VGTA Handicap Championship. Mondays, 8:00pm GMT, from 10th Jan 2022.PS4 

  • Thread starter Zolon32
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Hun200kmh
@Zolon32 It is with a heavy heart that I inform you of my impossibility to race today. I wish you and all the competitors a fun couple of races at Fuji, will hopefully meet you guys again in a week.
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Mario, NOOOOOOOOOOO! I'll bet you've been there for days too, getting over the jetlag.

I hope you're able to make the trip to your back yard fella. Thank goodness I put in the bit about "No one has to step up and drive the Nissan" in case of an absence. I think it might have been me.
 
Results from Fuji:

Race 1:
Race 1.jpg


Race 2:
Race 2.jpg


Standings:
Monday Individual.jpg
 
All in all a good race but I'm embarrassed with my performance.

Race one @Zolon32 took the lead and after a rough exit on turn 3? (left in kink) I squeezed by in turn 5 ?(long right) only to mess up the breaking in turn 7 (second hairpin) . Which started a long lasting trend for race two.

Having started 10 and passed my way up field I was watching some epic battles between @richroo and @Saltyjoe90 I went for the early pitstop, messed up the breaking on entry into pitlane gifting myself a few points of aero damage and a 37 second gap to @IfAndOr.

I then had @jammy21 and Reg around me. Breaking mistakes had taken a small pause but then my screen turned black for a few seconds - and my racing seat turned brown while my face turned red. By a magical touch it happened in turn 4 (long right) where the run off area will fit a 747 emergency landing so I suffered only cardio and odour damage but set up to catch @jammy21 and reg. Soon the efforts paid off and I was nearing striking distance. Reg had a poor exit from turn 5 so I closed in to turn 7 moved into free air hit the brakes and saw the sky behind me turning white in a wall of tire smoke. In a panic attempt to avoid Reg and @jammy21 I pulled right knowing that the corner was overshot and all other directions had a 100% likelihood of a ramming not seen since the first days of GT online racing. Reg and @jammy21 both avoided me and I didn't know @beachboy6658 was anywhere near us so as I struggled to get into turn 8? (The second of the consecutive hair pins) beach and I touched, again mild aero damage but enough that the race was sealed.

Apologies to @beachboy6658 and thanks for the battle to @Zolon32 on race 1, and Reg and @jammy21 in race 2.

I tried twitch for streaming the race
 
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30second penalty??? Track limits trying to steer in-between cars that had collided with each other quite successfully but got clipped ( accidentally) by someone rebounding back onto track, I had so many seconds to return to position 11 and as I moved off racing line to go back to 11th., (may have gone off track in doing so) the dreaded 30sec' penalty for exceeding track limits came on screen. Baffled I am indeed.!!!!!
 
Oldbass47
30second penalty??? Track limits trying to steer in-between cars that had collided with each other quite successfully but got clipped ( accidentally) by someone rebounding back onto track, I had so many seconds to return to position 11 and as I moved off racing line to go back to 11th., (may have gone off track in doing so) the dreaded 30sec' penalty for exceeding track limits came on screen. Baffled I am indeed.!!!!!
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Agree, the penalty system is ....curious. I've gone as far as to remove the penalty notification text off my HUD, so I don't even know or see when it wants me to slow down or give back places. I did it mostly for when I practice, because to constantly get told your time won't count for the last lap, the current lap or any lap you ever attempt while alive and playing PC2 (or so it feels sometimes) got too annoying; the elapsed time goes red, so I know anyway when I've exceeded limits.

As others have found out, slowing down or giving back places does not automatically mean you won't still get the penalty; and often you just get in someone's way who didn't know you were slowing down.
 
This was 1st track that I felt Nissan was a bit slower than porsches as there was too many porsches on race ;) If you got pass one then there was an other head of you.
All I could do was trying to take splitstream as much as I could as Nissan didn't have chance to pass on Fuji's main streight.
Anyway good racing, clean ones both races.

Actually it was me you hit on turn 8 on lap 21 not @beachboy6658 and I got front aero damage rest of the race. Maybe that's why I lost 3rd spot on finish line to Raeggee by 0,001s :crazy:
xeronima
Reg and @jammy21 both avoided me and I didn't know @beachboy6658 was anywhere near us so as I struggled to get into turn 8? (The second of the consecutive hair pins) beach and I touched, again mild aero damage but enough that the race was sealed.
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No, you're good! You beat me on quali. On races I got some splitstream to help so don't worry you're there too...
Napalm_LT
Amazing skills @jammy21. Seeing your lap times I am a bit depresed. All my imaginations I am quite good at racing gone like smoke of cigarete in the wind :)
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Another mysterie from PC2 - on the Xero replay I noticed he hit the wall while piting and got 2% of damage, set damage repier to "aero" and his pit stop lasted 4,9 s. I had 0 damage, pit stop was set to everything off, I didn't exceed speed on pit entry, but my pit stop lasted more than 5 s. How it is possible?
 
half_sourly
Agree, the penalty system is ....curious.
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Yes it has always been a little annoying and contrary in its operation. I suppose it's tricky to get a penalty system that suits everyone but PC2's is a bit clunky. Interesting idea about removing the text.

@Zolon32 you can adjust the maximum time given out for a penalty. 30 seconds is a lot to make up.


I think there is some randomness built into the pit stop timing @Napalm_LT, it makes it more realistic than fixed times for everyone. Xero's crew probably quickly patched his car with some repair tape. :)

xeronima
I tried twitch for streaming the race
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Appears to have worked well... Or was that the cause of your black screen?

It looked fun back there. It was a bit boring out front but I thought I'd give it a go and try to stay there, it's not a normal experience for me. :P
 
IfAndOr
It looked fun back there. It was a bit boring out front but I thought I'd give it a go and try to stay there, it's not a normal experience for me. :P
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I could sense the point when you got bored of being out front when my significant gap started reducing around the halfway mark (I know it was you getting slower rather than me faster, because Zolons gap followed the same trajectory).

Race 1 I was a distant spectator to Zolon and Xero, great racing guys. And I had some enjoyable battling with Jammy, keeping ahead only thanks to the notable car advantage.

Race 2 started well but I made silly mistakes in sections where its tricky to be side by side, and a kerb threw me into the wall. Those are the most difficult situations I find, where you're trying to leave space on the inside / outside but the trajectory of the cars isn't a scalelextric track, those lines easily cross. I seemed to be taking different lines through corners as well. Was still a fun race though, playing catch up and seeing who might pop up again after their pit stop.
 
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race one . was ok after contact with half and waited for him clawed back 6th.
race two . lap 2 the tv wanted to turn off had to fight to get remote , sry if you were near me then ..
then thought i pit early crashed pit entry spins me round and holds me in pit for ages ...
 
Napalm_LT
Another mysterie from PC2 - on the Xero replay I noticed he hit the wall while piting and got 2% of damage, set damage repier to "aero" and his pit stop lasted 4,9 s. I had 0 damage, pit stop was set to everything off, I didn't exceed speed on pit entry, but my pit stop lasted more than 5 s. How it is possible?
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Your not paying your mechanics enough. Ultra-realism in play
 
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Napalm_LT
Amazing skills @jammy21. Seeing your lap times I am a bit depresed. All my imaginations I am quite good at racing gone like smoke of cigarete in the wind :)
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He's the kind of Serena Williams of online racing, if you know what I mean ;)

But don't get too depressed Napalm, I think that everyone who races in this little group of ours has skills that would make the average person swear that we are cheating if they tried to join in. And you're not particularly slow yourself, you know. In fact I'm going to have to have a word with Half. His maths needs sorting if I'm in the Nissan and you, Salty, Reaggee etc are in the Porsche; there's something weird going on somewhere. Maybe I didn't pay him enough...


Anyway, I have to blow my own trumpet, and say that I'm loving the way the system is working. No one has an average finishing position below 12th, and just about everyone finished within 30 seconds of the winner in the long race at Fuji. Quite close for fifty minutes of balls-out blasting, I think.

@jammy21 @Napalm_LT @Hun200kmh @xeronima @Saltyjoe90 @Pantheons @JockeP22 @half_sourly @beachboy6658 @richroo @Maxmusmonster @Don Mejillone @Oldbass47 @IfAndOr


Folks, in a slight change from the weather forecasts we've had for the previous races, it's going to start bright and clear on the Algarve, then we'll have light cloud, heavy cloud, and finally, overcast. 13:00 start, on 6th October 2021.

That's the long race, quali and the short race will both be clear, as I think it has been most of the time elsewhere.


Oldbass47
30second penalty???
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IfAndOr
@Zolon32 you can adjust the maximum time given out for a penalty. 30 seconds is a lot to make up.
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Yeah, sorry about that Old. I'll adjust it down. I'm groping in the dark most of the time, you know. And I often have to wait until she's asleep.


Cheers, GirlyPig.
 
Zolon32
Yeah, sorry about that Old. I'll adjust it down. I'm groping in the dark most of the time, you know. And I often have to wait until she's asleep.
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I thought that you get DQ if you exceed the max penalty? Isn't there a risk to manage there as well?
 
xeronima
I thought that you get DQ if you exceed the max penalty? Isn't there a risk to manage there as well?
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Good heavens Xero, I wouldn't want that to happen. I'll leave things as they are and hope that naughty OldBass, and his badly behaved friends can sit down for a moment and think about what they did. Is there a step we can send them to?
 
Ah no. The adjustable limit is the accumulated time it allows before you have to take a drive through penalty, not a DQ. I think drive throughs are disabled so...
 
IfAndOr
Ah no. The adjustable limit is the accumulated time it allows before you have to take a drive through penalty, not a DQ. I think drive throughs are disabled so...
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So I could set the limit to ten seconds, and that's the maximum anyone could get, no matter how naughty they were, but nothing else would happen to them (car sets on fire, screen goes blank, hot liquid gets dropped in their lap etc)?

Interesting...
 
I think so. It is a very er... confusing game when it comes to penalties. You may still get extra time added for some more extreme offenses. And of course get DQd for pitlane speeding.
 
Great video, xero. People - and I'm one of them - are quick to make negative comments about games; and true, none of them is perfect; but it is incredible what depth of thinking and work go on behind the scenes, especially for firms with more or less unlimited resources, like Sony. Finding the balance between a commercial success and a game that will satisfy hardcore SIM enthusiasts must be difficult; I think Sony / PD do just fine. I'll be jumping on the GT7 bandwagon as soon as it is out - pity it will be on the PS4, but that will have to do for now.
 
I honestly can only see "Our AI is aggressive, and can drive more quickly than the very fastest driver on GT" here. It hasn't raised my hopes for GT7 at all.

The problem, as I see it, is that race cars and very powerful road (or off road) cars are, in reality, very difficult to master and extract the best times from. Only a small percentage of the population have the skills to do that. Therefore, if you model your racing game to replicate reality, a huge wedge of your potential market will not be able to handle it, and you wouldn't sell any games.

Sony are not about to do that, so they make their game 'accessible' to all; but no longer, I'm afraid, appealing to me. Having hooned around on PCars2 for the time that I have now, I really don't want to go back to GTs gripfest.


Just as a side point, there's no mention of tyre wear in their AI races. I don't find it surprising that a machine that can replicate with absolute precision its entry point, speed, turn rate, brake level, throttle level etc lap after lap after lap can optimise every element of the manoeuvre; it's the old thing about monkeys writing Shakespear. I wonder if they can do the same in a changing environment.
 
Not to get into any GT bashing - because I still like the series. But it doesn't actually say that the learning AI they've developed will be in GT7. It might just be an AI they've developed using GT as a platform. It's probably running on something more powerful than a PS5 if it's learning and making decisions. And I'd say it's not all about speed, it's more about believeability. Do you feel like you're racing against a human, will it back out of challenges and importantly, can it make mistakes. Tricky to get right in a racing game.
 
Sorry about that rant chaps, the old mental health problems biting me on the bum.
IfAndOr
Do you feel like you're racing against a human, will it back out of challenges and importantly, can it make mistakes. Tricky to get right in a racing game.
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Exactly right Paul, and the point I might have made if my loony hadn't been let out of his cage, crashing around my head in an orgy of pure destruction.. hey ho. I think that it does say an awful lot about what to expect from GT7 AI though. There's no boast about any way that it can enhance the offline experience at all; just "Our AI can p**s off into the distance at a tremendous rate". And, how the hell does that help my enjoyment of the game?

There was one version of GT, I honestly don't have a clue which one it was, where the AI were forced to use the same tyres you put on your car. Man, I loved that; the AI were as mad as me. Brilliant 😃
 

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