Would you like to see DR affected by aid usage?

[ASH32]

Not sure why you can even use some aids online, especially in Sport Mode, the cones, driving markers and stuff like that, it's just silly, just learn offline first if necessary. Other aids should depend on your DR level, A and above should only have ABS and maybe TC(not sure on that one) available, you definitely need traction control for the average B and C drivers but only D and E drivers should be able use ASM and CSA.

Probably not easy (maybe impossible) to change this now though, it's just a shame the game wasn't built this way in the first place for me, since it promotes actual improvement and you know for certain that all the top drivers are the real top guys 100% of the time and there are no A/A* driver at the top of the leaderboard using ASM, as this is just wrong.

 

[Satomiblood]

I currently use blue markers, but started out with the yellow driving line. I'm not sure why people are against them. They're visual guides. It's not like they grant players magical speed boosts.

 

[Groundfish]

I put no.
The only aid that concerns me is csa, but if I’m on wheel with tcs...fairs fair.
I don’t agree with much of what is commonly accepted regarding aids.
If I run group c vs gr1 at Lemans I run no tcs and weak abs.
If I run Gardens gr4 in say the nsx, it’s fastest for me to run abs default tcs and asm.
Asm is prohibited in F I A right? Lol my post reminds me...

 

[JCH8r]

Do you adjust TCS for hairpins? Just wondering, because on some aids (brake bias and TCS) there is a skill to switching settings based on speed, corner entry and exit, etc. Also, changing fuel flow can act like TCS.

 

[Sven Jurgens]

I currently use blue markers, but started out with the yellow driving line. I'm not sure why people are against them. They're visual guides. It's not like they grant players magical speed boosts.

Some people want to separate DS4 from wheel users and / or lock you to in car view without any aids, no ghosting, max damage, Basically they just want to be the last man left racing for easy wins

There's a fully functional lobby system where you can restrict as much as you like. Daily races are accessible for a reason, to get 20 people together to race at any time of the day twice an hour and 12/16 3 times an hour, while hopefully still have enough people to match separate them on SR and DR for better races.

Perhaps instead of not allowing aids, it should put them on automatically when you spin out and hit someone. Can't drive -> training wheels back on.
Spin out on corner exit, TCS turns on.
Spin on a kerb / grass edge. CSA turns on.
Can't drive a straight line, ASM turn on.
Brake too early, driving line turns on.
Brake too late, brake assist turns on.
Go off the road, steering assist turns on.

 

[Voodoovaj]

People who think the cones are silly aids have never gone to a track day in real life.

 

[Satomiblood]

Some people want to separate DS4 from wheel users and / or lock you to in car view without any aids, no ghosting, max damage, Basically they just want to be the last man left racing for easy wins

There's a fully functional lobby system where you can restrict as much as you like. Daily races are accessible for a reason, to get 20 people together to race at any time of the day twice an hour and 12/16 3 times an hour, while hopefully still have enough people to match separate them on SR and DR for better races.

Perhaps instead of not allowing aids, it should put them on automatically when you spin out and hit someone. Can't drive -> training wheels back on.
Spin out on corner exit, TCS turns on.
Spin on a kerb / grass edge. CSA turns on.
Can't drive a straight line, ASM turn on.
Brake too early, driving line turns on.
Brake too late, brake assist turns on.
Go off the road, steering assist turns on.

Honestly, with some of the asinine stuff I've read in the past year, the attitude against driving line aids shouldn't come as a surprise. I've been smoked by aliens that couldn't care less what aids I used, so maybe certain aids aren't quite as advantageous as others make them out to be. I've only managed a paltry 7 wins in my Sport Mode career, and they were all last year, so what the hell do I know?

 

[W Patrick]

Keep making it more difficult & your going to end up with fewer players than we have now. If you want it that hardcore iRacing is a much better option.

 

[Voodoovaj]

Honestly, with some of the asinine stuff I've read in the past year, the attitude against driving line aids shouldn't come as a surprise. I've been smoked by aliens that couldn't care less what aids I used, so maybe certain aids aren't quite as advantageous as others make them out to be. I've only managed a paltry 7 wins in my Sport Mode career, and they were all last year, so what the hell do I know?

Curious. Good point being made.

Some aids may make you faster and some not.


I only use ABS (default) and I am at 361 wins (as of today)

Keep making it more difficult & your going to end up with fewer players than we have now. If you want it that hardcore iRacing is a much better option.

Again, curious.

I rarely see low player counts. Sure, at odd hours, there's fewer, but at normal hours, the rooms are always full (not counting discounts, because those people would have played without the disconnect).

The least I can recall is 11 players in a Race C and it was around 8:30 (with my morning coffee)

 

[JayRS200]

Honestly, with some of the asinine stuff I've read in the past year, the attitude against driving line aids shouldn't come as a surprise. I've been smoked by aliens that couldn't care less what aids I used, so maybe certain aids aren't quite as advantageous as others make them out to be. I've only managed a paltry 7 wins in my Sport Mode career, and they were all last year, so what the hell do I know?

You have great taste in music. DOOM!

 

[W Patrick]

I’m a c/d rated driver with an s safety rating. All I do is lose and lose and lose to the s-b rated drivers in almost every race. That tells me there aren’t enough players. I mean it’s like going to your local track and racing Lewis Hamilton every night. It’s not fun.

 

[Sven Jurgens]

Curious. Good point being made.

Some aids may make you faster and some not.

I only use ABS (default) and I am at 361 wins (as of today)

Again, curious.

I rarely see low player counts. Sure, at odd hours, there's fewer, but at normal hours, the rooms are always full (not counting discounts, because those people would have played without the disconnect).

The least I can recall is 11 players in a Race C and it was around 8:30 (with my morning coffee)

Oh the rooms are nearly always full, PD makes sure of that, going as far as pitting A+/S drivers against D/E drivers! You are one of the fast guys, how often do you get to race a full room where the entire room is competitive vs your pace! It's pretty much A+/S to D/S most of the day, A+/S to B/S at prime time.

 

[Satomiblood]

Curious. Good point being made.

Some aids may make you faster and some not.


I only use ABS (default) and I am at 361 wins (as of today)



Again, curious.

I rarely see low player counts. Sure, at odd hours, there's fewer, but at normal hours, the rooms are always full (not counting discounts, because those people would have played without the disconnect).

The least I can recall is 11 players in a Race C and it was around 8:30 (with my morning coffee)

I use ABS (weak) and blue driving markers. Everything else is off.

 

[Majorwolf72]

Even the super aliens use ABS on Standard.

In actual motorsport, ABS is used if a car is equipped with it.

So in my world having ABS on is clean.

 

[Majorwolf72]

I imagine LIGHTNING would agree with you but that guy could still win with a 3 legged donkey.

Mik chooses not-meta cars as Manufacturer deliberately. Because he doesn’t like to be in a „winning car“. He still wins, but that is due to skill then. He wouldn’t want it any other way.

But that’s him and he’s an extraordinary talent. We pawns will likely always lean towards the meta...

 

[kilesa4568]

The JFK of Gran Turismo...

I choose to use McLaren. I choose to use McLaren in GTS, not because it is easy, but because it is hard, because that goal will serve to organise and measure the best of my energies and skills, because that challenge is one that I am willing to accept, one I am unwilling to postpone, and one which I intend to win, and to use the Pug VGT in the future, too. Just to rub salt into the other GT alien's wounds.

We're very similar, TRL LIGHTNING and I. We're both male and we both never choose the meta... Sadly, that's where the similarities end. I don't like cookies or strong black Turkish tea so I'll never be as good as him.

 

[ShiftingGears]

There's not enough feel in the physics for me not to use ABS. Project CARS gives you a much better feel of what the car is doing before lock-up occurs.

I like the GT:Sport physics... just not without ABS.

I would rather credit payouts impacted by aid usage. +5% for no ABS, -5% for ASM and CSA.

Having DR impacted by aid usage doesn't help because you are matched based on DR and SR before you enter the pre-race lobby (where you can subsequently turn aids on or off). Also DR is more or less a zero sum game, all you're doing is tsking DR points out of the system

 

[gtpierre]

People who think the cones are silly aids have never gone to a track day in real life.

People who think cones are not silly aids have never gone to a race track on a race day in real life.

You can put you cones in qualifying, or in arcade when you do timed training, but in race it should not be allowed.
It seems GT really got dumbed down (actually kaz said it himself), they should have made the driving school and circuit experience mandatory before playing anything else like in the firsts GTs to force people to learn tracks, braking zone etc.

Making good times on nurburgring track used to be a challenge because it is so long that it takes days (or weeks for some) before you know by heart where to brake, where not to brake, where to just let off the gaz, which bump to avoid etc. Now you can do a competitive time at the first try thanks to all the aids.

But I guess all the need for speed, forza, grid etc players would no buy GT sport if there was no driving aids

 

[Majorwolf72]

[...], they should have made the driving school and circuit experience mandatory before playing anything else like in the firsts GTs to force people to learn tracks, braking zone etc.

THERE is a good idea!! PLUS the missions, so you have a few hour racing time under your belt, and being ALLOWED to enter online racing is like being knighted already. It‘s all too easy to get in Gold anyway (with a very few exceptions, Night
Rallye at Colorado Springs... )

 

[VolkswagenX]

As the question says, do you believe that DR should be affected by the usage of driver aids?

Now, I personally don't care if people use them. Especially as you learn the game, or as a means to better enjoy the game. If the aids bring you up to par, great.

HOWEVER, at the pointy end of the stick, I do believe that "Driver Rating" is somewhat tarnished if using aids has no effect on it. In my view, the amount of DR you score is decreased for every aid you have turned on, and the degree to which it is enabled.

So, for full points, it's all off, even ABS (to be fair) and, let's face t, if you can win without ABS, you're pretty PRO!! The same goes for the rest. Because, let's face it, IF:

Driver A and Driver B cross the line in a tie (hypothetical). If Driver A is only using ABS and Driver B has all the aids maxed, I believe Driver A should be scoring more points


Agree or Disagree?

I came here to make this exact topic after having done 3 races at Fuji being the only driver on the grid only using ABS. The guy that won the last race was using ASM, TCS and CSA. I don't like the idea of excluding players for using aides and I believe giving points based on the aides used is a better and more fair way of balancing the field.

I agree with you. Aids should reduce the amount of DR you would gain under the same conditions not using any aids.

However, TCS pretty much makes you slower, but will keep you on track. So I think drivers who rely on TCS and other aids for that matter, aren't that great of drivers anyways so any changes like you suggested probably aren't necessary. I'm not sure how many A+ or A drivers use aids though.

My personal opinion is that aides reward dirty driving. When I drive a fast car without aides, I have to be careful not to touch another driver because any contact can cause my car to spin out. In full assist mode you can just ram your way through because your car is on rails. It's not just speed. Driving without aides makes you a cleaner driver in my opinion.

 

[Voodoovaj]

@gtpierre Is there a larger "eye roll" emoji?

You know what I would love to see introduced here at GTPlanet? A DR/SR score on the left sidebar. I think that would put a little perspective on comments. I say this because I often recognize the names of the posters and I have found, quite often, better players show the least elitism.

DR B <- this is where the most elitist players reside. (That's right, I said it!)

In DR B there is a bunch of players that believe themselves to be far better than then really are, because they can blow past all these "need for speed, forza, grid etc players" but, for some reason, despite their greatness, they just can't seem to break through to the higher ranks, because (insert excuse here).


Just so I am clear as to why I started this thread, I was curious to see what the community opinion was. It's almost even, which is SO uncommon.

I use ABS (weak) and blue driving markers. Everything else is off.

I suggest a change to ABS Default for ranked races. The difference is slight, but enough to change the complexion of your experience.

 

[gtpierre]

@gtpierre Is there a larger "eye roll" emoji?

You know what I would love to see introduced here at GTPlanet? A DR/SR score on the left sidebar. I think that would put a little perspective on comments. I say this because I often recognize the names of the posters and I have found, quite often, better players show the least elitism.

DR B <- this is where the most elitist players reside. (That's right, I said it!)

In DR B there is a bunch of players that believe themselves to be far better than then really are, because they can blow past all these "need for speed, forza, grid etc players" but, for some reason, despite their greatness, they just can't seem to break through to the higher ranks, because (insert excuse here).
[...]

You're right, GT sport is for everyone.
Anyone should be able to do well, so we totally need an assist that accelerate at the good moment, brake at the good moment, so all the Dr B players can be as fast as the Dr A. In addition, we need an assist to help people decide when they have to turn and overtake, it is wayyyy to complicated.

is there a largererest eye roll emoji ? it would totally help me make my point like an adult

 

[Satomiblood]

@gtpierre Is there a larger "eye roll" emoji?

You know what I would love to see introduced here at GTPlanet? A DR/SR score on the left sidebar. I think that would put a little perspective on comments. I say this because I often recognize the names of the posters and I have found, quite often, better players show the least elitism.

DR B <- this is where the most elitist players reside. (That's right, I said it!)

In DR B there is a bunch of players that believe themselves to be far better than then really are, because they can blow past all these "need for speed, forza, grid etc players" but, for some reason, despite their greatness, they just can't seem to break through to the higher ranks, because (insert excuse here).


Just so I am clear as to why I started this thread, I was curious to see what the community opinion was. It's almost even, which is SO uncommon.

I'm DR B/SR S and I never noticed this level of elitism that you speak of. I can at least claim that I don't think of myself as an elite level player, nor do I look down at other players over their ratings or use of driving aids. In fact, I make fun of myself for not being able to accomplish anything of import in this game.

 

[Majorwolf72]

@gtpierre
DR B <- this is where the most elitist players reside. (That's right, I said it!)

Well, here is an elitist thought: It’s way too easy to reach that B rating! Should start at 20,000, or even 25,000. Any half trained monkey can reach 10k after a while.

I think life really starts deeper into the A rating, say around 40k. That’s where it definitely takes skill to get to and stay at or even improve. Anything B is still „very much in training“, lower A still has homework to do. Lower than B... I‘m not going to comment. Then again there’s people who just don’t do Sport Mode and are pretty good drivers...

 

[kilesa4568]

You know what I would love to see introduced here at GTPlanet? A DR/SR score on the left sidebar. I think that would put a little perspective on comments. I say this because I often recognize the names of the posters and I have found, quite often, better players show the least elitism.

So opinions are rank based too? The higher your DR, the more it quantifies your opinion?

In DR B there is a bunch of players that believe themselves to be far better than then really are

There are a lot of DRA and +'s who think exactly the same way about those below them. Have you got a mirror handy?

You're calling for sanctions on assist users when you're using them yourself. gtpierre is right about the cones. They take a hell of a lot of the thought process out of learning a track and they also limit mistakes in races because you can blindly follow them race after race. I know you can because I used to do the exact same thing. Once I learn the track, I drop them but I wouldn't ask others to do the same or punish them if they didn't. If you want to use them or any other assists, it's no skin off my nose.

Delusions of grandeur has never been my thing so I guess it's time to unwatch this thread and leave the omnipotent opinions behind me.

 

[Majorwolf72]

Something else. I keep preaching this, because maybe not everyone has three accounts in three different regions and can compare.

Getting higher ratings is is not equally demanding depending on your region.

Simple example: My Sport Mode time on Dragon Trail with Gr. 4 was rank 260 in North America, 370 in Asia, and almost 1400 in Europe.

I‘m currently eligible for a S DR in North America, in Europe I‘m not even in the Top 1000 players.

Just as a reminder that rating does not equal rating. Any A rated European is an easy S in all other regions.

 

[Tassie_tiger]

People who think cones are not silly aids have never gone to a race track on a race day in real life.

You can put you cones in qualifying, or in arcade when you do timed training, but in race it should not be allowed.
It seems GT really got dumbed down (actually kaz said it himself), they should have made the driving school and circuit experience mandatory before playing anything else like in the firsts GTs to force people to learn tracks, braking zone etc.

Making good times on nurburgring track used to be a challenge because it is so long that it takes days (or weeks for some) before you know by heart where to brake, where not to brake, where to just let off the gaz, which bump to avoid etc. Now you can do a competitive time at the first try thanks to all the aids.

But I guess all the need for speed, forza, grid etc players would no buy GT sport if there was no driving aids

I know right.

I mean, race tracks should get rid of all the corner braking distance markers too.
Only noobs need those.

 

[Sven Jurgens]

I know right.

I mean, race tracks should get rid of all the corner braking distance markers too.
Only noobs need those.

Well, it is always easy to spot the noobs when the distance markers get taken out on Mount Panorama

 

[abrahamx]

This thread is getting more elitist by the minute. Good idea to unwatch. I'm right behind you. As I must be less than a half trained monkey.

 

[Satomiblood]

This thread is devolving into "git gud" territory, which is a shame since I don't think that's what the OP intended.