why can't the devs get the powerband right?

  • Thread starter Thread starter lobango
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lobango

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it bugs me how a 2 liter, single turbo car can burn out so easily at 2000 rpm. apparently if the car has 500lb/ft of torque, it makes that torque anywhere on the rpm band
 
usernamed
???

Relavance?? Do you have the game?
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i think he's talking about GT3, yea, that bugged me too

but i figured out how to feather the throttle to get the best times

but yea, it's not entirely realistic, on the 328ci, if i dump it from 3500 in real life, i wouldn't be spinning my tires like crazy, it catches almost instantly and I'm off
 
Remember in the old days with GT1 when you fitted a Stage 3/4 NA or Turbo modification, your car's engine's powerband became very peaky and with very little low-end torque (in other words useful only for top speed races as stated in those parts' descriptions) ? That was realistic. GT2 and GT3 were completely lacky in this aspect, modifications got too much arcadey.

Now... are modifications in GT4 realistic again? I miss those huge turbo lags :)
 
usernamed
Well If this is for GT3, It should of been posted in the GT3 Forum, welcome to GTPlanet.
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It was based off GT3 but I have the GT4 demo and although I can't turn off traction control, it seems to still be the same deal. Flooring the rx8 which basically makes power at high rpms, it sets off the traction control at very low RPMs. Then again, the rx8 IS a torque monster :dopey:
 
I acually though that some cars in Gt3 had good traction compared to the car. Best one i found. I took a dodge Viper Turned off Traction control. And put super softs on the rear. I Could launch that thing like crazy. But you had to keep stock suspention. I never was good at tunning. :crazy: :dunce: But my stage 2 N/A would run 9's :sly:
 
Rbnich
I acually though that some cars in Gt3 had good traction compared to the car. Best one i found. I took a dodge Viper Turned off Traction control. And put super softs on the rear. I Could launch that thing like crazy. But you had to keep stock suspention. I never was good at tunning. :crazy: :dunce: But my stage 2 N/A would run 9's :sly:
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I acually think they should have put in a drag slick tire. Very good traction but no turning ability at all. 💡
 
yeah i think there should have been more realistic turbo lag. like super lag if you put a big turbo on say a miata or something. the escudo was the only thing i can really think of that got bad lag in GT3.
 
I think the physics are just not good enough in GT3. Like the tire physics, temperature and stuff. I mean come on 4th gear burnouts in a stock toyota supra.. No!
 
It's not the powerband that PD did not get right. It is the coefficient of friction when the tire spins. This is difficult to measure.

For PD to get this right, they have to get a tire to spin (or burn) slowly to spinning fast (or smoking). Then they would have to reverse calculate what the coefficient of friction at each slip ratio then interpolate. Then they would have to do this for racing tires, normal tires, sports tires, for different tire brands, at different temperatures, etc.

The tire actually is the most difficult thing to simulate on a race vehicle. How you simulate tire can make or break a racing/driving simulation. Papyrus' Grand Prix Legends and Nascar series got this right. EA's Need for speed did not.

Tire can easily have over 100 parameters to simulate correctly. 'Changing' parameters that is. Temperature, pressure, compound, tread, camber, deflection (in all directions), rotation inertia, rotation resonance, slip, slip angle, width, height, etc, etc.

Overall, if I give GPL tires a 9/10, I would rate GT3 tires at about 6/10. IMO, temperature, pressure, and wear rate needs to be more realistically defined.
 
Those are very good points but I still think the powerband is weird. In GT3 if you floored a 2L 200hp car at 2000rpm, I don't think it'd start spinning the tires. Strapping on a huge turbo should not change that in real life, but in the game it somehow boosts horsepower where the single turbo isn't compressing. From what I played of GT4 demo (and my friend who has played the full version), GT4 has not changed much in that department.

Actually it doesn't really bother me too much except in very slow speed corners (such as the last turn in Laguna Seca) where exiting corners can be tricky in high powered street cars.
 
GTJugend
There are very much of that with stage 3/4 turbo in the original Gran Turismo game.
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No kidding... however I must argue against the presence of turbo lag in GT1 and GT2. The slow cars are just as slow without turbo on acceleration, and the higher powered racers don't seem to suffer. In fact, they often accelerate quicker, as illustrated by NA NSX vs Turbo Supra.
 
blargonator
yeah i think there should have been more realistic turbo lag. like super lag if you put a big turbo on say a miata or something. the escudo was the only thing i can really think of that got bad lag in GT3.
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No, the small cars like the Suzuki thing had bad lag. With the stage 3 or 4 turbo or whatever you could put on it, it takes like 3 seconds just get past 2.5k... :crazy:
 
i was playing around with a fully tuned r34 gtr in gt3....from a standstill i put it in 6th gear, then accelerated, fullboost was acheived by about 1500 rpm lol.....so yes i hope they did get this aspect of the game right....in reality it the gtr probaly wouldnt even start making boost until about 4-5k rpm...
 
I have GT4 now...
I'm happy to see that modifications are realistic again :)
I put a stage 1 turbo only on my Fiat Panda and torque at lower revs slightly decreased. Even the reference manual mentions about this happening with modifications. Very good!
 
SHIRAKAWA Akira
I have GT4 now...
I'm happy to see that modifications are realistic again :)
I put a stage 1 turbo only on my Fiat Panda and torque at lower revs slightly decreased. Even the reference manual mentions about this happening with modifications. Very good!
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How much hp does your panda turbo has for the moment? :) Does it go fast? :D
 
den brakke
How much hp does your panda turbo has for the moment? :) Does it go fast? :D
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My Panda has 89 ps. I haven't tested with the Turbo, but stock went up to 147 km/h (a bit higher than in real life). It oversteers a lot and it's fun to drive!
 
i hope there is realistic turbo lag. Then we will have to actually have to change our engine's power and tourque output depending on the course. :)
 
lobango
?

This is a GT4 complaint as well.
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no it's not, GT4 uses a completley different physics engine, evrything is much more accurate than in GT3, the powerband is just fine in GT4. so this post is irrelevant and the title is missleading to people thinking you are talking about GT4.
 
LFRANCOF483
...on the 328ci, if i dump it from 3500 in real life, i wouldn't be spinning my tires like crazy, it catches almost instantly and I'm off
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I dunno. My old 90 Civic DX sedan could spin 'em up quite nicely from ~2000 RPM. Considering the monstrous (:crazy:) low-end torque of a stock D15B2...
 

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