner says he and his team may use existing names from the TVR fold, but they would still like to build all-new cars rather than merely update the old ones.
When Edgar and his team bought TVR, they received the company's name, design rights and assets, the latter of which includes Blackpool Engineering, a company set up by Smolensky that, among other things, contains a store of jigs, molds and spare parts for existing models. Edgar hopes to sell those parts and the company's service expertise to owners of existing TVR models. Once the business of selling cars, parts and service is up and running, he says breaking even could be a minimum of three years away, and if that all goes well, a return to Le Mans racing could be possible, as well."
I saw this on Autoblog.
What do you guys think about it?
- 12,389
- Betelgeuse
- Beeblebrox_237
- 8,698
It all looks like investment posturing.
They're wasting time and money stringing out "plans" that nobody is ever really going to be interested in from an investment point of view. It's too niche, too long in the tooth already and too risky.
They need a rich mad-man - I mean passionate fan - to just throw caution to the wind and make something. Public reaction to a fully working prototype or two should be enough to guess whether it would be worth going further.
I think the reality is that people don't really want to deal with TVR style foibles these days, and that makes turning the prototypes into a suitable road car very difficult.
I wonder if a collaboration between smaller producers towards a new / modified rolling chassis can be exploited by producing different engined and bodied variants under the different names of the collaborators, all using the common basis.
They're wasting time and money stringing out "plans" that nobody is ever really going to be interested in from an investment point of view. It's too niche, too long in the tooth already and too risky.
They need a rich mad-man - I mean passionate fan - to just throw caution to the wind and make something. Public reaction to a fully working prototype or two should be enough to guess whether it would be worth going further.
I think the reality is that people don't really want to deal with TVR style foibles these days, and that makes turning the prototypes into a suitable road car very difficult.
I wonder if a collaboration between smaller producers towards a new / modified rolling chassis can be exploited by producing different engined and bodied variants under the different names of the collaborators, all using the common basis.
- 8,698
I agree in principle, but those electronics packages don't tune themselves. Where would the expertise come from? Presumably that's not stored in a warehouse somewhere. They're not very TVR, either, for whatever that's worth.
It's reliability, servicing and bits generally
falling off that are the biggest problems with the existing cars - they'd need engineering attention from that point of view, too.
They had so much attention to detail in the design and driving experience, especially in the Wheeler era, but not the R&D time to weed out reliability and quality issues. And that was more or less understandable.
There's always little bits about the cars that make you smile (and wonder what they were drinking up in Blackpool), but then the chassis rots away, the gearbox grenades and the engine pisses oil everywhere, and when you see what is involved in putting it all right, that upside down frown is left firmly the "right" way round.
I don't think TVR can come back without those issues and still be so characterful (not classing faults as "character").
- 9,401
- Western Sydney
- mustafur
The Handling isn't what im talking about its the Build side.
TVR keeping the driving experince the same would be a good thing though as it would stand out from the rest of the markets current clynical approach to dynamics.
- 8,698
The problem with reliability is that it's hard won. You don't take risks, you don't change things. You surely don't strive for character first.
What I'm saying is, are cars "too good" for a small manufacturer to live up to, whilst creating something genuinely interesting?
I think it's a difficult balance to strike, especially with such a long break in production (unlike, say, Morgan).
I'd love for TVR to come back, I just don't know that we can realistically expect a total lack of cynicism.
- 27,385
- Toronto
- NewAesthetic
- SlipZtrEm
As much as many of us love the concept behind Wheeler's TVR's, I can't imagine it's an easy business case to sell to investors. Especially if they're talking about developing their own engine again: show me a company that's selling reasonably priced, boutique-style sports cars that does that any more. It's an incredibly expensive option, especially if they want to sell it in various markets.
It's not like they must stick to an e-nanny-free approach, either: recent AMG's and the F-Type are plenty capable of hooliganism.
It's not like they must stick to an e-nanny-free approach, either: recent AMG's and the F-Type are plenty capable of hooliganism.
- 320
- East Coast
- Connissuer
I want to see a TVR under 40k and a modern day Speed 12.
- 11,323
- Marin County
TVR's were arguably best (though not my favorite) when they didn't build their own engines. Its simply too much of a development burden on a small company. The best you can hope is that they pick interesting engines from mainstream car makers.
- 40,420
- 5,303
- Riverside, Ca
- GTP_Leonidae_MFT
And still they are very beautiful and south-after cars. I like a few models myself! 👍
- 13,153
- GTPlanet
- Street-King-07
- Quattro Saltire
I wouldn't be at all surprised if the engine in a supposed all new TVR turned out to be some variant of the old LS dinosaur.
- 8,698
I think the "ur" SBC is a bit long in the tooth these days. Its replacements are just as complicated, control wise, as any other engine available. Maybe they're cheaper, I don't know, but there's a bit of cost in the very newest engines.
A pushrod lump would be nice for packaging, but there was never a real lack of space in recent TVRs. The AJPV8 was a single cam design, and at 70 degrees it was a bit taller than the Olds / Rover V8. But at 70 degrees, it probably wasn't much wider, either. The Speed Six was tall and long, but canted over so it was also wide.
Because TVRs haven't had cross plane V8s since the Griffith / Chimaera duo, I don't even think it's a necessary component. Any longitudinal 60 degree V6 packages kicking about?
What about a return to four pots? Going by the Cerbera, they should be able to make it sound nice.
A pushrod lump would be nice for packaging, but there was never a real lack of space in recent TVRs. The AJPV8 was a single cam design, and at 70 degrees it was a bit taller than the Olds / Rover V8. But at 70 degrees, it probably wasn't much wider, either. The Speed Six was tall and long, but canted over so it was also wide.
Because TVRs haven't had cross plane V8s since the Griffith / Chimaera duo, I don't even think it's a necessary component. Any longitudinal 60 degree V6 packages kicking about?
What about a return to four pots? Going by the Cerbera, they should be able to make it sound nice.
- 11,323
- Marin County
I think the "ur" SBC is a bit long in the tooth these days. Its replacements are just as complicated, control wise, as any other engine available. Maybe they're cheaper, I don't know, but there's a bit of cost in the very newest engines.
A pushrod lump would be nice for packaging, but there was never a real lack of space in recent TVRs. The AJPV8 was a single cam design, and at 70 degrees it was a bit taller than the Olds / Rover V8. But at 70 degrees, it probably wasn't much wider, either. The Speed Six was tall and long, but canted over so it was also wide.
Because TVRs haven't had cross plane V8s since the Griffith / Chimaera duo, I don't even think it's a necessary component. Any longitudinal 60 degree V6 packages kicking about?
What about a return to four pots? Going by the Cerbera, they should be able to make it sound nice.
The Ford 3.7 V6 seems to be a popular engine for the remaining British auto industry. Ginetta, Radical, and I think even Morgan all use it. 305hp and cheap. Sounds good too.
- 8,698
That induction sound is very intoxicating, not too dissimilar to the old Speed Sixes, weirdly. For some reason I'd assumed it was 90 degree, but the 60 degree angle means it should easily fit into anything TVR was making when it shut down. Some people have been squeezing LS-whatevers into Tuscans, mind you...
Still, it's maybe a little underpowered; the SP6 was capable of 350 bhp in 3.6 litre form, all the way up to 380+ in 4 litre guise. The Cyclone is meant to be capable of going to 4 litres, but I doubt they'd do it just for a TVR resurrection, and it'd still need tweaking to match the grunt of the old engines.
Other'n that, good candidate!
- 4,019
- Riga
