WRC champions personal car collection

[Leonidae@MFT]

Take a look at these..

Collection Of a Lifetime

 

[eight6er]

Nice collection, love all the old rally cars. It looks like he still drives the celica, did I see pics of this car getting restored online?

 

[Leonidae@MFT]

Yeah, Mäkelä Auto Tuning is the company that did the work for him. He also owns that badass Ford Model A with 250bhp BDA Cosworth motor

Oh mama..

 

[eight6er]

Lol I didn't spot that ford the first time I looked, they did some nice work on that celica.

 

[Famine]

That's just sad. Cars don't belong there. You may as well have static plastic models - they have no need for their powertrains, wheels, suspension, interior... everything that makes them a car is useless to them.

Woo, he drives a handful of them sometimes, for a few hundred yards. Well done - that's what they're made for and that's what all the hundreds of millions of pounds spent in research and development for them went towards. That's what they should all be doing. Stop hoarding them and give them to people who'll use them.


Car mausoleums. Hate them.

 

[Beeblebrox237]

Agreed. Cars are meant to be driven. What is the point of owning a beautiful sports car if you can't drive it?

 

[OwensRacing]

Wow Famine! Different perspective in a car collection.

 

[Bottoz]

A sports car without sports is just a car.

 

[FordMKIVJ5]

That's just sad. Cars don't belong there. You may as well have static plastic models - they have no need for their powertrains, wheels, suspension, interior... everything that makes them a car is useless to them.

Woo, he drives a handful of them sometimes, for a few hundred yards. Well done - that's what they're made for and that's what all the hundreds of millions of pounds spent in research and development for them went towards. That's what they should all be doing. Stop hoarding them and give them to people who'll use them.


Car mausoleums. Hate them.[/color][/b]

Agreed. But I do understand if the car has achieved something for example winning a world championship or certain race (24 hours of Le Mans/Spa/Daytona, 12 hours of Sebring, 1000km of Nurburgring etc.)

 

[Greycap]

That's just sad. Cars don't belong there.

Not sure if trolling or serious - but if serious, do you also think the same for every other thing in a museum somewhere in the world which could be useful for what it was originally made to do?

Why not keep flowers in a Ming vase on a living room table, it's perfectly good for that for example? Because it's extremely rare, irreplaceable and thus priceless yet the amount of pieces of Ming porcelain in this world is far higher than the amount of original condition 205 T16 Evo 2's for example. Cars like that belong nowhere else than in a museum unless it can be made 100% sure that nothing happens to them while being used and that can't be guaranteed. Having a car like that just sitting on a showroom floor is a lot better than having it crashed - yes, it could be rebuilt from the ground up with newly produced parts but it wouldn't be original anymore, more of a replica.

 

[SpartanG]

I'm kind of in the middle on this one. In one way, these cars should be preserved to the utmost ability so that people 30 years down the road can appreciate what was built. I mean, at one of those speed and car festivals, how cool is it when someone rolls up in a perfectly upkept half-century old car and drives around in it?

On the other side it is kind of depressing to see cars of such capability locked up like that. It's the epitome of unrealized potential.

But it is undeniable that this guy loves his cars, I mean just look at the racing suits and pictures hanging on the wall. The cars are in good hands 👍

 

[Liquid]

Car mausoleums. Hate them.

I agree with you to an extent, but I think there's a difference between preservation and mothballing. The cars at the Donington Collection is fantastic, and it's an absolute privilage to be able to see such wonderful cars lined up next to one another.

I agree with you about the racing, mind. Get them out on the damn track and let them live. I want to be able to hear the V6 Honda turbo of the MP4/4 or see the aesthetic perfection of a Porsche 917 for myself, and not just on the television or on YouTube.

It's why I love Goodwood.

 

[Blaze_409]

Because it's extremely rare, irreplaceable and thus priceless yet the amount of pieces of Ming porcelain in this world is far higher than the amount of original condition 205 T16 Evo 2's for example.

Pretty much how I feel. Its too rare to have some idiot try to drive his RS200 into a lake claiming he was hit by a pelican so that he can collect a huge insurance lump sum...

In addition, these historic cars are quite frankly not safe for racing anymore.....The standards we have nowadays ensure for minimal fatalities in motorsport. A Porsche 917 as much as i love it is not safe enough for the kind of horsepower it produces. I love the cars but they have there place off of the race track (except for slow laps etc/goodwood etc.)

 

[Cano]

That's just sad. Cars don't belong there. You may as well have static plastic models - they have no need for their powertrains, wheels, suspension, interior... everything that makes them a car is useless to them.

Woo, he drives a handful of them sometimes, for a few hundred yards. Well done - that's what they're made for and that's what all the hundreds of millions of pounds spent in research and development for them went towards. That's what they should all be doing. Stop hoarding them and give them to people who'll use them.


Car mausoleums. Hate them.

While I for the most part agree with you, I also think that preserving stupidly rare and historically signifficant race cars is also an important part of the big picture. If these were street cars (the Ferraris, for example), then yeah I wholeheartedly agree and think they should be in a garage, not behind chains. Heck one should be parked outside.

In the case of the rally cars, well, if they were mine I'd hit as many historic racing events with as many of them as I could diggest, and bein' in Europe and with the budget of this guy, I'd do so almolst every week lol. And indeed they would not be behind chains and in a place with a red carpet, so I could drive away in any of them any given time.


Anyway, awesome collection and pretty cool pictures!

 

[Timppaq]

Not sure if trolling or serious - but if serious, do you also think the same for every other thing in a museum somewhere in the world which could be useful for what it was originally made to do?

Why not keep flowers in a Ming vase on a living room table, it's perfectly good for that for example? Because it's extremely rare, irreplaceable and thus priceless yet the amount of pieces of Ming porcelain in this world is far higher than the amount of original condition 205 T16 Evo 2's for example. Cars like that belong nowhere else than in a museum unless it can be made 100% sure that nothing happens to them while being used and that can't be guaranteed. Having a car like that just sitting on a showroom floor is a lot better than having it crashed - yes, it could be rebuilt from the ground up with newly produced parts but it wouldn't be original anymore, more of a replica.

+1 great to see these great amazing cars are, I believe, in great hands.

 

[Rue]

Read this article in the latest issue of Octane. A right riveting read too. Not sure I wholly agree with Famine for a number of reasons. The millions of pounds of research that was spent on development of the technology to design and make these didn't stop there, it went towards the development of future generations of the rally, race and road cars that we see today. Added to that, and as you know, many examples of historic rally cars like this do still get driven in anger at historic rallies and races. I don't know if you've been to the Le Mans Classic, but if you have had the pleasure you'll see hundreds of cars far more valuable and with as much/more provenance than these examples being thrashed to within inches of their (and the drivers lives).

From 1:25 should do it...


The cars we see here in Juha's garage already have huge amounts of hard (World Champioship) use, so it's not like they're garage queens.

Also, we must take into account that World Champion Juha has made some of these cars what they are and without his hand in the development we wouldn't have had them at all. It is perfectly within his right to do what he wants with his cars and perhaps with all his fond memories, he doesn't want to see them ending up in a tangled mess of metal and kevlar.

While I agree that it is important to see cars like these to be driven in the way they were designed for, it is also just as important to keep and maintain them as a record of the glorious history of motor-racing.

 

[SkylineObsession]

I constantly, constantly daydream about my big warehouse filled with lots of exotic cars after i win Lotto (a fair chunk of them would be Skylines though), but most would be road legal/registered or would be taken to track days every now and then.

I don't like the fact cars are kept as museum peices, it is nice to look at them on display - but they should drive to that display...

 

[Famine]

We have books for that.

Hell, even Gran Turismo is a better "record of the glorious history of motor racing" than this... tomb. At least we can sort-of-see and sort-of-hear them in action, which is more than Juha's personal collection allows.

Not sure if trolling or serious - but if serious, do you also think the same for every other thing in a museum somewhere in the world which could be useful for what it was originally made to do?

Why not keep flowers in a Ming vase on a living room table, it's perfectly good for that for example? Because it's extremely rare, irreplaceable and thus priceless yet the amount of pieces of Ming porcelain in this world is far higher than the amount of original condition 205 T16 Evo 2's for example.

To an extent, yes I do. Ars artia gratis is idiotic. Historical record of societies that no longer exist - such as your Chinese dynasties - is a slightly different matter and of course there will come a day when cars are an historical record of a society that no longer exists, but it isn't today. All those cars need is a couple of gallons of readily-available 98RON (and probably a damned good service, given how long they've been standing, wasted) and you could drive them to work if you felt like it. Of course if you did drive them to work, a great deal more people would be able to see, hear and enjoy them - I know I'd probably burst if I saw an RS200 Evolution being driven up the bypass...

Cars like that belong nowhere else than in a museum unless it can be made 100% sure that nothing happens to them while being used and that can't be guaranteed. Having a car like that just sitting on a showroom floor is a lot better than having it crashed - yes, it could be rebuilt from the ground up with newly produced parts but it wouldn't be original anymore, more of a replica.

Do you love your car(s)? I love my cars. They couldn't possibly be replaced if they were to be crashed - yes, I could get another one that looked just like them, but they wouldn't be the original any more.

I still drive them because that is what they are supposed to do and most of the enjoyment comes not from just looking at them on my drive but from driving them. The Group B cars weren't famous for how they looked sitting behind a rope, but for the noise they made and how they went. Now we get to just look at their mummified remains. Woo.

 

[niky]

Much as I enjoy museums... I actually have to agree with that.

A car standing still just isn't appealing to me. That's why I almost never cover car shows, or even classic car shows, despite my love of classic car design. Hard-parked cars don't do it for me. I'd rather go to the racetrack and watch people flog the living daylights out of their classics. Lotus Elevens, Ford Escorts, Bellets, Alfas, old Dattos and Porsches... all flying around a track... all more fascinating than a rare LeMans racer sitting still.

I think a personal highlight of the 2011 F1 season was watching Alonso flog the living daylights out of that old Ferrari.

 

[TheCracker]

Not got a problem with Kankkunen's personal museum/collection. It doesn't say that the cars never get used, just that some are used more than others. He's only one guy, he has other business and family duties - he can't spend all his waking life thrashing the balls off each and every one of them.

Whilst i usually hate to see cars specifically designed with competition in mind sat doing nothing, the fact that they're old and rare means they can't just be constantly abused in the same way a more modern car can. The rare cars mentioned being used and driven hard at events like the Le Mans Classic will probably spend 363 days a year in a similar air conditioned mausoleum.

Since a majority of the cars have some meaning to Kankkunen's career and still get driven by the man, i can't think of anyone whose hands i'd rather see them in. Not to mention the fact that many have been restored on his request. Had he not done that they may have been lost forever.

I agree with you to an extent, but I think there's a difference between preservation and mothballing. The cars at the Donington Collection is fantastic, and it's an absolute privilage to be able to see such wonderful cars lined up next to one another.

The cars at the Donington collection are regularly brought out and exercised too. 👍

 

[Famine]

It doesn't say that the cars never get used, just that some are used more than others.

It specifically states that the Celica is "one of the few cars in the collection that's used regularly".

He's only one guy, he has other business and family duties - he can't spend all his waking life thrashing the balls off each and every one of them.

Whilst i usually hate to see cars specifically designed with competition in mind sat doing nothing, the fact that they're old and rare means they can't just be constantly abused in the same way a more modern car can. The rare cars mentioned being used and driven hard at events like the Le Mans Classic will probably spend 363 days a year in a similar air conditioned mausoleum.

Since a majority of the cars have some meaning to Kankkunen's career and still get driven by the man, i can't think of anyone whose hands i'd rather see them in. Not to mention the fact that many have been restored on his request. Had he not done that they may have been lost forever.

But again, if their only point is to be looked at, plastic replicas would do the job. All they serve to illustrate is that one man can buy a lot of cars and then stop them ever being cars again - making the remaining ones more valuable (by reducing supply of something already fairly scarce) and similarly less likely to be driven as a result, meaning we only ever get to see them hard-parked and not doing what they were made to do.

I'd rather see Rowan Atkinson stacking his McLaren F1 twice a year than one in laboratory conditions, roped off from the world.

 

[Dennisch]

Most of those are have already done what they where supposed to do. And that is racing. New cars have come in to their way, and now they are just relics of eras gone by. Sure, they need to be driven, but not the way they ment to do so, if that is what you all want to see, built replicas, and trash those around a gravel pit. But, as no one of us has such a car collection or the money to build something like it, we just need to be glad there are people who take the time and money to keep the cars in proper condition. I'm sure once in a while every single car will be shown full throttle to the public, just make sure you'll be there to witness it.

Btw.

Aawyeah.

 

[Famine]

Most of those are have already done what they where supposed to do. And that is racing. New cars have come in to their way, and now they are just relics of eras gone by. Sure, they need to be driven, but not the way they ment to do so

Why not?

​

That sound is something that should not be lost and Juha is making it happen.

if that is what you all want to see, built replicas, and trash those around a gravel pit.

Wait, a replica isn't good enough if you're just looking at something dead and immobile from three feet away, but it is good enough to do what the original should still be doing?

How does that work?

But, as no one of us has such a car collection or the money to build something like it, we just need to be glad there are people who take the time and money to keep the cars in proper condition.

The proper condition is "being used". I'll ask again:

Do you love your car(s)? I love my cars. They couldn't possibly be replaced if they were to be crashed - yes, I could get another one that looked just like them, but they wouldn't be the original any more.

I still drive them because that is what they are supposed to do and most of the enjoyment comes not from just looking at them on my drive but from driving them.

 

[TheCracker]

It specifically states that the Celica is "one of the few cars in the collection that's used regularly".

Well, that's slightly different then if most never get driven. Naughty Juan, bad boy!

But again, if their only point is to be looked at, plastic replicas would do the job. All they serve to illustrate is that one man can buy a lot of cars and then stop them ever being cars again - making the remaining ones more valuable (by reducing supply of something already fairly scarce) and similarly less likely to be driven as a result, meaning we only ever get to see them hard-parked and not doing what they were made to do.

I'd rather see Rowan Atkinson stacking his McLaren F1 twice a year than one in laboratory conditions, roped off from the world.

So many Group B cars have been bastardized over the course of time either to stay competitive in less top-flight events, or just because newer engines, and other parts, are more reliable/powerful/lighter or just available these days. Cars like that have really ceased to be what they were originally and have morphed into just another competition car.

Whilst i'm reluctant to admit that Kankkunen's ultra rare ex-works T16 EvoII is better off sat in a museum or collection indefinitely, i'd prefer that to someone ripping out the turbocharged Peugeot block and replacing it with a more reliable supercharged Honda unit, fitting a more modern higher downforce rear wing and re-painting it in the livery of a local recovery garage - just to do some local rallying. Sometimes the most important examples of a car do need preserving.

 

[homeforsummer]

All they serve to illustrate is that one man can buy a lot of cars and then stop them ever being cars again - making the remaining ones more valuable (by reducing supply of something already fairly scarce) and similarly less likely to be driven as a result, meaning we only ever get to see them hard-parked and not doing what they were made to do.

I'm not sure I agree with everything you're saying, but I certainly agree with this part. It's what really worries me about all the cars from the Saab museum being sold off by the administrators. I really hope they get bought by Saab enthusiasts all around the world, rather than being bought up by some Middle-Eastern oil baron who'll store them in his underground compound, never to be seen by anyone but himself again. Which happens far too often.

 

[Dennisch]

Famine, that's your point of view. And it isn't your money going to pieces when a over excited rallydriver gets the chance to trash around in a 450hp car wrap it around some trees. I'm all about older cars, and I get goosebumps when I hear and see them, but raping them they way they used to be raped isn't the way to go. I want my kid(s) to see them too, but in your idea the cars must be used now, so that we can see them, but when they crash, no one will see them as they were.

To add, Famine, I get your point, but with cars like that it just isn't going to be, how will I name it, "fair" to trash them now, and leave the 300hp Citroens and Fords of today, for our kids, when they get older.

 

[Pupik]

While I'm not a great fan of car museums of vehicles that aren't used, many racing cars are virtually unusable - let alone usually illegal - for driving on public roads. There's a reason old race cars were comparatively super-cheap at auctions, until the mid-1980s; little to no convenient use, parts impossibility, beat-up from battle, and historic racing barely existed.

As for locked-away road-going cars, garage queens, and trailer-only specials, I have little to no interest, unless parts just aren't available. If you've got the money, you can find a good machine shop.

Having been to a Ferrari store recently, it was a great pity to see these 20-year-old cars from my youth rolling into the shop on a flatbed tow trailer with 1500 miles on them, needing too much work for so little rolling mileage. The fellow owning a slightly beat-up Testarossa with 150,000 miles on it deserved a tip of the proverbial cap.

 

[Famine]

Famine, that's your point of view. And it isn't your money going to pieces when a over excited rallydriver gets the chance to trash around in a 450hp car wrap it around some trees. I'm all about older cars, and I get goosebumps when I hear and see them, but raping them they way they used to be raped isn't the way to go. I want my kid(s) to see them too, but in your idea the cars must be used now, so that we can see them, but when they crash, no one will see them as they were.

And if they're locked away the same thing happens, only sooner.

It's actually starting to become a problem (and I'd say it has been becoming a problem since the XJ220 and F50). People view certain niche cars as collectors' items and not cars. So rich people - and while I wouldn't exactly lump Juha Kankkunen in with your usual car collector who has little appreciation for the car and only looks at the dollar value, it is typically these kind of people - buy them up and no-one ever gets to see them turn a wheel. One guy bought FIVE One-77s. FIVE? What the hell for? Terrific, well done, have a cookie, you can buy things.

And this is how we end up with those retarded barn finds - where there's millions of dollars of rotting car corpse - or those secret underground middle-eastern garages - where there's hundreds of millions of dollars of unmoved cock-waving. Or with an F40 appearing with 37 miles on it - great, that'll need a rebuild before it goes anywhere, not that the buyer will drive it of course...


A car that doesn't go anywhere isn't a car. It's a shame.

 

[OwensRacing]

Famine. Point made. You are the minority as well lack some experience in my opinion. Once you have an understanding for classics and irreplaceable parts. You will get it.


Consider the souls that labored for the machine. These people's hard work lives in with these classics being preserved.

To even attach emotional feeling to a car is silly. Cars don't care is they sit or race.

So let's look deeper then just the car.

Also, thinking its time to move on.

 

[Famine]

Famine. Point made. You are the minority as well lack some experience in my opinion. Once you have an understanding for classics and irreplaceable parts. You will get it.

Irrelevant. To anything.

Consider the souls that labored for the machine. These people's hard work lives in with these classics being preserved.

Consider the souls that laboured for the machine. These people's hard work has died with these classics' engines not even being turned over - all that work put into the electrics, the engine, the intake, the exhaust, the clutch, the gearbox, the differentials, the hubs, the suspension, the brakes... all wasted. Still, at least we get to see what the folk who made the outside did - you know just like we would from looking at a picture in a book.

To even attach emotional feeling to a car is silly. Cars don't care is they sit or race.

Clearly you've never owned a car good enough to love then... What was that about lacking some experience? Of course that's irrelevant too. Learn to discuss the point, not the people making it.

A car that doesn't move is not a car. The word "car" is itself a contraction of the word "carriage" (sort of). Who are these dead husks carrying anywhere?