Watkins Glen - Real vs GT7

[FPV MIC]

GT tracks are called out for being more barren, because the tracks in real life have more details.

I honestly don't see a whole lot missing. What I do see is that the GT Sport one was done on the time trail setting which has the least action trackside, just as it would in real life. A better comparison would probably be an actual race day comparison.

I hate it when comparisons of any games seem to be done to skew results. It's pointless.

 

[Nowax]

What he pointed out is false. Their goal aligns with GT in replicating RL as far as the hardware of today allows them to.

If believing that makes you feel better, then sure buddy that's okay, I won't interfere.

 

[rhalgr]

If believing that makes you feel better, then sure buddy that's okay, I won't interfere.

You could watch presentation and inteviews of the developers. Inform yourself.

I hate it when comparisons of any games seem to be done to skew results. It's pointless.

The comparisons aren't scewed. If you visited some of these tracks you knew whats missing and whats there but not even close to being real. Just one hint rotating trees. The cycle is the same for generations now.

GT or any racing game releases:
Group A: OMG looks like real life.
Group B: Meh, here is a list of missing objects or flaws.
Group A: Bwahaha, no. Tracks are meant to look dull!!!! Those tracks look perfect and nothing can be improved.

PD releases a new game with some of the missing objects and solved some of the flaws:
Group A: What a time to be alive. Real life looking tracks!!!
Group B: Looks great. Here is a new list of flaws compared to RL.
Group C: Meh doesnt look much better than the old game.
Group A: Dont make me laugh C. The game looks 5 generation ahead!!!! Look at the track detail. Past games were bad in that regard. I made a comparisons between the real life looking tracks of the old and new game. See how the old games 100% real looking tracks don't look as real as the new real life looking tracks?

Racing genre fans are super weird.

 

[Nowax]

You could watch presentation and inteviews of the developers. Inform yourself.

I did inform myself, thanks for the suggestion! Improving physics calculations won't make it feel that different. In fact, by the looks of the gameplay they showed, the driving felt like it was FM7.

Regarding the presentations and interviews, Kazunori for example said that GT7 was gonna be the most complete GT ever, we're still waiting for that claim to be true. Don't blindly trust the developers.

And well, this will be my last reply towards you, I don't want to start an argument.

 

[rhalgr]

I did inform myself, thanks for the suggestion! Improving physics calculations won't make it feel that different. In fact, by the looks of the gameplay they showed, the driving felt like it was FM7.

What does track detail have to do with car physics?

Don't blindly trust the developers.

You can judge their actions. Both teams go out of their way to laser scan tracks and take thousands upon thousands of reference photos to recreate the tracks. The information about Turn10 trying to replicate RL is from various developers presentation and not their marketing campaigns.

 

[Artremis]

You guys defended GT since GT5 against criticism of GT tracks looking barren. Even the PS5 version of GT7 is missing trackside detail. Take a look at spa. The version is oudated to boot. Whenever I read a racing game looks like real life my footnails crawl upwards. Does your country italy have rotating trees or any of the other problems games like GT7, FM7 and all other racing games released got?
What he pointed out is false. Their goal aligns with GT in replicating RL as far as the hardware of today allows them to.

Do you really notice the 2D trees while driving? Seriously asking, I've played GT Sport in VR and even with the depth perception unless I stopped and started turning my head quickly the flat trees were basically impossible to notice. Maybe I'm not focusing on the right things lol

 

[rhalgr]

Do you really notice the 2D trees while driving? Seriously asking, I've played GT Sport in VR and even with the depth perception unless I stopped and started turning my head quickly the flat trees were basically impossible to notice. Maybe I'm not focusing on the right things lol

Yes, I do. Racing games have lots of flaws still and those will be solved in do course with better hardware. I wanted to point that out because I respect the hard work of these studios. The bar is simply too high once the discussion turns to real life.

 

[FPV MIC]

The comparisons aren't scewed. If you visited some of these tracks you knew whats missing and whats there but not even close to being real. Just one hint rotating trees. The cycle is the same for generations now.

Rotating trees has nothing to do with missing details, that's a design choice. I watched the videos you put up and I just don't see a whole lot missing, and that's in Time Trail, which is far and away the most baron part on track detail in GT Sport. During a race there's much, much more going on in the background.

The rest I won't even bother with.

 

[Nowax]

What does track detail have to do with car physics?

You can judge their actions. Both teams go out of their way to laser scan tracks and take thousands upon thousands of reference photos to recreate the tracks. The information about Turn10 trying to replicate RL is from various developers presentation and not their marketing campaigns.

GT or any racing game releases:
Group A: OMG looks like real life.
Group B: Meh, here is a list of missing objects or flaws.
Group A: Bwahaha, no. Tracks are meant to look dull!!!! Those tracks look perfect and nothing can be improved.

PD releases a new game with some of the missing objects and solved some of the flaws:
Group A: What a time to be alive. Real life looking tracks!!!
Group B: Looks great. Here is a new list of flaws compared to RL.
Group C: Meh doesnt look much better than the old game.
Group A: Dont make me laugh C. The game looks 5 generation ahead!!!! Look at the track detail. Past games were bad in that regard. I made a comparisons between the real life looking tracks of the old and new game. See how the old games 100% real looking tracks don't look as real as the new real life looking tracks?

Racing genre fans are super weird.

Sorry, I know, I said that you wouldn't receive any reply of me towards you, but this part just made me cringe, man, seriously, especially the last part...

Racing genre fans are super weird.

Did you just look at yourself in the mirror? I don't want to make this personal or anything like that, but...

It seems really off to me that whenever someone talks about FM, you have to defend it, and since you have that pretty picture of an Audi RS3, taken on FM7... wait are you a fan of Forza??????
It's actually not a bad thing, to each their own, but I can assume that you came here only to provoke, end of discussion. Now I really won't reply to you EVER again, how could I forgotten about that beautiful button called "ignore"? lol.

 

[Malipiero1]

I just wish they would apply the same level of realism to the A.I. 😏 ... and with that I mean Artificial Intelligence, NOT Artificial Incompetence.

 

[TokoTurismo]

I just wish they would apply the same level of realism to the A.I. 😏 ... and with that I mean Artificial Intelligence, NOT Artificial Incompetence.

PD? Nah doubt it. They're not well known for doing things that are actually important or what players want. That is just how they rolled since.

 

[eSZee]

The information about Turn10 trying to replicate RL is from various developers presentation and not their marketing campaigns.

What do you think the purpose of those presentations was?

 

[emula]

I just wish they would apply the same level of realism to the A.I. 😏 ... and with that I mean Artificial Intelligence, NOT Artificial Incompetence.

Gran Turismo 7's "Sophy" Artificial Intelligence Driving System Revealed

Polyphony Digital has unveiled its new artificially intelligent driving system named "Gran Turismo Sophy", developed in collaboration with Sony AI. It will be included in Gran Turismo 7 via a future update. Sophy was developed using the latest in reinforcement learning techniques, which train an

www.gtplanet.net

 

[Samus]

Gran Turismo 7's "Sophy" Artificial Intelligence Driving System Revealed

Polyphony Digital has unveiled its new artificially intelligent driving system named "Gran Turismo Sophy", developed in collaboration with Sony AI. It will be included in Gran Turismo 7 via a future update. Sophy was developed using the latest in reinforcement learning techniques, which train an

www.gtplanet.net

1. Doesn't exist in game yet and won't ever exist as competetive AI in GT7
2. Wasn't primarily created by PD, they just gave Sony AI the access and tools to their source code.
3. Wasn't particularly intelligent in what we saw, just programmed to go fast

 

[retrostate]

I feel sorry for they guy whos skid marks into the barrier have now been immortalized in game forever. Imagine trying to play GT7 and having PTSD every time you go past them

6 hours of the Glen 2019 I believe. Tire marks line up with the first lap crash.

 

[rhalgr]

Rotating trees has nothing to do with missing details, that's a design choice

Rotating trees are in a game to save performance and aren't a design choice.

What do you think the purpose of those presentations was?

The purpose was to inform developers on how Turn 10 develop their tracks. Developers presentations at GDC =/= marketing campaigns for consumers.

It's actually not a bad thing, to each their own, but I can assume that you came here only to provoke

Ironic. Your are the one trying to be personal after I told you to inform yourself about what the developers goals are.

1. Doesn't exist in game yet and won't ever exist as competetive AI in GT7
2. Wasn't primarily created by PD, they just gave Sony AI the access and tools to their source code.
3. Wasn't particularly intelligent in what we saw, just programmed to go fast

1. Kaz said the AI is coming to GT7. 3. The AI is more intelligent than any AI in racing games so far.

 

[FPV MIC]

Rotating trees aren't a design choice. Rotating trees are in a game to save performance. In the future GT won't use them anymore

So it's a design choice to save performance to utilise the power elsewhere. It's still a design choice!

 

[rhalgr]

So it's a design choice to save performance to utilise the power elsewhere. It's still a design choice!

Compromise is the word. GT7 on PS5 has more track details as GT on PS4. Was that a unforced design choice or did hardware limitations force them to make a compromise on PS4?

 

[FPV MIC]

A compromise is the word. GT7 on PS5 has more track details as GT on PS4. Was that a unforced design choice or did hardware limitations force them to make a compromise on PS4?

No, it was a forced design choice, but they could've easily chosen to make those sacrifices elsewhere other than the trees.

Edit: Rotating trees still doesn't count as missing details as per your original claim.

 

[rhalgr]

Rotating trees still doesn't count as missing details as per your original claim.

Rotating trees were a superb compromise for PS4 games. Once a future GT uses 3D trees you'll see the difference in detail and notice how 3D trees look more natural.

I wasn't saying rotating trees are missing detail. Those are flaws and what I referred to as not close to being real.

 

[FPV MIC]

In your opinion. If GT8 or 9 use 3D trees you'll see the difference in detail and how the trees fit into the environment.

The tree will either be there or it won't, if it's not there then it will be a missing detail from the environment. If it is there, then it's not missing. That the tree is not detailed enough for you is another story.

Perhaps the language barrier is having an effect here.

 

[rhalgr]

The tree will either be there or it won't, if it's not there then it will be a missing detail from the environment. If it is there, then it's not missing. That the tree is not detailed enough for you is another story.

Perhaps the language barrier is having an effect here.

The sentence was about trees and such

whats there but not even close to being real

Trees are there and even positioned correctly. Shows the love for detail PD has. Those trees just don't look real. Games still got a long way to go before reaching real life.

 

[FPV MIC]

The sentence was about trees.

This was part of the quote. The hint was rotating trees.

The comparisons aren't scewed. If you visited some of these tracks you knew whats missing and whats there but not even close to being real. Just one hint rotating trees. The cycle is the same for generations now.

I had you're video to go from, not real life. If you want me to compare to real life, then show me real life.

In your comparison there wasn't much in the way of missing details. The trees were there. There was a missing stand in one IIRC but as I said, the video was from the most baron part of GT Sport, namely Time Trial mode, where a lot of details are missing.

 

[rhalgr]

I had you're video to go from, not real life. If you want me to compare to real life, then show me real life.

The video had real life footage. Spa has several missing objects like stands or bushes on PS5.

 

[FPV MIC]

The video had real life footage. Spa has several missing objects like stands or bushes on PS5.

You said, if you visited ... and I already mentioned the missing stand and why details like that aren't there, and a few bushes fit's in with what I said also...

In your comparison there wasn't much in the way of missing details.

 

[Divaldo]

Gran Turismo is the only race game where there´s no race at all in the career mode--no qualification and the gamer is punished forced to start a lap down. That´s very bad because there are some nice venues in the game.

 

[Samus]

.

 

[emula]

1. Doesn't exist in game yet and won't ever exist as competetive AI in GT7
2. Wasn't primarily created by PD, they just gave Sony AI the access and tools to their source code.
3. Wasn't particularly intelligent in what we saw, just programmed to go fast

You look just terrified by the fact that Polyphony is working on the best AI on the market

 

[Samus]

You look just terrified by the fact that Polyphony is working on the best AI on the market

Yeah, that's it. Me, an offline only player, who has been asking for good AI in GT for years, is terrified that it might happen. No. I'm just being realistic based on facts. Sophy is not going to be a reality as competitive AI for a long time, GT8 at the earliest.

You still have that "they're criticising the game, that means they hate GT and are a secret Forza fan" mentality I see.

 

[Vhonskream]

I just got a great comment from a friend, I sent him couple of screenshots with the comparison, he didn't read the title properly, and he said "the PS4 ones are also good enough, but the PS5 is amazing" - not realising that the top pictures are actual real pics

Still using a PS4, I'll have to back his statement up as accurate. Its amazing how meticulous PD is to the tiniest detail